Which program should I choose?

[jebus]

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So, here's my story, I graduated in 2002 with a 3.36 from a top-tier school, worked in a lab for a few years, got published, took the MCAT the past August and got a 36. I applied to a bunch of schools, was complete at the end of November (Lazy LOR writer) but so far I'm not getting any bites - no interviews at all. (My MDapps profile has other stuff under the 'I' in my signature.) I applied to mostly unranked schools; I didn't apply to a bunch of top-tier schools that I knew were out of my reach. Yes, I know I should wait a little more because the cycle still has some time but I'm getting a little antsy-in-the-pantsy about this whole application cycle. I've got some decent clinical experience (shadowing, volunteering) but I could definitely use some more. I think improving my GPA would invariably help me for the next cycle. To that end, I'm thinking of applying to a post-bac program.
Therein lies the problem.
I've seen this page from the AAMC listing the post-bac programs. Right now I'm primarily looking at masters programs. I don't know what programs are good, have a good reputation, etc. I've looked into the Georgetown SMP and the administrative people there seem really nice but I'd appreciate if anyone else had some input. What should I look for? What programs are good - not just at getting students into med school but I'd like a degree I can use in case I don't get into med school. What else should I consider? Money isn't really an issue, nor is geography - I'll go anywhere and pay anything within reason.
Thanks for any advice.

 

[Phil Anthropist]

Grades from graduate programs actually feed into a separate section on AMCAS, so a solid grad performance can make up for a less than stellar undergraduate record but it won't actually affect your undergrad cumulative GPA.

Special Masters Programs (SMPs) cater to those with low-to-marginal GPAs, but competitive MCAT scores (e.g., you). Since you seem to be a US allopathic hopeful, the Special Masters programs best suited for you would probably be:

Georgetown's MS in Physiology and Biophysics SMP (1 year)

and

Boston U's MA in Medical Sciences (1-2 years)

The point of both programs is really to get you into med school. Both allow you to take multiple medical courses and have solid reps/good track records.

Georgetown's is almost exclusively a coursework-based program. BU offers more lab/clinical research opportunities, but it looks like you've already got plenty of that. So I'm not sure what qualities you're looking for in these programs in case med school doesn't pan out. However, some research jobs do pay higher starting salaries to those with advanced degrees.

There are a lot of other similar programs out there (Drexel IMS-MMS, EVMS, Creighton, UMDNJ-Newark, and Marshall are a few examples), but the above two are probably the ones you'll want to consider.

P.S. If you don't mind my asking, why the withdrawal from UNM?

 

[jebus]

Phil, thanks for the feedback. I've got some time to think about what I want and where to apply and I will definitely incorporate your feedback. Thank you.
The UNM withdrawl stems mostly from my stupidity. I've burned a lot of bridges there. I used to work for a member of the MD/PhD adcom there (a huge ass, by the way - and he was actually against MDs getting PhDs! He thought 4 years was too short! Everyone who worked for him hated him and we have all actually quit. I could keep going....) and I just upped and walked away one day. I made sure to get my LOR before that. It's in my file at the UW so its sanctity is secure. Getting an interview at UNM is not an accomplishment. They interview every instate applicant. They invited me to an interview date before my MCAT scores would be available and without a 2º app, LORs, or the 2º app fee.
In the past I've spoken with the dean of admissions and he said that with my goals (I won't say that I will stay in NM and they really want/need family practictioners to stay here and practice in rural areas - I'm interested in Psychiatry and Nephrology) I will not get in. Also, with my substantial research experience they would have trouble seeing me as a physician. I don't know what that means or how to address that and they will not tell me. I have no recourse to change their minds. Yes, interview practice would be worthwhile but frankly I don't have the emotional fortitude to deal with a rejection. (Yes, I need to work on that, I know.) I have a lot of friends who go there and they don't seem particularly happy there - while their clinical training is allegedly spectacular their USMLE prep is poor, the facilities are aged, basic things like WiFi access is poor, it is all PBL (which is a positive to me) but the PBL tutors (the basic science professors, and I'm friends with some of them, too) are disinterested. They don't have respect for the students. Also, overwhelmingly the students I know want to leave. Ok, you've likely noticed a lot of this is predicated on sour grapes.
Yes, in retrospect I should have attended the interview. I know, I know. My gray hair doesn't entirely belie my immaturity.
Anyway, after all this drivel, thanks. GT looks like it has an attractive program and my brother is a post-doc at Harvard so Boston is attractive as well.

