to all FMG's that have successfully prematched in the last few years...did you all have 99s on both steps? what else goes into this prematching business besides scores and bigtime interest in the program?? im hoping to prematch in chicago, and im trying to see if that could be a real possibility. thanks
what does it take to pre-match
- Thread starter wylie313
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I got two prematch offers.
One was to the very first place I interviewed. I had not planned on really matching there for several reasons : high crime city, very poor, far from family, very very very humid (60 inches of rain a year - I am from the desert) and some other things. I was only using them as a place to practice interviewing before my "real" interviews began, so I did them first. They offer one prematch per year. I got it. Since they said they taught MANY procedures I took it. I did send funny personal thank yous, which I recently found were saved in my permenant file.
I also got a prematch offer to a place that was a wonderful little town - low crime, low poverty, but a super religious uncle lived 14 miles away (he is a minister and I know he would have been coming by alot to get me to join his church), and they taught virtually no procedures. This place was not in my top 5 (I was offered 15 interviews). I actually showed up late, was super tired, and was thinking dirty thoughts during the interview just to get myself to smile. They offered me a prematch, I turned it down, and later I saw they offered 2 more prematches by watching NRMP at match time.
4 of my top 5 showed me little love. One showed me some favoritism, but did not offer a prematch. Some of the residents told me the PD really liked me, I was invited to a small late season party that I was told very few of the people who had interviewed were invited to. I shmoozed my best efforts here - but no prematch.
I am probably not indicative of most, but....LOL.... my experience is, don't try too hard or take it too seriously.
One was to the very first place I interviewed. I had not planned on really matching there for several reasons : high crime city, very poor, far from family, very very very humid (60 inches of rain a year - I am from the desert) and some other things. I was only using them as a place to practice interviewing before my "real" interviews began, so I did them first. They offer one prematch per year. I got it. Since they said they taught MANY procedures I took it. I did send funny personal thank yous, which I recently found were saved in my permenant file.
I also got a prematch offer to a place that was a wonderful little town - low crime, low poverty, but a super religious uncle lived 14 miles away (he is a minister and I know he would have been coming by alot to get me to join his church), and they taught virtually no procedures. This place was not in my top 5 (I was offered 15 interviews). I actually showed up late, was super tired, and was thinking dirty thoughts during the interview just to get myself to smile. They offered me a prematch, I turned it down, and later I saw they offered 2 more prematches by watching NRMP at match time.
4 of my top 5 showed me little love. One showed me some favoritism, but did not offer a prematch. Some of the residents told me the PD really liked me, I was invited to a small late season party that I was told very few of the people who had interviewed were invited to. I shmoozed my best efforts here - but no prematch.
I am probably not indicative of most, but....LOL.... my experience is, don't try too hard or take it too seriously.
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A friend of mine prematched (I'm a US medical student, my friend was a US citizen who had gone elsewhere for medical school) and when she interviewed she told the chief resident and the PD that it was her first choice and that she would gladly accept a prematch if it were offered. They called her within a week.
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I've never been an IMG or done family practice,
but I can tell you that knowing you really really want to go some where can influence program directors more than you think. You don't want to totally grovel, but you should be blatant about wanting to be in Chicago, and lay it on thick about how you like that particular program, if/when you get any interviews. Having said that, matching in cities like New York, Chicago, etc. is a totally different ballgame than in less competitive geographic areas. It ratchets everything up a notch...though I'm not sure how fp is affected in particular.
but I can tell you that knowing you really really want to go some where can influence program directors more than you think. You don't want to totally grovel, but you should be blatant about wanting to be in Chicago, and lay it on thick about how you like that particular program, if/when you get any interviews. Having said that, matching in cities like New York, Chicago, etc. is a totally different ballgame than in less competitive geographic areas. It ratchets everything up a notch...though I'm not sure how fp is affected in particular.
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this is the frist time I've hgeard of prematch...
any FAQ for where ti find out more about it?
any FAQ for where ti find out more about it?
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You can only do it if you are a FMG, IMG or DO, or an "independent applicant" (such as someone who completed a PGY1 prelim year and now floating around trying to find an upper level/PGY2 spot) is my understanding. It just means that a program offers you a spot outside the normal Match process. Any program can do it, but they have to do so before a certain date (?March). They have to take a corresponding number of spots from the match if they do so (i.e. if their program has 6 spots/year and they choose to prematch 2 people, then they have 4 spots left in the Match).
