What about a PhD/DO?

[docbill]

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Hi All,

I was wondering if anyone knows what it is like to have a PhD and then complete a DO. I am in that boat (don't want to come across the wrong way)... I liked research so I did a Masters and now finishing my PhD. I hope to start DO prog in Aug. 2005.

I know that for MD schools, if you have an PhD it is a big plus. You will have advantage over residency and benefits, as well as univeristy based employements... becoming prof or associate etc...

Also how big are school (AZCOM, CCOM, UNE, NSUCOM, PCOM, KCOM, COMP, LECOM, etc... ) on Research experience for admis... should I talk about it... bragg or just mention it and talk about other qualities, qualifications etc...

Any advice on this and what is the best and worst school to match up with would be great.

BA

 

[Docgeorge]

I have a class mate who will be defending his PhD in Immunology form Iowa State this Sept. I believe that there is PhD in the class of 2005. Having a PhD will definately set you appart from the crowd. Also try to go to a school that encourages research. That way you can stay in the game.

PMG

 

[Amy B]

We have a classmate that has his PhD and is now an MSI at VCOM. He is the only one that has his doctorate. I can only assume it helped him get in.

VCOM talked about research during orientation and in fact we can have one of our rotations be a research project in our 4th year. They have some great research going on. Some of the profs have NIH grants and are working on their research. It is a part of their vision that they want to grow and are making strides already in reaching that part of their vision.

 

[docbill]

Thanks for the replies... I think it will help with getting in as well as future prospective. I know that most DO schools have said that they want to push research... but very few actually have basic or clinical research going on. AZCOM, CCOM, PCOM, UNECOM. VCOM did not even send me a supplement yet... they said they will contact me in 6-8weeks with their decision. 9 others did and some even called for interview.

I will have to contact them and see what they have to say. By the way how do you like VCOM.

Thanks

 

[Amy B]

We just finished a 3 day orientation and will start classes on Monday, so I don't know much yet. However, I really like all the staff (granted, I haven't had their exams yet 😉 ) I really like how they have structured the 1st block (11 weeks) We have numerous afternoons off so we can get lots of studying in before evening which is helpful to those of us with families. They have paid our dues to AOA and VOMA which is great. I will let you know if I like it but for now, I have to say that I like it very much. My fellow classmates are great.

Good luck with the application process

 

[phd2b]

At PCSOM the Class of 2007 has one PhD OMS-II and one (me) who is almost finished with a PhD. I'd have to believe that the faculty liked my research, but it has not helped me one bit as far as getting through the program. I have lots of folks who want me to help them do research (applied osteopathic research, primarily), but none of the schools that I have observed have the kind of hard-core research component common at a top-20 NIH-funded medical school (no offense to those schools with budding and established research programs).

What do you want to do with the phd??? I personally will likely teach, research, practice, and consult, so the PhD won't be a wasted effort, and I'd suspect that the credentials will help more in landing a desirable residency spot than med school spot, but I may be inhaling some of the same smoke I'm blowing... 😉

PM me if you'd like to discuss further.

 

[dr.z]

I am currently finishing up my Ph.D in Molecular Microbiology and Immunology. Although my research interest and objective is more biochemistry oreinted and cell signaling. I applied to both allopathic and osteopathic schools for entering class of 2005. I'm not too optimistic about allo programs since my numbers don't shine like people that post here.

I did get an interview invite from COMP. I visited them during their info session, but they don't really have any research. Their curriculum doesn't allow much free time either. I hope to get into school that has more research.

I would like to be in academic medicine where I'll be able to run lab and do clinical work. Do you know if it would be more difficult for D.O./Ph.D to obtain academic position and also to get NIH grants?

 

[docbill]

PhD2B that is great info.

I don't think PhD will help me get through prog any faster or any easier.
I do want to stay active in research durring and after. Like you I wish to be associated with an institution/University and pref University Hospital. Doing bench to bedside work. My work now is touching on both basic and clinical. I do most all my work in a Univer Hosp and my PI is an MD clinician scientist. That looks like fun..

Unfortunatly I did not apply to PSCOM.. since I am a Canadian hey.. I had to be selective with where I would have the best chance. PSCOM class is too small.

Should I push my desire to do research in the future ... during my interviews. Or should I say well change of mind.. and I just want to do FP. I don't think I would do the later.. I will probably tell them the truth. They will prob like that more.

I will keep in touch and send you message soon.

