What are you thoughts on dating and socioeconomic level?

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FlatIsJustice

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I've never really had trouble finding and maintaining relationships throughout my life, but it's safe to say that I'm not the most attractive guy (probably a 6/10 if I'm being honest with myself) nor am I the most charming, caring or empathetic. Although we would all like to think that dating is only about finding a soul mate, a lot of times other factors like career prestige or future income potential can play a role (conscious or unconscious) in attraction. In that regard, I think being a medical student pretty significantly increases my desirability as a partner and has made me more selective in who I choose to date.

Do you think it's wrong of me to think that way? Is it wrong for me to reject someone who I am attracted to just because I think I can do better? Is it wrong for me to want to only date another graduate level professional rather than someone who is only a college graduate? If there's a girl who complements my personality perfectly but isn't as educated or career driven as I am is that ok?

I'm having trouble formulating precisely what my question is but I guess I just want to know how (if at all) being a med student or physician has changed the way you date and if you think that's healthy for you or not.

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What do you mean by "attracted to" If you mean looks only? probably just let it pass as forming a long term relationship solely on physical attraction isn't likely to lead to success. However, if you're attracted to someone on a deeper level than just looks then socioeconomic factors shouldn't matter unless that is your personality...in that you look at people who have less earning power as beneath you which is silly although if you think someone can't relate to you that is different...
 
I don't agree you should set a certain career requirement. I know people in med school who are dumb as rocks and girls who didn't finish college who I could spend all night hanging out with talking about anything from music to politics. The interpersonal experience should always be the most important factor if you care about your relationships lasting.

I didn't even realize this was a thing until I went on a date with a teacher once who told me she was surprised I'd go out with her considering our different earning potential. Said she dated an anesthesiology resident who broke up with her after saying they didn't have a future together because she didn't make enough lol.

I think people end up dating other med students or professionals by virtue of the fact that we're so busy. We're either surrounded by other medical professionals at work or going out with them to places that more often than not only other professional people frequent. I'd have no problems dating someone who was a part time stripper who had a good head on her shoulders... I'm just not really sure where I'd need to be besides the strip club for our paths to cross. Actually, if anyone could let me know, that would be great.
 
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This is a big discussion and so I will refrain from getting super deep here.

But personally, I've never valued my partner being particularly career driven/high money making status. If anything, I like that my wife is not that way. It allows my career to kind of drive the ship. I do value independence, intelligence, and hard work which are all things my wife has in plenty. Being realistic, it makes it easier if one partner can be more flexible with their career. Since medicine is an above average paying field, its not like another large income is necessary to have the lifestyle I desire.

So its up to you what you value.
 
Unfortunately OP's line of thinking increases vulnerability to hypergamy ("trading up") because of not being available. The desirability in peer-aged partners does NOT increase with medical school/resident/physician status, but rather in those who have grown tired of "fun" and casualness (ie. older people, single parents, possible predators, etc.) The lack of "free-time" also decreases your ability to discriminate between these types.

It seems that the default position of mate-seekers is to find someone "equal or better" as applied to SES and education level. Prioritizing virtue and factoring certain topics such as "Are we hiring strangers to raise our children because we're prioritizing money?" or "How do we want to resolve conflicts?" might be better. This also means considering *gasp less-educated partners, if someone besides government schools will be taking care of the kids and you don't want to be ~50 years old when the kids are college-aged.

Or you can chase the booty and not care about things. And all the choices in-between.
 
Yes. and Yes. Love the one you're with. The attitude you have means that you'll never settle in with anyone, because you'll always be thinking you can do better.

Do you think it's wrong of me to think that way? Is it wrong for me to reject someone who I am attracted to just because I think I can do better? Is it wrong for me to want to only date another graduate level professional rather than someone who is only a college graduate? If there's a girl who complements my personality perfectly but isn't as educated or career driven as I am is that ok?
 
