What are my chances of matching into top 20 IM program?

[Bigwater]

---

Members don't see this ad.

I recently took Step 1 and scored 22x. I understand that this is a rather subpar score, and I am trying to devise a game plan for my upcoming third year so that I could maximize my chances of matching into any top 20 IM program, if that's possible at all.

I am in a top 5 medical school program, expecting to have one first author paper published by this summer, and have a few abstracts published during M1-M2. I wasn't involved in many EC activities during medical school, though.

Assuming that I'll be performing decently during my third year with honor in IM clerkship, do I have any shot at matching into top 20 IM programs? What should I focus on during next year to maximize my chances? Thank you for your help in advance.

 

[username456789]

Why do you want to go to "any top 20 IM program" in the first place?

 

[GoldenFish]

Here's what helps you match into a top 20 IM program:

- High step scores (245+, realistically)
- H in IM and fantastic third year grades in general
- AOA
- Published research
- Medical school pedigree

The more of those you have, the better off you'll be. There are tons of factors that go into this, so none of the above are "musts" for any program.

Also, why do you want a "top 20"?

 

[Bigwater]

It doesnt have to be a top 20, what I meant was IM programs with decent name values.

Would I be able to make up for the poor Step 1 score with a great Step 2 score, say something over 250?

 

[GoldenFish]

It doesnt have to be a top 20, what I meant was IM programs with decent name values.

Would I be able to make up for the poor Step 1 score with a great Step 2 score, say something over 250?

It helps somewhat. Again, the more of the above you have, the better your chances will be. A lot of times, Step 1 acts like a filter to get your foot in the door as well.

 

[Bigwater]

It helps somewhat. Again, the more of the above you have, the better your chances will be. A lot of times, Step 1 acts like a filter to get your foot in the door as well.

That makes sense. I just searched for the cutoff values of some IM programs, and it seems to be 230 for the top tier programs currenly. But for other decent IM programs, say Georgetown's, would they enforce more or less similar cutoff points meaning that my application wouldn't get a chance to be reviewed at all?

 

[TBV]

That makes sense. I just searched for the cutoff values of some IM programs, and it seems to be 230 for the top tier programs currenly. But for other decent IM programs, say Georgetown's, would they enforce more or less similar cutoff points meaning that my application wouldn't get a chance to be reviewed at all?

I've actually heard georgetowns IM program was trash. From facilities that suck to unhappy and underpaid staff that make life miserable. Just what I heard though.

 

[Taddy Mason]

I've actually heard georgetowns IM program was trash. From facilities that suck to unhappy and underpaid staff that make life miserable. Just what I heard though.

I've heard the exact same for Georgetown IM as well as Psych.

 

[Bigwater]

I've heard the exact same for Georgetown IM as well as Psych.

I've actually heard georgetowns IM program was trash. From facilities that suck to unhappy and underpaid staff that make life miserable. Just what I heard though.

This might sound like a stupid question, but would mid-tier programs like Georgetown's have lower cutoff points compared to top IM programs? I mean would they at least consider my application and not reject it outright based on my step 1 score of 22x?

 

[Cytarabine]

This might sound like a stupid question, but would mid-tier programs like Georgetown's have lower cutoff points compared to top IM programs? I mean would they at least consider my application and not reject it outright based on my step 1 score of 22x?

Step cutoffs are completely program dependent. You can't change your step, so I think it's wasted breath and anxiety to worry about it. Do everything else you can, apply, see where you get interviews. Being at a top school will help

 

[Taddy Mason]

This might sound like a stupid question, but would mid-tier programs like Georgetown's have lower cutoff points compared to top IM programs? I mean would they at least consider my application and not reject it outright based on my step 1 score of 22x?

What @Cytarabine said. How strictly Step cuttoffs are followed, pending the rest of the application, also varies between programs.

 

[235009]

Here's what helps you match into a top 20 IM program:

- High step scores (245+, realistically)
- H in IM and fantastic third year grades in general
- AOA
- Published research
- Medical school pedigree

The more of those you have, the better off you'll be. There are tons of factors that go into this, so none of the above are "musts" for any program.

