Just got accepted, so I'll be matriculating in the Fall. But there's been this nagging thought in the back of my mind-- what if I can't cut it? What if I'm not smart enough? I'll be taking out close to 250k in debt, so I'm pretty much "all-in". Anyone else have these thoughts/doubts before plunging in?
What if I'm not smart enough for medical school?
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I am pretty sure that if you have surmounted all the premed obstacles and proven (in an interview) that you have the personal skills (i.e a pulse and the ability to form words with your vocal chords and mouth), you are set. The system is set up to make failure really difficult. I think I read somewhere that 99% or so end up with an MD and that other 1% probably left for personal reasons or a change of heart. Keep your head high and have confidence in yourself, that's really all you need to succeed.
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To the med students: is it weird to find that everyone else is just as smart if not smarter than you? Someone's gotta be in the 5th percentile...
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Don't doubt yourself so much...if you got in, then I think you're ready.
I think it really depends on how you see yourself compared to others. I suppose if you have the pretentiousness to believe that you are "smarter" than most people, then being among 150+ really bright students may be somewhat of a shock. But if you never felt that way in the first place, then medical school isn't any different than life. I know a lot of my classmates did random oddjobs before med school like, coaching, clown shows, movie rentals etc., and yet they are med students. So that kind of diversity allows you to appreciate the intelligence of common people.
Also, as a warning, I wouldn't stratify med school performance in terms of "smartness." Everyone is bright, that's a given. But to what degree you will measure up is impossible to tell and doesn't reflect your cognitive ability, especially at P/F schools. Your success has little to do with "smarts," and a lot to do with strategy. Especially 3rd year when many of your grades are subjective and dependent upon non-cognitive factors like punctuality, professionalism, rapport, teamwork, smile etc.
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The people who granted you the magic letter know what they are doing; you would not have been let in if you were inherently incapable of doing the work.
And anyways, the stuff you learn in medical school is not all that conceptually difficult. The challenge is the sheer volume of what they throw at you. It's not so much a test of who is smarter, but who works harder. If you put in the effort, you'll be fine; just be ready for a lot of work.
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You dont have to be that smart to do well in med school. Just willing to sit and memorize stuff all day and night long...
ok maybe very slight oversimplification...but seriously average intelligence will do- and you need higher than avg intelligence to get IN so dont worry about it.
ok maybe very slight oversimplification...but seriously average intelligence will do- and you need higher than avg intelligence to get IN so dont worry about it.
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if you cant cut it
you can always join the military
you can always join the military
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Thanks for the response. I wasn't trying to sound pretentious or anything, though I probably did. I guess I don't think I'm all that smart and I'm just scared that I will have trouble adapting to the rigors of medical school this August. The analogy of undergrad as trying to take a sip from a water fountain...and medical school as the attempt to drink from a fire hose really scares me. I have this fear in my head (which SDN has contributed to) that all of my fellow students will be super brilliant...and I will be left behind.
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relax... you have arrived.
so whats up doc?
so whats up doc?
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I have a feeling that since I graduated in 2008 and will be taking a year off, I will foget everything and end up flunking out during the first unit.
BTW I am spending my year off watching television, going out like 3-4 times a week, sleeping till noon and repeating.
Is there something that I should be doing to prepare myself for med school that does not involve getting a job or taking classes of any sort?
BTW I am spending my year off watching television, going out like 3-4 times a week, sleeping till noon and repeating.
Is there something that I should be doing to prepare myself for med school that does not involve getting a job or taking classes of any sort?
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I'm sure everyone feels this way to some degree.
I know I am feeling it now even with the application process, so be happy that you got in and realize that even if you don't always believe in yourself, someone had to if they granted you an acceptance.
Congratulations
I know I am feeling it now even with the application process, so be happy that you got in and realize that even if you don't always believe in yourself, someone had to if they granted you an acceptance.
Congratulations
Don't trip. I didn't mean *you* specifically, I should have said *one* perhaps. But the analogies are correct, but rest assured that you will succeed, and if you're still a little scared, go to a P/F school.
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I have this fear too. I look now at my study and class prep habits and think to myself, "Oh crap, this isn't going to cut it. Do I even know how to study properly?"
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Don't sweat it. If you were accepted into medical school, you are smart enough for it. Actually, it doesn't necessarily take a "brain-child" to do well in medical school or, especially, to be a good physician. What it takes is persistence, a good work ethic/study habits, solid listening skills, and really caring about your patients.
