WAMC Worried about lack of dental-specific facing experiences.

[benjamin_obtainer]

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I am worried about not having enough dental-facing experiences. I will say it has taken some time to figure out what exactly I want to do, but I've realized just how cool the dental field is. I really want to shoot for OMFS or perio, but I would be happy as a gen dentist (I know this is important). As you can see I have jumped around a bit in experiences. Luckily, it all has a common denominator in research. In my post I have a lot of underlined parts, these are essentially things I have considered doing and have the opportunity to. The only issue is my time available, but if it seems like I do not have enough dental-facing experiences I would definitely be able to commit to it!!

I do not really have anyone in my life knowledgeable on this sort of stuff. I have no clue where I stand in application competitiveness – I realize I have a decent score and GPA, but does that really mean anything without a good amount of dental experience? Any advice here on where I stand would be truly amazing.

Date of submission: Upcoming May/June 2025
Overall GPA: 3.93 / 4.00
Science GPA: ~3.87 / 4.00
DAT score (include AA and all sections): QR: 22 / RC: 21 / BIO: 27 / GC: 23 / OC: 27 / TS: 25 / PAT: 21 / AA: 24

State of Residence: Pacific Northwest

Major: Biology
Minority? No
Reapplicant? No
Nontrad? No

Shadowing Experience: ~120 hrs by application, (80 gen dentist, 20 oral surg, 20 periodontist)

Volunteering Experience: ~120 hrs at child bereavement center, supporting grief counseling

Employment: Worked at NASA for a summer (continued for ~2 years supporting the research lab I worked in from time to time), work as TA (4 semesters) in biology course. did ~80 hours working as EMT early in college.

Research: 2000+ hrs, 1 publication (likely not done by application), ~3 posters/presentations.

Other Extracurriculars: Ran health-facing club (not really dental-connected) supporting and promoting research opportunities in biology at my university. I have the chance to periodically volunteer at low-researouce dental clinc. Seems very cool and exciting, just time is a bit of an issue. Should I prioritize this and commit to maximize my application and give more dental-facing experience?

Have you volunteered/shadowed/attended events at any dental schools? Personally toured UWashington Dental School. Took intro to dentistry online course offered by my university. I want to shadow a bit at my university's dental clinic, but have not yet (driven by my fear of not having enough dental-facing experiences.) again, should I prioritize this or commit to the current things I am doing?

Relevant Honors or Awards: Earned prestigious nation-wide scholarship program. 5-time university honors, consistent dean's list. Many small scholarships awarded as well (about 3 or 4).

LOR type and strength: Deciding now, wanted to ask if it would be worth having one from the general dentist I shadowed to maybe make up for the lack of dental experiences?

Misc Info/Things not stated elsewhere/Red Flags: I've said it a lot (and in the title) but my worry is not having enough dental-facing experiences.

School list:

columbia umich

nyu washington

penn

ucla

ucsf

unc

usc

boston u

case

colorado

stony brook

 

[macsak]

I am worried about not having enough dental-facing experiences. I will say it has taken some time to figure out what exactly I want to do, but I've realized just how cool the dental field is. I really want to shoot for OMFS or perio, but I would be happy as a gen dentist (I know this is important). As you can see I have jumped around a bit in experiences. Luckily, it all has a common denominator in research. In my post I have a lot of underlined parts, these are essentially things I have considered doing and have the opportunity to. The only issue is my time available, but if it seems like I do not have enough dental-facing experiences I would definitely be able to commit to it!!

AM I COOKED???

Date of submission: Upcoming May/June 2025
Overall GPA: 3.93 / 4.00
Science GPA: ~3.87 / 4.00
DAT score (include AA and all sections): QR: 22 / RC: 21 / BIO: 27 / GC: 23 / OC: 27 / TS: 25 / PAT: 21 / AA: 24

State of Residence: Pacific Northwest

Major: Biology
Minority? No
Reapplicant? No
Nontrad? No

Shadowing Experience: ~120 hrs by application, (80 gen dentist, 20 oral surg, 20 periodontist)

Volunteering Experience: ~120 hrs at child bereavement center, supporting grief counseling

Employment: Worked at NASA for a summer (continued for ~2 years supporting the research lab I worked in from time to time), work as TA (4 semesters) in biology course. did ~80 hours working as EMT early in college.

