Wall Street to Residency - What are my chances?

[TheWallStDoc]

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I have my MD from a top 3 med school. Didnt do residency after that - worked for a wall street hedge fund doing biotech. Now coming back to do anesthesia. Step 1: 210. Step 2 pending. Grades average. LORs non-anesthesia except one from pain observership. Not looking for top programs, just medium ranked. Can I get any interviews?

 

[amyl]

how long were you away from medicine?

 

[TheWallStDoc]

5 years

 

[Per4mer8]

I was unaware that there were schools that awarded the medical degree without passing Step 2....... as far as your situation, while i'm sure you have lots of "non-traditional" experience that sets you apart your best bet is getting 240+ on that step 2.

 

[TheWallStDoc]

even for the lowest ranked program?

 

[Per4mer8]

even for the lowest ranked program?

In all honesty a 210 step 1 is low in general (below the mean by 10-12 points), so you have to vastly improve your step 2 score. Even then most programs filter apps by the Step 1 scores (I'm currently applying anesthesia now) so your app may be circular filed even with a 240 step 2. Basically hope for a good/great step 2 score, apply very broadly (50+ apps), and write a kick-ace personal statement leveraging your other experiences. As far as the exact implications of graduating but not going into medicine for 5+ years I have no idea, some PDs may like it, some may see it as you didn't/don't love medicine and are only "coming back" because the economy tanked..........

 

[Jay82]

Interesting story OP

Why are you leaving the financial industry? What initially caused you to pursue a non-traditional path after med school?

 

[Taurus]

Consider that many states have a 7 year limit for completing all three steps before you can get a license. Factor that into your equation as you contemplate trying to get back into medicine.

 

[sevo85288]

Ok I will help you get into an anesthesia residency, you tell me about the following stocks. 🙂

svnt, cadx, mnta, hgsi, optr,

Thanks

 

[epidural man]

I have my MD from a top 3 med school. Didnt do residency after that - worked for a wall street hedge fund doing biotech. Now coming back to do anesthesia. Step 1: 210. Step 2 pending. Grades average. LORs non-anesthesia except one from pain observership. Not looking for top programs, just medium ranked. Can I get any interviews?

I think you should right a book about dinosaurs and DNA and stuff.

 

[hoyden]

I have my MD from a top 3 med school. Didnt do residency after that - worked for a wall street hedge fund doing biotech. Now coming back to do anesthesia. Step 1: 210. Step 2 pending. Grades average. LORs non-anesthesia except one from pain observership. Not looking for top programs, just medium ranked. Can I get any interviews?

I do not see any reason why won't you get in, despite a bit of discouraging remarks here. But do your homework and do not apply to those programs which take standard applicants only. There are plenty of non-standard applicants and a lot of non-standard programs, elite ones included.

Your step 1 score is average but it won't matter if you get a good step 2 and step 3 scores( I am not sure if you can take it before residency as AMG, though).

Your PS should incorporate some healthy self-mockery and be concise 😉

 

[pgg]

I don't have anything concretely encouraging or discouraging to offer, but from the CSB files: I met a CT surgery fellow a while ago who left a nauseatingly lucrative career on Wall Street to go to medical school to become a cardiac surgeon.

He said when he left (late 1990s), 3 of his partners each bet him $500,000 that he wouldn't make it. I wonder if they ever paid up.


I would think you'd find a spot somewhere. A 210 step 1 from your average 4th year applicant is not as interesting as a 210 step 1 from a person with an interesting story about time away from medicine.

 

[TheWallStDoc]

thanks for all the great advice. I'm excited to return to medicine and to see where I end up. As for the economy tanking: I shorted my whole portfolio back in May! 🙂 So, I'm definitely not doing this for the $$$. Plenty of investment opps out there. GLTA and thanks!!!

 

[Quirk11]

Why are you leaving Wall Street and / or what happened there? If interested in serving others, as many of us have espoused, why not consider a non-profit route?

Also, have you thought about becoming a dental specialist?

I am smart but do not have the "people skills" to be as successful in business / ibanking / consulting , but perhaps I could have done an okay job in some mid level position. (who knows?)..I don't agree with those posters on here who argue that they would have done much better in business as I think you need to have more skills than just being "smart" to do well there...I think medicine is more about endurance and testing....

