Vandenbos Procedure

[Sig Savant]

Can anyone comment on the Vandenbos procedure - is it taught or performed?

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[Podfather]

Can anyone comment on the Vandenbos procedure - is it taught or performed?

I am not aware of anyone who is performing this procedure. Someone may be doing it after blood letting or placing a hole in the patient's skull for a headache LOL.

 

[PADPM]

Whaddya mean??? I just did a couple of these today

Actually, there is a youtube video of this procedure dated January 2010, so apparently there are some luney tunes still performing this barbaric procedure.

I found it almost as disturbing to watch as a circumcision. You know, it just "hurts" watching.

To think of the post-operative discomfort these patients must experience vs. a simple chemical cauterization of the matrix is staggering.

Just a "little" overkill.

 

[krabmas]

Whaddya mean??? I just did a couple of these today

Actually, there is a youtube video of this procedure dated January 2010, so apparently there are some luney tunes still performing this barbaric procedure.

I found it almost as disturbing to watch as a circumcision. You know, it just "hurts" watching.

To think of the post-operative discomfort these patients must experience vs. a simple chemical cauterization of the matrix is staggering.

Just a "little" overkill.

but if you read wikipedia there were no recurrances in 600 patients.

 

[Podfather]

but if you read wikipedia there were no recurrances in 600 patients.

To make 2 ellipses and then not close them and "allow them to granulate in" IMO is asking for trouble. It's not 1959 ( when I believe it was described) and good luck if someone gets infected/osteomyelytis. The 2010 attorney will have a field day. Mastectomy worked but simple lumpectomy has proven to be as effective for the same types of breast cancer. A 2010 video! Yikes!

 

[Feli]

Good lord... mised well do a prophylactic toe amp.

P&A for most, Winograds in select situations, or the occasional Zadik are the way to go. That antiquated Vandenbos procedure is just inviting infection, esp in diabetic pts. Even if you luck out and it doesn't get infected, you sure won't get very good results in terms of cosmesis or post op pain level. The reason the "study" had no recurrences is probably because their pts were smart enough to follow up elsewhere after they realized their toe had just gotten butchered.

I am not aware of anyone who is performing this procedure. Someone may be doing it after blood letting or placing a hole in the patient's skull for a headache LOL.

Exactly^^

 

[krabmas]

To make 2 ellipses and then not close them and "allow them to granulate in" IMO is asking for trouble. It's not 1959 ( when I believe it was described) and good luck if someone gets infected/osteomyelytis. The 2010 attorney will have a field day. Mastectomy worked but simple lumpectomy has proven to be as effective for the same types of breast cancer. A 2010 video! Yikes!

Sarcasm?

 

[Podfather]

Sarcasm?

No

 

[PADPM]

but if you read wikipedia there were no recurrances in 600 patients.

I think Feli hit the nail right on the head. There were probably no reported recurrences because the patients were afraid to return to the doctor!!

Whether or not there were any recurrences is really insignificant. The procedure is barbaric. If you knew there was a 10% recurrence rate with a traditional phenol matrixectomy, would you ever even CONSIDER having a Vandenbos procedure even if there WAS a zero recurrence rate?

I've been performing phenol procedures for over 20 years, and have yet to prescribe any post op pain medication. I'm sure patients take a Tylenol or Advil once in a while, but I'm also sure that patients must take some heavy duty pain meds after a Vandenbos procedure.

It takes a long time for those wounds to granulate and for epithelization and complete healing.

There would also be a zero recurrence rate with amputation, and it would probably be much less painful, with a quicker recovery time.

If any doctor I hired ever performed this procedure on a patient in our practice, it would be his/her last day in our office.

 

[krabmas]

I think Feli hit the nail right on the head. There were probably no reported recurrences because the patients were afraid to return to the doctor!!

Whether or not there were any recurrences is really insignificant. The procedure is barbaric. If you knew there was a 10% recurrence rate with a traditional phenol matrixectomy, would you ever even CONSIDER having a Vandenbos procedure even if there WAS a zero recurrence rate?

I've been performing phenol procedures for over 20 years, and have yet to prescribe any post op pain medication. I'm sure patients take a Tylenol or Advil once in a while, but I'm also sure that patients must take some heavy duty pain meds after a Vandenbos procedure.

It takes a long time for those wounds to granulate and for epithelization and complete healing.

There would also be a zero recurrence rate with amputation, and it would probably be much less painful, with a quicker recovery time.

If any doctor I hired ever performed this procedure on a patient in our practice, it would be his/her last day in our office.

again, sarcasm

 

[PADPM]

krabmas,

You really didn't make it clear whether your post was sarcasm or whether you were questioning if podfather's post was sarcasm. You followed podfather's post with "sarcasm?", therefore I thought you were basically questioning whether HIS post was being sarcastic, and hence my response.

It's all a matter of perception!

Now when are you going to schedule your first Vandenbos procedure?

 

[krabmas]

krabmas,

You really didn't make it clear whether your post was sarcasm or whether you were questioning if podfather's post was sarcasm. You followed podfather's post with "sarcasm?", therefore I thought you were basically questioning whether HIS post was being sarcastic, and hence my response.

It's all a matter of perception!

Now when are you going to schedule your first Vandenbos procedure?

so was that sarcasm?

obviously, it is a barbaric procedure that I will not be doing anytime soon.

 

[Podfather]

so was that sarcasm?

obviously, it is a barbaric procedure that I will not be doing anytime soon.

I actually thought you were an advocate.

 

[PADPM]

I actually thought you were an advocate.

So did I, and that's why I wrote my original response to krabmas. As I stated, it's a matter of perception, and obviously we both perceived her posts to advocate the procedure.

Regardless, it's all cleared up now and I doubt we'll see the Vandenbos procedure boldly advertised in anyone's Yellow Page ad anytime soon! (by the way, I don't have a yellow page ad)

 

[that1guyfromFL]

I take every reference to wikipedia as a reliable information source as sarcasm out of reflex.