What to do?

[MarginalUtility23]

Hello all! I'm in a pretty tough situation and wanted to seek the advice of the wonderful /premed community.

I am a Caribbean medical student and am not doing well. I did not pass first semester and currently am attempting to repeat the semester but will likely not pass this time either. I will be withdrawing in the coming days so that I do not waste any more time and money to try to fix grades that are essentially unsalvageable at this point.

I wanted to seek advice on what to do next. I believe my academic issues stem from less than stellar performance in the pre-med, pre-req courses which has caused me to suffer in subsequent upper level courses due to having a weak knowledge base. I believed that those courses would not matter and that med school would be easy, boy was I wrong! It is not a place where you can effectively cram. The sheer amount of content and memorization required is something I have never excelled with before. I know that I can improve this with practice and time; I did not have adequate time in med school. I was stupid to choose this route, instead of becoming a stronger student I took the easy way out. My GPA was lower than DO's and MD's would consider, but with an upward trend. My MCAT was also below average, mainly due to not having that strong of a knowledge base of the basic sciences.

I am confident that I can take some time and learn the material I need to with the help of friends, Khan Academy, etc. then take several upper level science courses at a local university and obviously try to succeed. I also believe that I can devote about 6 months to study for the MCAT and receive a competitive score. I also know several doctors that I can go back and shadow as well before I reapply to US schools. I know that my study habits have significantly during my time here and am confident that I can apply them for future good.

So basically, what should I do? I want to reapply to US MD and DO schools and am willing to work for it. So far, I sense that there is not a CHANCE IN HELL that a student who ever stepped foot on a Caribbean medical school's campus should ever let the words "United States medical school" or "doctor" enter their mind again. That I would be better off burying my worthless corpse beside the highway. Why is this? If someone is willing to put in this level of work and has the results to show for it, wouldn't they be accepted? I feel like this experience has built character and maturity that only this type of failure could have. I would love to go to a doctor who grew as a human being and learned how to succeed than one who was born with a 4.0 and a 528.

Thank you for reading this, any advice is appreciated!!

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Lucca]

Nobody is worthless just because they do not become a physician or even because they fail to achieve their professional goals. If you honestly feel this way and are not just venting, then you should seek professional help. Take care of your physical and mental health and you will be more likely to succeed. There are many positive things one can do with their life that do not involve going to medical school.

I'm afraid I dont know enough about applicants in your situation to advise you, but if you are struggling to pass at Ross then I would cut your losses as early as possible and attempt to find a different career and re-evaluate your medical school aspirations at a later date when you are in a better financial, emotional position and therefore better prepared to perform academically at the level you need to be competitive for US MD/DO.

 

[Med Ed]

I would love to go to a doctor who grew as a human being and learned how to succeed than one who was born with a 4.0 and a 528.

No one is born with a 4.0 and 528. You are simply protecting your ego by diminishing the success of others.

Withdraw from Ross ASAP, find another career, and revisit this whole thing in about 5 years.

 

[MarginalUtility23]

Nobody is worthless just because they do not become a physician or even because they fail to achieve their professional goals. If you honestly feel this way and are not just venting, then you should seek professional help. Take care of your physical and mental health and you will be more likely to succeed. There are many positive things one can do with their life that do not involve going to medical school.

I'm afraid I dont know enough about applicants in your situation to advise you, but if you are struggling to pass at Ross then I would cut your losses as early as possible and attempt to find a different career and re-evaluate your medical school aspirations at a later date when you are in a better financial, emotional position and therefore better prepared to perform academically at the level you need to be competitive for US MD/DO.

I am just venting and do not actually feel worthless. I am very disappointed in myself but realize that I was not ready for the rigors of medical school. Would you recommend me devoting my time to studying for the MCAT and working a part time job like UBER driver, scribe, or tutor to earn some income? Or, would the better route be to forget medicine and pursue a totally different path for a year or two? I have a degree in economics and am confident I can land at least an entry level job in the corporate world.

Why US MD/DO wont look at a person in your situation? You had several chances to show your motivation and commitment and failed at each one.

1) you had 4 years of undergrad and you choose to say “I dont need this material,” ignoring the fact that not having the content and, more importantly, learning the skillset to be a student, is what you needed to be successful in medical school

2) postbacc or SMP. You did neither, a chance to redeem and you just ignored it.

3) MCAT: many students who didnt do great in prereqs spend significant time prepping and shining on the MCAT. You didnt

4) finally, you got into Ross, a medical school, a place that could have led to be a doctor. And you couldnt hack it.

With tens of thousands highly successful applicants a year, who havent blown all these chances above, why should any US med school spend even 5 minutes looking at your record and reject you.

Your plan to somehow make all this up as a recovering premed will not work. The only possible thing to do is be successful at something else for several years. Prove that you can accomplish something and maintain it such as a nurse. Then makeup all those deficiencies. You still will only have a snowball’s chance in hell. So get any, and I any, timeframe or dates when you can try applying again out of your head. Before any of that you need to focus solely on something else

I understand that all of this is true. My question is based on the possibility that I excel in upper level Biology, Chemistry, and Anatomy courses, as well as the MCAT. If this happens, I feel like a US medical school would at least give me chance to talk since I would have proved that I can succeed at that point. Would you mind answering my question to the above poster as well?

No one is born with a 4.0 and 528. You are simply protecting your ego by diminishing the success of others.

Withdraw from Ross ASAP, find another career, and revisit this whole thing in about 5 years.

I do not mean to undermine anyone else's accomplishments. I have great respect for everyone in the medical field and for the amount of work it takes to get there.

 

[ndafife]

Not everyone is academically capable of handling medical school. You did bad in pre-reqs. You did bad in upper level courses. You did bad on the MCAT. You're doing bad at Ross.

You can talk about how confident you are that you can do it, but at some point you need to face some sense of reality.

 

[gyngyn]

When you have dug yourself into a hole this deep, you really need to stop digging.

 

[Goro]

OP, you'd be DOA at my school. I can't sugar coat this: your medical career, if not over, is in DEEP stasis until you fix every one of your deficits.

 

[MarginalUtility23]

Not everyone is academically capable of handling medical school. You did bad in pre-reqs. You did bad in upper level courses. You did bad on the MCAT. You're doing bad at Ross.

You can talk about how confident you are that you can do it, but at some point you need to face some sense of reality.

I agree. I am asking what I would need to do to get into a US medical school at this point.

When you have dug yourself into a hole this deep, you really need to stop digging.

I appreciate the input!

OP, you'd be DOA at my school. I can't sugar coat this: your medical career, if not over, is in DEEP stasis until you fix every one of your deficits.

Is DOA dead on arrival? If so, that's disheartening. In your opinion, what can I do at this point?

 

[Kpw101]

People really underestimate how much work they put in.

Really ask yourself how hard you're pushing yourself. Re-evaluate what you're doing before you try again, if against all advice you choose to.

Like that person we all know at the gym who complains that we lose fat alot easier than he does, often you might just not be running hard enough. And from your post it seems like you're the type of person to try and take shortcuts, no offense intended.

 

[IMGASMD]

Also examine your own motivation of why you want to be a doctor so bad? There are plenty of jobs that will not require you to do anything else more for the next 15 years of your life.

 

[ndafife]

I agree. I am asking what I would need to do to get into a US medical school at this point

Magically become better at school.

You just flunked out of a caribbean school you went to because your gpa and MCAT werent up to par with US schools. Take a breath. Take a few years off and get a different job and worry about something other than medical school. If after a few years you still want to go, start retaking classes. If youre still not getting good grades then stop. If you are, take the MCAT and go from there.

 

[MarginalUtility23]

I still have a log shot of passing here at Ross. I would need to average about a 77% on the remaining exams and practical to do this which is well above the average. At this point, should I try with all of my effort to pass this term? And If I do fail, would this look worse in the long run than if I were to withdraw right now? My advisors have recommended withdrawing and reapplying to Ross in the future or to other Caribbean schools.

 

[MarginalUtility23]

Also, would anyone recommend contacting advisors from US schools regarding my situation? I would obviously like to exhaust all of my options before pursuing a completely different career/job. I am interested in neuroscience and evolution and will probably take upper level courses in those subjects regardless.

 

[MarginalUtility23]

People really underestimate how much work they put in.

Really ask yourself how hard you're pushing yourself. Re-evaluate what you're doing before you try again, if against all advice you choose to.

Like that person we all know at the gym who complains that we lose fat alot easier than he does, often you might just not be running hard enough. And from your post it seems like you're the type of person to try and take shortcuts, no offense intended.

You are probably right, I was not working as hard as I should have been. The bad thing is that now in medical school, I consistently work hard for 8-12 hours but that is the average and I am further behind than most.

As I told you in my first post, you need to do and be successful at something else for sometime before you can even think about medical school, preferably in something medically related, because all your records has shown so far is failure. It took you years to get in this hole and it will take you years to get out of it


Why do you possibly think that over all the other thousands of applicants who didnt screw up in undergrad, who enhanced their record in a postbacc or SMP if need be, who didnt bomb the MCAT the first time, and above all, didnt get into a medical school and fail out, would even look at you now even if you suddenly made a great SMP and MCAT?

I am sorry, but before you can make any plans, before you can even think about where to go from here, you need to accept and come to terms with this fact: you failed. I dont mean crying, suffering, depressed, I mean accept the responsibility and be at peace with the reality before you can even take any step because you must be accepting of where you are or you are no place. Until you can accept that without fear, without anger, without frustration, and without some immediate desperate plan of how to get out of it, you will always be what you are. Only when you come to terms with it, can you then even begin to accept and understand why you are that way. Stop digging deeper before trying to claw your way out this hole. Cause I will tell you, I have spent years of my life in deep, dark holes, and if you dont stop, take a breath, understand where you are and how you really got there, you will never climb out.

My argument is that if a student has proven that they can succeed, then previous results shouldn't matter as much. Making a great MCAT and SMP would indicate that the student is academically competent after all and can actually handle the rigors of medical school. I am seriously evaluating what to do next.

 

[Med Ed]

I am just venting and do not actually feel worthless. I am very disappointed in myself but realize that I was not ready for the rigors of medical school. Would you recommend me devoting my time to studying for the MCAT and working a part time job like UBER driver, scribe, or tutor to earn some income? Or, would the better route be to forget medicine and pursue a totally different path for a year or two? I have a degree in economics and am confident I can land at least an entry level job in the corporate world.

You cannot be reborn unless you have been dead.

 

[ndafife]

My argument is that if a student has proven that they can succeed, then previous results shouldn't matter as much. Making a great MCAT and SMP would indicate that the student is academically competent after all and can actually handle the rigors of medical school. I am seriously evaluating what to do next.

Youre arguing a bunch of hypotheticals that do not exist. You dont have a great MCAT and nothing youre saying gives me any confidence you will get one/get into a SMP/do well in an SMP.

 

[Rajaredhilu]

This caribbean school seems like your one chance. You should of been more diligent during the semester, but if you can continue at this carib school that would be my advice. Once you quit this school idk why anyone else would take you. Med school is it man. Its the time you need to perform, sounds like youve slacked off on all the other things before this, so if youve also been slacking off in med school then I dont see you ever becoming a physician.

 

[Goro]

You are probably right, I was not working as hard as I should have been. The bad thing is that now in medical school, I consistently work hard for 8-12 hours but that is the average and I am further behind than most.



My argument is that if a student has proven that they can succeed, then previous results shouldn't matter as much. Making a great MCAT and SMP would indicate that the student is academically competent after all and can actually handle the rigors of medical school. I am seriously evaluating what to do next.

Stop with the magic thinking already!. You're already in medical school and you are starting to fail out. What makes you think that magically you can do better in an SMP???

Not everybody is destined to be a doctor.

In addition to the wise advice you've been given here in this thread, you can start by making better decisions.

 

[frog301]

Hello all! I'm in a pretty tough situation and wanted to seek the advice of the wonderful /premed community.

I am a Caribbean medical student at ROSS and am not doing well. I did not pass first semester and currently am attempting to repeat the semester but will likely not pass this time either. I will be withdrawing in the coming days so that I do not waste any more time and money to try to fix grades that are essentially unsalvageable at this point.

I wanted to seek advice on what to do next. I believe my academic issues stem from less than stellar performance in the pre-med, pre-req courses which has caused me to suffer in subsequent upper level courses due to having a weak knowledge base. I believed that those courses would not matter and that med school would be easy, boy was I wrong! It is not a place where you can effectively cram. The sheer amount of content and memorization required is something I have never excelled with before. I know that I can improve this with practice and time; I did not have adequate time in med school. I was stupid to choose this route, instead of becoming a stronger student I took the easy way out. My GPA was lower than DO's and MD's would consider, but with an upward trend. My MCAT was also below average, mainly due to not having that strong of a knowledge base of the basic sciences.

I am confident that I can take some time and learn the material I need to with the help of friends, Khan Academy, etc. then take several upper level science courses at a local university and obviously try to succeed. I also believe that I can devote about 6 months to study for the MCAT and receive a competitive score. I also know several doctors that I can go back and shadow as well before I reapply to US schools. I know that my study habits have significantly during my time here and am confident that I can apply them for future good.

So basically, what should I do? I want to reapply to US MD and DO schools and am willing to work for it. So far, I sense that there is not a CHANCE IN HELL that a student who ever stepped foot on a Caribbean medical school's campus should ever let the words "United States medical school" or "doctor" enter their mind again. That I would be better off burying my worthless corpse beside the highway. Why is this? If someone is willing to put in this level of work and has the results to show for it, wouldn't they be accepted? I feel like this experience has built character and maturity that only this type of failure could have. I would love to go to a doctor who grew as a human being and learned how to succeed than one who was born with a 4.0 and a 528.

Thank you for reading this, any advice is appreciated!!

Why do you want to be a doctor? Looking at the history you provided, it looks like there has been a severe lack of motivation throughout all of your endeavors, leading to an inevitable failure. All of your doors are closed. Undergrad failed. MCAT failed. Caribbean med school failed. Caribbean med school failed again. Why do you think you're magically going to become "capable and hard working?" You shot yourself in the foot several times. Time to find a different career path.

Also have you even thought about what kind of FINANCIAL DIFFICULTY you're in? You just wasted 2 semesters worth of tuition, with nothing to show for it. You're not graduating with a degree, and you're sure as heck not matching into any residency. No source of sustainable income. Working as a "scribe" or "shadowing" isn't going to compensate for your lackluster performance. You could have 10,000 hours shadowing and scribing, and you'd still be screened out before anyone even thinks about your application.

Why do you think ROSS took you, when US MD/DO schools wouldn't? It's because they're profit schools. They don't care about you, they just want your money. People like you are the ones that they prey on. Even if you graduated from there, the majority DO NOT match into residency. And looking at your academic performance in classes, I don't think you'd do too hot on the USMLEs.

You're an economics major? What're you going to tell employers when they ask you what you've been doing all this time after you graduated? No work experience, no internships.

You need to step away from this path, and seriously consider something else. @MarginalUtility23

 

[MarginalUtility23]

I will never give up

 

[smukke]

I will never give up

You don't have to. You just have to accept that it's not going to happen right now or any time soon. Realize that you are in a hole and the important thing is to have a plan in place of getting yourself out of the hole and not dig deeper. Right now even a successful SMP is going to be overshadowed by 2 failing med school semesters (plus the fact that it would have been your 3rd pass through some of the material). Listen to what everyone is saying.

Withdraw (failing 1 semester + 1 possible fail is better than 2 definite fails).
Make a 5 year plan to have a successful career that DOESN'T include med school. Consider nursing like gonnif suggested, personally I'd make the case that a completely unrelated field will make for a better come back story if you do reapply.
Re-evaluate after 5 years. Make another 5 year plan. Start doing a DIY postbacc. Start accumulating ECs. Consider a SMP after this.

At the end of the day probably the only thing you could say to adcoms is going to be "Yes I was young, I was stupid, I made mistakes and things didn't work out. Over the last X years I've worked in Y and while I have had a successful career but I still felt that my calling was in medicine" and the only thing that is going to allow you to say that is time.

 

[frog301]

@MarginalUtility23



How about you continue and complete your education? Since you're already enrolled, you might as well finish through. Then at least you'll have a CHANCE to match, instead of starting from scratch and being set back years more.

Finish the program at Ross, try your hand at USMLE. If your work ethic is "good" and you have decent scores, who knows. Maybe you'll end up matching and start practicing in a couple years.

IMHO that's a better option right now then going back to start school from baseline.

 

[frog301]

I will never give up

Keep us updated on your decision

 

[863168]

At this point, should I try with all of my effort to pass this term?

I will never give up

If you honestly feel this way and are not just venting, then you should seek professional help. Take care of your physical and mental health and you will be more likely to succeed.

"At this Point"

 

[Osminog]

If time and money aren't factors for you:

Master's degree in biomedical science field from a low-tier university: 3.8+ (or two years of full-time science courses with 3.8+) --> SMP: 3.8+ --> MCAT: 505+ --> apply to all DO schools.

If time and money are factors for you:

Choose another profession.

 

[dial1010usa]

I will never give up

You should put your 100% what you are doing. If you pass great but if you fail then comeback to USA and start with community college basic science classes. You need to sit down and where you are going wrong. Only you can fix this. Do not rush. As I said take some community college classes and work as a scribe not uber. Shadow a doctor do some volunteers. Do a baby step.

All the best!

 

[TheRealCookieMonster]

Prove that you can accomplish something and maintain it such as a nurse.

Hahaha... and all the nurses start flaming.

I'm in a pretty tough situation and wanted to seek the advice

But seriously, your chances of leaving Ross and preparing for and becoming a successful nurse and then reapplying and attending 4 years of med school are low for a multitude of reasons. Nor should you apply to another health profession with any intention other than being great at that job, especially nursing. You gotta really tap into the reason you wanted to be a doctor in the first place, it will likely tell you why you don't need to be one or shouldn't be one. I bet you can find the answer in your personal statement.

If I was you I would join the military ASAP!

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

I still have a log shot of passing here at Ross. I would need to average about a 77% on the remaining exams and practical to do this which is well above the average. At this point, should I try with all of my effort to pass this term? And If I do fail, would this look worse in the long run than if I were to withdraw right now? My advisors have recommended withdrawing and reapplying to Ross in the future or to other Caribbean schools.

I will never give up

Then what the hell are you doing on SDN? Go sit your butt in a chair and study like your entire medical career depends on it, because it does. If you fail out then you are done. It’s over. You won’t ever be a doctor. This is your one chance, and yet you are here asking about some fanciful future about how much better you will be and the only reason you are asking this is because you don’t think you are a good enough student to pass your classes. If you really think you can do better then go be better now. It’s your only chance.