Wedding during residency?

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

Scrubs920

Full Member
10+ Year Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2009
Messages
43
Reaction score
2
My daughter got engaged and I am tasked to do all the wedding plans due to her grueling schedule. I can understand and am willing to do as much of the legwork as possible. My daughter tells me that the wedding must take place on Sunday since that is her only day off. I wish programs would have more flexibility in their vacation allotment. Currently she gets two slots of two weeks that must be used to cover her religious holidays. Finding halls for a reasonable price in a timely manner is very tough if I am only restricted to a Sunday affair.

Members don't see this ad.
 
Last edited:
She gets vacation, guaranteed. It's likely she was given the chance to ask for vacation at a specific time to accommodate a major event such as her own wedding. If she is choosing not to use vacation time for her wedding, then you have only her to blame for any constraints in planning.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 4 users
Her two 2 week blocks are taken up by religious holidays so there is no wiggle room there. Without vacation days to play with (remember, they do not allow one to break up vacation days, only blocks of 2 weeks at a time) and the difficulty in finding wedding venues with the right price and size, one needs some flexibility to find a good fit.
 
Last edited:
Her two 2 week blocks are taken up by religious holidays so there is no wiggle room there. If they wont give her off for a wedding they most certainly will not give off for religious holidays. Without vacation days to play with (remember, they do not allow one to break up vacation days, only blocks of 2 weeks at a time) and the difficulty in finding wedding venues with the right price and size, one needs some flexibility to find a good fit. Common courtesy would dictate a little play for this once in a lifetime event. I am almost afraid to ask what the policy is for giving birth! Oh brother!

Unfortunately medical careers in general, but residency in particular, require a lot of sacrificed time and difficult choices. I have colleagues who are extremely observant in a variety of faiths, and all have had to work on certain holidays, or make arrangements to have them off that meant working extra later. Most of the major religions account for the work of caring for others/healing the sick as an appropriate reason to be excused from traditional observances.

If your usual observance of holidays includes international travel- the only thing I can think of that would involve a two-week vacation block- it may soon become necessary for your daughter to either find a way to observe these days closer to home, or understand that she will have no other blocks of time off for the duration of her residency. Including for her wedding. This isn't college, or even med school, anymore. At the end of residency she will be expected to have completed a certain number of weeks of training to be eligible for her license- if not, she will have to make them up. That's just the way it works.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 3 users
At the end of residency she will be expected to have completed a certain number of weeks of training to be eligible for her license- if not, she will have to make them up. That's just the way it works.
Understood, but as I stated previously, we are talking about a once in a lifetime event for one possibly two days. I have searched with our friend Google and noticed this topic brought up but in all cases people were asking about being allowed or asking permission for a week of honeymoon time, I have not seen where people were having problems with their wedding day itself.
 
Last edited:
Understood, but as I stated previously, we are talking about a once in a lifetime event for one possibly two days. I have searched with our friend Google and noticed this topic brought up but in all cases people were asking about being allowed or asking permission for a week of honeymoon time, I have not seen where people were having problems with their wedding day itself. Her attending's answer to her was "get married after you finish your residency".

I am at a relatively benign, friendly program, and if one of my residents insisted that an exception be made for her to have more time off than her colleagues, in order for her to have an event whose timing she controls completely, I might just say the same thing. Four weeks of vacation not enough? Guess you'll have to wait until you have more vacation time.

You don't see many topics about wedding days themselves because most people at this stage are adult enough to make whatever tough choices are necessary to have their wedding day. Lengthy vacations are usually a different animal.