Make the use of all of your academic resources. Use tutors, get advice from upperclassman, etc. Some schools even have a special department that specializes in helping you develop good study habits.
Make the use of all of your academic resources. Use tutors, get advice from upperclassman, etc. Some schools even have a special department that specializes in helping you develop good study habits.
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Although I've never considered the MCAT a relative test of "brightness," a lady on the admissions department at a certain med school told me that studies have shown that if you can score a 21 you have the ability to survive med school. I've never heard of anyone actually getting in with a score that low, but I do believe it to be somewhat true.
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Medical school is a very humbling experience. In college when you put in the work you got an A. In medical school, for a lot of students (myself included), you can work your ass off every day and still end up an average student. Looking back, I realize if I put in even half the effort I do now when I was in undergrad, I would have been a 4.0 student. You have to change your mindset from pre-med days. It's not about getting the grades, it's about learning as much as you possibly can.
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I was never that smart to begin with 
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Don't worry about taking time off; nothing you learn in undergrad makes a huge difference anyways. I took more than a year off and had no problem material-wise once I started. I did feel that my brain was a bit rusty simply getting back into the swing of studying (not related to retention of undergrad material though), but you get used to it quick. I also felt that reading some good, but more challenging books (non-medicine related) before school started helped get the neurons used to firing again.
Otherwise, watch plenty of TV and keep going out 3-4 times per week. And sleep AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE! There will be plenty to do soon.
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I definitely have these doubts. Not so much that my fluid intelligence isn't ample, but that my memory (capacity and encoding speed) just isn't good enough. I out-studied people in undergrad... but now that everyone will be studying hard, I'm not sure how it'll play out.
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I've never questioned my intelligence. But I do get worried about being able to retain all of this stuff.
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Oh, thank God someone mentioned something. I've been tempted to start this thread for weeks.
I am PETRIFIED. I've been out of college for almost two years now and I'm starting to wonder if maybe I'm not smart enough, if I never studied enough, if I don't know how to study, if I'll ever get through my procrastination issues, if I'll be able to force myself to go to class every morning, if I'll stay sane/alive/healthy, if I'll actually be able to memorize all that information...I am a smart kid, sure, but I don't think I've ever actually had to do THAT much work in my life, not nearly as much as med students say they do. Like Maja, it's not so much that I'm afraid that I won't grasp the concepts, it's that I can't imagine how I'll make myself study that much.
!
I am PETRIFIED. I've been out of college for almost two years now and I'm starting to wonder if maybe I'm not smart enough, if I never studied enough, if I don't know how to study, if I'll ever get through my procrastination issues, if I'll be able to force myself to go to class every morning, if I'll stay sane/alive/healthy, if I'll actually be able to memorize all that information...I am a smart kid, sure, but I don't think I've ever actually had to do THAT much work in my life, not nearly as much as med students say they do. Like Maja, it's not so much that I'm afraid that I won't grasp the concepts, it's that I can't imagine how I'll make myself study that much.
!
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Yeah, I totally know what you mean. I sort of fall into that category myself. Medical school is like the Olympic games, in a way. Everybody there is operating at extremely high levels and the game itself elevates, too. When you reach this level, it's a whole different ballgame. Anyway, at some point, I had to make peace with my academic ability. I think it was half way into my first year when I finally realized that I'd have to put in an insane amount of effort to get past the threshold of where I normally score, and to me, it simply wasn't worth sacrificing my wellbeing for that few extra points, etc. I'd much rather favor my overall happiness than kill myself trying to be at the very top of my class.Couldn't agree more.
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Oh, thank God someone mentioned something. I've been tempted to start this thread for weeks.
I am PETRIFIED. I've been out of college for almost two years now and I'm starting to wonder if maybe I'm not smart enough, if I never studied enough, if I don't know how to study, if I'll ever get through my procrastination issues, if I'll be able to force myself to go to class every morning, if I'll stay sane/alive/healthy, if I'll actually be able to memorize all that information...I am a smart kid, sure, but I don't think I've ever actually had to do THAT much work in my life, not nearly as much as med students say they do. Like Maja, it's not so much that I'm afraid that I won't grasp the concepts, it's that I can't imagine how I'll make myself study that much.
You stole my thoughts... I am still in undergrad and I have gotten away with not studying enough... In two of my upper div classes, I just aced the final to get an A, but the only reason I aced it was because everyone else did poorly... I really did not learn anything from the class... I am afraid in med school, I will not be so lucky, because I really do not how to study...