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I just had my first interview today, and when the PD asked if I had any questions, one thing I wanted to ask was whether they offered any pre-matches for that program. However, I refrained from asking this because I don't know that this is a program I would be ranking highly yet, it's only my first interview. Would it be ok if I contact the PD later on in the season to inquire about pre-matching if it turns out that this program is one I would be ranking highly?
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There is nothing illegal about asking about / for a prematch. It's kinda like asking someone out on a date -- there are good/polite ways to do so, and not-so-polite ways. Nothing wrong with asking nicely.
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so there's no such thing as prematch for US seniors then huh? oh well, thanks for the details! much appreciated.
B
Blade28
In most fields, if you're not a traditional US allopathic senior med student.
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Prematching is on a case by case basis and there is no centralized list of programs that offer them.
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I have been offered a position outside the match, but it was my first interview in my #2 specialty! I have 2 important "outside the match" interviews in 6 weeks in my #1 specialty in a desirable location and great programs..... what do i DO????
They say a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush, but I was wondering.... if I accept this 1st position and then Im offered an out of match position for my specialty of choice, are there any repercussions? Obviiously I am not a fan of breaking a contract, but Im kind of in a bind, and I wouldnt mind attending my 1st prematch institution if I dont get any other offers....
Any advice? If you had this happen or know of it happening to someone, please give me your insight. Should I accept and continue with interviews or accept and call it a day? The 2 interviews I have in the specialty of choice are very competitive and it will be a miracle if I get them, still I hate to shoot myself in the foot...... plleeeeeeeeez help!
They say a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush, but I was wondering.... if I accept this 1st position and then Im offered an out of match position for my specialty of choice, are there any repercussions? Obviiously I am not a fan of breaking a contract, but Im kind of in a bind, and I wouldnt mind attending my 1st prematch institution if I dont get any other offers....
Any advice? If you had this happen or know of it happening to someone, please give me your insight. Should I accept and continue with interviews or accept and call it a day? The 2 interviews I have in the specialty of choice are very competitive and it will be a miracle if I get them, still I hate to shoot myself in the foot...... plleeeeeeeeez help!
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I've got no experience with being an IMG or prematching, but I was offered an outside the match fellowship spot once that I didn't take because I thought I could get a better offer (which I did).
I don't know what would happen if you took a prematch contract and then broke it. Will be interested what others have to say.
It might help us give advice if we knew how competitive you are as an applicant and what your "dream" specialty is. If the dream specialty is neuro or ER, my answer might be different than if it's ortho or radiology...
I don't know what would happen if you took a prematch contract and then broke it. Will be interested what others have to say.
It might help us give advice if we knew how competitive you are as an applicant and what your "dream" specialty is. If the dream specialty is neuro or ER, my answer might be different than if it's ortho or radiology...
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Hi dragonfly 99,
Thanks for replying, and yes it will be interesting to see what others say. I am an above ave. or decent candidate for Neuro (#2 Specialty of Choice) and a mediocre to low candidate for Anesthesia (#1 Choice) -- have 2 anes. int. and 4 more neuro
Thanks for replying, and yes it will be interesting to see what others say. I am an above ave. or decent candidate for Neuro (#2 Specialty of Choice) and a mediocre to low candidate for Anesthesia (#1 Choice) -- have 2 anes. int. and 4 more neuro
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Accepting a prematch contract and then breaking it for a better deal is not uncommon. Since the NRMP or other regulatory bodies are not involved, the major sticking point tends to be your own moral obligations toward the first program.
Even if you have signed a contract for the prematch offer, most programs will not go to the trouble to sue you for breaking the contract. They will simply find someone else.
You have not mentioned whether your offer comes contingent on you signing a contract by X date...I would try and stall them as long as possible, although you have to be cognizant of the fact that if you stall too long, they may rescind the offer.
Until you (and they) have a signed contract in hand, an offer is worth nothing.
Even if you have signed a contract for the prematch offer, most programs will not go to the trouble to sue you for breaking the contract. They will simply find someone else.
You have not mentioned whether your offer comes contingent on you signing a contract by X date...I would try and stall them as long as possible, although you have to be cognizant of the fact that if you stall too long, they may rescind the offer.
Until you (and they) have a signed contract in hand, an offer is worth nothing.
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Anesthesiology is one of those specialties that tends to end up with a lot of open spots (relatively) later on because people drop out, quit or get kicked out or some programs add spots. If you really want anesthesia why don't you interview for a bunch of medicine prelim years and make sure you get one, then keep trying for anesthesia (at least one more time next year) before giving up on it? I mean, there are out of the match CA-1 anesthesia spots posted on here (and other web sites) fairly frequently.