Research: 2000+ hrs, 1 publication (likely not done by application), ~3 posters/presentations.

Other Extracurriculars: Ran health-facing club (not really dental-connected) supporting and promoting research opportunities in biology at my university. I have the chance to periodically volunteer at low-researouce dental clinc. Seems very cool and exciting, just time is a bit of an issue. Should I prioritize this and commit to maximize my application and give more dental-facing experience?

Have you volunteered/shadowed/attended events at any dental schools? Personally toured UWashington Dental School. Took intro to dentistry online course offered by my university. I want to shadow a bit at my university's dental clinic, but have not yet (driven by my fear of not having enough dental-facing experiences.) again, should I prioritize this or commit to the current things I am doing?

Relevant Honors or Awards: Earned prestigious nation-wide scholarship program. 5-time university honors, consistent dean's list. Many small scholarships awarded as well (about 3 or 4).

LOR type and strength: Deciding now, wanted to ask if it would be worth having one from the general dentist I shadowed to maybe make up for the lack of dental experiences?

Misc Info/Things not stated elsewhere/Red Flags: I've said it a lot (and in the title) but my worry is not having enough dental-facing experiences.

School list:

columbia umich

nyu washington

penn

ucla

ucsf

unc

usc

boston u

case

colorado

stony brook

why would you not volunteer at UWSOD if you are afraid that you don't have enough dental facing experience?

how did you come up with this school list?

 

[Mr.Smile12]

In my post I have a lot of underlined parts, these are essentially things I have considered doing and have the opportunity to. The only issue is my time available, but if it seems like I do not have enough dental-facing experiences I would definitely be able to commit to it!!

In other words, anticipated activities, which I can ignore for the sake of argument.

Earned prestigious nation-wide scholarship program. 5-time university honors, consistent dean's list. Many small scholarships awarded as well (about 3 or 4).

Nice, but you aren't applying to medical school. Dean's lists just tell me you have a high GPA, which you do.

Describe something you have done that involves intense training with your hands (fine manual dexterity).

You don't have much dental experience at all. Shadowing is nice, but working is better. You have done EMT, so you might be able to find a dental assistant position? Shadowing one practitioner doesn't give you the range of ways dentists run their practices. How do I know you understand what you are getting yourself into?

 

[benjamin_obtainer]

why would you not volunteer at UWSOD if you are afraid that you don't have enough dental facing experience?

I actually plan to start volunteering at my University's dental school! Do you think a few months would be enough to really put forth a strong application?

how did you come up with this school list?

I reached out to some advisors at my University and worked together to build this out – recommendations for reaches, targets, and safeties (at least in their opinions).

 

[benjamin_obtainer]

First off- thank you so much for the response!! It is very very helpful!!

Nice, but you aren't applying to medical school. Dean's lists just tell me you have a high GPA, which you do.

I see. Are such research-facing awards not regarded the same to Dental schools as they are to Medical?

Describe something you have done that involves intense training with your hands (fine manual dexterity).

In my labs I do micron-level dissections on organisms used as models from human systems – I've refined these skills so much that I have been trusted on limited samples from spaceflight missions!

You don't have much dental experience at all. Shadowing is nice, but working is better. You have done EMT, so you might be able to find a dental assistant position? Shadowing one practitioner doesn't give you the range of ways dentists run their practices. How do I know you understand what you are getting yourself into?

I see – this is exactly what I am worried about. I know this is what I want to do – I've shadowed multiple of practitioners and hope to have a strong application. To this end, I want to certainly improve this before application time rolls around! I intend to engage in work at a low-resource dental clinic as well as volunteer at my University's dental school, but just worried about how much experience I can gain in time.

