Utah allows Pods to treat the trunk and limbs

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MPhy

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I'm wondering how state surgical regulations affect Pods.

For example,
Utah allows Pods to perform debridement on the limbs and trunk.
I'm curious if any Pods actually do that.


Some state allow Pods to treat the lower leg.

Some even allow Pods to treat the hand (emmm… hand is the foot of the arm).

California and Oregon allow Pods to assist in any surgery.
Does this mean Pods can touch the knee or hip?
 
Awkward Topher Grace GIF by ABC Network
 
I'm wondering how state surgical regulations affect Pods.

For example,
Utah allows Pods to perform debridement on the limbs and trunk.
I'm curious if any Pods actually do that.


Some state allow Pods to treat the lower leg.

Some even allow Pods to treat the hand (emmm… hand is the foot of the arm).

California and Oregon allow Pods to assist in any surgery.
Does this mean Pods can touch the knee or hip?
This is fear mongering. Something quite popular in culture right now. Way overblow things to shed negative light on a non issue.

Podiatrists are not scope creepers. We are foot/ankle and soft tissue below the tibial tuberosity.
 
It is technically true podiatrists can treat wounds anywhere on the body in Utah. Doubt it’s happening much, maybe if they work in a wound care center?
 
This is fear mongering. Something quite popular in culture right now. Way overblow things to shed negative light on a non issue.

Podiatrists are not scope creepers. We are foot/ankle and soft tissue below the tibial tuberosity.
Its funny - I actually read this in in a different manner. I wondered if this was a pre-pod who was seeing things that are "more" than they expect and wondering if somehow podiatry is a path to something outside the foot. Historically, prepods on SDN lock into small things that have almost no relevance in the day to day lives of most podiatrists and some how decide these things will open the door to being something we're not. People used to ask if they could use their DPM degree to become a hospitalist.

The Utah thing is interesting. A year or 2(?) ago I read an article describing a state - presumably Utah based on the above - where podiatry had through consensus with decision makers / state reps worked out a scope change to allow them to perform wound care throughout the body. The article praised everyone involved basically saying they'd found a way to work with other specialties and state reps to pass legislation without a battle. It was put forward as a path for scope change in other states. To be fair though - Utah isn't like other states.

The hand thing has been in certain state scopes for years. My suspicion is this allowed people to clip fingernails. If the thread lasts long enough Dr. Rodgers will write an explanation on how credentialing and privileging works and explain that you can't do hand surgery at a hospital just because the state scope uses the word.

Surgical assists at best get a 16% reimbursement.

Georgia or someone used to list "leg". Maybe it was Florida. In most states podiatrists can already operate on the leg as long as the issue they are treating manifests in the foot.

I refer you to the above concerning knees and hips - you are reaching for something that isn't going to be part of your training or scope or practice. The simple truth is most podiatrists don't do enough rearfoot or ankle work. Telling yourself this is a path to the hip, knee, or hand is just absurd.
 
Its funny - I actually read this in in a different manner. I wondered if this was a pre-pod who was seeing things that are "more" than they expect and wondering if somehow podiatry is a path to something outside the foot. Historically, prepods on SDN lock into small things that have almost no relevance in the day to day lives of most podiatrists and some how decide these things will open the door to being something we're not. People used to ask if they could use their DPM degree to become a hospitalist.

The Utah thing is interesting. A year or 2(?) ago I read an article describing a state - presumably Utah based on the above - where podiatry had through consensus with decision makers / state reps worked out a scope change to allow them to perform wound care throughout the body. The article praised everyone involved basically saying they'd found a way to work with other specialties and state reps to pass legislation without a battle. It was put forward as a path for scope change in other states. To be fair though - Utah isn't like other states.

The hand thing has been in certain state scopes for years. My suspicion is this allowed people to clip fingernails. If the thread lasts long enough Dr. Rodgers will write an explanation on how credentialing and privileging works and explain that you can't do hand surgery at a hospital just because the state scope uses the word.

