VCU CERT vs. Tufts MBS

[bruinsbaseball]

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I wanted to see if there were any other applicants making the decision between VCU CERT and Tufts MBS.

I see two big differences when I compare the programs:
1. VCU offers graduate school classes taught by medical school faculty while Tufts offers a "re-run" of the actual classes taught by the faculty.
2. Price

I've done research on SDN and have read nearly every thread concerning both schools. It should seem obvious that Tufts would be the better choice because of the "Tufts name" and the fact that you take the actual medical school classes. However, after searching threads on SDN it seems that both schools have similar success rates and ultimately it comes down to the individual and how well they succeed in the program that will determine their outlook.

I am leaning toward VCU because of the price difference (with living expenses Tufts is nearly twice as much) and because I have already been exposed to the VCU "core" classes at a step lower than the graduate level and have faired well.

Is there anything else I am missing in this simple equation? Is Tufts really worth the price difference over VCU?

Any feedback on how I making a decision would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

I was also accepted to BU and am on the waitlist at EVMS and Cincy (which are both my top choices).

 

[klmnop]

I wanted to see if there were any other applicants making the decision between VCU CERT and Tufts MBS.

I see two big differences when I compare the programs:
1. VCU offers graduate school classes taught by medical school faculty while Tufts offers a "re-run" of the actual classes taught by the faculty.
2. Price

I've done research on SDN and have read nearly every thread concerning both schools. It should seem obvious that Tufts would be the better choice because of the "Tufts name" and the fact that you take the actual medical school classes. However, after searching threads on SDN it seems that both schools have similar success rates and ultimately it comes down to the individual and how well they succeed in the program that will determine their outlook.

I am leaning toward VCU because of the price difference (with living expenses Tufts is nearly twice as much) and because I have already been exposed to the VCU "core" classes at a step lower than the graduate level and have faired well.

Is there anything else I am missing in this simple equation? Is Tufts really worth the price difference over VCU?

Any feedback on how I making a decision would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

I was also accepted to BU and am on the waitlist at EVMS and Cincy (which are both my top choices).

I'll take a quick stab. there are a few major differences in these programs that you may or may not have considered:

VCU - is arguably only helpful to get into VCUmed
Tufts - has proven success at dozens of schools

VCU - offers only a 2-semester certification with completion
Tufts - can get 2-semester certification or a full year Masters degree with the option of continuing on to an MPH

VCU - self-proclaimed that 50% of graduates have been accepted into 'professional' schools
Tufts - self-proclaimed that 80%+ of graduates have been accepted to medical schools

VCU - you can apply (i think) for a Fast Track Self Review, in which a 3.5 and 28 MCAT gets you an automatic VCUmed interview
Tufts - top 25% of class get automatic interview for following cycle (though 50% is more likely.... though only 10% accepted to Tufts)

i don't know much more.
i researched all of these schools very closely and based on similar data made my final decision to apply to tufts, gtown, cinci, and bu (accepted, waitlisted, waitlisted, accepted) and i personally rank cinci and tufts higher than the other two, let alone the other programs i didn't apply to.

my suggestion, contact people who are in or were in the program, regardless of their success. these people will give you the most honest opinions of their experiences and tell you things you can't learn from statistics and brochures.

i dont have any contacts for vcu , but if you want to pm me i can tell you a number of people who are willing to talk about tufts and gtown.

 

[jslo85]

SDN member contacts for the programs above that I know of who answer questions in this subsection of the forum and are either in the current programs in question/completed it/or done extensive research would be:

Georgetown SMP: Haplo
BU MAMS: Gujudoc / Bleargh
Tufts MBS: Klmnop? (lol)
UCinn: ?
VCU: InStateWaiter

(disclaimer: I don't know how they will react to someone PMing them but they all seem friendly and forthcoming about helping potential applicants from what I've seen)

 

[Instatewaiter]

SDN member contacts for the programs above that I know of who answer questions in this subsection of the forum and are either in the current programs in question/completed it/or done extensive research would be:

Georgetown SMP: Haplo
BU MAMS: Gujudoc / Bleargh
Tufts MBS: Klmnop? (lol)
UCinn: ?
VCU: InStateWaiter

(disclaimer: I don't know how they will react to someone PMing them but they all seem friendly and forthcoming about helping potential applicants from what I've seen)

You guys can always PM me if you have questions about VCU medical school or VCU's certificate program.