I agree that money is not the most important thing, as I am quite happy living on my resident salary in the place I grew up in with all my friends / family.

However, life is short and I would consider dentistry in light of the vision of our current leaders..

thanks for all the great advice. I'm excited to return to medicine and to see where I end up. As for the economy tanking: I shorted my whole portfolio back in May! 🙂 So, I'm definitely not doing this for the $$$. Plenty of investment opps out there. GLTA and thanks!!!

 

[El Dooderino]

Why are you leaving Wall Street and / or what happened there? If interested in serving others, as many of us have espoused, why not consider a non-profit route?

Also, have you thought about becoming a dental specialist?

I am smart but do not have the "people skills" to be as successful in business / ibanking / consulting , but perhaps I could have done an okay job in some mid level position. (who knows?)..I don't agree with those posters on here who argue that they would have done much better in business as I think you need to have more skills than just being "smart" to do well there...I think medicine is more about endurance and testing....

I agree that money is not the most important thing, as I am quite happy living on my resident salary in the place I grew up in with all my friends / family.

However, life is short and I would consider dentistry in light of the vision of our current leaders..

He already finished med school

 

[saratoga733]

dude... top 3 med school? we're talking harvard, upenn, etc... right?? subpar step 1 notwithstanding, if you can come up with a half way decent reason why you want to return to medicine, u are sure to go before all the img's, do's, not to mention most of the average us med students. don't sell urself short. u'll be fine.

 

[Fah-Q]

thanks for all the great advice. I'm excited to return to medicine and to see where I end up. As for the economy tanking: I shorted my whole portfolio back in May! 🙂 So, I'm definitely not doing this for the $$$. Plenty of investment opps out there. GLTA and thanks!!!

How do you expect to survive an internship? You've been away from medicine for 5 years. Your step 1 score shows you are not a particularly good student. You just won't have the knowledge base.

You've got some balls for wanting to come back but I think it would be a mistake. Medicine is circling the drain in this country. Stay far away. The grass looks greener because it is astroturf...a cruel illusion.

By the way, any chance I could get an interview for the position you are leaving?

 

[saratoga733]

btw, were u guys the one's shorting my KERX last week?? :0

 

[Per4mer8]

dude... top 3 med school? we're talking harvard, upenn, etc... right?? subpar step 1 notwithstanding, if you can come up with a half way decent reason why you want to return to medicine, u are sure to go before all the img's, do's, not to mention most of the average us med students. don't sell urself short. u'll be fine.

See, this I don't get. I understand he has unique experience blah blah blah but why does the fact that he (potentially) went to Harvard etc put him ahead of ALL D.O.s and "most" US M.D.s? The ONE indicator of medical knowledge that we have is the standardized test(s) we all take. I understand you can put your nose up to GPA, class rank, and MD over DO because those things are dependant on individual school and the relative competition at each but the USMLE is it, the gold standard. I don't get it.

 

[Trajan]

See, this I don't get. I understand he has unique experience blah blah blah but why does the fact that he (potentially) went to Harvard etc put him ahead of ALL D.O.s and "most" US M.D.s? The ONE indicator of medical knowledge that we have is the standardized test(s) we all take. I understand you can put your nose up to GPA, class rank, and MD over DO because those things are dependant on individual school and the relative competition at each but the USMLE is it, the gold standard. I don't get it.

USMLE is not the gold standard. When a real patient begins to desat in the OR, no one hands you a piece of paper stating, this is happening because of a)....b)....c)...etc. There is no gold standard for resident selection, and this person is clearly an atypical case.

USMLE is a licensing exam and its creators did not intend for it to be used in resident selection. Virtually every other profession uses licensing exams as pass/fail mechanisms to answer one and only one question: does this person meet a threshold that weeds out those with a degree but questionable competence. That's why failing a USMLE is a big red flag. However, it does not mean that someone with a 230 is undoubtedly superior to someone with a 210. If that were the case, the best doctors would be those who did nothing but illegally snort crushed pills and stare at Q-bank for 2 years in their pajamas.