I'd be interested to know what field she is in that guarantees work Monday through Saturday with no flexibility for every rotation of an entire year.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 4 users
My daughter got engaged and I am tasked to do all the wedding plans due to her grueling schedule. I can understand and am willing to do as much of the legwork as possible but one item makes no sense to me. She tells me that the wedding must take place on Sunday since that is her only day off and her program will not allow her to take off during the week even to get married. Mind you we are not asking for a week off for honeymoon or anything like that, only one, possible two days off for a wedding. Are residents truly treated so poorly? I tell her that it is impossible for professionals to behave in such a manner, but what do I know! Finding halls for a reasonable price in a timely manner is very tough if I am only restricted to a Sunday affair.
Bizarre that all of her days off are on Sundays. Almost no way that can be correct. The hospital isn't only open M-Sa, so *someone* is working on those Sundays, which means that someone else has (for example) Saturday off. I don't know about her program, but if that is the case and there are other residents who have a different day off in the week, she can almost certainly trade days off with someone (with notice to the program well in advance and appropriate paperwork filled out for who covers who when).

If one of my coresidents wanted to work out coverage for this sort of thing, I'd probably agree. With payback of course. On the other hand, if one of my coresidents asked for extra days off? No. Do it on your own time, whether that's on vacation, days off you already have, or whatever. I have had numerous colleagues get married so far in residency, and not a single one of them have gotten an extra day off for it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 3 users
I'd be interested to know what field she is in that guarantees work Monday through Saturday with no flexibility for every rotation of an entire year.

I asked my daughter if she can switch her Sunday day off with another resident but I believe she said everyone is off on Sunday and Saturday is not an option. I guess it looks like it will have to be a Sunday wedding, I just don't know what the policy is when one gives birth. I assume one simply forgoes a rotation, which I guess makes sense.

Mind you, she has no problem with this, she simply stated that it must be a Sunday wedding, it is I that had a hard time believing the inflexibility of the system.
 
Last edited:
This sounds fishy. She can only do it on a Sunday because she NEVER gets any other days off ever? In a pathology residency? There's not a lot going on in pathology on a Saturday that also wouldn't happen on a Sunday (i.e. frozen sections, autopsies, etc.). How much in advance is this wedding being planned? If she is unwilling to change her vacation dates, the program technically has no obligation to accommodate her for extra time off (especially since others who get married in her program are probably using their vacation weeks to do so).
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
How exactly are both you and your "daughter" residents at the same time? Seems more than a little bit fishy.

No mystery here, she is the resident, I am tasked to plan the wedding :)
 
This sounds fishy. She can only do it on a Sunday because she NEVER gets any other days off ever? In a pathology residency? There's not a lot going on in pathology on a Saturday that also wouldn't happen on a Sunday (i.e. frozen sections, autopsies, etc.). How much in advance is this wedding being planned? If she is unwilling to change her vacation dates, the program technically has no obligation to accommodate her for extra time off (especially since others who get married in her program are probably using their vacation weeks to do so).

She is a sabbath observer in a sabbath program, don't quite know why she never works on Sunday. I always assumed that if you are in a sabbath program you basically lose Sundays in the process. Now people stop jumping on her, she, as I am beginning to see by the responses here, is right that there is no flexibility in residency programs, she told me up front "IT MUST BE A SUNDAY WEDDING" it is I that found it hard to believe that I did not have the flexibility to make a mid-week wedding for her hence my thread here. I guess she was right!
 
She is a sabbath observer in a sabbath program, don't quite know why she never works on Sunday. I always assumed that if you are in a sabbath program you basically lose Sundays in the process. Now people stop jumping on her, she, as I am beginning to see by the responses here, is right that there is no flexibility in residency programs, she told me up front "IT MUST BE A SUNDAY WEDDING" it is I that found it hard to believe that I did not have the flexibility to make a mid-week wedding for her hence my thread here. I guess she was right!
It can be very hard for someone outside medicine to grasp just how inflexible medicine can be at times. I know a wedding is an important day, but it is completely voluntary. I lost a parent on July 1st of my PGY3 year. Literally the worst possible time for a senior resident to be pulled from the schedule. But my program was very understanding and gave me all the time I needed to have off. THAT is the kind of event that gets extra days off. Not a wedding that you can CHOOSE to schedule.


Re: troll status, I just figured the daughter had OP log into her account. Maybe against the ToS, but possible...
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
Re: troll status, I just figured the daughter had OP log into her account. Maybe against the ToS, but possible...

