Yes, thats the current thinking.
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When do you call yourself Dr?
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Yes, thats the current thinking.
That would be conventional wisdom, yes.
Its also lame on your license plate - like "IvyMD" on the Mercedes speeding through the medical complex parking lot today.
I'd be afraid someone would try to be purposely injured by my car if I had a vanity plate. 
Can you tell me why it's lame?
I'm not so sure it's as much conventional wisdom as it is SDN "wisdom".
Can you tell me why it's lame?
I'm not so sure it's as much conventional wisdom as it is SDN "wisdom".
Dear DrSno,
You are entitled to believe whatever you like.
I am fairly sure I have been around the medical community much longer than you have and believe me, this wisdom that using your degree to make restaurant reservations, put on your checks and credit cards, license plates, etc. - essentially try to impress someone/anyone - has been "wisdom" for longer than SDN has been around.
Society has changed. People are not nearly as impressed that someone is an MD/DO as they used to be. Physicians are no longer glorified and as a matter of fact, in many circles they are trashed and vilified.
All I have to do is look at my own office staff who roll their eyes when a patient who is a physician or PhD holder insists on being called "Dr."
I can only imagine the looks if they were booking your hotel room or dinner table.
So WHY is it lame? Because it suggests that you are impressed with yourself, with your degree and expect special favors because of it. It suggests that you think you deserve better than average treatment for the simple fact that you stayed in school for longer than most people. You are a physician. You do not deserve anything better than the janitor, the administrative assistant, the SAHM.
It is appropriate to use the degree in professional situations. But to try and curry special favors? That is ridiculous and self-serving. Two groups of people do this sort of stuff:
1) pre meds and junior medical students
2) DBs (and sometimes both 1 and 2 are relevant)
There are very few residents and attending physicians who do this sort of thing. Most would be appalled at the idea of using their title for such stupid stuff. Besides, in this day and age of poor customer service, do you really think the hostess at "local chi-chi restaurant du jour" is really gonna feel impressed enough to give you the best table in the house because you're some damn doctor? Its not like you're Brad Pitt or something.
Feel free to do so...I certainly don't care if you and others who believe it to be acceptable go right ahead. The vast majority of us will be sitting back laughing at you.
PS: for someone just coming off post-hold, you might want to consider laying low for awhile and stop trying to post with intent to flame/annoy
WS, your post reminds me of an icident at my job 2 winters ago. A lady came into our rental shop looking to purchase gloves. I asked her what size she would like to try on. She told me, "I wear a size 6.5 glove." So, I looked at her and said, ma'am I don't know what surgical gloves transform into for ski gloves. She looked at me and asked how did you know what I meant? (Because, you know she was trying to be like, "Look at me, 6.5, blah blah blah.) I told her, I'm starting on the journey and she just kind of got ho hum, haha. I burst her bubble, I guess.
I don't think MDs should be entitled to better treatment, but I think being treated with respect is a little bit of extra subconscious motivation for us to do a better and more compassionate job.
Exactly. And, if my friends are correct, it's typically a bittersweet moment. Proud you are now a physician and scared you are now actually responsible.
Yes, very lame and in poor taste. However, I tend to think anyone trying to use their title deliberately to get preferential treatment is on the lamer side of things.
Uh oh. Be prepared for patients and co-workers who give you nothing of the sort.
That is true to some extent but many people are still impressed with doctors.
This is where we fundamentally disagree, and it's a common disagreement among people today. The egalitarians think, like you do, that all it takes to become a doctor or lawyer or professor is to simply stay in school longer, and that anyone can do it, so they believe professionals should not be viewed as higher. The other group, including myself and psychologists, agree that it takes a relatively high level of intelligence to get into these professions. We do not hold the view that anyone can simply stay in school longer and accomplish success.
Well I don't mind if people are laughing at me in this case. You can't make everyone happy.
Fair enough...you've given a measured response with some thought behind it. I appreciate it and we will disagree.
I however, never stated that you didn't have to be intelligent to be a physician. I'm not sure if you HAVE to have more than average intelligence though. Whatever intelligence is.