 

[madonna]

Phil, thanks for the feedback. I've got some time to think about what I want and where to apply and I will definitely incorporate your feedback. Thank you.
The UNM withdrawl stems mostly from my stupidity. I've burned a lot of bridges there. I used to work for a member of the MD/PhD adcom there (a huge ass, by the way - and he was actually against MDs getting PhDs! He thought 4 years was too short! Everyone who worked for him hated him and we have all actually quit. I could keep going....) and I just upped and walked away one day. I made sure to get my LOR before that. It's in my file at the UW so its sanctity is secure. Getting an interview at UNM is not an accomplishment. They interview every instate applicant. They invited me to an interview date before my MCAT scores would be available and without a 2º app, LORs, or the 2º app fee.
In the past I've spoken with the dean of admissions and he said that with my goals (I won't say that I will stay in NM and they really want/need family practictioners to stay here and practice in rural areas - I'm interested in Psychiatry and Nephrology) I will not get in. Also, with my substantial research experience they would have trouble seeing me as a physician. I don't know what that means or how to address that and they will not tell me. I have no recourse to change their minds. Yes, interview practice would be worthwhile but frankly I don't have the emotional fortitude to deal with a rejection. (Yes, I need to work on that, I know.) I have a lot of friends who go there and they don't seem particularly happy there - while their clinical training is allegedly spectacular their USMLE prep is poor, the facilities are aged, basic things like WiFi access is poor, it is all PBL (which is a positive to me) but the PBL tutors (the basic science professors, and I'm friends with some of them, too) are disinterested. They don't have respect for the students. Also, overwhelmingly the students I know want to leave. Ok, you've likely noticed a lot of this is predicated on sour grapes.
Yes, in retrospect I should have attended the interview. I know, I know. My gray hair doesn't entirely belie my immaturity.
Anyway, after all this drivel, thanks. GT looks like it has an attractive program and my brother is a post-doc at Harvard so Boston is attractive as well.

hey i am kind of similar position as u r. except for the mcat score. if u dont get in this year, i think you'll get in next cycle for sure. just apply early. ur gpa is not that low and mcat is sweet. do you really want to pay extra 50000? that said i mailed my transcrpts to georgetown 🙂

 

[Law2Doc]

Grades from graduate programs actually feed into a separate section on AMCAS, so a solid grad performance can make up for a less than stellar undergraduate record but it won't actually affect your undergrad cumulative GPA.

Special Masters Programs (SMPs) cater to those with low-to-marginal GPAs, but competitive MCAT scores (e.g., you). Since you seem to be a US allopathic hopeful, the Special Masters programs best suited for you would probably be:

Georgetown's MS in Physiology and Biophysics SMP (1 year)

and

Boston U's MA in Medical Sciences (1-2 years)

The point of both programs is really to get you into med school. Both allow you to take multiple medical courses and have solid reps/good track records.

Georgetown's is almost exclusively a coursework-based program. BU offers more lab/clinical research opportunities, but it looks like you've already got plenty of that. So I'm not sure what qualities you're looking for in these programs in case med school doesn't pan out. However, some research jobs do pay higher starting salaries to those with advanced degrees.

There are a lot of other similar programs out there (Drexel IMS-MMS, EVMS, Creighton, UMDNJ-Newark, and Marshall are a few examples), but the above two are probably the ones you'll want to consider.

P.S. If you don't mind my asking, why the withdrawal from UNM?

I agree with Phil that an SMP might help, since your lower BCPM suggests you perhaps need to prove yourself in medical school type science setting a bit. A strong, well thought out, and carefully reviewed and edited PS would be a good idea too. Your MDApplicants page also looks like you had some LOR issues. I know that for nontrads, schools often tend to like to see some form of LOR or committee letter from all institutions you've attended (a dean at a top 10 school told me this), so I wonder if the same is true for transfers.

 

[Law2Doc]

hey i am kind of similar position as u r. except for the mcat score. if u dont get in this year, i think you'll get in next cycle for sure. just apply early. ur gpa is not that low and mcat is sweet. do you really want to pay extra 50000? that said i mailed my transcrpts to georgetown 🙂

For reapplicants, the schools tend to want to see how you have improved your credentials since the last app. Thus just applying again with the same app is probably not the best advice. Also bear in mind that each year you don't get it right and don't get in is another year of salary you forego at the other end of the tunnel.

 

[jebus]

I agree with Phil that an SMP might help, since your lower BCPM suggests you perhaps need to prove yourself in medical school type science setting a bit. A strong, well thought out, and carefully reviewed and edited PS would be a good idea too. Your MDApplicants page also looks like you had some LOR issues. I know that for nontrads, schools often tend to like to see some form of LOR or committee letter from all institutions you've attended (a dean at a top 10 school told me this), so I wonder if the same is true for transfers.

Well, it's nice to know that I was on the right track while thinking about SMPs. At least you all seem to believe I am. In my upper level BCPM courses I actually have a 3.6, my BCPM GPA suffered from my poor performance in the introductory courses. I hoped my MCAT score would somehow negate this, especially because I attended "good" schools but it clearly will not.
If schools want to see an LOR from everywhere then I am screwed! I haven't been to WUStL since 2000. While I viewed my transfer as a non-issue I can understand why a school would prefer a student with the same academic credentials who does not have a history of leaving schools. If that is an issue it is one I did not anticipate. I have LORs from professors of my upper level courses, but those were all taken at the UW.
The Personal Statement: Yes, it needs work. In retrospect it conveys no passion for medicine, no raison d'etre. I should probably scrap it and start over. Yikes! That is intimidating.

For reapplicants, the schools tend to want to see how you have improved your credentials since the last app. Thus just applying again with the same app is probably not the best advice.

Staying with a losing horse seems like a frustrating proposition for all involved let alone me: the horse.
Thanks for your input everyone.

 

[jebus]

I apologize for abusing your time this way but I have another question/idea:
What about getting a Masters in some non-medical program, just some straight up basic research MS, for instance at Texas Tech, and then applying to SOM at the same institution? The benefits being that I would meet the SOM admissions people and get my foot in the door at the least selective Texas SOM that way (a tenuous proposition, I understand), establish Texas residency and get cheaper tuition (I've looked up the statutory requirements for Texas residency and this is not entirely untenable), and it would enable me to apply to the whole gamut of Texas schools as a resident.
I guess my concern is whether or not it is deleterious to matriculate into a non-medical related Masters program. I also suspect I will have more time for clinical volunteering this way than in an SMP -- GT explicitly discourages clinical activity while in their program. It will take two years as opposed to one for an SMP, which is a clear disadvantage as I would prefer that my MCAT scores do not expire the year before I apply.... I'm rambling....
Thanks for your time/advice.

 

[Touchdown]

Keep in mind that most medical schools require you to get your masters degree before enrolling, the Georgetown SMP is the only masters program in the country that gets you your degree in one year.

 

[Phil Anthropist]

Many med schools do require applicants to complete advanced degree programs prior to matriculation. Georgetown is well designed since it must be completed in one year, so you don't have to worry about not completing the program in time. But there are some other coursework-based masters programs that can be finished in one year or that must be completed in one year. Most of these programs probably aren't as effective as G-town's SMP, but here are some examples:

-G-town MS in Tumor Biology
-Barry U MS in Biomedical Sciences
-Florida Atlantic U MS in Biomedical Sciences
-USF MS in Medical Sciences (I think that's the name)
-Northwestern MS in Physiology and Neurobiology
-Loyola (Chicago) MA in Medical Sciences
-Indiana U pre-professional MS in Biology
-Ball State MA in Bio or MA in Physio
-Tulane MS in Pharmacology, MS in Cell Biology, MS in (Human?) Genetics, assuming its programs haven't been affected by Katrina
-Boston U MA in Medical Sciences
-Kansas City (osteopathic) MS in Biomedical Sciences
-Dartmouth MS in Clinical Evaluative Sciences (not really hard science though)
-UMDNJ-Newark and UMDNJ-Stratford MBS/MS in Biomedical Sciences
-Columbia MS in Nutrition
-Case Western MS in Applied Anatomy
-EVMS MS in Biomedical Sciences - Medical Masters track