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I don't think I've ever put as much effort or applied as much brute force into studying as I did my first year of medical school. I consider myself to be fairly lazy, too, but the intensity of the game forces you to adapt, or else you'll sink fairly quickly. At first, you are merely concerned for your survival and it comes at you like a swift kick in the pants. You simply do what you need to do. Second year is much better, in part, because you've now developed and solidified your study style, etc., and gotten accustomed to the volume and intensity.
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Oh, thank God someone mentioned something. I've been tempted to start this thread for weeks.
I am PETRIFIED. I've been out of college for almost two years now and I'm starting to wonder if maybe I'm not smart enough, if I never studied enough, if I don't know how to study, if I'll ever get through my procrastination issues, if I'll be able to force myself to go to class every morning, if I'll stay sane/alive/healthy, if I'll actually be able to memorize all that information...I am a smart kid, sure, but I don't think I've ever actually had to do THAT much work in my life, not nearly as much as med students say they do. Like Maja, it's not so much that I'm afraid that I won't grasp the concepts, it's that I can't imagine how I'll make myself study that much.
Everything (every single word) in this post echos my sentiments exactly. It appears that others share the same doubts which somehow makes me feel a bit better. We're all in this together, guys!
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I don't worry about intelligence or work ethic so much as memory. Up til now its been learn and dump, learn and dump, learn and dump. And for med school it seems like it will be sort of important to learn and remember forever. Ok maybe not for everything but its still a bit scary.
These days whenever I forget something I should have remembered I think to myself "You just killed a patient." Hahaha oh the pre-med mind.
These days whenever I forget something I should have remembered I think to myself "You just killed a patient." Hahaha oh the pre-med mind.
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The first exam will kick everyone into gear if they're not jump-started. I hope it doesn't take this for me, because I don't want the anxiety.
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Well, you still end up doing a good amount of learning and dumping, but you do end up re-learning and seeing things enough times that you actually start to retain the important stuff. Probably you'll end up retaining about 1/2-1/3 of what you study the first two years, and you'll probably only realistically need about that much, anyway, but since you don't know which 1/3 you'll end up needing, you have to try to cover everything. Truthfully, having a good memory is definitely going to be of benefit, but retaining the content of your preclinical years isn't nearly as important as the learning skills you develop as you go through all that intense academic trauma. It's all about learning how to shift through a huge amount of information, triaging what you have in front of you, deciding what is important, and then learning it fairly quickly under a bit of pressure. The rest of the first two years is familiarity with the "vocabulary" of medicine and how to research what you don't know.
Hahaha...I remember those days.
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I think it's good that you recognize that there are many people smarter than you. I know it seems silly, but that's the first step. When I first entered college, most of my classmates had been used to always being at the top, and many were shocked to discover that in this new environment, they were just average.
As a result, they wasted valuable time in their state of shock/denial as they initially fell behind, did poorly etc. So coming into this type of a situation with the understanding that you may not be a genius (or that a lot of other people are just bigger geniuses) is a good thing. I think that when you're transitioning to a new academic environment, it's better to overstudy than understudy in that initial first semester. I think that it's also important to remind yourself that thousands of med students across the country are doing just fine, and as long as you put in the requisite work, the chances that you will be the outlier are exceedingly small.Oh, thank God someone mentioned something. I've been tempted to start this thread for weeks.
I am PETRIFIED. I've been out of college for almost two years now and I'm starting to wonder if maybe I'm not smart enough, if I never studied enough, if I don't know how to study, if I'll ever get through my procrastination issues, if I'll be able to force myself to go to class every morning, if I'll stay sane/alive/healthy, if I'll actually be able to memorize all that information...I am a smart kid, sure, but I don't think I've ever actually had to do THAT much work in my life, not nearly as much as med students say they do. Like Maja, it's not so much that I'm afraid that I won't grasp the concepts, it's that I can't imagine how I'll make myself study that much.
Like many others in the thread, this is exactly how I feel. I'm just glad to know I'm not the only one.
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Your classmates will inspire you to rise up to the occasion and you will either succeed or pass out. Don't worry, from now on, if you don't know what you're made of, you know now. Heck, if you aren't smart enough, work harder... and harder. Everyone has their unique talents, skills and strengths. Didn't you get the question, "What are your strengths?" question during your interview?
