Wash U, Yale, and UPenn Which One/

[BeccaBoo]

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I am trying to do my rank order list and can not decide between UPenn, Yale, and Wash U and what order to put these in. Does anyone have opinions on these programs? Especially on Wash U and their work load on wards.
Thanks a bunch guys.

 

[ucla2usc]

I am trying to do my rank order list and can not decide between UPenn, Yale, and Wash U and what order to put these in. Does anyone have opinions on these programs? Especially on Wash U and their work load on wards.
Thanks a bunch guys.

Penn all the way, better city, better program. PENN is top 5, very supportive, great clinical training, autonomy, excellent research, faculty, fellowship placement. You can't go wrong there.

 

[quidnunc]

I also agree for the above mentioned reasons (research, autonomy, program reputation, etc.), stick with :

1. U Penn
2. Wash U.
3. Yale

I'm sorry to see you in such a bad predicament. 😉

 

[DrRobert]

1. WashU
2. Penn
3. Yale

WashU has been top 5 for a long time. Those who don't agree with that usually cite location as the reason.

Not everyone thinks Philly is a great city btw.

 

[BeccaBoo]

Thanks for your input guys. My main concern is about Wash U and their work load. There is one resident per two interns. This means that one resident could cap at 24 pts! I am coming from a program where it is typical for a resident to have 22-24 pts on a team and I do not think this is optimal for learning. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind working, but I also want to learn. Does anyone know the typical medicine ward census numbers at Wash U and if the residents are overworked??
Thanks

 

[ucladukes]

Thanks for your input guys. My main concern is about Wash U and their work load. There is one resident per two interns. This means that one resident could cap at 24 pts! I am coming from a program where it is typical for a resident to have 22-24 pts on a team and I do not think this is optimal for learning. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind working, but I also want to learn. Does anyone know the typical medicine ward census numbers at Wash U and if the residents are overworked??
Thanks

I didn't know that 1 resident/2 interns wasn't the norm at most programs

Every program I went to save 1 or 2 had it that way

 

[generaltso]

penn is also 1 resident per 2 interns, with a 24 pt cap. i also believe this is the norm...

 

[coldfeet]

Thanks for your input guys. My main concern is about Wash U and their work load. There is one resident per two interns. This means that one resident could cap at 24 pts! I am coming from a program where it is typical for a resident to have 22-24 pts on a team and I do not think this is optimal for learning. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind working, but I also want to learn. Does anyone know the typical medicine ward census numbers at Wash U and if the residents are overworked??
Thanks

I have the impression that 24 pts per resident is a very rare occurrence. It also seemed like the interns did most of the work for the patients, so having 24 patients would not be that time consuming?

 

[2359]

Yale is a 1 resident:1 intern system with a cap of 12 per intern/resident pair.

 

[BStein76]

Thanks for your input guys. My main concern is about Wash U and their work load. There is one resident per two interns. Does anyone know the typical medicine ward census numbers at Wash U and if the residents are overworked??
Thanks

I peeked at an intern's census and it wasn't bad. The interns raved about how they were able to sleep in call (in contrast to other programs). The interns looked well rested to me. The list that I looked at had about 18-20 total patients for the team; my home program routinely has 14-20+ patients for a 1 resident + 2 interns + 2 med student team at the county hospital; maybe a little less at the VA hospital.

 

[PickyBicky]

Does anyone know ...if the residents are overworked??
Thanks

Where is this not the case? I think autonomy and patient diversity will contribute most to the overall teaching and learning that takes place on a service... Duke has the 1 intern to 1 resident on the general medicine wards. Not my cup of tea. As a PGY2/3, do you really want to follow around your intern all day? In that setting, two interns would be a blessing, no?

I agree with the above...I thought 2 interns, 1 senior resident, cap at 24 was more common than not.

-PB

 

[coldfeet]

Where is this not the case? I think autonomy and patient diversity will contribute most to the overall teaching and learning that takes place on a service... Duke has the 1 intern to 1 resident on the general medicine wards. Not my cup of tea. As a PGY2/3, do you really want to follow around your intern all day? In that setting, two interns would be a blessing, no?

I agree with the above...I thought 2 interns, 1 senior resident, cap at 24 was more common than not.

-PB

Great point! I would thinkthat in a 1 intern: 1 resident system, the resident would end up functioning like an intern much of the time (taking care of much of the scut)

 

[jadedbearsprite]

Great point! I would thinkthat in a 1 intern: 1 resident system, the resident would end up functioning like an intern much of the time (taking care of much of the scut)

I also agree with most of the above postings. I got the impression that a 1 resident:2 intern team is pretty much the norm, at least at 1 hospital in each program. My home institution has 1R:1 intern on the university GM wards, and the resident ends up helping the intern out A LOT, which is nice of them, but as a resident, you don't want to be an intern anymore.

I only interviewed at Penn, which I LOVED. So I would rank the three:
1. Penn
2. WashU
3. Yale

I did not apply to Yale based on what I heard and read on Scutwork which is not positive. However, I recently worked with a fellow who just finished his residency at Yale and loved it there.

I don't think you can go wrong with any of these programs. Therefore, I think it will be the less tangible factors that will help you decide in the end, such as city. Philly is a large, East coast city that actually is affordable for its size and location. New Haven is much smaller. I tend to think of it has having Yale and not much else. Please correct me if I'm wrong. St. Louis is a large midwestern city. Probably very affordable compared to the other 2.

 

[BStein76]

I agree with the above...I thought 2 interns, 1 senior resident, cap at 24 was more common than not.

-PB

"Agree with above"

- I just wanted to practice that phrase before entering residency

 

[Bobblehead]

"Agree with above"

- I just wanted to practice that phrase before entering residency

Just remember you can't agree with anything in the medical student's note for billing purposes except the review of systems, social and family history. The attending can write a short "I saw and evaluated the patient with Dr. X and agree with his note" but then the note being referenced must be a physician's note.