I am a big proponent of both VCU and the cert program.

I'll take a quick stab. there are a few major differences in these programs that you may or may not have considered:

VCU - is arguably only helpful to get into VCUmed
Tufts - has proven success at dozens of schools

VCU - offers only a 2-semester certification with completion
Tufts - can get 2-semester certification or a full year Masters degree with the option of continuing on to an MPH

VCU - self-proclaimed that 50% of graduates have been accepted into 'professional' schools
Tufts - self-proclaimed that 80%+ of graduates have been accepted to medical schools

VCU - you can apply (i think) for a Fast Track Self Review, in which a 3.5 and 28 MCAT gets you an automatic VCUmed interview
Tufts - top 25% of class get automatic interview for following cycle (though 50% is more likely.... though only 10% accepted to Tufts)

i don't know much more.
i researched all of these schools very closely and based on similar data made my final decision to apply to tufts, gtown, cinci, and bu (accepted, waitlisted, waitlisted, accepted) and i personally rank cinci and tufts higher than the other two, let alone the other programs i didn't apply to.

my suggestion, contact people who are in or were in the program, regardless of their success. these people will give you the most honest opinions of their experiences and tell you things you can't learn from statistics and brochures.

i dont have any contacts for vcu , but if you want to pm me i can tell you a number of people who are willing to talk about tufts and gtown.

VCU's cert will help you get into VCU as well as various other schools. I also know people who got into GW, WVU, EVMS, and a few others. That is just from my year. I imagine that there are others in the 4 years since I have done it.

VCU also allows you to do a full masters with another year of research.

We have 2 posters on SDN who recently got into MCV/VCU's med school after doing the cert program- Hung and TMNTdonjuan- they may be able to give you more up to date info.

I thought the program was very hard yet got me into med school (I had below a 3.0). I would not have gotten in without the program. I am very happy with how it prepared me for medical school and where I am going for residency. I think VCU was exactly what I needed.

 

[klmnop]

You guys can always PM me if you have questions about VCU medical school or VCU's certificate program.

Good to know, we could use some VCU advice around here.

VCU's cert will help you get into VCU as well as various other schools. I also know people who got into GW, WVU, EVMS, and a few others. That is just from my year. I imagine that there are others in the 4 years since I have done it.

Yeah this isn't surprising, some regional schools and others with SMPs as well. This type of success can be assumed of most SMPs too. But don't the majority of those accepted somewhere go to VCU because that is the primary purpose. This was my impression, obviously I may be mistaken.

VCU also allows you to do a full masters with another year of research.

My bad, had no idea about this either. Everything I read from the website said certification... is this a common path for students that aren't admitted to med?

 

[jslo85]

If what I understand about Instatewaiter's post about the VCU problem and how they structure their first and second years, it's seems to model the typical MBS format that most of the osteopathic MBS (SMP hybrid) programs offer in that their first year is crammed full of OMS-1 and medical school level graduate courses and the second year dedicated to research and whatever med school elecctives you choose (and the advisory committee) allows you to take.

ie. PCOM MBS (1st year certificate, 2nd year Masters) or LECOM (1st year certificate, can choose to continue on for 2nd year of research for M.S)

What would be nice is if ISW elaborated more on the requirements of the second year. Is it a thesis requirement and if so, are students allowed to conduct a library thesis instead (like BU MAMS) or is an oral defense etc. required.

 

[klmnop]

I'm sure the OP has seen this, but found this straight from the VCU Cert website: http://www.medschool.vcu.edu/graduate/premed_cert/index.html

"The Pre-Medical Health Sciences Certificate Program (CERT) of Virginia Commonwealth University School of Medicine (SOM) is a one-year, graduate-level program for individuals seeking to enhance their qualifications for admission into professional school, including Medical, Dental, and Veterinary School. Students who complete the Certificate Program also have an opportunity to continue to a Master of Science (M.S.) or Ph.D. degree program within the School of Medicine.... Certificate students who continue into a second year for the M.S. degree (CERT/MS) program will work closely with an individual faculty member in a particular department....In their second year, CERT/MS students focus almost exclusively on experiments in their mentor's laboratory, with minimal course work."

"Required and elective courses are drawn from departments within the School of Medicine: Anatomy and Neurobiology, Biochemistry and Molecular Biology, Human and Molecular Genetics, Microbiology and Immunology, Pharmacology and Toxicology, and Physiology and Biophysics."

"Students successfully finishing the program with a GPA of 3.5 and presenting an MCAT score of 28 or higher are guaranteed an interview for Medical School at VCU, for the application cycle following completion of the CERT Program. Significant medical experience and exemplary professional behavior are also expected for guaranteed interviews."

 

[klmnop]

Also, email response from the administration:

"The estimated number thus far is that 50% of students that finish the program are accepted into a professional school program."

"None of the courses are medical courses in the sense that they are taken with the medical students. The courses in the program are graduate courses that teach the material similar to the first year medical curriculum. The core courses of Mammalian Physiology (PHIS 501) and Biochemistry (BIOC 503 and BIOC 504) cover a majority of the material for medical physiology, biochemistry, human genetics, and immunology. The elective courses of Histology (ANAT 611) and Neuroanatomy (ANAT 610) cover a majority of the material for medical histology and neuroanatomy/neuroscience."

 

[tmntdonjuan]

Also, email response from the administration:

"The estimated number thus far is that 50% of students that finish the program are accepted into a professional school program."

"None of the courses are medical courses in the sense that they are taken with the medical students. The courses in the program are graduate courses that teach the material similar to the first year medical curriculum. The core courses of Mammalian Physiology (PHIS 501) and Biochemistry (BIOC 503 and BIOC 504) cover a majority of the material for medical physiology, biochemistry, human genetics, and immunology. The elective courses of Histology (ANAT 611) and Neuroanatomy (ANAT 610) cover a majority of the material for medical histology and neuroanatomy/neuroscience."

That's correct. The courses are also taught by the same faculty as the medical school.

 

[bruinsbaseball]

Thank you for emailing the administration klmnop. Thanks for joining the conversation Instatewaiter, I have read a lot of your previous posts in the older VCU CERT threads.

I plan to call VCU sometime next week to discuss the program with an admin.

The conclusion I have made is that Tufts is more geared toward prospective medical school students. But is it really worth twice the money? My long-term goal is to go to MD wherever that may be and VCU would be great.

Instatewaiter: What percentage of prospective medical school students in the program were accepted to VCU SOM? What were some of the MCATs of those students?

 

[klmnop]

yeah cost is a huge deal at tufts, its a matter of personal preference i guess. its been tough for me to swallow. just got my financial aid letter from them and its like 58k or something of loans (with $0 personal/parental contribution) .... fun

 

[hung]

I did VCU's CERT program last year. 2008-2009. Because of the program, I have been accepted to VCU/MCV and EVMS. I am also considered oos for the VA schools so that helps too. It really comes down to where you want to go for medical school. If you want to attend VCU SOM or EVMS, doing the CERT program would provide you the best chance. Go with Tufts if you want the higher chance of gaining admission to a medical school. If you get off the waitlist for EVMS and Cincy, I would go Cincy.

 

[blackjack42]

I'm trying to decide between Tufts and VCU's cert. I want to matriculate next year, and I was wondering which of these two would give me a better chance to make that happen. I really do love Boston and Tufts, but I know beggars can't be choosers and I am happy to go to any med school I get accepted into. Anyways, I would greatly appreciate any help!