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most posts in this thread are basically what i've been thinking for the last few weeks... i'm terrified, but i keep telling myself that the luxury of getting into a U.S. medical school is knowing that you are good enough to go through the system...
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Just remind those who got in and have a severe case of imposter syndrome:
As a committee-letter-writer, advisor, and professor (link to evaluation criteria), you have the tools and the preparation to succeed ... otherwise your references and the evaluation committees who wrote your letters probably wouldn't have attested to it.
But "smart"? Only when you can pass the curriculum at your future school can you say anything about smart "to be a doctor". It's not just what you learn in lecture, but also how intelligent you are in observing and working with others ("emotional intelligence"), manipulating sutures and scissors (muscle memory), and integrating your knowledge. That will take time and a lot of help from faculty and peers.
(I will not comment on the new "Smart Power" diplomacy now in place with Hillary Clinton as Secretary of State, but you can elsewhere.)
As a committee-letter-writer, advisor, and professor (link to evaluation criteria), you have the tools and the preparation to succeed ... otherwise your references and the evaluation committees who wrote your letters probably wouldn't have attested to it.
But "smart"? Only when you can pass the curriculum at your future school can you say anything about smart "to be a doctor". It's not just what you learn in lecture, but also how intelligent you are in observing and working with others ("emotional intelligence"), manipulating sutures and scissors (muscle memory), and integrating your knowledge. That will take time and a lot of help from faculty and peers.
(I will not comment on the new "Smart Power" diplomacy now in place with Hillary Clinton as Secretary of State, but you can elsewhere.)
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glad to know I'm not the only one with cold feet!
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Oh, thank God someone mentioned something. I've been tempted to start this thread for weeks.
I am PETRIFIED. I've been out of college for almost two years now and I'm starting to wonder if maybe I'm not smart enough, if I never studied enough, if I don't know how to study, if I'll ever get through my procrastination issues, if I'll be able to force myself to go to class every morning, if I'll stay sane/alive/healthy, if I'll actually be able to memorize all that information...I am a smart kid, sure, but I don't think I've ever actually had to do THAT much work in my life, not nearly as much as med students say they do. Like Maja, it's not so much that I'm afraid that I won't grasp the concepts, it's that I can't imagine how I'll make myself study that much.
Ha...I've been wondering the same thing. I keep thinking I should use this semester to Audit science classes I have never taken if only to boost my confidence for next year.
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Just don't make the same mistake in reasoning I saw many of my classmates did. After our first exam many of them who did not score as well as they hoped were throwing around the "I don't understand, I put more hours into studying than _______ and he/she did better than me!" thing.
Pretty much everyone's gonna be studying an absurd number of hours. It's what you do in those hours that counts, though.
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Sometimes I feel this way, particularly now that I'm pregnant and can't remember where I live half the time (that's a joke, btw). However, I have to say that having gone to a few interviews and meeting the other candidates has kind of calmed me down a little. Without a doubt, these are really bright, motivated and accomplished people. I'm sure they outclass me intellectually in some ways. But they're not that different from me in terms of smarts.
Another thing that makes me feel better about all of this is that I'm friends with a lot of doctors. One in particular is unbelievably smart - her IQ is probably in the 150 or 160 range. I went to undergrad and took a lot of classes with her. She totally blew me out of the water academically, but I still managed to pass curved classes while competing with her. She ended up going to a top med school and is doing a fellowship at another top med school. Just recently we had this conversation, and she seems to think I'd be just fine at her alma mater ... intellectually. "Dude, it's pass/fail! I mean, it's hard, but you work hard, so you'll be fine. I'm more worried that you'll flip out in 3 weeks because so many of the students are arrogant pr!cks." Ya.
I think you'll be fine, too. As long as you have more patience than I do.
Another thing that makes me feel better about all of this is that I'm friends with a lot of doctors. One in particular is unbelievably smart - her IQ is probably in the 150 or 160 range. I went to undergrad and took a lot of classes with her. She totally blew me out of the water academically, but I still managed to pass curved classes while competing with her. She ended up going to a top med school and is doing a fellowship at another top med school. Just recently we had this conversation, and she seems to think I'd be just fine at her alma mater ... intellectually. "Dude, it's pass/fail! I mean, it's hard, but you work hard, so you'll be fine. I'm more worried that you'll flip out in 3 weeks because so many of the students are arrogant pr!cks."
Ya. I think you'll be fine, too. As long as you have more patience than I do.