Is my application dead in the water?

Having this completed, where do you think I would stand with regard to the strength of my application? Any other advice considering the above? I would be immensely appreciative!!

Thank you for taking the chance to respond!!

 

[macsak]

I actually plan to start volunteering at my University's dental school! Do you think a few months would be enough to really put forth a strong application?

I reached out to some advisors at my University and worked together to build this out – recommendations for reaches, targets, and safeties (at least in their opinions).

a few months is cutting it close IMO

your advisors are not giving you good advice
your list is WAY too long, but also WAY too top heavy
you should eliminate NYU and USC immediately

columbia umich

unc

penn

ucla

ucsf

6 of the top 6-8 most difficult schools to get into outside of the texas schools

nyu usc get rid of these washington- have you talked to memory brock or dr sue coldwell about your chances at UW? colorado in-range you need more of these your one remaining safety is here, but some would even recommend you getting rid of it boston u case stony brook i know these are in because of research, but your chances at them are not high- look at their matriculation rates for washington residents

please get access to the adea guide/dental school explorer and look at the stats of each school carefully before asking questions like "am i cooked?" and "is my application dead in the water?" your gpa is pretty high and your DAT is in the upper to mid 90 percentiles...

 

[Mr.Smile12]

I see. Are such research-facing awards not regarded the same to Dental schools as they are to Medical?

1) I don't recognize any awards you disclosed as "research-facing," and I'm not sure what that means.

2) Not as much. Now, if you wanted to have more research in your dental education, read

Bridging the Gap Between the Bench and Chairside: The DDS/PhD Pathway | SDN

Do you want to deliver oral health care and dive deeper into the mechanisms that initiate and promote diseases of the orofacial complex? A combined

www.studentdoctor.net

There are fewer DDS/PhD or DMD/PhD programs vs. MD/PhD. Most dental schools focus on training new dentists and not new academic dentists. That's a topic for a different circumstance.

In my labs I do micron-level dissections on organisms used as models from human systems – I've refined these skills so much that I have been trusted on limited samples from spaceflight missions!

Okay, that is helpful. You will be asked about your fine manual dexterity (I think there's still an essay on this topic on AADSAS).

I see – this is exactly what I am worried about. I know this is what I want to do – I've shadowed multiple of practitioners and hope to have a strong application. To this end, I want to certainly improve this before application time rolls around! I intend to engage in work at a low-resource dental clinic as well as volunteer at my University's dental school, but just worried about how much experience I can gain in time.

Is my application dead in the water?

Having this completed, where do you think I would stand with regard to the strength of my application? Any other advice considering the above? I would be immensely appreciative!!

Thank you for taking the chance to respond!!

The main question most adcoms want to know is how you got to a decision you wanted to be a dentist. Do you have enough insight about the profession to take on 40 years of work in the field? Yes, I think working at a low-resource clinic and your dental school will help, but as someone coming from a different industry, you need to show you have made an irreversible turn. The training takes much more than just good grades and knowledge. And the education debt/investment is not trivial.

Contact the folks at UW as macsak recommended. UW is your in-state option, though you have a private dental school that also opened up to consider.

Ask the Expert: Fotinos S. Panagakos, Dean, Pacific Northwest University School of Dental Medicine | SDN

Fotinos S. Panagakos, DMD, PhD is the founding dean of the Pacific Northwest University of Health Sciences (PNWU) School of Dental Medicine. He recently

www.studentdoctor.net

 

[benjamin_obtainer]

a few months is cutting it close IMO

your advisors are not giving you good advice
your list is WAY too long, but also WAY too top heavy
you should eliminate NYU and USC immediately

please get access to the adea guide/dental school explorer and look at the stats of each school carefully before asking questions like "am i cooked?" and "is my application dead in the water?" your gpa is pretty high and your DAT is in the upper to mid 90 percentiles...