Thanks
BA

 

[phd2b]

Be smart and be honest in your interviews! I simply told them that I grew up in a rural area so their mission matched my background. I told them that I had an academic interest in applying research to underserved populations that mapped to their mission (appalachia, in this case). They apparently bought it as I am now an OMS-II...the kicker for me, of course, was that I actually love the OMT and have experienced a lot of relief (and a couple of curative therapies based on musculoskeletal problems (sports injuries) that I'd had for a long time that allopathic docs had no answer for). So, unless I end up doing something very specialized, like rad-onc, I'd like to have the ability to do OMT on patients who need it and I'm honing those skills now accordingly. Will I do an AOA-approved residency? I don't know, though I will ernestly search for a program that is dually approved so that I'll be AOA and ACGME approved! I'm pretty excited that I have all options open to me across the spectrum of practice settings (academic, private, government, and combinations thereof). So, whereas I feel blessed to be able to do OMT (and bill for it!), I also know I have a heck of a 2nd year ahead of me.

Finally, for those of you PHD types with fantasies of conducting a lot of research during the school year of OMSI and OMSII, keep dreaming. I've found that the course load is simply too much to keep up with any cogent research (think required courses from 8-5 daily for many weeks, followed by study). Perhaps this is an obvious indictment on my own mental prowess... 😉

Notwithstanding, there is time to conduct research in the semester breaks, the summer break, and as an elective during 3rd/4th years. It is just much harder to do...

As always, depending on geography and temperament, your mileage may vary...

 

[brianjc]

Finally, for those of you PHD types with fantasies of conducting a lot of research during the school year of OMSI and OMSII, keep dreaming. I've found that the course load is simply too much to keep up with any cogent research (think required courses from 8-5 daily for many weeks, followed by study). Perhaps this is an obvious indictment on my own mental prowess... 😉

I disagree. Although tough, you can still do research during the school year. Granted I am the type that rarely attends lectures so I have more free time to research and study. But during my first year of school I spent 10-20 hrs a week in the lab and plan to do so during my second year as well. As long as you work hard and are proactive with your time management you can research and do well in school.

Also if your inclined to do research and can put a few publications out there while you in med school you will be well served when it comes time to apply for residency.

 

[Ypo.]

I am currently finishing up my Ph.D in Molecular Microbiology and Immunology. Although my research interest and objective is more biochemistry oreinted and cell signaling. I applied to both allopathic and osteopathic schools for entering class of 2005. I'm not too optimistic about allo programs since my numbers don't shine like people that post here.

I did get an interview invite from COMP. I visited them during their info session, but they don't really have any research. Their curriculum doesn't allow much free time either. I hope to get into school that has more research.

I would like to be in academic medicine where I'll be able to run lab and do clinical work. Do you know if it would be more difficult for D.O./Ph.D to obtain academic position and also to get NIH grants?

I was wondering why you specifically want to do a DO/PhD-are you interested in researching OMT?

 

[phd2b]

I disagree. Although tough, you can still do research during the school year. Granted I am the type that rarely attends lectures so I have more free time to research and study. But during my first year of school I spent 10-20 hrs a week in the lab and plan to do so during my second year as well. As long as you work hard and are proactive with your time management you can research and do well in school.

Also if your inclined to do research and can put a few publications out there while you in med school you will be well served when it comes time to apply for residency.

OK, fair enough (this is why I said 'your mileage may vary'). Let me condition my earlier response by pointing out that I am required to attend classes. (I'm also a workaholic and I have a family here that I'm responsible for, and I also work part time as a consultant, and I do still work on publishing my papers from my dissertation work...) With all of those sticks in the fire, I have certainly not had any time to entertain *new* research. OTOH, my kids recognize me, my wife loves me, and I take out minimal loans to make it all work...

If I were single, of course, I'd have time to help directly with the research we're cooking up here in eastern KY...pulmonary function and OMT, LBP and OMT, osteoarthritis and OMT...I'll probably help them with study design and statistics, but won't have time to actually participate in the clinical research...

 

[dr.z]

I was wondering why you specifically want to do a DO/PhD-are you interested in researching OMT?

Not particularly in to OMT, but I'll keep option. I will have my Ph.D before entering med school next year (hopefully) so either allopathic or osteopathic I'll be a physician scientist.

I have friends who are M.D. and M.D./Ph.D who are faculty members at academic institution, and they all encourage me to become a physician as well. It will take longer, but they told me that I'll have more doors open to me later in my life.

I am considering DO since I like their philosophy. Also the fact that my stats as an applicant isn't that special in allopathic schools, I don't see myself being too successful there.

 

[Ypo.]

Oh, I understand. Good luck

 

[doyoda2004]

TCOM has a combined DO/Ph.D program. You might try them.

 

[docbill]

TCOM doesn't accept Canadian applicants
thanks for info anyway... PCOM, AZCOM, CCOM and others have similar program... I don't think I am willing to go and redo a PhD... too much work.
BA