What Sold You On Your Path Program?

[mosche]

---

Members don't see this ad.

Okay, I know that there are many posts regarding the match. Further, I know that people choose programs for varying reasons ( reputation, geography, desperation, etc...).

I spent my spring break touring the upper-Midwest, trying to get an idea of which schools to list in ERAS. My conclusion: every school seems to have many good points, and a few not-so-good points.

For example, I loved the University of Minnesota and the Twin Cities. Unfortunately, the facilities seemed older than some of the others.

The Medical College of Wisconsin was amazing. The problem: Milwaukee seems to be an old city that has suffered from mass exoduses in the 70's, 80's, and 90's.

The University of Wisconsin was OKAY on all levels; but, nothing really wowed me.

So here's my question: What was the one thing that sold you on your program?
Before anyone chastises me, I know that interviews will impact my decision, as will residents opinions, etc.... I just wanted to know if there were/are specific things that influence/d others.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

I spent my spring break touring the upper-Midwest, trying to get an idea of which schools to list in ERAS. My conclusion: every school seems to have many good points, and a few not-so-good points.

So how did you like the Midwest? 😉 Anyways, I agree with your conclusion 100%. My impression is that one can get solid pathology training at many programs. And clearly almost all the programs fill and the majority of applicants get their first choice on Match Day. So what does this tell me? There are a variety of reasons, far beyond comprehension, why certain people choose to go somewhere and different people choose to go to a variety of places. Maybe it has to do with family issues? Maybe the institution is really strong in a certain collection of specialties that a person is interested in? Maybe one fell in love with a certain city? Maybe the residency program had a smokin' hot chick (yeah, and I'm looking right at you yaah!)? Who knows. That's why this talk of top 5, top 10, top 20 programs (and realize that formal rankings don't exist for pathology programs) is kinda pointless and moot. Sure reputation comes into play when choosing programs; nonetheless, reputation IMHO is a subjective assessment and you will hear different opinions depending on who you talk to. The only important ranking is the ranking list that YOU make come rank order list deadline day because this reflects what programs are the best FOR YOU.

So here's my question: What was the one thing that sold you on your program?

There wasn't one overriding thing that sold me on my program. Although I applied all over the country (and interviewing at 12 places in retrospect was kinda foolish of me), I knew that I wanted to go back to the east coast for my residency training and postdoc. Furthermore, I knew early on and prior to interview season that the program I will be joining this summer would be my #1 (probably very superficial of me). This was based on talking to advisers and various attendings. Is this program the best pathology program in the nation? Many would argue no. But I felt that given my career goals that this was the best pathology program for me--a place with emphasis on basic science research, strong track record for producing physician-scientists in pathology, strong diagnostic pathology training, etc. Of course, being committed (in the back of my mind) to this place from the get-go was a risky proposition given that I had not visited the place. Worst case scenario would be that I would interview here and come away thinking that the visit was a horrible experience. Fortunately, that didn't happen and after my interview visit, I felt even more strongly that this program was the best program for me personally.

Again, there wasn't any overriding motive for choosing this program as my #1. And there were quite a few intangible factors and impressions that figured into the decision...can't go into them or this post would be longer than it already is.

 

[EvilNewbie]

I was sold on some of the perks (stipend, book fund, meals, etc.) of the program and a general "how I thought I would fit into the program" feeling. I wanted to get a sense of how well I could be trained and what resources they had for that training as well as what fellowships they had for me career-wise. NCI-associated cancer centers with the program was a plus for me as well as what "type" of specimens they had and how much scut work I was expected. And just between you and me, I tried to see how many autopsy months they had (I wanted the shortest possible) and some places had almost a year of it (that's just crazy, no way would I do that many autopsies especially when I wasn't even going into forensics).

 

[deschutes]

Since I am going to UMN... 🙂

I loved the University of Minnesota and the Twin Cities. Unfortunately, the facilities seemed older than some of the others.

I know what you mean. My review is here.

They have 4 separate sites. I did not have the chance to visit anywhere else but the Fairview site (which is - like you say - quite old). I thought about a second visit to see the other sites, but didn't have the time.

Hennepin County Medical Centre I am told has stunningly new facilities, and I imagine Abbott Northwestern (since it is private) cannot be too shabby. The VA is probably, well, a VA.

So you can see that I did not need complete information to make a comfortable decision.