The OP will probably find a good program at which to match. However, a greater hurdle than the 210 is convincing a program that you can perform again as an intern, having done nothing clinical in five years. Additionally, some may be turned off by a person who took a coveted spot at Harvard or Hopkins only to leave medicine at graduation. I still think that you will find a good program, just cast a large net and have good answers for sceptical PD's.

 

[Per4mer8]

USMLE is not the gold standard. When a real patient begins to desat in the OR, no one hands you a piece of paper stating, this is happening because of a)....b)....c)...etc. There is no gold standard for resident selection, and this person is clearly an atypical case.

USMLE is a licensing exam and its creators did not intend for it to be used in resident selection. Virtually every other profession uses licensing exams as pass/fail mechanisms to answer one and only one question: does this person meet a threshold that weeds out those with a degree but questionable competence. That's why failing a USMLE is a big red flag. However, it does not mean that someone with a 230 is undoubtedly superior to someone with a 210. If that were the case, the best doctors would be those who did nothing but illegally snort crushed pills and stare at Q-bank for 2 years in their pajamas.

The OP will probably find a good program at which to match. However, a greater hurdle than the 210 is convincing a program that you can perform again as an intern, having done nothing clinical in five years. Additionally, some may be turned off by a person who took a coveted spot at Harvard or Hopkins only to leave medicine at graduation. I still think that you will find a good program, just cast a large net and have good answers for sceptical PD's.

I agree with most of what you are saying.....to a point. I agree that a person with a 230 is not automatically or obviously a better physician than one who scored a 210. We all know there are flaws in standardized tests including the luck involved in the subject matter person A got vs what person B got, if you're not great at Neuro and got a neuro heavy test your score will suffer etc. I also agree (somewhat) that your point about clinical situations not being multiple choice etc and someone with a 260 could be horrible clinically and vice versa, but if you couldn't pick out a reason for desaturating out of 5 choices where you know one is correct why assume that person could do it without any choices from thin air? (I 100% agree that someone who COULD pick out the answer from test options may very well blow it in real life without choices)

I also agree that there is more to selection of residents than a single test score. Personality, life experiences, point of views in relation to whatever the PD deems important etc. But saying that there is little to no correlation between USMLE score and clinical competence other than pass/fail I think is a little bit of a stretch. If ignoring the USMLE for that reason, how does a PD "know" the person will be a good clinician? He/she can't get that info from an interview.

My biggest issue with the post that I replied to was the assertion that going to Harvard (for example) automatically puts you ahead of all DOs and most Allopathic students even with a 210 step 1. Why? Getting into Harvard means a.) you got great grades in undergrad b.) you went to a recognized undergrad institution and c.) you likely had an "in" (family,friend, alumni) working for you. Ignore the fact that not everybody has those opportunities, if we say going to Harvard compensates for a low medical licensing exam score you are essentially saying that what that person did previously (acing micro/macroeconomics, sociology, calculus, english, etc) is a better predictor of future clinical success than THE test we all take that assesses medical knowledge. I'm sorry but that's crazy, and if true is exactly what's wrong with the elitist attitude.

Lastly, to the OP, i did not intend to imply that you are doing this BECAUSE the economy tanked, I was just pointing out that that COULD be in some PDs minds so you should be sure to have a good reason that you're coming back now and didn't go to residency initially which others have said as well. I also believe you will likely match but am being realistic in saying the 210 step 1 IS a hurdle for some if not most programs. Apply broadly.

 

[ssmallz]

Your step 1 score is a bit low but good enough to match if the rest of your application is up to snuff. Going to a top medical school will help but IMO your entire application comes down to desire. Why anesthesia? Why now? A PD will look at your application and want to know that information before offering you an interview. Did you do any anesthesia rotations as a med student? Did you work with any anesthesiologists during your days on wall street? Get some solid letters from practicing anesthesiologists and have a good reason why you want to be one for the rest of your life as opposed to any other field in medicine. If you can do that in your application you'll be fine, if not, apply for a transitional year, impress people with your work ethic and get into the OR to shadow some anesthesiologists.

 

[aneftp]

There will be at least 5-10 residency directors who will give the OP a chance.

1. Top medical school.

2. Life experience (especially different working) counts.

My sister and sister in law both went to top 3 and top 5 med schools. There are a lot of normal and weird people in both their schools. Some of them went to business school or did combine business MD degrees.