Sorry about that guys, Google directed me to this site and I guess IE/Firefox autologged me in. I will bow out gracefully ...
 
Her two 2 week blocks are taken up by religious holidays so there is no wiggle room there. If they wont give her off for a wedding they most certainly will not give off for religious holidays. Without vacation days to play with (remember, they do not allow one to break up vacation days, only blocks of 2 weeks at a time) and the difficulty in finding wedding venues with the right price and size, one needs some flexibility to find a good fit. Common courtesy would dictate a little play for this once in a lifetime event. I am almost afraid to ask what the policy is for giving birth! Oh brother!

She needs to decide what is more important, a wedding or missing one religious holiday in one year. If it's the wedding, then do it during vacation. If it is the religious holiday, get married after residency... Your daughter sounds downright inflexible and her thinking doesn't make much sense.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 users
I thought I closed this thread but it appears that I was either not clear, or there is a comprehension problem or people simply do not read the entire thread before responding to a single post on a thread so I will try to explain so here it goes.


(1)The resident, my daughter, got engaged and being that her day off is Sunday would like to make her wedding on Sunday. She is not asking for special consideration or special treatment. I am sure that all have no problem with this. She is not inflexible and religion does not come into play. Case closed with regards to her role in this argument!!!


(2)Myself, her mother, is tasked with booking and paying for the wedding and would have a much easier task if I was not restricted to a Sunday only option. Sundays get booked way in advance and is much more expensive. So being that I come from a “world” where one gets vacation time in days not blocks of days and is accustomed to “personal days” (like what would one do if they were called to traffic court) and sick days. I was simply surprised when my daughter told me such flexibility does not exist in a residency program. I was wrong, she was right. As to the vacation blocks they are inflexible, one block is for the next Passover next April and one is for the upcoming set of high holidays and the debating of or trying to explain why these vacation blocks were chosen and why we cannot chose other blocks is not debatable, plus it is not fair or is rather pointless to debate my religious beliefs with yours, just accept its choice as an axiom for the purpose of this argument.


If the sysop wants to delete this thread as being a troll thread then please feel free. I hope this clarification can close this thread. Again, my apologies.
 
If the sysop wants to delete this thread as being a troll thread then please feel free. I hope this clarification can close this thread. Again, my apologies.

Look on the bright side- this thread may be helpful in the future, to help another resident or their family member realize just what they are getting into.

Best of luck to your daughter.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Is it an option for her to get married on her two-week April block on one of the days Passover is not? IIRC, Passover celebrations last a week, although I could be wrong on this of course. It seems to me though that since she has already taken this time off, if not every day is used for religious celebrations or prohibited by religious beliefs, one of those days could be used.
 
I agree with the others.

Your daughter is the one to blame here, not the residency program or the medical education system.

A 2 week block for vacation is clearly revealed to incoming and current residents months in advance. Your daughter would have been well advised about the fact that her program offers vacation in a block time fashion far in advance of any wedding planning. She had the opportunity to schedule her wedding during one of the blocks or to request that the block be changed to a different 2 week period.

As others have noted, a wedding is a planned, voluntary event usually with several months to years advance notice. Her program is under no obligation to offer her a different schedule than others have or any additional time off. Frankly, either your daughter is not being entirely honest with you, is too scared to inquire about the possibility of switching a Sunday off for another day or she is a less than stellar resident (because some programs would make an exception to any stated rules about days off for a wedding, at least for a good resident, and as long as it didn't hurt other residents). The workload volume and educational experiences during the week would generally make having a mid-week day off difficult for most residencies.

But the bottom line is that she had the opportunity, like everyone else (including someone in this same thread who recently got married) to schedule her wedding or other personal activities during the generous 4 weeks off she receives or on the weekly Sunday off she gets, but is making things difficult for you by choosing not to use her vacation time for her wedding but instead chose Sunday.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Is it an option for her to get married on her two-week April block on one of the days Passover is not? IIRC, Passover celebrations last a week, although I could be wrong on this of course. It seems to me though that since she has already taken this time off, if not every day is used for religious celebrations or prohibited by religious beliefs, one of those days could be used.