I had heard the story about the university hospital being in the red a few years ago, but since they have the highest PGY-1 salary of all the places I visited (though residents pay tuition) and since resident training was apparently not much affected during the financial difficulty, I laid that to rest.

Rosai was once there. There are two ways to look at this:
(1) It is not as great as it used to be, or
(2) The place has a solid legacy in its systems, goals and standards.

My approach to residency is that it is the means to an end, not the end itself. The flexibility and potential of the UMN program definitely weighed in there. At the interview the PD kept saying "we can do that too" in answer to a lot of my questions - and I felt a little sceptical of this. I wasn't able to pin things down, but I think (and what yaah said comes to mind now) that there really are some programs out there with no particular "personality", precisely because they have that flexibility.

As I wrote in a recent post, I didn't imagine when I ranked them #1 that they would even consider sending me to present at a non-North American conference in my PGY-1 year. (PGY-1's are really just small fry 😉 ) But certain traits tend to go with certain work environments and I might just have gotten lucky.

By March 14, I honestly didn't want to end up anywhere else - though I probably wouldn't have been terribly unhappy at Numbers 2-5 🙂

 

[deschutes]

I tried to see how many autopsy months they had (I wanted the shortest possible) and some places had almost a year of it (that's just crazy, no way would I do that many autopsies especially when I wasn't even going into forensics).

I sometimes wonder if that is not due to the way the autopsy service works.

I don't know if this is possible, but what if you're not actually on an autopsy month but still go in for autopsy call?

With autopsies # dropping nationwide I wonder if the long period (perhaps while being on another simultaneous cush-er service?) is what was found to be necessary to catchment the 50 that ABP certification needs.

Just my 0.02.

 

[yaah]

I didn't have anything specific that sold me on my program. I didn't want to pick a program because of one thing (or avoid one because of one factor, conversely). I wanted a well rounded program where the residents were happy, smart, and teaching was a key part of day to day activities. I was also looking for a place I would be happy living for at least 4 years. Thus, where I ended up.

Some people will pick programs based on one person that they meet - be it the PD, the chair, another resident, or an attending that they want to train under.

I would advise not picking a program based on one thing - while that may be a nice thing, the majority of your training will revolve around the rest.

 

[mosche]

Thank you for all the really great responses.

Andy, I am almost certain that I will end up in the upper-Midwest. I love the weather, the people, and the laid-back pace.

Deschutes, thank you for the info. and link. I was not aware that UM had other campuses -- good to know. Perhaps we will be colleagues 👍 .

EvilNewbie, I agree that the benefits are a huge plus at any program. Thank you for emphasizing it; it will be one of those questions that I will put on my list ( if I don't put it on a list, I will forget it on the interview trail).

Finally, Yaah, as usual, I agree with everything you said. I think that I just want this to be over quickly and as painlessly as possible. What can I say: I'm a third year med student who has senioritis .

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Andy, I am almost certain that I will end up in the upper-Midwest. I love the weather, the people, and the laid-back pace.

I loved the 7 years I spent in the upper midwest too. Perhaps I will come back here when my career is more established. 🙂

 

[cjw0918]

I ended up at #3 on my ROL, but it easily could have been #2. I really liked the city where I matched. And I had to consider my husband's job prospects in different cities as well. For me there was a clear #1 because of husband's job, but #2 and #3 were both the same basically. I even devised an objective way to rate the programs (as objective as possible) and they both got the same rating. It's hard at first not getting what you want in the match, but when you start focusing on the positives about where you matched you start to get excited.
I also considered the residents at the programs. I like to feel part of the group. I think I like bigger places for this reason. I didn't know this about myself until I interviewed at lots of places. I feel like there's bound to be more people you have things in common with and people you really click with at big places. Just my observations...

 

[moonunit77]

What kind of board scores do I need to do path? I realize there's a range. But what's a ballpark figure? Thanks

 

[deschutes]

What kind of board scores do I need to do path? I realize there's a range. But what's a ballpark figure? Thanks

Short answer: Anyone's guess.

I was going to link you to the Post-Match thread, but hesitated because the #'s reported (despite my best efforts 😉 ) are definitely skewed towards the ridiculously high.

I'll link you anyway, since the contributors have evidently put considerable effort into their posts there. Hopefully more so-called "average" applicants - or so-called "stellar" applicants who matched into so-called "average" programs - will post now!

 

[yaah]

The only board score you have to get is a passing grade. After that, doing well will help your application but so will other things on your application. It's best to not think of certain parts of your application as make-or-break, despite what some will argue.