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I think it's good that you recognize that there are many people smarter than you. I know it seems silly, but that's the first step. When I first entered college, most of my classmates had been used to always being at the top, and many were shocked to discover that in this new environment, they were just average.
concur, there are some great points here that match my experience going from a good college to a top 5 grad school - going from "study pretty darn hard and get almost all As" to competing with the best and brightest from within and outside the US (40% of the class were international)
In the beginning, it felt like I was pretending; walking through the same halls as all those nobel winners and former students who had done so many incredible things. Next step was to realize that EVERYONE was within the top few percent of applicants, and was brilliant, and was incredibly accomplished; it was a major mindshift to become accustomed to being "average". Effort and hours of study was what mattered at that point.
One point to add that I'd experienced - after becoming comfortable in that environment, in which your peers are that bright and have worked that hard for so many years, it can become difficult to relate to/communicate with the average person who has chosen a different path, watches american idol during the week, works a normal job, coaches volleyball..In my experience, if you stretch your brain every day for years, you become different. Just something to be aware of, and careful about.
This country values talent over a hard work ethic, oddly enough. If you were able to get into college, graduate in four years and make it into medical school you are above average in terms of intelligence. It does not take a super-genius to be successful, it takes motivation and drive.
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As has been hinted at and mentioned in the previous posts, I think the higher one ascends to in any endeavor, the smaller the difference becomes in terms of ability. The factors that separate people at higher levels are intangible - motivation, work ethic, dedication, etc.
I, too, share many of the sentiments expressed above. What puts me at ease is the fact that I will give my best at whatever I do and at the end of the day, that's all I can ask out of myself.
I, too, share many of the sentiments expressed above. What puts me at ease is the fact that I will give my best at whatever I do and at the end of the day, that's all I can ask out of myself.
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I have to say, seeing some of you crazy high-stat SDNers having the same concerns makes me feel somewhat better. We're clearly not all going to fail, so maybe the fact that we're worried is a good thing? I wonder if the people who fail out are the ones who don't really understand what they're getting themselves into and the huge adjustment they'll need to make.
Maybe this is a good sign, guys. I'm going to go ahead and believe that now.
Maybe this is a good sign, guys. I'm going to go ahead and believe that now.
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pretty much the same here, if i get in then i must be good enough to do what needs to be done, of course i am going to still worry about it, but, like other hard things i have gone through i will remember that millions have gone through it
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Half of all med students are going to find themselves in the bottom half of the class. Most were in the top 20% of their college classes so it's hugely humbling and shakes a lot of people's foundations to the core. Some folks deal with it better than others.
A lot of folks show up to med school thinking they are going to be deciding between derm and plastics and ortho, and expressing disdain for anything primary care related. You see it on SDN all the time, with folks excited about the cushy lifestyle fields and expressing negatives about things like FP. Many of those same people will ultimately come to the realization that something less competitive might really be what's most likely within their grasp. It is hard for folks to go from being the braniac straight A student to being the guy who can't see to put much distance between himself and the P/F line test after test.
The key, I think, is to stop worrying about grades, stop worrying about how other people are doing compared to you. You simply buckle down and do the best you can and let the chips fall where they may. Some people don't even look at their grades -- if you did your best and worked your hardest, the validation or lack thereof isn't that important. Certainly this ignoring the grades notion sounds a bit blasphemous to premeds, who are made and broken by their numbers. But in med school you honestly will find you do better if you keep your eyes in your own plate and don't worry about what or how others are doing. I think if you had the option to work harder, then this advice might not be the best, but in med school where most are going full tilt anyhow, and the key is really to study "smarter" not harder, something many people will never master, then trying to double down and spend more time isn't really an option when you already have the gas pedal to the floor.
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yes I think you need to take a hard look at the old self-esteem and boost it a bit
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cbrons, every time I read what's under your avatar pic I sing that old 70's song:
"Ah, ah, ah, I'm just a love machine. And I won't work for nobody but you."
AND NOW IT IS STUCK IN MY HEAD AND I CAN'T FOR THE LIFE OF ME REMEMBER WHO SANG IT!!!!
Okay, back to your regularly-scheduled thread.
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cbrons, every time i read what's under your avatar pic i sing that old 70's song:
"ah, ah, ah, i'm just a love machine. And i won't work for nobody but you."
and now it is stuck in my head and i can't for the life of me remember who sang it!!!!
Okay, back to your regularly-scheduled thread.
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