Telling them to wait to get married until April '16 is off the table it is simply too far away. They are not the type of people who will "live together".
 
The Sunday requirement is not one of her inflexibility, it is her reality of that being her only day off.
But its not her only day off.

She has 4 WEEKS off but instead of choosing to get married then, she has forced you into planning a wedding on a Sunday. So she is being the inflexible one as far as we can see.

We sympathize with you as this is not a world you're familiar with. Your daughter is. Since she cannot ask for anything that would be unfair to her co-workers, her only option (if she refuses to be married during her vacation) is a Sunday wedding.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 4 users
Look on the bright side- this thread may be helpful in the future, to help another resident or their family member realize just what they are getting into.

Best of luck to your daughter.


Thank you for the wishes. Anyway, this is now a non-issue. Thank g-d, one of the caterers that I have been waiting on just got back to me. I got my Sunday! Not only that, at a fantastic price (at least in my circle), Under $10k for a wedding for 300 guests including 16 hot dishes for the buffet! This includes the hall and the food, now I can deal with the flowers, photographer and orchestra. Alls well that ends well.

Good luck everyone on your residency.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
Congratulations.

I would suggest editing out some of the details in these posts, as I imagine that there are very few female pathology residents in sabbath programs getting married on that specific date, and your daughter's program might not love reading these complaints. Heck she might not either.

Thanks for the tip. My daughter had no complaints, she loves her program, and why not, she is off every Saturday and Sunday and her vacation blocks cover her holidays, I complained, the meddling mother of the bride!
 
What's the rush?

Maybe this was rhetorical, but clearly this resident is very religiously observant. She wants to begin "married life" (you know what I mean) as soon as possible, and unlike many engaged couples, probably isn't planning to do that until after the wedding. I can respect that... but like I've been saying since the beginning, medicine comes with a lot of constraints. Choosing to add other constraints is fine, you just have to be willing to deal with the inconveniences that result.


(Edited b/c I accidentally a word.)
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 users
Just fly to Las Vegas and have Elvis do the wedding.
Problem solved.

Or do what I did and get married in your back yard.

My daughter got engaged and I am tasked to do all the wedding plans due to her grueling schedule. I can understand and am willing to do as much of the legwork as possible. My daughter tells me that the wedding must take place on Sunday since that is her only day off. I wish programs would have more flexibility in their vacation allotment. Currently she gets two slots of two weeks that must be used to cover her religious holidays. Finding halls for a reasonable price in a timely manner is very tough if I am only restricted to a Sunday affair.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Maybe this was rhetorical, but clearly this resident is very religiously observant. She wants to begin "married life" (you know what I mean) as soon as possible, and unlike many engaged couples, probably isn't planning to do that until after the wedding. I can respect that...

I understand what you mean.

I had made the erroneous assumption that although she was in a Sabbath observant residency, that it was not necessarily the case that she was observant, given that she was off on Sunday. I was assuming she was working Friday night - Saturday night to cover for her observant colleagues and then was off on Sunday.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
Understood, but as I stated previously, we are talking about a once in a lifetime event for one possibly two days. I have searched with our friend Google and noticed this topic brought up but in all cases people were asking about being allowed or asking permission for a week of honeymoon time, I have not seen where people were having problems with their wedding day itself.
sorry, but she is choosing to use her vacation blocks to accommodate her religious holidays over her wedding..she can't get "extra" days because she has decided to have her once in a lifetime experience during her residency...she is going to have to pick...wedding or religious holidays..OR she could have her wedding within the 2 week block she is taking for her religious holiday...OR she waits to get married when there are no limits to her time.

and it is not typical for a program to make one take their vacations as 2 week blocks...some do, some don't.

out of curiosity...what religious event takes 2 weeks?
 