I've never really had trouble finding and maintaining relationships throughout my life, but it's safe to say that I'm not the most attractive guy (probably a 6/10 if I'm being honest with myself) nor am I the most charming, caring or empathetic. Although we would all like to think that dating is only about finding a soul mate, a lot of times other factors like career prestige or future income potential can play a role (conscious or unconscious) in attraction. In that regard, I think being a medical student pretty significantly increases my desirability as a partner and has made me more selective in who I choose to date.

Do you think it's wrong of me to think that way? Is it wrong for me to reject someone who I am attracted to just because I think I can do better? Is it wrong for me to want to only date another graduate level professional rather than someone who is only a college graduate? If there's a girl who complements my personality perfectly but isn't as educated or career driven as I am is that ok?

I'm having trouble formulating precisely what my question is but I guess I just want to know how (if at all) being a med student or physician has changed the way you date and if you think that's healthy for you or not.

I fell in love with my wife for many different reasons over the past 12 years. But, when I look at my relationship with her right now, what matters the most is that she can tell me what to do and 99% of the time it is the best possible thing for me to be doing for my long term health and happiness. I have found that that is one of the things that I value the most. She puts most of my life on autopilot so that I can focus on doing what I enjoy most, vascular surgery. You have to figure out what the most important things are to you and seek those out in a partner. Putting arbitrary boundaries like education level only limits you. Unless of course being able to show off your wife at parties is the most important thing, in which case, maybe that is an important factor.
 
This is a big discussion and so I will refrain from getting super deep here.

But personally, I've never valued my partner being particularly career driven/high money making status. If anything, I like that my wife is not that way. It allows my career to kind of drive the ship. I do value independence, intelligence, and hard work which are all things my wife has in plenty. Being realistic, it makes it easier if one partner can be more flexible with their career. Since medicine is an above average paying field, its not like another large income is necessary to have the lifestyle I desire.

So its up to you what you value.

This sums my feelings up pretty perfectly. When my wife and I first met she was pretty career driven, and at the beginning of our marriage we did the dual-income thing for a while. After our daughter was born she took some time off and we both realized we were much happier, so we made it a permanent ordeal. Given what I know now, I would never date/marry a woman that works as much as I do.
 
Marry in haste, regret at leisure.

Seriously, take your time and worry less about whether someone is good enough to be dating you. Don't get serious with anyone unless you find someone who so makes your heart sing that you can't help but want to be with them, whatever their demographics. Getting involved with someone just to be dating somebody means that you are likely to be involved with the wrong person when the right one does come along.
 
Do you think it's wrong of me to think that way? Is it wrong for me to reject someone who I am attracted to just because I think I can do better? Is it wrong for me to want to only date another graduate level professional rather than someone who is only a college graduate? If there's a girl who complements my personality perfectly but isn't as educated or career driven as I am is that ok?

I think you're asking the wrong questions. You're not thinking about it in deep enough terms. Why are you seeking out graduate level women instead of girls with lower educations? Is it really because you're thinking of it in terms of status or are the traits you're looking for in women more common in graduate level women? If you're looking for women who are intelligent, driven, and who has "larger" life and career goals than average, then you're probably more likely to find that in someone committed to their education. I'd also say to keep in mind that if that's what you're looking for, that there are plenty of others out there who fit that description and who don't have a graduate level education. I wouldn't reject someone because you "think you can do better", but if you don't think they're the right fit for you or they're missing qualities that are really important for a partner to have, then you shouldn't feel bad about not dating them.

I also think that there's absolutely nothing wrong with being with someone 'less educated' or career driven as you, and in medicine having someone less career driven is probably a good thing if you're hoping to start a family, as it puts far less stress on you as a parent during those times when work becomes overwhelming. Also, keep in mind that just because someone didn't have as strong of a traditional education as others doesn't necessarily mean they're less intelligent. There are some absolutely brilliant people out there who never go to college. So try not jump to conclusions about people just because they don't have the same level of education on paper as you're looking for.
 
They say contempt is the worst possible thing for a relationship so while it is probably wrong to think someone is beneath you because they earn less it would be unwise to date someone who you did actually think was beneath you. It will likely shine through in your tone and will lead to relationship dissatisfaction on both ends.


Here is the link to the researcher who talks about this.

https://www.gottman.com/blog/the-four-horsemen-contempt/
 
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I've never really had trouble finding and maintaining relationships throughout my life, but it's safe to say that I'm not the most attractive guy (probably a 6/10 if I'm being honest with myself) nor am I the most charming, caring or empathetic. Although we would all like to think that dating is only about finding a soul mate, a lot of times other factors like career prestige or future income potential can play a role (conscious or unconscious) in attraction. In that regard, I think being a medical student pretty significantly increases my desirability as a partner and has made me more selective in who I choose to date.

Do you think it's wrong of me to think that way? Is it wrong for me to reject someone who I am attracted to just because I think I can do better? Is it wrong for me to want to only date another graduate level professional rather than someone who is only a college graduate? If there's a girl who complements my personality perfectly but isn't as educated or career driven as I am is that ok?

I'm having trouble formulating precisely what my question is but I guess I just want to know how (if at all) being a med student or physician has changed the way you date and if you think that's healthy for you or not.

I can't believe people are even humoring this.

There is a decent chance a girl that is "less educated" is smarter than you. If title alone is what bothers you and you think a BS in mathematics and an MD are on different levels then GTFO and good luck ever finding a girl to date you.
 
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I can't believe people are even humoring this.

There is a decent chance a girl that is "less educated" is smarter than you. If title alone is what bothers you and you think a BS in mathematics and an MD are on different levels then GTFO and good luck ever finding a girl to date you.

What part of my original post triggered this outburst? Such vitriol at a pretty common question reflects an overly idealistic world view.
 
I can't believe people are even humoring this.

There is a decent chance a girl that is "less educated" is smarter than you. If title alone is what bothers you and you think a BS in mathematics and an MD are on different levels then GTFO and good luck ever finding a girl to date you.

One of the wisest things my dad ever said:

Education doesn't necessarily equal intellect and money doesn't equal class
 
I've never really had trouble finding and maintaining relationships throughout my life, but it's safe to say that I'm not the most attractive guy (probably a 6/10 if I'm being honest with myself) nor am I the most charming, caring or empathetic. Although we would all like to think that dating is only about finding a soul mate, a lot of times other factors like career prestige or future income potential can play a role (conscious or unconscious) in attraction. In that regard, I think being a medical student pretty significantly increases my desirability as a partner and has made me more selective in who I choose to date.

Do you think it's wrong of me to think that way? Is it wrong for me to reject someone who I am attracted to just because I think I can do better? Is it wrong for me to want to only date another graduate level professional rather than someone who is only a college graduate? If there's a girl who complements my personality perfectly but isn't as educated or career driven as I am is that ok?

I'm having trouble formulating precisely what my question is but I guess I just want to know how (if at all) being a med student or physician has changed the way you date and if you think that's healthy for you or not.

OP, I am a female med student who is dating another med student. We have talked about it, and his feelings are like yours. According to him, he would not date someone who isn't post graduate educated because he wants a wife who is willing to also work, and wants a 'super mom' type. He makes me feel like a rockstar because he is proud that I am doing what he is doing, and comments all the time on how awesome it is we can talk about med school with our best friend who knows what it's like.

Keep in mind- you have to be ok not being the 'best' or highest achiever in this type of relationship, because if you're dating a girl in med school she might be scoring higher than you, doing better at clinicals, getting more competitive residencies, etc. In this case, you might not be the 'captain of the ship' as another poster said, because she's the one applying for derm and you two have to couples match in her favor. So decide whether or not a strong women's success would make you love her more or resent her...
Obviously, education does not equal intellect or IQ, so keep that in mind too. But you are not alone in your thinking, a gal in your own field with your own level of education might be worth waiting for. Being able to talk to your partner about the things we all know and not have to dumb it down (and they're actually interested, or can even explain things to you!) is pretty awesome.