BTW, I dropped out of a PhD program in Psychology, so I know a fair bit about the subject and no one has ever proven that a significantly higher than average IQ is necessary to be a physician. Physicians may have a higher IQ on average, but it is not a requirement.
And even if you did, why does that mean its ok to introduce yourself as Doctor during social events or use the degree to try and curry favor?
Let's say that only the privileged intelligentsia are able to become physicians. Is that reason to be treated better, to be offered the best table at the restaurant?
There are some pretty dishonest, immoral and generally unpleasant physicians out there. For the life of me, I cannot see giving them any more than anyone else simply because they are physicians.
This is a pretty silly thread.
You call yourself Dr. when you walk across the stage and get the M.D. handed to you by the Dean of Medicine. Period.
You call yourself Dr. when you walk across the stage and get the M.D. handed to you by the Dean of Medicine. Period.
You, and psychologists.... all of you?
Fine, it takes a high level of intelligence to get into medicine. What kind?
Kinesthetic? It doesnt take any of that to get into medicine... not even to get into surgical residency. (maybe to get out of it, though)
Interpersonal? Yeah right. I'm convinced that med students are the most un-interesting self-absorbed bunch of the lot. Being that this is my second career, Ive lived a little.
Verbal? How many doctors do you know that can't string 5 words together to make a sentence. How many professors have you had who can't explain a concept to you, one which they know very well?
Logical/Mathematical? Yeah, I'll give you that one.
Naturalistic? Not at all required for entry into the medical field.
Intrapersonal Intelligence? Categorically frowned upon by the medical community A requirement for entry into the field is the belief that one wants to take care of everybody elses grandfather, just because their own grandfather has COPD. Besides, if we had intrapersonal intelligence, where would forums like the SDN be? ... "I hate every specialty, and cant decide among Radiology, Dermatology, and Interventional Cardiology. Which one should I choose?" Anyway...
Visual-spatial? Not required for entry into the medical field, or even surgical residency.
Musical? Nope.
So, you were saying that all psychologists hold that it takes a high level of intelligence to be a physician? How so? Even the ones that argue for different types of intelligence, acquired vs. innate intelligence?
Then....
It takes (logical) intelligence to be a doctor... and it takes kinesthetic sense, and strength to be an athelete... It takes interpersonal intelligence to be a social worker....
So what???? Psychologists hold that one should be treated better because they have more intelligence?
How does having intelligence follow with the assertion that one should get special treatment which hasnt got a thing to do with said intelligence?
All you are doing is trying to intellectualize your douchebaggery, by hiding behind phantom psychologists, and big words like "fundamentally", "egalatarian", and "accomplish".
And, Intellectualization is a defense mechanism. Put that in your crack-pipe and smoke it, Dr. Freud.
Fine, it takes a high level of intelligence to get into medicine. What kind?
Kinesthetic? It doesnt take any of that to get into medicine... not even to get into surgical residency. (maybe to get out of it, though)
Interpersonal? Yeah right. I'm convinced that med students are the most un-interesting self-absorbed bunch of the lot. Being that this is my second career, Ive lived a little.
Verbal? How many doctors do you know that can't string 5 words together to make a sentence. How many professors have you had who can't explain a concept to you, one which they know very well?
Logical/Mathematical? Yeah, I'll give you that one.
Naturalistic? Not at all required for entry into the medical field.
Intrapersonal Intelligence? Categorically frowned upon by the medical community A requirement for entry into the field is the belief that one wants to take care of everybody elses grandfather, just because their own grandfather has COPD. Besides, if we had intrapersonal intelligence, where would forums like the SDN be? ... "I hate every specialty, and cant decide among Radiology, Dermatology, and Interventional Cardiology. Which one should I choose?" Anyway...
Visual-spatial? Not required for entry into the medical field, or even surgical residency.
Musical? Nope.
So, you were saying that all psychologists hold that it takes a high level of intelligence to be a physician? How so? Even the ones that argue for different types of intelligence, acquired vs. innate intelligence?
Then....
It takes (logical) intelligence to be a doctor... and it takes kinesthetic sense, and strength to be an athelete... It takes interpersonal intelligence to be a social worker....
So what???? Psychologists hold that one should be treated better because they have more intelligence?
How does having intelligence follow with the assertion that one should get special treatment which hasnt got a thing to do with said intelligence?
All you are doing is trying to intellectualize your douchebaggery, by hiding behind phantom psychologists, and big words like "fundamentally", "egalatarian", and "accomplish".
And, Intellectualization is a defense mechanism. Put that in your crack-pipe and smoke it, Dr. Freud.
Forget modesty, too much work and debt! I'm getting a face tattoo with Dr. Plainolerichie!
Hey Bacchus,
In your sig, Texarkana is spelled with a K not a C 😀
Also, best movie ever
On a serious notes, I've tried to play it down and usually try to correct when people call me doctor on the wards and with family and friends (its actually a little annoying with family and stuff). I am thoroughly convinced I'll jinx myself and not graduate if I don't!
The only caveat is when in the hospital my senior/resident tells me to call someone or do something simple (like ask for lab results or get AML from a nurse or reads from a lab or radiologist) and they ask which doctor they are speaking to and which team. During my first few rotations, TOO MANY times I'd get to the end of a 4-5 min convo with a nurse or radiologist asking for a read, they ask my name, and I call myself med student, they get pissed and won't do it and often lecture me on how a med student should call blah blah! THEN I have to get a resident to waste 4-5 min to call them, etc. to say the same damn thing!!!
On the other hand, I don't really know where the convo's going, but I feel that once we graduate (and that means getting our diplomas on stage), I really don't think it's that bad to use the title "doctor" more liberally and not just in the hospital, especially in this society where occupation is generally highly valued. Think about it, someone introduces themself to you, you'd probably ask name, where they are from, then occupation! It's not really arrogant, it's a pretty large part of who you are and I doubt it changes much how people respond to you, maybe a few raised eyebrows. And we really do work hard towards an MD.
I don't think I'll personally use it too much because it makes me feel weird except in the hospital/with patients, but if someone asks what I do, no problem telling them and telling them proudly! I wouldn't introduce myself as doctor for any possible benefits except when I get pulled over and crap like that ("officer, I was speeding to the hospital to save lives"). Maybe with a few cute girls I meet too...
The only caveat is when in the hospital my senior/resident tells me to call someone or do something simple (like ask for lab results or get AML from a nurse or reads from a lab or radiologist) and they ask which doctor they are speaking to and which team. During my first few rotations, TOO MANY times I'd get to the end of a 4-5 min convo with a nurse or radiologist asking for a read, they ask my name, and I call myself med student, they get pissed and won't do it and often lecture me on how a med student should call blah blah! THEN I have to get a resident to waste 4-5 min to call them, etc. to say the same damn thing!!!
On the other hand, I don't really know where the convo's going, but I feel that once we graduate (and that means getting our diplomas on stage), I really don't think it's that bad to use the title "doctor" more liberally and not just in the hospital, especially in this society where occupation is generally highly valued. Think about it, someone introduces themself to you, you'd probably ask name, where they are from, then occupation! It's not really arrogant, it's a pretty large part of who you are and I doubt it changes much how people respond to you, maybe a few raised eyebrows. And we really do work hard towards an MD.
I don't think I'll personally use it too much because it makes me feel weird except in the hospital/with patients, but if someone asks what I do, no problem telling them and telling them proudly! I wouldn't introduce myself as doctor for any possible benefits except when I get pulled over and crap like that ("officer, I was speeding to the hospital to save lives"). Maybe with a few cute girls I meet too...
That might not work.
Watch this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikZm6W6Zn4c
Or this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qa64tIwKuQ
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Yeah, one of my residents had a ticket and I heard him talking to the courthouse clerk and used that excuse! I was encouraging him to use it though.
👍 I agree completely.
Men are often judged by their career, and it's tough to find one that's more respected than a physician.