Hello, your response to my WAMC post is incredible, and I thank you very much. I honestly feel so lost with this whole process, and realizing the misleading of my advisors for my school list only further distresses me. I will certainly be investing the explorer tool you said.

Two questions: why do you recommend removing NYU and USC?

Also, if I were to get some experience in these next few months (~4 ish months) with some dental volunteering/ maybe light assisting, would that make a big improvement in my app?

I do not really have anyone in my life knowledgeable on this sort of stuff. I have no clue where I stand in application competitiveness – I know i have a high score and GPA, but does that really mean anything without a good amount of dental experience? Any advice here on where I stand would be truly amazing.

 

[Smile2thetop]

Truth is no one can tell you exactly where you stand. That's up to the cycle and the randomness that comes with the process. That said, with a high GPA/DAT, over 100 hours of shadowing, and meaningful extracurriculars, you're in a good place to get in. The remaining steps to solidify that spot would be

- create a coherent application where you tell a story that highlights your personal achievements but also sufficiently makes your interest in dentistry clear despite that not being a major theme perhaps in your ecs
- apply to schools that are aligned with your stats/experiences. Here you don't want schools that are too low (like NYU or USC) and will therefore not entertain your application (look up yield protection) but also don't want only the top schools. Focus on research heavy schools, and those regionally closest to you.
- do well on the interviews.

I personally wouldn't be worried about "dental hours" too much, as being an assistant or even having particular activities that highlight manual dexterity aren't requirements per se. Stay somewhat engaged with dentistry between now and the application and continue to do things that are meaningful to you and impactful to others.

 

[Smile2thetop]

For LORs definitely make sure you get one from a dentist. The best combination is typically 1 dentist, 2 science profs, and 1 other (in this case your PI should be included since you have so many research hours).

You seem like an excellent candidate for UW so any involvement you can have with the school would be excellent.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

So an imperfect analogy with athletics.

You run a 40-yard dash in 4.3s. You bench press 250+ pounds. You can jump high (10 feet).

But you want to join the swim team. And it will cost you $400K to join, not counting any extra money for additional coaching. $600K for USC.

You have some excellent characteristics. Just make sure this is what you want to do and lean on advice from admissions professionals, current students, and current professionals (recent graduates/residents/owners). Dentistry admissions is generally regionalistic, so your best shots are going to your in-state programs (both UW and PNWU).

 

[macsak]

Hello, your response to my WAMC post is incredible, and I thank you very much. I honestly feel so lost with this whole process, and realizing the misleading of my advisors for my school list only further distresses me. I will certainly be investing the explorer tool you said.

Two questions: why do you recommend removing NYU and USC?

Also, if I were to get some experience in these next few months (~4 ish months) with some dental volunteering/ maybe light assisting, would that make a big improvement in my app?

I do not really have anyone in my life knowledgeable on this sort of stuff. I have no clue where I stand in application competitiveness – I know i have a high score and GPA, but does that really mean anything without a good amount of dental experience? Any advice here on where I stand would be truly amazing.

look at the gpa/dat stats for these schools and the cost of attendance
you are WAY about their stats and they are VERY expensive schools
your advisors suggested these as safeties, but they are not appropriate to your situation

 

[macsak]

Hello, your response to my WAMC post is incredible, and I thank you very much. I honestly feel so lost with this whole process, and realizing the misleading of my advisors for my school list only further distresses me. I will certainly be investing the explorer tool you said.

Two questions: why do you recommend removing NYU and USC?

Also, if I were to get some experience in these next few months (~4 ish months) with some dental volunteering/ maybe light assisting, would that make a big improvement in my app?

I do not really have anyone in my life knowledgeable on this sort of stuff. I have no clue where I stand in application competitiveness – I know i have a high score and GPA, but does that really mean anything without a good amount of dental experience? Any advice here on where I stand would be truly amazing.

the rest of the questions are more difficult to answer

when did you decide to switch to dental?
what was your plan before dental?
how many ACTUAL shadowing/volunteering hours do you have?

you need to separate what you have done from what you are planning to do...