People change their minds all the time but these are not stupid or unmotivated people we are dealing with.

Heck my sister left OB/gyn 6 years ago (after finishing first in her college, top 10% at her top 5 medical school and chief resident at one of top OB/GYN programs.

So OP. Go for it. We all know know you will do well in whatever program you get it.

Oh by the way. If you go to one of those top med schools you end up owing much less than regular folks. Top med schools essential give you scholarships if you can pay the full price. Gotta love the power of top schools.

 

[Arch Guillotti]

There will be at least 5-10 residency directors who will give the OP a chance.

1. Top medical school.

2. Life experience (especially different working) counts.

Maybe. I am not sure I would want a cat who bailed on medicine from the get go.

 

[dozitgetchahi]

Maybe. I am not sure I would want a cat who bailed on medicine from the get go.

I agree here. Plus, everything I've ever heard/read on the subject indicates that 1) bailing on medicine looks bad to residency directors and 2) having a lengthy period (especially 5 years) during which you did work that had absolutely nothing to do with medicine looks, well, really bad.

But suddenly all this gets swept under the rug because this guy went to a "top 3 med school" - with a below average step 1 score to boot? Really?

I've also never quite understood the fawning that some people in medicine have for those with "interesting work experience" that has absolutely nothing to do with medicine. Smug as they may be, the non-trads at my school are absolutely not totally superior to every other younger student. Some younger students definitely have a better work ethic and are more honest, for starters.

 

[hoyden]

I agree here. Plus, everything I've ever heard/read on the subject indicates that 1) bailing on medicine looks bad to residency directors and 2) having a lengthy period (especially 5 years) during which you did work that had absolutely nothing to do with medicine looks, well, really bad.

Absolutely NOT true.
Might look bad for some, and will look amazing for others. PDs are not all uniformly produced in a lab 😀

 

[Sergio99]

Even though most of what was said here is true from both sides, the fact is that not everybody does always fit the stereotypes; neither the applicants, nor the program directors. People's minds are not mechanical. Statistically the above comments are right, but individually, you never know what the program directors are thinking and how they are going to react. So the only way to know is applying and finding out. This one might say no, another one might say yes.

 

[Birdstrike]

I have my MD from a top 3 med school. Didnt do residency after that - worked for a wall street hedge fund doing biotech. Now coming back to do anesthesia. Step 1: 210. Step 2 pending. Grades average. LORs non-anesthesia except one from pain observership. Not looking for top programs, just medium ranked. Can I get any interviews?

Why in God's name are you leaving a job on Wall St for a career in medicine? Don't do it. I'm saying, don't do it.

 

[dbth77]

Why in God's name are you leaving a job on Wall St for a career in medicine? Don't do it. I'm saying, don't do it.

Posts like this are hilarious. You have no idea what job this guy had, how much he made, what kind of hours or stress he had, or really any details about his situation yet you hear the buzzword Wallstreet St and assume he's leaving something great. It reminds me of the fly-over state masses hearing the words Wall St and really having no idea what it means besides some knee-jerk reaction of 'of those guys must be rich.'

 

[drpainfree]

anesthesiologist is a dead-end job: salary will be capped, respect will be challenged, job stability will be altered.

why going to anesthesia or just any medicine at this point is unknown to me. obviously if your alternative seems dismal too, you have no other choices.

Posts like this are hilarious. You have no idea what job this guy had, how much he made, what kind of hours or stress he had, or really any details about his situation yet you hear the buzzword Wallstreet St and assume he's leaving something great. It reminds me of the fly-over state masses hearing the words Wall St and really having no idea what it means besides some knee-jerk reaction of 'of those guys must be rich.'

 

[dbth77]

anesthesiologist is a dead-end job: salary will be capped, respect will be challenged, job stability will be altered.

why going to anesthesia or just any medicine at this point is unknown to me. obviously if your alternative seems dismal too, you have no other choices.

I really can't tell anymore if the posts on this board are just flat-out hilarious hyperbole or serious responses from entitled people with no connection to the real world and what's currently going on in the economy and other industries

 

[Birdstrike]

:troll: