Where else should I apply? PsyD

[Edward3nigm4]

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So I just applied to a few schools...but am wondering if anyone can recommend any other psyd programs that still have their application open.
I'm waiting to hear back from pgsp, wright institute, Long Island U, Yeshiva, and Nova...

I started my applications really late and missed several deadlines for great schools..
I am only limiting myself to schools in big cities, and the only 2 by NYC are LIU & Yeshiva that I know of. I would love to be near miami and the bay too.

Does anyone else know of good schools I should apply to?

I saw a thread a few months ago about the top 20 psyd programs and am trying to limit my selection of schools to being from that list.

ALso, how is the Wright Institute? I have read mixed things...i don't plan on working in a VA hospital, but i would obviously like to land a good APA internship.

*just to clarify..i don't have a masters so that also limits my options. I have NOT looked at a single Psych GRE question in my life so it's also probably too late to take that exam. I'm a career changer, but still have a great application overall I think. I went to good schools and got great volunteering/research experience. I just want to be realistic of where I will fit in. If it makes any difference, I'm also a non-white male...I only mention that because, well it makes me pretty unique in the application pool honestly and does indeed make me stand out a bit.

thanks 🙂
-3nigm4

 

[JeyRo]

So I just applied to a few schools...but am wondering if anyone can recommend any other psyd programs that still have their application open.
I'm waiting to hear back from pgsp, wright institute, Long Island U, Yeshiva, and Nova...

I started my applications really late and missed several deadlines for great schools..
I am only limiting myself to schools in big cities, and the only 2 by NYC are LIU & Yeshiva that I know of. I would love to be near miami and the bay too.

Does anyone else know of good schools I should apply to?

I saw a thread a few months ago about the top 20 psyd programs and am trying to limit my selection of schools to being from that list.

ALso, how is the Wright Institute? I have read mixed things...i don't plan on working in a VA hospital, but i would obviously like to land a good APA internship.

*just to clarify..i don't have a masters so that also limits my options. I have NOT looked at a single Psych GRE question in my life so it's also probably too late to take that exam. I'm a career changer, but still have a great application overall I think. I went to good schools and got great volunteering/research experience. I just want to be realistic of where I will fit in. If it makes any difference, I'm also a non-white male...I only mention that because, well it makes me pretty unique in the application pool honestly and does indeed make me stand out a bit.

thanks 🙂
-3nigm4

Are you independently wealthy?

 

[voyeurofthemind]

So I just applied to a few schools...but am wondering if anyone can recommend any other psyd programs that still have their application open.
I'm waiting to hear back from pgsp, wright institute, Long Island U, Yeshiva, and Nova...

I started my applications really late and missed several deadlines for great schools..
I am only limiting myself to schools in big cities, and the only 2 by NYC are LIU & Yeshiva that I know of. I would love to be near miami and the bay too.

Does anyone else know of good schools I should apply to?

I saw a thread a few months ago about the top 20 psyd programs and am trying to limit my selection of schools to being from that list.

ALso, how is the Wright Institute? I have read mixed things...i don't plan on working in a VA hospital, but i would obviously like to land a good APA internship.

*just to clarify..i don't have a masters so that also limits my options. I have NOT looked at a single Psych GRE question in my life so it's also probably too late to take that exam. I'm a career changer, but still have a great application overall I think. I went to good schools and got great volunteering/research experience. I just want to be realistic of where I will fit in. If it makes any difference, I'm also a non-white male...I only mention that because, well it makes me pretty unique in the application pool honestly and does indeed make me stand out a bit.

thanks 🙂
-3nigm4

Honestly, at this late a date most programs are going to be closed or you will likely only have a week or so to submit. If you are going to drop that much money on a degree like a PsyD I would really take my time and evaluate programs and prepare for next year.

 

[PHD12]

Honestly, at this late a date most programs are going to be closed or you will likely only have a week or so to submit. If you are going to drop that much money on a degree like a PsyD I would really take my time and evaluate programs and prepare for next year.

+1 All the programs you quoted are going to require taking out 150-200K in loans. You are also committing to 5-6 years of graduate school. You need to spend time improving your qualifications, studying for the GRE, and trying to get into a program with good outcomes. You should also spend time thinking about other shorter options for graduate school if you do not want a research career or enjoy research.

The wright institute i've heard doesn't have such a great reputation overall with low APA internship match rates.

 

[Edward3nigm4]

Are you independently wealthy?

Yes.

Honestly, at this late a date most programs are going to be closed or you will likely only have a week or so to submit. If you are going to drop that much money on a degree like a PsyD I would really take my time and evaluate programs and prepare for next year.

I really want to start a program this year, I'm already 25 and don't want to waste more time.

+1 All the programs you quoted are going to require taking out 150-200K in loans. You are also committing to 5-6 years of graduate school. You need to spend time improving your qualifications, studying for the GRE, and trying to get into a program with good outcomes. You should also spend time thinking about other shorter options for graduate school if you do not want a research career or enjoy research.

The wright institute i've heard doesn't have such a great reputation overall with low APA internship match rates.

I don't know how else I can improve my application honestly, I've taken more then enough psych classes at great schools, did research, and volunteer at a crises line regularly. I graduated college in 2010 and also have experience working in other fields.

I just found that FIU's deadline is not for another week. I feel like I'm reading mixed things from the wright institute. People say the reason they have low apa internships after graduation is because many students want to live in California and you don't need an APA internship to do so. This is just a speculation tho.

Will I go to a program for 100% certainty this year? NO...but I want to apply to every good school possible that I still can and keep my options open. I've learned over the years to always just keep the options open. I can always make a better decision in the summer.

 

[erg923]

Yes.


I really want to start a program this year, I'm already 25 and don't want to waste more time.




I don't know how else I can improve my application honestly, I've taken more then enough psych classes at great schools, did research, and volunteer at a crises line regularly. I graduated college in 2010 and also have experience working in other fields.

I just found that FIU's deadline is not for another week. I feel like I'm reading mixed things from the wright institute. People say the reason they have low apa internships after graduation is because many students want to live in California and you don't need an APA internship to do so. This is just a speculation tho.

Will I go to a program for 100% certainty this year? NO...but I want to apply to every good school possible that I still can and keep my options open. I've learned over the years to always just keep the options open. I can always make a better decision in the summer.

There is NOTHING you can/could possibly regret more 5-10 years from now than going to a poor quality program that makes the constant hoop jumping and competitiveness of this field even worse for you. This isnt something to be do so spontaneously.

Ind. wealthy shouldn't be a reason to squander money and make less than solid educational/career decisions.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Instead of trying to add programs bc they are in a preferred area of the country and/or their deadline has not yet passed, you should try and figure out which programs are most appropriate for your specific situation. Having to wait a year isn't the worst thing in the world, but attending the wrong program could really muck up the overall training.

 

[PHD12]

Yes.


I really want to start a program this year, I'm already 25 and don't want to waste more time.

I don't know how else I can improve my application honestly, I've taken more then enough psych classes at great schools, did research, and volunteer at a crises line regularly. I graduated college in 2010 and also have experience working in other fields.

I just found that FIU's deadline is not for another week. I feel like I'm reading mixed things from the wright institute. People say the reason they have low apa internships after graduation is because many students want to live in California and you don't need an APA internship to do so. This is just a speculation tho.

Our field takes about 7-8 years from start until you are licensed. You will need to put in long hours and a ton of persistence for many years to get through the endless hoops and competitiveness. If you are already feeling impatient I don't know how you are going to make it through a dissertation and the internship process. That's my 2 cents.

In terms of CA and APA rates, the vast majority of fellowships and early career jobs in California require an APA internship. When you graduate, you will still need 1-2 years of additional clinical hours before you are licensed (In California you need 1500 post-doc hours, 4 hours of supervision per week, and you need to take 5 extra courses which can be taken online and are not offered by graduate programs). Without an APA internship, it is very difficult and can take years to accumulate these hours. I've met people out here from professional schools who cannot get licensed or take 2-3 years to get licensed because they had a tough time finding an employment position that would provide them with enough supervision hours and some fail the licensure exam. Keep in mind that it is not so easy to get 4 hours of supervision per week from a licensed psychologist in an employment setting (if you are working 40 hours, you need 10% of those hours to be supervised).

I just looked at the licensure rate for Wright. It is at 68% 2 years after graduation. Given that the students don't go into research and the point of the program is a professional program, what happens to 32% of them? 40% of them also fail the licensure exam. Without licensure you cannot practice as a psychologist. I don't know this program personally so you can draw your own conclusions from the data.

 

[Edward3nigm4]

i understand what you guys are saying...it's really just that finding info about psyd programs is really difficult. I base mostly how good they are on the apa-match rates, and on reviews I read online. I've also spoken with some psyd's who mentioned which schools are good.
I really did try to narrow my application list, and from what I've researched PGSP, Nova, LIU-post, FIU and yeshiva are all pretty good schools. I understand the doubt that comes with Wright, but my other schools don't seem too bad...😕 I feel like every school is ridiculously expensive and so I've kind of just accepted that aspect of the PsyD game.
And I know this may sound really bad, but I would rather be in a B level school in a city I will enjoy living in, then a A-level school in a place I know I won't be happy. I've lived in both small southern towns, and big cities and I just find myself being more productive and enthusiastic when I'm in a city I love. It's also a culture thing, being a man of color I find more comfort in metropolitan areas. It just provides me a better quality of life. But at the same time, I wouldn't want to attend a C-level school just to fulfill that need.
It's really unfortunate that there are so many iffy psyd programs out there. I shouldn't have to fiddle through old threads from 2005 trying to find if they are reputable or not, but alas it is what it is.

 

[roubs]

It's really unfortunate that there are so many iffy psyd programs out there. I shouldn't have to fiddle through old threads from 2005 trying to find if they are reputable or not, but alas it is what it is.

It's a feature, not a bug.

 

[Edward3nigm4]

It's a feature, not a bug.

It's a great feature that I'm extremely grateful for...I'm saying that the bug is the system..the fact that I could potentially go to a school, drop 100k, and still NOT attain my goal...

 

[AcronymAllergy]

It's a great feature that I'm extremely grateful for...I'm saying that the bug is the system..the fact that I could potentially go to a school, drop 100k, and still NOT attain my goal...

Very true, and that's why you've received some of the responses here (while also considering that $100k is potentially on the conservative end). At least in my opinion, when weighing the cost of waiting an extra year or two to potentially obtain a position in a funded or partially-funded program vs. attending an unfunded program, the former would always win out. This is particularly true given that the programs encompassed in the former group may also have stronger reputations, by and large, than the latter, which can go a long way toward improving your internship, postdoc, and (subsequently) career outlooks.

 

[PHD12]

It's a great feature that I'm extremely grateful for...I'm saying that the bug is the system..the fact that I could potentially go to a school, drop 100k, and still NOT attain my goal...

That's why people on this forum tend to issue strong warnings about attending most professional PsyD/PhD programs. There are too many of them out there with shady marketing strategies, poor outcomes and high attrition rates. That's why its best to take a data driven approach and evaluate the schools. I wouldn't base my decision on what other PsyD students said about the program since plenty of people make poor choices. Look more at APA rates, class size, quality of training sites, licensure rates and other outcomes.

Out of the schools you mentioned, only PGSP (PsyD), LIU, and Yeshiva have pretty good outcomes so I would prioritize those 3. Nova has only a 40% apa internship match rate (pretty horrible actually). I have no idea what FIU is.

Why do you even want a PsyD degree? If you want a career doing psychotherapy (no research) there are quicker and less costly options (MSW). These don't require that you complete an internship before you graduate and thus may involve somewhat less risk. You can probably still add some MSW programs as a back up.

 

[Edward3nigm4]

Very true, and that's why you've received some of the responses here (while also considering that $100k is potentially on the conservative end). At least in my opinion, when weighing the cost of waiting an extra year or two to potentially obtain a position in a funded or partially-funded program vs. attending an unfunded program, the former would always win out. This is particularly true given that the programs encompassed in the former group may also have stronger reputations, by and large, than the latter, which can go a long way toward improving your internship, postdoc, and (subsequently) career outlooks.

okay....also,
PGSP, Nova, yeshiva, and LIU were all in the top 20 psyd programs list that was posted on here a few months ago. Actually the WI was #20...so I thought I DID do a decent job of picking good programs. I know Baylor/rutgers are the best, but I'm not at that level yet, nor do I really think I will be.

Sigh....I'm just gonna wait and see if I even get in anywhere and go from there. If I do get in to PGSP i won't hesitate to take that spot, it's a great program. If WI is the only place I get into, I'd probably cruise another year. I just feel old guys...all my peers are already in grad programs, and I'm 25..turning 26 this august...my forehead is getting bigger each month. I always feel like being in school makes me feel younger, perhaps I need some serious CBT?

 

[Edward3nigm4]

Why do you even want a PsyD degree? If you want a career doing psychotherapy (no research) there are quicker and less costly options (MSW). These don't require that you complete an internship before you graduate and thus may involve somewhat less risk. You can probably still add some MSW programs as a back up.

I actually looked into getting a msw, but in the end I just felt like I was selling myself short. I feel like I'm too capable and motivated to stop at the masters level. It's definitely a great degree and you can obviously still help people and be happy, but I just feel like I owe it to myself and family to go the full distance. I love psychology and definitely want to be a doctor in it, it would just make me more satisfied knowing that I sought the best training possible...which is ironic given that I applied to mediocre schools...but a part of me thinks that even a mediocre psyd program will train me to be a better therapist then a top 5 msw program. This is by no means fact, its just purely based on opinion.

 

[Pragma]

I actually looked into getting a msw, but in the end I just felt like I was selling myself short. I feel like I'm too capable and motivated to stop at the masters level. It's definitely a great degree and you can obviously still help people and be happy, but I just feel like I owe it to myself and family to go the full distance. I love psychology and definitely want to be a doctor in it, it would just make me more satisfied knowing that I sought the best training possible...which is ironic given that I applied to mediocre schools...but a part of me thinks that even a mediocre psyd program will train me to be a better therapist then a top 5 msw program. This is by no means fact, its just purely based on opinion.

I personally don't hold Psy.D. programs at a higher esteem than MSW programs, FWIW. You'll have the added benefit of being able to do testing, but that's about it. Is that worth it to go to a mediocre program that will cost more money?

Don't get me wrong, I think pursuing doctoral training is a worthwhile endeavor and that more therapists should be doctoral level providers. But if you don't want to do anything that you specifically need a doctorate for, it does not seem like an economical pursuit.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Just a quick note about the cost of attending any program....

Tuition + Fees can be a large chunk, but housing, food, and related costs can double (or more) your actual cost if you live in any of the "popular" locations like CA, NYC, CHI, etc. The gov't also axed subsidized loans, so you pay interest on every dollar borrowed from Day 1, instead of getting a break on those loans during school. That seemingly minor change can add tens of thousands of dollars to the total cost of a person's loans. The loan rates are also higher now than say 10 years ago, when some students could get <2.5% when they consolidated. Now loans are starting at 6.8% + origination fees + whatever else they can charge you. Private loans (if you go above the gov't limit) are even worse. Just be careful to read the fine print with loans, because along with death and taxes....the 3rd thing that is for sure is that the gov't will take their cut.

 

[roubs]

A promise you'll get called "Doctor" at the end of any Psy.D. program, does not mean all doctoral programs are created equal. They are cashing in on the cachet of that word to offer a substandard product for too high a price. The statement "I feel like I'm too capable and motivated to stop at the masters level." reflects a healthy level of ambition on the one hand, but can also reflect a vulnerablility: being hoodwinked into thinking that achieving a doctoral degree at some of these programs actually puts you on a higher level. They, unfortunately, do not place you there and can even place you at a disadvantage.

 

[Psychadelic2012]

I just feel old guys...all my peers are already in grad programs, and I'm 25..turning 26 this august...my forehead is getting bigger each month. I always feel like being in school makes me feel younger, perhaps I need some serious CBT?

Sorry, but.......Oh, youth! You'd be one of the youngest ones in my program if you came on board here.

I actually looked into getting a msw, but in the end I just felt like I was selling myself short. I feel like I'm too capable and motivated to stop at the masters level. It's definitely a great degree and you can obviously still help people and be happy, but I just feel like I owe it to myself and family to go the full distance. I love psychology and definitely want to be a doctor in it, it would just make me more satisfied knowing that I sought the best training possible...which is ironic given that I applied to mediocre schools...but a part of me thinks that even a mediocre psyd program will train me to be a better therapist then a top 5 msw program. This is by no means fact, its just purely based on opinion.

You're being brainwashed by marketing. These are horrible reasons to pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for a doctorate. Perhaps you owe it to yourself and your family to not waste valuable cash on such a desperate, emotional decision? Even (or especially) if you are independent wealthy, this is a horrendous investment.

 

[Edward3nigm4]

The gov't also axed subsidized loans,

i was not aware of this...wtf??

on a side note, I come from a family of doctors. Literally everyone in my immediate family is a doctor of some kind, so my mind set has always been to achieve that level.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

i was not aware of this...wtf??

Here is a random news article about it.

Here is an example of how much it will cost.

Compound interest is not your friend on this side of the table.

 

[Edward3nigm4]

Here is a random news article about it.

Here is an example of how much it will cost.

Compound interest is not your friend on this side of the table.

god bless america

 

[PHD12]

on a side note, I come from a family of doctors. Literally everyone in my immediate family is a doctor of some kind, so my mind set has always been to achieve that level.

That's a pretty poor reason to pursue a really rigorous and expensive undertaking. It is not an easier path than an MD by the way. The path is just as lengthy as medical school but with tons of risk and more hoops that are not build into the program (you are not even licensed once you finish your degree). If you go to a US MD program, at least you are guaranteed a residency slot somewhere and your degree is in demand.

The PsyD title is also misunderstood and probably won't be too impressive to a family with MD's. Most people don't know what psychologists do and refer to us as "shrinks" and therapists. Your friends and family members will not understand why you are in school for so long just to "hear people complain." I don't think you are going to get the prestige that you are hoping for. Plus, as others mentioned, you will face stigma in our field from going to a B or C level PsyD Program. Professionals view these programs as "diploma mills" so you will face an uphill battle.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

i was not aware of this...wtf??

on a side note, I come from a family of doctors. Literally everyone in my immediate family is a doctor of some kind, so my mind set has always been to achieve that level.

It's a strong pull, I can understand that. For a physician, given the job market and average income across all specialties, it can make sense (or at least isn't severely off-putting) to have $200k in student loans. Plus, I'm sure we've all heard the joke: "what do they call the student who finished last in their med school class? Doctor." While this obviously minimizes some of the differences that can be associated with attending a more- vs. less-reputable program, it's much, much more true for physicians than psychologists.

There's just so much variability in training owing to our field having done a lackluster job of establishing minimal competency standards, allowing the accreditation of only those programs that can provide adequate resources and support to their students, etc. Attending a "B-level" PsyD program, quite honestly (justifiably or not) is not going to be seen in nearly the same light within the field as would attending a B-level med school by other physicians. There exists the feeling that there is a very real, very discernible difference in the average quality of students being churned out by these programs, and that belief is something you'll continually struggle against.

Beyond that, taking on staggering loan debt when you might not be likely to earn much more than perhaps $110-120k at just about any point in your career can put you into a tougher spot financially when compared with your physician colleagues.

It's very possible to become competitive for a program like Rutgers, Baylor, or various mid-tier and funded PhD programs in one or two years of dedicated work. Don't sell yourself short. Put the work in now on the front end to save yourself from some of the frustration and struggle on the back end.

 

[Edward3nigm4]

That's a pretty poor reason to pursue a really rigorous and expensive undertaking. It is not an easier path than an MD by the way. The path is just as lengthy as medical school but with tons of risk and more hoops that are not build into the program (you are not even licensed once you finish your degree). If you go to a US MD program, at least you are guaranteed a residency slot somewhere and your degree is in demand.

The PsyD title is also misunderstood and probably won't be too impressive to a family with MD's. Most people don't know what psychologists do and refer to us as "shrinks" and therapists. Your friends and family members will not understand why you are in school for so long just to "hear people complain." I don't think you are going to get the prestige that you are hoping for. Plus, as others mentioned, you will face stigma in our field from going to a B or C level PsyD Program. Professionals view these programs as "diploma mills" so you will face an uphill battle.

Okay...first of all, I just spent this past semester in a graduate level course completely focused on Motivation. I know what I'm motivated by. To be specific, I have intrinsic motivation and have a mastery-orientation in regards to psych. I've read the best scholarly work out there on what motivates students and which type of motivation is best to have.
I'm fully aware of the bs that comes with the psyd. I've been gettting it for the past year from family and friends. Yes, it sucks having to explain a career and field that I'm so passionate about but it is what it is. If anyone knows how dismissive it feels like to be a psych student its me haha..I've heard it all, and I'd be lying if I said it didn't bother me. IT DOES BOTHER ME. There's even a bigger stigma being a man of color in this field, but I'm comfortable with who I am and know what I want. I have specific goals I want to accomplish in life, and I'm not going to let social stigmas and comparisons deter me from attaining that. I'm not stupid, I'm fully aware that I wont be getting the same prestige that others might attain. I'm motivated to help people, not to just feel like a smart ass with a fancy business card. I genuinely want to help patients, that is honestly what everything boils down to. The MSW (or LCSW rather) that I know seem to be good at therapy, but they aren't always great scientists or up to date with scholarly research. I'm not a huge fan of performing research, but I definitely love to read it and consume it. I don't just want to limit my skills to the clinic. I also have desires to be a writer, speaker, and community leader. I currently have been talking with a psychologist who used to host a radio show that was pretty successful. I want to follow in those similar footsteps. I know it may sound crazy and off the wall, but it's something that I want.
Anyways...can we move on from the debate of whether I should pursue a PsyD...Not to sound condescending, but I've done my homework and probably cite articles on what drives and causes us to chose our paths that most of the people on this board haven't read.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Not to sound condescending, but I've done my homework and probably cite articles on what drives and causes us to chose our paths that most of the people on this board haven't read.

This kind of attitude won't fly in a doctoral program (or most graduate training). You will need much thicker skin and be more open to feedback if you want to one day make it through a training program.

 

[Edward3nigm4]

This kind of attitude won't fly in a doctoral program (or most graduate training). You will need much thicker skin and be more open to feedback if you want to one day make it through a training program.

Come on man...give me a break would ya? All I wanted was some school names...now you guys got me re-thinking my entire perspective on life and ****..

 

[cara susanna]

Okay...first of all, I just spent this past semester in a graduate level course completely focused on Motivation. I know what I'm motivated by. To be specific, I have intrinsic motivation and have a mastery-orientation in regards to psych. I've read the best scholarly work out there on what motivates students and which type of motivation is best to have.

If you have a mastery-oriented motivation, then you shouldn't sell yourself short with second-rate training.

I understand not wanting to wait, but waiting and delay of gratification is something you'll have to get used to in a psych grad program. And honestly, with the current internship crisis, I wouldn't touch most of the programs you've listed with a ten foot pole. You think it's bad to wait now? Try waiting when you've spent four or five years in a program already.

 

[bmedclinic]

The MSW (or LCSW rather) that I know seem to be good at therapy, but they aren't always great scientists or up to date with scholarly research. I'm not a huge fan of performing research, but I definitely love to read it and consume it. I don't just want to limit my skills to the clinic. QUOTE]

Dude, I have zero desire to pile on as I hear where you're coming from and commend you for your motivation, but the problem with PsyD (even though I have lots of respect for it) is that for the quoted reason above (and more) is that it gets lumped into the same "second rate" group as a MSW for the exact reason you cited. Some PsyD's I know love research, but many more hate it and think it's gross and never want to leave the clinic or do stats or...and worse of all, they're outspoken about it, which seems to further said stigma.

.. So bottom line is this: get what you want, and good for you man. For real, I hope you get exactly what you want. Beyond stigma (which you cleraly understand from multiple angles) know that another stigma is that "PsyD's cant read or do research, much less be directors of programs, clinics or dept's" is out there too, even though there are a number of PsyD's that are researchers, clinic directors, and dept heads.

 

[Psychadelic2012]

University of Utah (perhaps a few too many people lacking in melatonin in the area 🙂), QUOTE]

I think you mean melanin. Unless they're chronic insomniacs over there in Utah.

 

[PHD12]

Come on man...give me a break would ya? All I wanted was some school names...now you guys got me re-thinking my entire perspective on life and ****..

When 10 people in the field are all sending the same message. Its a good idea to listen. Some people on this forum are involved in the selection of post-docs and interns so I think they a good long-term outlook.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

I think you mean melanin. Unless they're chronic insomniacs over there in Utah.

The lack of caffeine (in many settings) should help with that! 😀

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Come on man...give me a break would ya? All I wanted was some school names...now you guys got me re-thinking my entire perspective on life and ****..

Fair enough, though I think what you wanted to hear and what you probably needed to hear were two distinctly different things. Best of luck w. your path.

 

[Buzzwordsoldier]

E3N4 there are a few pearls of wisdom here. There are also a good deal of groupthink tar balls. You should consider that this site is an enclave for a specific type of professional/academician, with the usual suspects all quick to jump on this thread, and filter accordingly. PM me on the degree or the Wright, if you like.

 

[PHD12]

E3N4 there are a few pearls of wisdom here. There are also a good deal of groupthink tar balls. You should consider that this site is an enclave for a specific type of professional/academician, with the usual suspects all quick to jump on this thread, and filter accordingly. PM me on the degree or the Wright, if you like.

There are many people on this thread with non-academic clinical careers/paths actually, including myself. I am personally a part of several networking groups for professionals, including private practice groups, so I've personally seen the outcome of professional degree students even though my program is funded. All I can say is that these graduates faced a ton more hurdles than I did in securing a job or internship position (often applying twice and still landing an unaccredited position) and having to go through CAPIC (most of these full-time internship positions are unpaid), and then facing additional hurdles to get hours for licensure. The top 5-10% of these graduates do okay but they have to work that much harder. They also can take longer to graduate if they don't match for an internship.

There is always a professional school student who comes onto these forums with a different viewpoint. I think this is great as long as people are being honest about the limitations of their degree (e.g., not telling people that its fine to take on a CAPIC internship and that there are no consequences to this). Sometimes professional students have disseminated misinformation about their degrees so I would just evaluate everything you hear.

 

[Psychadelic2012]

The lack of caffeine (in many settings) should help with that! 😀

True that. They probably don't have a lot of melatonin in their medicine cabinets.

 

[PHD12]

Buzz = professional school sunshine pumper.

So great. I'm going to borrow this lingo. 👍

 

[JeyRo]

When 10 people in the field are all sending the same message. Its a good idea to listen. Some people on this forum are involved in the selection of post-docs and interns so I think they a good long-term outlook.

I'm a pro-school graduate, I'm on postdoc and internship selection committees at a top VA on the west coast, and I'm happy to dish about our perspective on pro-school candidates anytime anyone wants.

 

[PHD12]

I'm a pro-school graduate, I'm on postdoc and internship selection committees at a top VA on the west coast, and I'm happy to dish about our perspective on pro-school candidates anytime anyone wants.

I would be very interested in hearing your perspective. The VA supervisors who are professional school graduates are extremely well-trained from my experience but I know that they were not the norm in their programs. Also, by professional school, it will help to clarify whether you are referring to reputable professional programs (PGSP Stanford, Yeshiva) vs. programs with very poor outcomes (alliant, argosy, wright etc).

 

[JeyRo]

I would be very interested in hearing your perspective. The VA supervisors who are professional school graduates are extremely well-trained from my experience but I know that they were not the norm in their programs. Also, by professional school, it will help to clarify whether you are referring to reputable professional programs (PGSP Stanford, Yeshiva) vs. programs with very poor outcomes (alliant, argosy, wright etc).

I can speak for our gero-rehab postdocs. I believe we have about a dozen or so postdocs between both programs and currently only one of them is from a professional school - this person happens to be a PGSP graduate.

You are right that Alliant/Argosy/Wright et al students don't seem to even be minimally competitive - we've never interviewed a single one from programs like that since I've been here. I believe basically we interview a very occasional PGSP grad and that's it - the rest (90-95 percent of our candidates) appear to be from funded programs.

Regarding the OP, if he's truly independently wealthy and can afford to drop a quarter-million down on a pro-school education, I would say Nova and PGSP (which he mentioned) are probably OK and would get the job done, at least in the sense of making you basically competitive for most clinical jobs. That's assuming you work your ass off (as I did) getting quality APA internships and postdocs, and getting pubs, none of which are guaranteed just because you went to a 'good enough' program like PGSP.

 

[PHD12]

Makes a lot of sense. You may want to conceal some of the information you posted at the end since it may reveal your identity and provide too much info about the selection process at a particular site. Not sure if the VA police will come after you?

 

[JeyRo]

Makes a lot of sense. You may want to conceal some of the information you posted at the end since it may reveal your identity and provide too much info about the selection process at a particular site. Not sure if the VA police will come after you?

Yeah, I dropped one of my paragraphs - TMI, you're right.

 

[Edward3nigm4]

so I just got off the phone with rutgers & baylor, both said the application for this year is close. Actually they have been closed for a while now, so if I were to apply to them I would have to wait another year. I guess that would be the most wise thing to do, to wait and apply again. But it's not like I'm certain I'll even get an interview, so I could potentially wait another year and a half and end up at the same program anyway. The rep at baylor said I should look for a job in a mental health setting. SHe also said the cohort each year is 7, and they got 240 applications this year. That's a 2.9% acceptance rate. These programs are great, but they are competitive. Everyone wants to be there. I asked if the students accepted had a masters. She giggled and said the students are mixed, some half masters, some have phd's, some have multiple masters, and some are right out of college.
I guess I'm just gonna wait until I get accepted from this current cycle, and if I don't I'll just beef up my application and do it again. If I do get in somewhere, I'll figure out if I want to settle or go at it again and apply to the tougher programs.


Edit: Also, I would HIGHLY appreciate it if anyone that's currently in a PsyD program private message me. I'd love to speak with you in a more private matter. ME me, gracias

 

[Edward3nigm4]

University of Utah (perhaps a few too many people lacking in melatonin in the area 🙂),

😴 lol

 

[AcronymAllergy]

so I just got off the phone with rutgers & baylor, both said the application for this year is close. Actually they have been closed for a while now, so if I were to apply to them I would have to wait another year. I guess that would be the most wise thing to do, to wait and apply again. But it's not like I'm certain I'll even get an interview, so I could potentially wait another year and a half and end up at the same program anyway. The rep at baylor said I should look for a job in a mental health setting. SHe also said the cohort each year is 7, and they got 240 applications this year. That's a 2.9% acceptance rate. These programs are great, but they are competitive. Everyone wants to be there. I asked if the students accepted had a masters. She giggled and said the students are mixed, some half masters, some have phd's, some have multiple masters, and some are right out of college.
I guess I'm just gonna wait until I get accepted from this current cycle, and if I don't I'll just beef up my application and do it again. If I do get in somewhere, I'll figure out if I want to settle or go at it again and apply to the tougher programs.