This is a great way to look at the formula for getting your foot in the door at these "elite" IM programs. Basically you need 3 of the above listed criteria to reliably be considered for an interview. Those at top schools basically get a freebie. In addition those at top med schools tend to have associated "elite" IM programs as their home program(s) that tend to be significantly more lenient with the standards for their med school's students.

It doesnt have to be a top 20, what I meant was IM programs with decent name values.

Would I be able to make up for the poor Step 1 score with a great Step 2 score, say something over 250?

What are your career goals? The fact that you are asking about Georgetown goes to show that your criteria at the moment is "a residency at a hospital that has a name I recognize". GTown IM program has had many struggles and is considered a lower tier program that does not match well. They'd be thrilled to have you but you'll certainly be disappointed.

 

[Bigwater]

What are your career goals? The fact that you are asking about Georgetown goes to show that your criteria at the moment is "a residency at a hospital that has a name I recognize". GTown IM program has had many struggles and is considered a lower tier program that does not match well. They'd be thrilled to have you but you'll certainly be disappointed.

I very much appreciate your reply. My ultimate career goal is to do a GI fellowship after my IM residency. From the limited knowledge that I have of such track, I thnk I've read that for a competitive fellowship such as GI, being exposed to research experiences during your residency training is crucial, which I believe woud be more readily available at more prestigious "big named" academic institutions. So my primary concern was if I were to do my IM residency at a less well-known program that tends to be weaker in terms of its ability to provide research opportunities, would I still have a reasonable chance of getting accepted into a GI fellowship in the States?

 

[Cytarabine]

I very much appreciate your reply. My ultimate career goal is to do a GI fellowship after my IM residency. From the limited knowledge that I have of such track, I thnk I've read that for a competitive fellowship such as GI, being exposed to research experiences during your residency training is crucial, which I believe woud be more readily available at more prestigious "big named" academic institutions. So my primary concern was if I were to do my IM residency at a less well-known program that tends to be weaker in terms of its ability to provide research opportunities, would I still have a reasonable chance of getting accepted into a GI fellowship in the States?

Yes

 

[Psai]

I very much appreciate your reply. My ultimate career goal is to do a GI fellowship after my IM residency. From the limited knowledge that I have of such track, I thnk I've read that for a competitive fellowship such as GI, being exposed to research experiences during your residency training is crucial, which I believe woud be more readily available at more prestigious "big named" academic institutions. So my primary concern was if I were to do my IM residency at a less well-known program that tends to be weaker in terms of its ability to provide research opportunities, would I still have a reasonable chance of getting accepted into a GI fellowship in the States?

You can match gi from pretty much any program from what I've seen. It might not be a top 20 fellowship program though since that seems to be rather important to you

 

[Bigwater]

You can match gi from pretty much any program from what I've seen. It might not be a top 20 fellowship program though since that seems to be rather important to you

I see...Is that because they look at residency prestige as well as step 1 score?

 

[Instatewaiter]

I see...Is that because they look at residency prestige as well as step 1 score?

For fellowship they look at the program you go to, your letters of recommendation and your research. No one cares about your step scores because realistically that will help determine what residency you go to.

 

[TBV]

Yeah but if you don't go to a program with a name you have to shine more and more to get good fellowships. For example my home institution wont seriously look at someone from a low IM program who wasn't chief resident or did a bunch of research. However if their app says Hopkins/UCSF/etc they do their due diligence

 

[Instatewaiter]

You can match gi from pretty much any program from what I've seen. It might not be a top 20 fellowship program though since that seems to be rather important to you

So based on the last data, GI match rate is about 65%.
http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uplo...gram-NRMP-Results-and-Data-SMS-2014-Final.pdf (Page 43)


Those from strong programs match. Those from weak programs don't. Go to the strongest program you can.