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Dude I only date girls who are 9/10 on attractive scale, couldn't care less how smart they were. Never ends up working, but whatevs.
 
I wouldn't worry about it, OP. Based on the information provided in the first paragraph, chances of you finding yourself in the hypothetical described in the second are minimal at most.


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As you get older and the world around you gets more heterogeneous youll notice the differentiating factors more and picking along the lines you feel guilty about right now is very acceptable. It is easy to pontificate in theory but when it comes to your life and your kids that's when **** gets real.

Someone forwarded me a link a couple wks ago to this site www.roaddating.com. The more you think about it the more sense this makes in todays world
 
I've never really had trouble finding and maintaining relationships throughout my life, but it's safe to say that I'm not the most attractive guy (probably a 6/10 if I'm being honest with myself) nor am I the most charming, caring or empathetic. Although we would all like to think that dating is only about finding a soul mate, a lot of times other factors like career prestige or future income potential can play a role (conscious or unconscious) in attraction. In that regard, I think being a medical student pretty significantly increases my desirability as a partner and has made me more selective in who I choose to date.

Do you think it's wrong of me to think that way? Is it wrong for me to reject someone who I am attracted to just because I think I can do better? Is it wrong for me to want to only date another graduate level professional rather than someone who is only a college graduate? If there's a girl who complements my personality perfectly but isn't as educated or career driven as I am is that ok?

I'm having trouble formulating precisely what my question is but I guess I just want to know how (if at all) being a med student or physician has changed the way you date and if you think that's healthy for you or not.
Uh, dude, only you can answer that for yourself. I see no reason to value dating another graduate level professional over anyone else so long as they fit with me personality-wise. What does her being a graduate offer me? I've got my own money, and I wouldn't date her if she couldn't carry on a decent conversion. So what do I get out of dating a girl with fancier credentials? Literally nothing.

If you value stuff, power coupling might be advisable, because dat dual income. It also provides a buffer against alimony in divorce, since your incomes are more equal. They might bring you networking connections if you don't already have enough to work with on your own. That's about all I can see. If these things appeal to you, then set your sights higher. Nothing wrong with that.
 
I find it interesting that some people are giving the guy a hard time about want to marry someone with equal education/socio status. Because lets be real here women seldom if even will marry down. When was the last time you saw a female med student with a male nurse? Why don't we given women a hard time about that?

Even more reason roaddating.com makes sense
 
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I find it interesting that some people are giving the guy a hard time about want to marry someone with equal education/socio status. Because lets be real here women seldom if even will marry down. When was the last time you saw a female med student with a male nurse? Why don't we given women a hard time about that? Even more reason roaddating.com makes sense
Just yesterday. She's in my class. Great couple.
 
Uh, dude, only you can answer that for yourself. I see no reason to value dating another graduate level professional over anyone else so long as they fit with me personality-wise. What does her being a graduate offer me? I've got my own money, and I wouldn't date her if she couldn't carry on a decent conversion. So what do I get out of dating a girl with fancier credentials? Literally nothing.

You need to respect the person you marry. Not just love, but respect. If you come from a family that places a high value on education, which I think most medical students do, it be hard not to at least slightly look down on someone less educated. And that is fatal for a marriage.

Don't get me wrong, I consiously get that education doesn't equal intelligence. I work with a number of Gunnery Sergeants and Navy Chiefs who are both brilliant and financially successful despite never having gotten past an associate's, and I kown a number of bankrupt idiots from my high school who 'achieved' masters degrees (especially low tier liberal arts and law degrees). But knowing something isn't the same as feeling it, and childhood biases are hard to overcome. That's doubly true for biases that you are consciously trying to pass on to your own children. And I am very much planning to teach my children that education isn't optional.

OP, my advice:. If you want to date a professional, date a doctor. They will understand your schedule. Dual doctor relationships have by date the lowest divorce rate in medicine (barely half of the average), and honestly by MS3 only other doctors will get your sense of humor.
 
You need to respect the person you marry. Not just love, but respect. If you come from a family that places a high value on education, which I think most medical students do, it be hard not to at least slightly look down on someone less educated. And that is fatal for a marriage.

Don't get me wrong, I consiously get that education doesn't equal intelligence. I work with a number of Gunnery Sergeants and Navy Chiefs who are both brilliant and financially successful despite never having gotten past an associate's, and I kown a number of bankrupt idiots from my high school who 'achieved' masters degrees (especially low tier liberal arts and law degrees). But knowing something isn't the same as feeling it, and childhood biases are hard to overcome. That's doubly true for biases that you are consciously trying to pass on to your own children. And I am very much planning to teach my children that education isn't optional.

OP, my advice:. If you want to date a professional, date a doctor. They will understand your schedule. Dual doctor relationships have by date the lowest divorce rate in medicine (barely half of the average), and honestly by MS3 only other doctors will get your sense of humor.
And if you've got that hangup, I get it. I just never really had that- I'm the only person in my family aside from an uncle that will have a graduate degree, which is viewed more as a miracle than a requirement. I respect people for who they are, not what piece of paper they hold, and that extends to dating. I honestly think we oversell education these days- there's a lot of trades out there that will put you ahead financially when compared with degree holders, that will allow you run your own business and contribute far more to society than the average liberal arts major. If I had kids, I'd obviously prefer they enter the professions, but I'd still respect their choice so long as it was a productive one.
 
There are some absolutely brilliant people out there who never go to college. So try not jump to conclusions about people just because they don't have the same level of education on paper as you're looking for.
Right on. I agree

Education has little to do with intelligence.
 
I think being a medical student pretty significantly increases my desirability as a partner and has made me more selective in who I choose to date.

If I ever get the impression that someone I'm interested in has this mindset, I will run the opposite way. Kindness and generosity are what matters. Arrogance is a huge turn-off.
 
I think one thing you fail to realize is that the thing you think improves your status, ie career/money is something that professional level women can achieve on their own. In fact these women are notorious for being independent.

So if they don't need you or your loads of money, what else do you got? Maybe you should work on that before you try to rule out all other women based solely on socioeconomic status or future income.

Case in point: don't think accomplished women will fall head over heals for a degree. Chances are they want a real man, not a status.
 
I feel like there is a double standard if the woman is the professional married to non professional or to someone earning less. The guy I want to be with is not in medicine but is fun, intelligent and hard working. My family is frowning on us because "I can do better" and do I want to be taking care of him once I'm an attending etc... All the common quips.

I'm trying to ignore their banter but it's hard. Im of the opinion that it's harder for girls the higher we climb and if I guy is looking to take advantage of and use you.. You don't need to be a doctor for that!

So idk easier said for guys!
 
Even more reason roaddating.com makes sense

and I thought farmersonly.com was pushing the envelope. I expect a dating site to propagate soon for Ambidextrous Accountants who work in Atriums(it'll be called AAA.com and the american automobile association will promptly sue them)

I feel like there is a double standard if the woman is the professional married to non professional or to someone earning less. The guy I want to be with is not in medicine but is fun, intelligent and hard working. My family is frowning on us because "I can do better" and do I want to be taking care of him once I'm an attending etc... All the common quips.

I'm trying to ignore their banter but it's hard. Im of the opinion that it's harder for girls the higher we climb and if I guy is looking to take advantage of and use you.. You don't need to be a doctor for that!

So idk easier said for guys!

I think familial issues like that cross gender borders-- you get the same type of thinking in the male-sphere where a mother might think that XYZ girl is not "good enough" for her son in med school. I think parents in general will more or less assume no one will ever be good enough for their daughter/son.
 
I feel like there is a double standard if the woman is the professional married to non professional or to someone earning less. The guy I want to be with is not in medicine but is fun, intelligent and hard working. My family is frowning on us because "I can do better" and do I want to be taking care of him once I'm an attending etc... All the common quips.

I'm trying to ignore their banter but it's hard. Im of the opinion that it's harder for girls the higher we climb and if I guy is looking to take advantage of and use you.. You don't need to be a doctor for that!

