I have heard a lot of talk about people going and becoming an EMT or RN or something along those lines while they are still in under grad school finishing their pre-med. What do you guys think about this? Would you suggest doing this? Just give me your thoughts! I am afriad that I wont have the time to work and go to school full time, but then again im just very paranoid lol so what are your thoughts on this?
What to do while getting pre-med?
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First off: relax. School is by far the most important part of the equation. Second, you don't just become an RN in your spare time. It requires a 4year degree and frankly a stupid thing to do if your end goal is to become a physician. Becoming a CNA is doable, and many people rave about the experiences for applications. I didn't do it, so I can't comment further.
An EMT-b course, on the other hand, is great and could easily be done at night during a semester once your are comfortable in college. Working part time, or volunteering with your college's student EMS systems, is a great way to gain some meaningful pt experience and see a lot of health care. I've been working for a few years post graduation as an EMT and it has been great. It has also been extremely helpful on interviews.
The college where I live offers a 2 year RN program and most of the requirements for the program are also pre-med reqs, thats why i thought it might be a good idea.
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You will need to show significant clinical experience, preferably over 500 hours. This doesn't necessarily need to be done through RN or EMT, but those are two great ways to rack up some clinical experience hours.
So working as an RN/EMT will count towards those 500+ hours of clinical experience?
Honestly, it'll look stellar on your application, but there are better ways to go about buffing yourself up with less time commitment. If you really think you'd love the EMT or RN atmosphere, then by all means go for it. If not, I'd suggest checking in with your local hospital to see what volunteer opportunities they'd have for someone with little experience in the field. Scribe is one of the new fads that actually helps your application out quite a bit. Here's a link to know more- http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=927613
One of the best pieces of general advice I've been given on the road to becoming a doctor is this: no matter what you do outside of school, try your best to make sure you're in a leadership position.
Thanks for the link, I'll check it out. Are you a doctor? What did you do while you were in your pre-med years?
The Scribe program seems to require somewhat of a base knowledge of how the things in the hospital/ER works. Im guessing that this would be suggested after ive been through some of my pre med courses already?
Nah, I just have a lot of experience in the medical field both from a military and civilian standpoint. I also have a ridiculous amount of doctors in my family.
The sciences won't have much to do with the ins and outs of hospital functionality. You could do it after volunteering at the hospital for a while, or try to get in through a recommendation if you know someone.
Oh haha, well thanks for bringing your knowledge here! I dont even have a person in my family that has went to college....
Well you came to the right place then. 👍 There aren't many other places where informed individuals will argue on your behalf over what the perfect option is out of many good options.
yeh i may just volunteer for a while and then take it from there.
im glad i found this place
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Depending on where you live and how well you can swim, lifeguarding is a good option, it's usually pretty flexible.
It not exactly a clinical experience, but you are still doing protecting lives in the community.
And if you do become a lifeguard, it not about the number of people you save, it about preventing people from getting into trouble in the first place.
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Thanks for the tip, but i live about 400 miles from the nearest beach :/
Public pools. 🙂
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dude don't become a nurse, unless you wan't to become a nurse. and don't become a CNA unless you don't mind cleaning up poopy behinds every day. i think the best thing to do to get "clinical experience" is to get your EMT and then become an ER tech.
but frankly, most admissions committees know that at the application stage, most "clinical experiences" listed on an app are fluff or BS. I think it's more important to do something you like, do it well/with leadership positions, and do it for a substantial period of time. admissions would rather hear that you did something for a long time because you were passionate about it and wanted to be the best you can be. they don't care that you were a candy striper at the local hospital because you wanted to get into medical school...because so did everyone else.
be yourself, be unique. and then fill in any gaps with some shadowing experiences.
but frankly, most admissions committees know that at the application stage, most "clinical experiences" listed on an app are fluff or BS. I think it's more important to do something you like, do it well/with leadership positions, and do it for a substantial period of time. admissions would rather hear that you did something for a long time because you were passionate about it and wanted to be the best you can be. they don't care that you were a candy striper at the local hospital because you wanted to get into medical school...because so did everyone else.
be yourself, be unique. and then fill in any gaps with some shadowing experiences.
I am so glad you brought up the ER Tech. I cant believe that I forgot to mention that. I am very interested in being an ER Tech
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yeah i think its better than riding around on the ambulances...you will get better interactions with the physicians, from what i've seen.
Yeh, do you even have to have any schooling for that? My friends mom did it for a while and i dont think she went to school
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Eiot's correct, scribe is also something to consider.
yeh like i told him, ill look into it later in my pre-med
To be a tech in a hospital the requirements are usually either being a NA or an EMT. A lot of what you will be doing is OJT and the job can vary from cleaning up feces and undressing patients to starting IVs, drawing labs, and being an integral member of the trauma team.
These jobs are very competitive where I live, and most of the people I know working as techs transitioned from being EMTs. It is really a great option to go with, and more of a reason to become an EMT.
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It's not fair to say just "riding around on the ambulances". EMTs do a significant amount of medical work. There is also a lot of collaboration with the ER and the incoming ambulances. When I was in the ER, the docs were frequently getting calls from the EMTs about certain drugs and such.
I definitely agree that we do a significant amount of medical work, but there is not a whole lot of "collaboration." We have a scope of practice which is controlled by the state and to varying degrees a medical director. This scope dictates what we can do for certain patients (e.g. if a patient has a altered mental status, is able to swallow, and has a blood glucose level of less than 70mg/dl my protocols states that I give them oral glucose). Occasionally my protocol tells me to contact medical control (e.g. if the same patient shows signs of a stroke I am required to seek medical advice before I give glucose). The only other contact I really have with doctors in an ED (and far more often it is with the RNs) is when I call in an entry note to let them know that I am bringing them a sick patient. Paramedics, on the other hand, are much more advanced in their training and their skillset. They are able to push drugs, shock arrhythmias, intubate patients, and start IVs. They frequently handle the sickest patients and the most serious traumas. They are in more frequent contact with the ED because they have a scope which allows them to make more meaningful treatments to the patient. They are still limited by a scope of practice which defines the care they may provide.
Tl;dr: EMTs don't collaborate, but I think we are very important.
OP, the patient care experience I have recieved on the ambulance has been incredible. I have seen psych patients, peds patients, traumas, medical emergencies, and transfers from pretty much every department in the hospital. It has been very rewarding and has provided me a great base to discuss why I have wanted to become a physician with my interviewers.
EDIT: I'm an idiot and thought a comment was directed to me.
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i said "just riding around in ambulances." i didn't mean to undersell the importance of EMTs or the hard work they do. nor did i mean to say that their job isn't medical. i just had a case presentation to complete and didn't have too much time to BS around while i was finishing it...
what i was trying to say is that generally EM doctors don't do a whole bunch of riding in the ambulances. they are working in the ER waiting for the ambulance to come. and while they do talk to the EMTs to get a quick HP, the EM doctors I work with have a much more intimate relationship with the ER techs who they work with for 12 solid hours at a time...
its the latter interaction i would think you would want if you are looking for shadowing opportunities/quality LORs for medical school.
what i was trying to say is that generally EM doctors don't do a whole bunch of riding in the ambulances. they are working in the ER waiting for the ambulance to come. and while they do talk to the EMTs to get a quick HP, the EM doctors I work with have a much more intimate relationship with the ER techs who they work with for 12 solid hours at a time...
its the latter interaction i would think you would want if you are looking for shadowing opportunities/quality LORs for medical school.
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An EMT supervisor could write a LOR. And as for shadowing an other opportunities, this can be done on your own. It doesn't need to be through your job. Especially if you go to a hospital affiliated with your undergraduate institution. You could ask one of the doctors if you could shadow him/her after your shift sometime. I would honestly feel a little bit awkward about shadowing people I worked with. I think being an ER tech would be a great job, but I don't think it would put you ahead of someone working as an EMT.
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yes. that is correct. you can get a LOR from anyone. but i think the admissions committee would be more impressed by a LOR from a physician who has spent substantial time seeing you around patients than an EMT supervisor. the physician will be better able to comment on your bearing and potential as a future physician.
i would also recommend not shadowing people you work with. but i can't tell you how many times on this board and elsewhere people complain about not being able to find someone to shadow. if you get in good with the ER docs, i am certain they would be willing to set you up shadowing with a colleague in the specialty of your choosing. just gotta get your foot in the door!
i would also recommend not shadowing people you work with. but i can't tell you how many times on this board and elsewhere people complain about not being able to find someone to shadow. if you get in good with the ER docs, i am certain they would be willing to set you up shadowing with a colleague in the specialty of your choosing. just gotta get your foot in the door!
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True but it doesn't need to be done through a job. Many people find physicians through undergraduate research which pre-meds should be doing anyway. If your ugrad school has an affiliated medical school, you can just apply for medical related research. I've seen tons of undergrads at the hospital. Even freshmen are doing research.
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Most pre-meds don't do research with MDs, if only because the number of science labs run by PhDs vastly outnumber the MD labs. Further, a research LOR can be important, but even if your PI is a physician, their evaluation of you in a research setting is not the same as a physician's evaluation of your clinical potential. Basically, what I am getting at is if your research LOR is from a MD, I would still strive to get a physician LOR garnered from a relationship in a clinical setting.
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+1
also, my point was that you need to be strategic when you're networking and setting up your premed activities. everyone has limited time, so better to work smart than hard.
and really, you can get shadowing a lot of different ways. some people seem to have a hard time setting it up though. i was just saying that you need to use your network to set up connections. makes life a whole bunch easier.
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At UVM a lot of undergraduate biology related research is done with physicians. I don't know about other institutions though.
What is an LOR?
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did you read his post bro?
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sorry man, and LOR is a letter of recommendation. you usually need a handful to apply to medical school. most schools require at least one to be from a physician.
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Uhh. Just get clinical experience. Like get some volunteer hours in at a hospital or a community clinic that serves the poor. Molecular cell biology will be a far practical major for med school since thats the trend in medicine nowadays. If you have the time to be an RN or CNA.. I'd just find a lab and get on a research project. No joke. I don't know where you heard its good to be an RN or something to go into medicine. I think it's only justified to become an RN if you are actually considering the career. My roommate became an RN and it was very time consuminggg. Becoming an EMT is doable, but its benefit for your application is still marginal than to just rack up some volunteer hours, given you spend that extra time doing something more interesting like taking on leadership roles, joining a organization you care about, etc.
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A lot is not most. Done with physicians is not done with physicians as the PI. Further, biology extends vastly beyond biomedical science.
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No but a lot proves that you can do it if you want to. Biomedical research is what I'll be doing though.
wow i feel stupid lol
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I never said that you couldn't dude.
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Thanks dude.
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Looks like it was mentioned but I'll re-iterate here. Do not waste time with an EMT cert unless you plan on spending a SIGNIFICANT amount of time working for a service. FOr the most part adcoms aren't impressed with it, and this is coming from someone with 10 years as a Firefighter and Paramedic (continue working shifts still today).
I suppose things could have changed in four years, but seems unlikely, and I know 4 years ago they cared very little about my 10's-of-thousand hours of patient care, and more about the other crap in my application.
I suppose things could have changed in four years, but seems unlikely, and I know 4 years ago they cared very little about my 10's-of-thousand hours of patient care, and more about the other crap in my application.
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EMT is a great way to show medical experience. And it's fun. Getting certified is actually really easy as long as you're not a complete *****.
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I agree, it's great fun, that's why I still do it. But the experience is varied. The overwhelming vast majority of people who go through an EMT course aren't going to land a 911 gig, even volunteer. Most end up doing private transports, which is vastly different.
Again, my experience were somewhat unique, 10,000+ plus hours of patient care in a very busy (25,000+ calls year) ALS system. And almost universally (there was one place that was very interested in my background) it never came up at interviews. I got more questions about the fire side (which has no patient contact) than I ever did about the EMS side.
Again, not saying it isn't fun (been doing it for ten years), but for admission purposes there are better options.
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I think during the interview EMTs should really try to promote themselves and place an emphasis on the patient care. I live in a small state with a relatively small number of EMTs proportionately to the population. Pretty much any EMR, EMT-B, EMT-I, or Paramedic will get patient contact starting day one at any given rescue squad. When I'm interviewing I think my focus will be on the experiences I've had with patients rather than the number of hours, and certifications I have.