 

[HelpPleaseMD]

I recently took Step 1 and scored 22x. I understand that this is a rather subpar score, and I am trying to devise a game plan for my upcoming third year so that I could maximize my chances of matching into any top 20 IM program, if that's possible at all.

I am in a top 5 medical school program, expecting to have one first author paper published by this summer, and have a few abstracts published during M1-M2. I wasn't involved in many EC activities during medical school, though.

Assuming that I'll be performing decently during my third year with honor in IM clerkship, do I have any shot at matching into top 20 IM programs? What should I focus on during next year to maximize my chances? Thank you for your help in advance.

If you did well during 3rd year you will likely match very well despite a score of 22x. Coming from a top 5 is a huge advantage. I have no idea what they set their filters to, but its unlikely that they set it at 220 even if that is now below the mean

 

[Psai]

So based on the last data, GI match rate is about 65%.
http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uplo...gram-NRMP-Results-and-Data-SMS-2014-Final.pdf (Page 43)


Those from strong programs match. Those from weak programs don't. Go to the strongest program you can.

I'm not a medicine person and I don't know much about the fellowship match. But I do see people from weak programs matching into fellowship. I don't know how much program name matters although I'm under the impression that it's pretty important for the reasons elucidated above

 

[HelpPleaseMD]

i'd say it is highly possible to match into GI from midtier programs and even community programs. you have to be a really good resident though to get a good endorsement from the PD

 

[Bigwater]

If you did well during 3rd year you will likely match very well despite a score of 22x. Coming from a top 5 is a huge advantage. I have no idea what they set their filters to, but its unlikely that they set it at 220 even if that is now below the mean

Thank you really for your encouragement. I felt like being shot in the foot when I saw that score. I'll work hard during my third year to make up for it as much as I can.

 

[WilliamofOckham]

Get involved in community service, such as a student-run clinic. IM tends to value bleeding-heart types more than other specialties do. Plus, it'll give you something to talk about on your interviews (I was asked about mine at almost every interview).

Obviously, get killer comments on as many rotations as possible; IM goes w/o saying.

Unfortunately, even with all of that, getting into the "top 20" (opinions vary as to which programs "really" fit this description, and whether it even matters) is hit-or-miss.

 

[GoSpursGo]

Moving to IM to help facilitate discussion.

 

[Cytarabine]

Moving to IM to help facilitate discussion.

The IM subforum regulars thank you 🙂

 

[Aequanimitatis]

OP, just go through the match forum from the past few years. 22x step I with fantastic IM matches are there in multiples. Your med school pedigree makes up for a lot. Ride it all the way and don't look back.

 

[ArkansasMed]

Being from a "top 5 school" if this is true then you can essentially add 30 points to your step scores and compare yourself to a state school applicant. Look at Penns, Harvard or Hopkins match list each year for their medical school. I am sure a ton of them scored below 230 and are essentially matched at top places. You have the research, you have the pedigree. You can easily match at a big 4 if you top quartile your 3rd year (and honor IM).

Also, it does matter where you attend residency. If you are considered one of the worst applicants from the big 4 you still match at a top residency program. If you are a chief resident all-star from a 25 or lower program you may match at a top program. If you are at a 50 or lower program you may match in a competitive field like GI or Cards if you are a top applicant. Shoot high but also a place you will be happy at.

 

[IMreshopeful]

You can match well in most of the competitive specialties (cards, GI, Pulm/cc) coming from any major academic residency as an American graduate. You need to have some form of research, decent scores, and good letters just like with residency. Going to a "top 20" will make it easier for sure as name matters, but you will be expected to do all these things nonetheless to garner interviews and match.

This is all career goal driven as well. Do you want to work as an attending eventually in an academic center spending at least half your time writing IRBs, grant proposals, and doing research, and maybe teach? Then you want to be going to as name-brand a residency and fellowship as possible. If you want to stay primarily clinical and simply want good training in both residency and fellowship, it matters a whole lot less.

As someone who likes medical education and clinical care a lot more than research the latter would be more my jam.