I've always introduced myself by my first name and stated that I was a student working with Dr. So-and-So and will continue to do so until I graduate. Then I'll probably introduce myself by my first name and state that I'll be the physician taking care of them while they're here....I haven't yet figured out how to tell them I'm the lowest on the chain with respect to intern/resident status.
What I've found a little annoying is when family members make a big deal of it. I was in Sam's with the family tagging along for some shopping when one of the family members stopped by a little stand hawking chondroitin sulfate, picked up a bottle, handed it to me and said,'Do I need this DOCTOR?' with heavy emphasis on the 'doctor' part.....I looked at it, set it back down and said,'I don't know, you may want to ask your PCP'......Well, the lady working the stand comes firing around the end, runs up to me and starts excitedly asking where my practice was, if I was a physician and starts going into her medical problems, and the rest of her story.....she followed us for about 15 yards until I turned around and stated I was a student, not a physician and that she needed to contact the state medical association for information on physicians in the area......
It turned out to be embarassing for all of us.....
What I've found a little annoying is when family members make a big deal of it. I was in Sam's with the family tagging along for some shopping when one of the family members stopped by a little stand hawking chondroitin sulfate, picked up a bottle, handed it to me and said,'Do I need this DOCTOR?' with heavy emphasis on the 'doctor' part.....I looked at it, set it back down and said,'I don't know, you may want to ask your PCP'......Well, the lady working the stand comes firing around the end, runs up to me and starts excitedly asking where my practice was, if I was a physician and starts going into her medical problems, and the rest of her story.....she followed us for about 15 yards until I turned around and stated I was a student, not a physician and that she needed to contact the state medical association for information on physicians in the area......
It turned out to be embarassing for all of us.....
I can't believe this thread is still alive.
You know when it's nice to be called "doctor"? When you've earned it through respect - not because you had to ask to be called "doctor."
I have a patient in my longitudinal clinic who was quite ill when I first picked her up as a patient. I worked very hard on adjusting her seizure medications - and also worked hard on working-up and resolving her anemia. Because of her complex problems, I had to see her every month or two - and, somewhere along the line, we got to be friends.
I had originally introduced myself to her as a medical student. After several months, however, she started calling me "doctor." This puzzled me a little bit, because it was new. I finally said, "you know, I'm still a student - I don't graduate for another year - anyway, you're welcome to call me by my first name, NonTrad." She locked eyes with me and said, "I know you haven't graduated yet. But you've worked so hard to take care of me for the past year - and I feel much better. You're MY doctor and I depend on you - and that's why I call you Dr. Tulsa."
So, she still calls me Dr. Tulsa and I absolutely love it - because it's based on friendship and mutual respect.
You know when it's nice to be called "doctor"? When you've earned it through respect - not because you had to ask to be called "doctor."
I have a patient in my longitudinal clinic who was quite ill when I first picked her up as a patient. I worked very hard on adjusting her seizure medications - and also worked hard on working-up and resolving her anemia. Because of her complex problems, I had to see her every month or two - and, somewhere along the line, we got to be friends.
I had originally introduced myself to her as a medical student. After several months, however, she started calling me "doctor." This puzzled me a little bit, because it was new. I finally said, "you know, I'm still a student - I don't graduate for another year - anyway, you're welcome to call me by my first name, NonTrad." She locked eyes with me and said, "I know you haven't graduated yet. But you've worked so hard to take care of me for the past year - and I feel much better. You're MY doctor and I depend on you - and that's why I call you Dr. Tulsa."
So, she still calls me Dr. Tulsa and I absolutely love it - because it's based on friendship and mutual respect.
I don't think there's really anything wrong with using your professional title as part of your name. Most, if not all, of the previous generation physicians I've met referred to themselves as "Dr. so and so" in social or business situations. I don't really try to flaunt my M.D., but if someone knows I'm a physician and feels like giving me better service for whatever reason (respect, expecting a larger tip, fear), I'll be happy to take it. I did work quite hard for my degree, and if that awards me some societal advantages, I'll take them as a fringe benefit. I'm not gonna fall on my sword to make sure everyone's treated equally.
:troll:
