where would you go for smp

[rebel1]

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Hey future smpers,
Where would you go if accepted at both schools (RFU and Univeristy of Toledo) for smp?Why? or Why not?

 

[rebel1]

responses are appreciated !!!!!!!!

 

[Donnie1310]

I'm accepted at RFU so i only know about that program between these two, but what I did, since I've been accepted at two SMPs (and potentially a third that I haven't heard back from) was type up a list of pro's and con's. Without any history about what you need the SMP for it's hard to say.

Deciding between SMPs is hard just because they all have their own unique pro's and con's. You have to decide which pro's you really need, and which con's you can successfully rise above.

Also, maybe schedule a visit if it's financially feasible? I just recall my perceptions of every med school changing drastically (some went way up, others way down) on interview day when I actually went there.

 

[RokKidA]

Donnie's right, you have to choose based on your situation and what you personally need to get out of the program.

I applied to Toledo as well and feel that if I had to choose b/w this school and RFU, I would choose RFU.

This is because tuition is a bit cheaper at RFU ($36,386) compared to Toledo which is $47,775 for OOS students.

Another factor is the linkage percent, which is higher at RFU, with 75 percent of BMS students getting into their med school compared to Toledo's (65%).

Other than that, I feel that the curriculum is very similar, being only one year long and requiring students to take most of the same courses. They are also both in small towns, so the environment is pretty similar imo.

 

[rebel1]

I'm accepted at RFU so i only know about that program between these two, but what I did, since I've been accepted at two SMPs (and potentially a third that I haven't heard back from) was type up a list of pro's and con's. Without any history about what you need the SMP for it's hard to say.

Deciding between SMPs is hard just because they all have their own unique pro's and con's. You have to decide which pro's you really need, and which con's you can successfully rise above.

Also, maybe schedule a visit if it's financially feasible? I just recall my perceptions of every med school changing drastically (some went way up, others way down) on interview day when I actually went there.

Thank you for the response
I have a low mcat (26) and high gpa (3.94) situation. I took mcat twice and don't want to take it again. So the goal is to get into MD program thru linkage offered by the smp.
I really want to visit the schools but I work full time and can only visit on the weekends (dunno if that would do any good)

 

[rebel1]

Donnie's right, you have to choose based on your situation and what you personally need to get out of the program.

I applied to Toledo as well and feel that if I had to choose b/w this school and RFU, I would choose RFU.

This is because tuition is a bit cheaper at RFU ($36,386) compared to Toledo which is $47,775 for OOS students.

Another factor is the linkage percent, which is higher at RFU, with 75 percent of BMS students getting into their med school compared to Toledo's (65%).

Other than that, I feel that the curriculum is very similar, being only one year long and requiring students to take most of the same courses. They are also both in small towns, so the environment is pretty similar imo.

I agree about the linkage numbers but not on the financial part- the smp at rfu might be cheaper than at UT, the state of Ohio allows you to be a resident after a year so the 4 years of med school are relatively cheaper than at Rfu (private university)
Am still waiting to hear from UT .... But getting very confused between these two schools

The support system at Toledo is simply amazing- I got in touch with current M1 students (former smpers) and they all seem to be very happy there. I don't know how the rfu students feel though.

 

[deleted248403]

I'll point out the obvious - your issue is with your MCAT, not with your GPA; which you know.

$60k to maybe overcome a 26 MCAT through trying to link is a pretty expensive route to take IMO.

 

[rebel1]

Then the answer is RFU. I know some who did the program for that reason and got in. They give interviews to everyone who does 3.0 or over. So if you kickass u'd probably get accepted despite 26 mcat.

Thank you for the post
My confusion arises from the fact that from my conversations with the current M1 students at UT as well as the admissions office, I got the vibe that as long as I do well in the program, I'll be accepted to MD program
I haven't have had any interaction with RFU students so have no idea how they like it at RFU...

However your advice sure carries a lot of weight!

 

[Donnie1310]

I haven't have had any interaction with RFU students so have no idea how they like it at RFU...

There are some on the RFU forum you could probably ask. But I do know some people currently in the program personally who like it.

 

[rebel1]

There are some on the RFU forum you could probably ask. But I do know some people currently in the program personally who like it.

I did PMed two people but never got any reponse from them - however I will be trying to get in touch with someone asap.
Its great that the people you know like the program - its always good to hear positive responses

 

[rebel1]

I'll point out the obvious - your issue is with your MCAT, not with your GPA; which you know.

$60k to maybe overcome a 26 MCAT through trying to link is a pretty expensive route to take IMO.

You do raise a good point robflanker, but like I said I am done taking the mcat - thats why I am taking the expensive route. I can't afford to waste another year of my life retaking the mcat, and reapplying to medical schools. My goal is to be an MD (from a u.s. accredited school) so I refuse to consider other options available (DO route, or carribean). I feel this is the best option for me 🙂

 

[deleted248403]

A 26 is going to make getting into allopathic very hard - regardless of the SMP you go to

 

[drizzt3117]

A 26 is going to make getting into allopathic very hard - regardless of the SMP you go to

I think if he did well at RFU he could link. That said, I agree that this isn't the best choice, a MCAT prep course is a much better option IMO.

 

[marspotter]

Thank you for the response
I have a low mcat (26) and high gpa (3.94) situation. I took mcat twice and don't want to take it again. So the goal is to get into MD program thru linkage offered by the smp.
I really want to visit the schools but I work full time and can only visit on the weekends (dunno if that would do any good)

I agree with responses above. With your great GPA, I would suggest to shell out some money on prep courses (which would be significantly lower than what you would pay at SMP) to help you with comprehension and strategy on taking MCAT.

I understand that you believe that SMP linkage would be more beneficial than re-taking MCAT. And solely based on your undergraduate GPA, I think you will probably to do well in SMP classes. However, here are my reasons that I think it will be better for you to re-take MCAT than opting out for SMP.

1. Financial requirements.
more than 60K for SMP (tuition and living: and the program will strongly discourage you to keep your full time job. Thus, you won't be able to keep up with current living standard solely based on loans)
Even if you decide to take all TPR, Kaplan, EK, and TBR classes and additional classes, you will shell out no more than 15K. Also, you should be able to work at least part time.

2. MCAT score.
Since you are pretty much set on MD schools, it will be very, very difficult for anyone to get into MD schools (other than carribeans) with MCAT score of 26. Even if you have 3.94 uGPA (hopefully from a reputable school) and you may be able to keep up great SMP GPA (>3.8), MCAT score is one of the significant factors that medical schools look at. When I talked to two medical school deans and 2-3 admission officers and few pre-health committee (from top 25 medical schools based on US NEWS, not that I believe that US NEWS ranking is the only ranking that should be regarded) three years ago when I was a traditional pre-med student, they all mentioned that although both MCAT and GPA are important, they tend to give out interviews to those with higher MCAT and lower GPA than lower MCAT and higher GPA (assuming that MCAT is higher than 28 and GPA is higher than 3.2). One of the reasons is that they believe the individuals with higher MCAT will be able to do well in USMLE and thus, be able to graduate and the medical schools do not have to worry about individuals dropping out as much.

3. Risk of SMP
Also, there are risks involved with SMPs. Although the results may be great for those that do very well and follow through, chances for the individuals that suffer in SMPs are significantly lower.
Again, you may do very well in SMP. But what if you don't due to personal issues?
For many people, SMP is pretty much necessary required step to get into a medical school. And we take those chances to pursue our dream.
But for your case, SMP doesn't seem necessary, but you just find it very appealing compared to an easier alternative. And you may find yourself taking SMP classes and actually hurting your chance in medical schools. And even if you do well in SMP, it is possible that you may need to re-take MCAT.

If you are looking for SMPs to take graduate level classes and receive faculty support and all other benefits to pursue your dream of becoming a medical doctor, then I think you should continue. 😉

However, if you are looking for SMPs with linkage programs so that you won't have to re-take MCAT, I believe you are risking a lot more than you need to..

 

[rebel1]

I do appreciate all the respoonse but it looks like I wasn't clear with my originial post

My question was which smp to pick, not whether or not I should take the smp route. That decision has already been made. I would appreciate if everyone sticks to my question posted.

I am not arrogant or ignorant, I know the risks I am taking. Don't mean to offend anyone but like I said before please address my original question only.

Thanks!

 

[drizzt3117]

Do whatever you want, just realize that no matter how well you do in the SMP there's a good chance you won't get into a MD school bc your mcat is just unacceptable.

I do appreciate all the respoonse but it looks like I wasn't clear with my originial post

My question was which smp to pick, not whether or not I should take the smp route. That decision has already been made. I would appreciate if everyone sticks to my question posted.

I am not arrogant or ignorant, I know the risks I am taking. Don't mean to offend anyone but like I said before please address my original question only.

Thanks!

 

[rebel1]

Do whatever you want, just realize that no matter how well you do in the SMP there's a good chance you won't get into a MD school bc your mcat is just unacceptable.

Thank you for that assessment drizzt.

 

[drizzt3117]

The only thing that is unacceptable is your ignorance. I know several who have gotten interviewed and into MD schools across the country with as low as 24-26 and sometimes for people who did RFU BMS or other similar linkage style SMPs as low as 23.

So I would be careful in assuming you know everything about MD admissions. You are not even an adcom member so I would tread carefully if I were you in making absolute statements like yours. Really depends on the school.

You know the thing they say about assumptions?

Florida and texas schools, RFU for its SMP students, EVMS for its SMP students and I'm sure to some extent for In staters, several different lower tier schools will be more forgiving depending on the rest of your story.

It is incorrect to assume anything is absolute in the admissions process to med school as I've learned first hand. One thing Dr. Offner of BUSM MD admissions said a long time ago is there are no hard and fast rules in MD admissions and i've seen the truth of this.

Maybe you should read my post more carefully. I said that there's a good chance (not 100%) that the OP wouldn't get into a MD program even after a successful SMP because their MCAT is unacceptable. I didn't say they had no chance of getting into a MD program.



The purpose of a SMP (in fact, the reason these programs exist at all) is to rehabilitate a poor GPA. Rehabilitating a poor MCAT score is pretty straightforward, just study for it and retake it. There's another poster here (I'm not sure if shes posts anymore) that had a similar situation, 3.8+ GPA and low MCAT and did a SMP (MWU-AZ I believe) and ended up doing poorly and having difficulty getting into med school afterwards and posted that she would never have done it again given the choice. Do whatever you want, but your best bet of getting into a MD program is taking the MCAT again and getting an acceptable score.

 

[Donnie1310]

There's another poster here (I'm not sure if shes posts anymore) that had a similar situation, 3.8+ GPA and low MCAT and did a SMP (MWU-AZ I believe) and ended up doing poorly and having difficulty getting into med school afterwards and posted that she would never have done it again given the choice.

I just wanted to jump in here with one point about RFU: that program is essentially half of the M1 classes. So if someone does so poorly in that that they fail out, then there's no way they could have handled the full M1. If so, at least they didn't take a spot in a med program to learn that.

Now if by "doing poorly" you mean doing "okay" in the program (as in, would have passed M1 but just not top of the class), then I completely agree with the "risk" argument.

 

[drizzt3117]

I just wanted to jump in here with one point about RFU: that program is essentially half of the M1 classes. So if someone does so poorly in that that they fail out, then there's no way they could have handled the full M1. If so, at least they didn't take a spot in a med program to learn that.

Now if by "doing poorly" you mean doing "okay" in the program (as in, would have passed M1 but just not top of the class), then I completely agree with the "risk" argument.

I think it's accepted in this forum that "doing poorly" in the context of a SMP is not doing significantly better than the med students (since you're graded against their average)