On the other hand, if you only slightly prefer anesthesia to neuro, then perhaps taking the sureshot neuro spot is the way to go. You have to ask yourself if you'll regret it later on down the line. I would think you could still snag a neuro spot at some later point if you got stuck w/a medicine intern year but no advanced spot (i.e. no neuro or anesthesia). I'm not sure I think you should feel this huge pressure to sign some contract right away. If, as you say, you're a pretty strong neuro candidate, you probably could get a neuro spot in the regular match.
On the other hand, if you only slightly prefer anesthesia to neuro, then perhaps taking the sureshot neuro spot is the way to go. You have to ask yourself if you'll regret it later on down the line. I would think you could still snag a neuro spot at some later point if you got stuck w/a medicine intern year but no advanced spot (i.e. no neuro or anesthesia). I'm not sure I think you should feel this huge pressure to sign some contract right away. If, as you say, you're a pretty strong neuro candidate, you probably could get a neuro spot in the regular match.
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Dragonfly99 and Winged Scapula,
Thank you so much for your input - you probably know how hard it is to sort all this out in your head with so many different options or lack of options....
To clear something up, I am already in a prelim year program, and my 2 anes. interviews are out of match (yay)... and only one of my neuros is in the match so far the rest are OOM for 09.....so the downside is - either you get them or you dont, no ranking or other chances...the good news is, you find out pretty quickly. Unfortunately the anes. interviews are in dec. and most of the 09 out of match neuro positions want to interview before then..... and make their offers before then....
I am interested to see what happens when the deans letter comes out, my school advisor said that many programs rely on this because it is more of an evaluation rather than a recommendation and programs use this as a solid part of the app. process? If you think otherwise, please let me know. Many of my 2010 anes. apps are getting denied before the deans letter, but only the top neuro programs have declined me so far, and more positive interest has also come in....
Also, the prematch wont hold it for me, but they said they would give me right of first refusal (which confuses me....) but I am not really sure what to do now... I like your advice on seeking opened anes. positions, which is why im hoping my chicago interviews work out. AND I figured that people must break prematch contracts because they lack nrmp backing.... but you are right, morally...... however, i dont really want to be stuck without a job ..... If i had more 2010 interviews (match), I wouldnt be as concered about ending up empty handed, ya know?
DO you have any advice for these anes. interviews? So far, the interviews I have been on, just want to know what ?'s I have for them, and although i come prepared with good questions, I feel like I leave without bumping myself up a notch, only with more information about a program that Im not going to get into! Would you say it is too ballsy to go into them limiting the "asking" of questions and using the time to tell them that i am the right one for the job? I sort of feel like Im pleading, but I sort of am....... can you sound too desperate?😱
I think your prior posts have helped me a lot, I just have to think about it and check back to see if anyone else has input. Thanks for your time.
Thank you so much for your input - you probably know how hard it is to sort all this out in your head with so many different options or lack of options....
To clear something up, I am already in a prelim year program, and my 2 anes. interviews are out of match (yay)... and only one of my neuros is in the match so far the rest are OOM for 09.....so the downside is - either you get them or you dont, no ranking or other chances...the good news is, you find out pretty quickly. Unfortunately the anes. interviews are in dec. and most of the 09 out of match neuro positions want to interview before then..... and make their offers before then....
I am interested to see what happens when the deans letter comes out, my school advisor said that many programs rely on this because it is more of an evaluation rather than a recommendation and programs use this as a solid part of the app. process? If you think otherwise, please let me know. Many of my 2010 anes. apps are getting denied before the deans letter, but only the top neuro programs have declined me so far, and more positive interest has also come in....
Also, the prematch wont hold it for me, but they said they would give me right of first refusal (which confuses me....) but I am not really sure what to do now... I like your advice on seeking opened anes. positions, which is why im hoping my chicago interviews work out. AND I figured that people must break prematch contracts because they lack nrmp backing.... but you are right, morally...... however, i dont really want to be stuck without a job ..... If i had more 2010 interviews (match), I wouldnt be as concered about ending up empty handed, ya know?
DO you have any advice for these anes. interviews? So far, the interviews I have been on, just want to know what ?'s I have for them, and although i come prepared with good questions, I feel like I leave without bumping myself up a notch, only with more information about a program that Im not going to get into! Would you say it is too ballsy to go into them limiting the "asking" of questions and using the time to tell them that i am the right one for the job? I sort of feel like Im pleading, but I sort of am....... can you sound too desperate?😱
I think your prior posts have helped me a lot, I just have to think about it and check back to see if anyone else has input. Thanks for your time.