Surgical assists at best get a 16% reimbursement.

Georgia or someone used to list "leg". Maybe it was Florida. In most states podiatrists can already operate on the leg as long as the issue they are treating manifests in the foot.

I refer you to the above concerning knees and hips - you are reaching for something that isn't going to be part of your training or scope or practice. The simple truth is most podiatrists don't do enough rearfoot or ankle work. Telling yourself this is a path to the hip, knee, or hand is just absurd.
Alright so I looked up a random neurosurgeon code.

CPT 61520 for infratentorial tumor excision. Totally random good AI code/procedure.

57.09 RVU

If I assisted and got 16% thats the same as a bunion at $476

Maybe I should just assist neurosurgery all day and stop doing bunions.

No follow up. No stress. Just retract.

(Problem is I can probably do 2-3 bunions in the time that surgery takes).
 
This is fear mongering. Something quite popular in culture right now. Way overblow things to shed negative light on a non issue.

Podiatrists are not scope creepers. We are foot/ankle and soft tissue below the tibial tuberosity.
Soft tissue below tuberosity you are going to do wound care in a BKA dehsic
 
The hand thing has been in certain state scopes for years. My suspicion is this allowed people to clip fingernails. If the thread lasts long enough Dr. Rodgers will write an explanation on how credentialing and privileging works and explain that you can't do hand surgery at a hospital just because the state scope uses the word.
I'll refer you to my favorite quote from Inglorious Bastards.

Steve Bannon Bingo GIF


It's the same if you're an MD, with an unlimited scope in your license. That doesn't mean you have an unlimited scope in practice. You need to demonstrate your education, training, and experience to the hospital in order to be granted privileges. We don't have the education or training to do hand surgery and I don't know of any podiatrist who does hand surgery, despite it being in a state statute.
I refer you to the above concerning knees and hips - you are reaching for something that isn't going to be part of your training or scope or practice. The simple truth is most podiatrists don't do enough rearfoot or ankle work. Telling yourself this is a path to the hip, knee, or hand is just absurd.
Yes, some state podiatry associations have pushed the scope to include soft tissue above the ankle so they can treat wounds. But I haven't heard any serious person or organization advocate for anything else.
 
This is fear mongering. Something quite popular in culture right now. Way overblow things to shed negative light on a non issue.

Podiatrists are not scope creepers. We are foot/ankle and soft tissue below the tibial tuberosity.
Totally true.

The AOFAS commentary claiming podiatrists are coming after hands, knees, and hips is purely baseless fearmongering to get the AAOS and AMA to care about F&A ortho vs. podiatry competition.
 
Funny, Utah is home to Charles Saltzman who I recall banned all podiatrists in his hospital from doing ANY osseous surgery. Not sure if the ban is still in place, but it was fairly recent, not in the 1970s.

Oh well, you can still debride a fecally contaminated sacral ulcer at least
 
The hand thing has been in certain state scopes for years. My suspicion is this allowed people to clip fingernails. If the thread lasts long enough Dr. Rodgers will write an explanation on how credentialing and privileging works and explain that you can't do hand surgery at a hospital just because the state scope uses the word.

I been doing hand stuff since high school... Oh you mean hands and podiatry! My state allows it, originally the wording was very ambiguous, and a ambitious pod could probably have argued that hands were in our scope. However, a few years ago the pod board altered it to say something along the lines of "nails and skin lesions of the hand" (meaning warts and calluses). I excise probably 5-10 warts a year on the hands.
 
I been doing hand stuff since high school... Oh you mean hands and podiatry! My state allows it, originally the wording was very ambiguous, and a ambitious pod could probably have argued that hands were in our scope. However, a few years ago the pod board altered it to say something along the lines of "nails and skin lesions of the hand" (meaning warts and calluses). I excise probably 5-10 warts a year on the hands.
You've made the OP very happy I'm sure. Adding the hand to our scope generates you an extra $500-$1000.
 
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