So idk easier said for guys!
Pose this question for your family. Am I marrying a life partner or a business partner..
 
You are marrying the spouse that will provide half of the genetic makeup of your children. Intelligence is definitely a major factor. Education suggests that they are able to delay gratification enough to complete a degree, so in my mind is important. Physical attractiveness plays a major role but my 9/10 may not be yours. Similar value system such as religion is important for many people but not for others. Future income potential works both ways and can be very reassuring for your family's economic security, i.e. If I become disabled will my spouse be able to make enough to maintain a reasonable lifestyle. Choosing your life partner is a major determinant of your future happiness so choose wisely. 30+ happily married years, both physicians.
 
Yes. and Yes. Love the one you're with. The attitude you have means that you'll never settle in with anyone, because you'll always be thinking you can do better.

Do you think it's wrong of me to think that way? Is it wrong for me to reject someone who I am attracted to just because I think I can do better? Is it wrong for me to want to only date another graduate level professional rather than someone who is only a college graduate? If there's a girl who complements my personality perfectly but isn't as educated or career driven as I am is that ok?

And this is now stuck in my head... "Love the one you're with!"
Totally agree...
Looks, money... All fades. You need someone who makes you happy and who you make happy. Someone who's quirks are actually endearing to you. And you'll struggle. Money doesn't fix everything. You need someone who will fight with you through things, not against you
 
And this is now stuck in my head... "Love the one you're with!"
Totally agree..
Looks, money... All fades. You need someone who makes you happy and who you make happy. Someone who's quirks are actually endearing to you. And you'll struggle. Money doesn't fix everything. You need someone who will fight with you through things, not against you

Its not really about money. A person's career and education telegraphs their character. When you're dating someone it's easy to figure out if they're kind, or if they have a good sense of humor. Its tougher to figure out if they're hard working, if they can commit to something, or if they can manage a crisis. If you marry someone who hasn't achieved anything since high school you are basically just rolling the dice and hoping that you're going to have a partner in life, rather than a dependent. Part of having someone who will fight with you through things is knowing that they'll fight. When faced with a challenge, most people just wilt.
 
Staying home to smoke crack and staying home to be a good mom/dad are two very different things as well.
 
I find it interesting that some people are giving the guy a hard time about want to marry someone with equal education/socio status. Because lets be real here women seldom if even will marry down. When was the last time you saw a female med student with a male nurse? Why don't we given women a hard time about that?

Even more reason roaddating.com makes sense

Actually women in medicine (at least in surgery) seem to USUALLY "marry down" (your phrase not mine). Many women in my surgical residency married blue collar workers or college graduates with a LOT lower earning potential. Seems like having a reliable partner who is supportive and flexible comes above all else.
 
Actually women in medicine (at least in surgery) seem to USUALLY "marry down" (your phrase not mine). Many women in my surgical residency married blue collar workers or college graduates with a LOT lower earning potential. Seems like having a reliable partner who is supportive and flexible comes above all else.
Surgeons are very unattractive people in general... Can't imagine what a woman in surgery would look like.
 
Surgeons are very unattractive people in general... Can't imagine what a woman in surgery would look like.

I can promise you that several of these women were good looking, physically fit, and had good personalities. The men they married were also good looking and socially normal, but in terms of "marrying down," it happens.
 
This is a huge topic and I'm not going to dive deep in here but there are two popular and viable life paths in medical school when it comes to males seeking significant others.

The first is to find a woman who is less career oriented who can do a good job rearing the children.

The second is to find another physician and just be partners in crime and bffs for life.

I think both can be possible, but I do think #2 is harder to pull off but has a higher potential for happiness.


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I intend to marry someone that makes me happy, will be passionate about their own interests and share my values. I tend to like creative people, which means money is not guaranteed. I come from a blue-collar family so I am lucky that they won't care if the person I marry is a mechanic, artist or surgeon.
 
I like how so many posters in this thread just assume that high socioeconomic level will be attainable to them after residency years from now.


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