Last edited:
sorry, but she is choosing to use her vacation blocks to accommodate her religious holidays over her wedding..she can't get "extra" days because she has decided to have her once in a lifetime experience during her residency...she is going to have to pick...wedding or religious holidays..OR she could have her wedding within the 2 week block she is taking for her religious holiday...OR she waits to get married when there are no limits to her time.

and it is not typical for a program to make one take their vacations as 2 week blocks...some do, some don't.

out of curiosity...what religious event takes 2 weeks?
The Sept-Oct Jewish Holidays take longer than 2 weeks. There's 2 days at the beginning (Rosh Hashanah) you aren't allowed to work, one day eight days later (Yom Kippur), 2 days five days after that (Sukkot) and yet another day a week later. That's 6 days in a ~20 day period, not counting any saturdays in there which are extra days. The actual "High Holy Days" are only Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur, but that's still 3 days over a 10 day period. Definitely doesn't fit in a week.

Getting married during that period is hard, because (if I remember right), you can't do it between Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur, and while you can do it between Kippur and Sukkot, if that falls over a weekend you are running out of days to do it. Looking ahead in the calendar, the only option during that block at all for a heavily observant Jew to get married would probably be Thursday, Sept 24 (or Sunday, Sept 27... but that's still a Sunday). Doing it before Rosh Hashanah is probably more doable most of the time, except that this year Rosh Hashanah is a Monday, so that won't work.

The other period is Passover (Pesach), which is an eight day holiday. The first two and the last two days are also ones you can't work. That's four days over an eight day period, still not counting the Saturday which is probably in the middle of that period. I don't know about the rules regarding those middle 4 days and weddings. If you're taking a 2 week block, the 6 days before/after are probably easier, but per mom above, they don't want to wait for the spring.

There's another couple non-working holidays stuck that aren't in either of those periods, but those are the big ones.

(Note: I'm not the least bit religious, though I've had friends over the years who are. Take what I said with a grain of salt, because there's rules upon rules and I only know some of them).
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 2 users
(Note: I'm not the least bit religious, though I've had friends over the years who are. Take what I said with a grain of salt, because there's rules upon rules and I only know some of them).

Informative post, thank you. Before OP clarified, I had actually assumed their religion was Hinduism, and the two week vacations were needed for trips to India and back. I have had many Jewish colleagues, mostly Reform or Conservative, and none have taken more than a week off at a time around Yom Kippur.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Consider having the wedding on either thanksgiving day or christmas eve. both thursdays this year. most hospitals will have little to no elective surgeries, and for a pathology resident, there should be ample opportunity to take the day off.
 
The program sounds quite flexible, actually. It's a shabbos program, so she is off starting Friday night to Saturday night. And, she seems to get every Sunday off. So, basically, she gets the whole weekend off, every weekend. That's actually quite generous. I am amazed she gets Sundays off -- I would expect the fri-Sat religious period would count as the 1-day-off-in-7.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 4 users
There's a bit of a disconnect here between OPs perception and how residency training programs work. OP sees religious holidays as a given -- fixed days his daughter needs off and can't work, distinct from vacation. The residency likely looks at it that they are being quite accommodating in letting her time her vacation days to encompass her religious needs. I suspect there are others in the program that would love more days off too. Doesn't work that way. You only get so many days off and as far as a residency is concerned you can spend them on religion, weddings etc but that's all from the same set number -- if you choose one you necessarilly sacrifice from the other. Even if that's not an option based on scripture.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
The program sounds quite flexible, actually. It's a shabbos program, so she is off starting Friday night to Saturday night. And, she seems to get every Sunday off. So, basically, she gets the whole weekend off, every weekend. That's actually quite generous. I am amazed she gets Sundays off -- I would expect the fri-Sat religious period would count as the 1-day-off-in-7.
That's what confused me. I had assumed she was a non-observant resident covering Friday and Saturday and then getting Sundays off.
 
Informative post, thank you. Before OP clarified, I had actually assumed their religion was Hinduism, and the two week vacations were needed for trips to India and back. I have had many Jewish colleagues, mostly Reform or Conservative, and none have taken more than a week off at a time around Yom Kippur.
If she was Hindu and so strict about requiring religious days off she'd be off most of the year, ha.
 
Top