Sounds like a good approach to me. You've already applied for the current cycle, so see how things turn out while also keeping in mind what you're going to do over the course of the coming year if you opt to re-apply for the next cycle. A job in a mental health setting would apparnetly help strengthen your application for Baylor, while seeing if you can secure an RA position would do the same for most funded Ph.D. programs, which means you've got some options (and subsequent thinking to do).

If it helps alleviate some of the potential impatience, know that many, many people (including myself) go through two or more application cycles before gaining or accepting an admission offer. You certainly wouldn't be alone in that respect, if it comes down to it.

Edit: Also, as has been mentioned, I'd recommend summarily counting out all small towns unless/until you've visited. It generally never hurts to at least apply, and if you end up with an interview offer, it'll give you a chance to gain some first-hand knowledge about whether or not you could see yourself living there for 4-6 years. You might actually be surprised how interesting (or at least tolerable) some of those places could be.

 

[PHD12]

so I just got off the phone with rutgers & baylor, both said the application for this year is close. Actually they have been closed for a while now, so if I were to apply to them I would have to wait another year. I guess that would be the most wise thing to do, to wait and apply again. But it's not like I'm certain I'll even get an interview, so I could potentially wait another year and a half and end up at the same program anyway. The rep at baylor said I should look for a job in a mental health setting. SHe also said the cohort each year is 7, and they got 240 applications this year. That's a 2.9% acceptance rate. These programs are great, but they are competitive. Everyone wants to be there. I asked if the students accepted had a masters. She giggled and said the students are mixed, some half masters, some have phd's, some have multiple masters, and some are right out of college.
I guess I'm just gonna wait until I get accepted from this current cycle, and if I don't I'll just beef up my application and do it again. If I do get in somewhere, I'll figure out if I want to settle or go at it again and apply to the tougher programs.

Yep, its very competitive and it gets more competitive as you progress through the program and apply for internship. When I applied for internship (typically 4th or 5th year), every program I applied to had 120-400 applications for 1-5 slots. If you want to be in/near a big city its a blood bath out there. Now I'm applying for post-docs in a geographically desirable location and its the same #'s except the caliber of applicants are better this time around since they completed APA internships. You have to go to a reputable program, be geographically flexible for internship and post-doc to do well in this field.

 

[Ollie123]

Sounds like you have a plan moving forward.

Though I will once again raise the question of why you are entirely discounting the idea of pursuing training at a balanced PhD program. Most of these will offer just as much or more clinical training than a typical PsyD program, better opportunities in other areas, will be far less expensive, and will likely have a much better reputation than many of the other places you've expressed an interest in. Any decent graduate program is going to be pretty competitive, so it seems somewhat counter to your stated goals/motivation to pick out crummy schools just because its easier to get in.

 

[Edward3nigm4]

And feel free to chime in and and mention how young I really am...it feels great. (I'm 25).

 

[psychRA]

Yep, its very competitive and it gets more competitive as you progress through the program and apply for internship. When I applied for internship (typically 4th or 5th year), every program I applied to had 120-400 applications for 1-5 slots. If you want to be in/near a big city its a blood bath out there.

I think this bears repeating. There aren't a lot of grad programs in major cities, and the options that are available tend to get a lot of applications due to the desirability of the location. That's not to say that it's impossible to get in, but sticking to major metro areas will add an extra barrier.

 

[Edward3nigm4]

Sounds like you have a plan moving forward.

Though I will once again raise the question of why you are entirely discounting the idea of pursuing training at a balanced PhD program. Most of these will offer just as much or more clinical training than a typical PsyD program, better opportunities in other areas, will be far less expensive, and will likely have a much better reputation than many of the other places you've expressed an interest in. Any decent graduate program is going to be pretty competitive, so it seems somewhat counter to your stated goals/motivation to pick out crummy schools just because its easier to get in.

Okay, well to be frank..I am terrible at statistics. Yes I took the course but it was like learning Chinese. I even took AP stat in high school and got a 1 (yes..a 1) on the AP exam. I pulled a B+ in the college stat required for grad school. I've realized that good phd students are great in statistics, because it really is the bread and butter of research. Don't get me wrong, I love research. I think it's fascinating, but when it comes to reading the data section I sort of just blank out. I tried getting a tutor, and that helped a bit but I can't have someone holding my hand in grad school. IF I really enjoyed statistics, and moreover felt that I had a really good understanding of it, I would probably aim for a phd honestly. Why go through all this other crap when I can just live in peace as a PhD student?