What would you do if your PI was sleeping with the most senior PhD student?

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whatbout2morrow said:
OP, if you walk away now, nobody loses anything but you. Nothing changes at the lab, and you end up without your MS degree.
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I second this post. OP, you're one semester away to finish MS and start med school. Just do your thing and move on. Be supportive of those around you if that's something you want to do. Realize that often people around you will engage in drama and that sort of stuff, but you will need to focus on your job and task at hand, which will be to practice medicine.
 
Funny, this is typical education and academic medicine. Nothing you can do unless there is verifiable harassment and hostile work environment,etc. Keep your head steady and plow forward and through. You will see it in the hospitals as well. It's not right, but too many people just don't care about what is right. If people sleeping around only affected the two people, well, that would be one thing. But the political favoritism and capricious behavior of a good number of folks is something you can count on...sad to say...whether there is sex involved or not.

Can you try to have a careful discussion with the PI over the toxic work environment? How about a meeting again w HR re : toxic environment. I mean, if that is the real issue, that's what you have to go with, regardless of who is sleeping with whom. Id try to stay away from the "spicy" piece of it, and focus on the issue of toxic environment. Sadly, the sex angle is so prevalent, it's not winnable from that angle. Other people in high places would have to pass judgment on things they have or are engaging in, and the PI knows it. Truly honorable leaders of influence are hard to find. People are just too happy to take the road more travelled...rationalization road.

What a sad state affairs--the smarmy politics and looking the other way... People are so stupid. This kind of thing generally does not work out well for either party.

And I'd stay away from cranking up the Ex. That's a hornet's nest, and you'll end up getting stung bad.

If you can make it through and get what you need, write a professional letter in the form of an exist interview. Of course, what will be said, from their line of justification, is that if those that worked in the hostile environment didn't let them know...i.e., enough times to be able to address it (with appropriate documentation each time), well, what could they do? This is the kind of crap they always say. This is why this kind of nonsense ends up becoming a job in itself. Then someone ends up taking time away from their work to document and follow up, only to be given the run around. If no one does the documentation and f/u, there is no claim, and all complaints have nothing on which to stand. Hence, you are damned no matter what you do. Thing is, other people that are affected need to help you in this regard--formal complaints ,documentation, follow ups. If they won't step up, you have no option, other than to get through your situation, and then deal with it in writing on exit. Many people are quick to whine and complain, but they haven't the gonads or wear-withal to step up.

What does HR say about the toxic work environment?

I hate this kind of crap. Sadly there's usually more than enough of it to see everywhere. When it gets real unendurable is when patients' conditions are compromised b/c of idiotic politics like this. That's when it's tough to turn away from it.
 
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MuAgonist said:
My PI is male, and I'm within a semester of completing an MS based off research in his lab. It's just getting to the point where this student thinks she can do whatever she wants. Like literally flipping out on lab members while the boss just sits there and says nothing.
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Finish the MS. You are only one semester away. Just ignore them and let it be... you will experience way worse crap in your life and career, as there is a good percentage of people just like this and worse out there (in any field in life), so consider this a little learning experience and be happy you have more class 🙂

I think someone above said there is nothing you can do, which is true (unless you are being abused/harassed), so don't hurt yourself by missing out on your MS.
 
I'd get into his bed too so I can play on equal foot with that slutty student?
 
If you really want to do something about it then first talk to the PI or their superior. Then if nothing changes you will need proof so start documenting everything the student does that is inappropriate and creates a toxic work environment. Include the date and time (some places have a time stamp, that would be useful) and see if you can get another coworker to do the same, just don't exchange notes because you cant be teaming up and letting each POV affect the other. Especially take detailed notes if the PI was present at the time of her outbursts. If its not illegal then record her with your phone recorder, just make sure your phone is in plain site next to you. Then, either write up one hell of a letter and submit your information to three of the PIs superiors right away, or wait until after your first couple days of medical school and you're in the safe zone before submitting it. If the work environment is as bad as it seems, I would be concerned about the people who are stuck there. You can't have a student with the PI on a leash treating people badly.

But hey, it's up to you.
 
Doudline said:
I'd get into his bed too so I can play on equal foot with that slutty student?
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Apparently that's what it takes to publish with him. He even puts himself as 1st author and her as last author, and the person who really deserved 1st author gets 2nd. I think I'm just going to wait until I start medical school and then break the story to local newspapers.
 
MuAgonist said:
...and that PhD student was given extreme favoritism and allowed to act as a second boss and even verbally berate other members with no consequence?


Edit: Could this be used as a reason not to finish my MS, withdraw from the program, and just continue with med school?
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Uhhhh why is this thread even here in the premed section

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The best way to handle this situation is grit your teeth, finish your MS, go on to medical school, be successful and realize you got the better of the situation.
 
On one hand, they are two consenting adults. On the other hand, the power differential between the two individuals is inappropriate, and they way the student is now apparently "holding the reigns," as it were (*cough*...), with respect to the PI only makes it worse.

That being said: It sounds like you are in a position where you are 1) on your way out 2) potentially need the MS to satisfy schools 3) are capable of holding your ground against the student when she goes on her little power trips. The situation does suck, yes, but unless you are absolutely unable to put up with it any longer without hurting someone or absolutely need another publication or something, I would just put my head down and crank through it.

You could, either now or when you are done, chase the issue. It sounds like people have tried that without success, though, and I doubt it would be in your best interest to get tangled up in that at this point in your professional life.

Good luck.
 
You have to decide whether it's worth it to speak out. Like someone above said, if you leave the program the only one who loses is you. I wouldn't even consider this option (all of the work/suffering you've endured so far would be for nothing). What would the lab environment be like if you had a meeting about it with the PI? With HR? You have to weigh these options and tread carefully. Personally I think it would be easier to just ride out the last semester, but if you absolutely can't stomach the thought then try talking to someone about it. No rude letters or leaks or gossip, but a straightforward meeting discussing the real problem: blatant favoritism and an unfavorable work environment.
 
AestheticGod said:
SOLUTION:
Seduce your PI.
Sex him up.
????
Profit.
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This could work, from what muagonost says the grad student is fugly anyway. Why would the PI sleep with a 4/10? I mean if you are going to sleep with your grad student at least go for an 8+/10
 
AM4EVA said:
Uhhhh why is this thread even here in the premed section

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Because they op is a premed.

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I was looking online and - I am definitely not a lawyer - it doesn't look like this meets the legal definition of a hostile work environment (as far as I could parse this, anyway), but it's obviously unethical and unfair to everyone in the lab, regardless of the legality.

I wish you all the best in figuring this out, and I just don't know what to say about what you should do.
 
MaenadsDance said:
I was looking online and - I am definitely not a lawyer - it doesn't look like this meets the legal definition of a hostile work environment (as far as I could parse this, anyway), but it's obviously unethical and unfair to everyone in the lab, regardless of the legality.

I wish you all the best in figuring this out, and I just don't know what to say about what you should do.
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it's definitely not allowed at my school, but when both parties deny it you can't do anything. it's one thing when the student actually complains of sexual harrassment, but if they're both in it together you need evidence. people have already had to meet with hr and lawyers answering questions about other student and faculty complaints.


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Persevere, ignore the crazies, get your MS, then go on to greener pastures.
 
Interestingly, I just found out that last week HR finally acted on the complaints and had more meetings with some of the members in the lab. I guess the PI and student are now both on probation and since the student is now a post-doc/paid employee, if there are any more complaints then the student/post-doc will be fired. Apparently she was a jerk to the people in HR when they met with her and they told members of my lab that she was "not a nice person." I'm pretty sure everybody at the school is on our side, and if we say anything they will have to act and remove this girl. I'm seriously going to record every meeting I have from now on.
 
MuAgonist said:
Interestingly, I just found out that last week HR finally acted on the complaints and had more meetings with some of the members in the lab. I guess the PI and student are now both on probation and since the student is now a post-doc/paid employee, if there are any more complaints then the student/post-doc will be fired. Apparently she was a jerk to the people in HR when they met with her and they told members of my lab that she was "not a nice person." I'm pretty sure everybody at the school is on our side, and if we say anything they will have to act and remove this girl. I'm seriously going to record every meeting I have from now on.
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Lol.... 🙄
 
What would you do if it also happened on your workstation such as your desk or table you work at? Could you ever work there in the same way?
 
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