why cant schools have video conferences instead of face-to-face interviews ?

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Because they feel that it is important that you see the school and they get to meet you. Interview day is more than just an interview. You get a tour, a chance to meet faculty and students and a chance to ask any questions you may have about the school. They need to want you, but you need to want them as well.
 
I agree. You have to go to the school and see the place and also meet the faculty and other students. It would be a waste of your time if you didn't. I changed what school I wanted to go to because I went to interview at the school. So it is a great idea to go to the school.
 
Video conference is not even a better option IMO, there can be so many technical issues that can be present during the video interview.
 
gochi said:
just a huge waste of time and money to travel to schools for interviews.
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yeah, why cant we just download each schools financial aid powerpoint presentation and figure it out ourselves, have virtual tours of the campus and clinic, meet the faculty and students through facebook/myspace, get a feeling of the school and surrounding area vicariously through some student you've never met, and be forced to make the decision of where to spend the next 4 years of our lives and upwards of $80,000 of student loans on a place we've never visited. that would save us so much money on traveling expenses.
 
gochi said:
just a huge waste of time and money to travel to schools for interviews.
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I don't think I'd be comfortable with that until "the matrix" was a reality.....and I could "jack in" for my interview/tour
 
there is only so much you can get from pictures, reading articles, etc about some place. you have to go there to see it and get the real experience. yes, it may cost some money, but its nothing compared to the thousands of dollars you'll spend on the school, so its a good idea to make that small investment to ensure you're happy with where you're going.
 
gochi said:
just a huge waste of time and money to travel to schools for interviews.
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That is an odd way of looking at it. For many of us, we invest the money and time to travel to these schools because it is potentially where we are going to live for the next 4+ years of our lives. We don't want to make a decision on something this important based off pictures and web cam images.
 
Would you accept a marriage proposal from someone you've never met in person?
 
thanotoriousfob said:
Russian bride services don't have a problem with that. 😀
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Haha, well I guess this would be under the assumption that one would have some standards... maybe that's too much of a leap for some people 😛
 
It would all be much easier if my idea of teleportation were to be true.
 
oceanblue392 said:
yeah, why cant we just download each schools financial aid powerpoint presentation and figure it out ourselves, have virtual tours of the campus and clinic, meet the faculty and students through facebook/myspace, get a feeling of the school and surrounding area vicariously through some student you've never met, and be forced to make the decision of where to spend the next 4 years of our lives and upwards of $80,000 of student loans on a place we've never visited. that would save us so much money on traveling expenses.
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Exactly. I would so attend this school.
 
To be honest, it seems to be more of a personal matter for people to visit schools.

How different will a grad school look or feel relative to your friendly undergraduate school?

There should atleast be an option for video-conferencing. As long as it does not overshadow the interest of an applicant for the school.

Not to mention, it would save the school some $ aswell.
 
oceanblue392 said:
yeah, why cant we just download each schools financial aid powerpoint presentation and figure it out ourselves, have virtual tours of the campus and clinic, meet the faculty and students through facebook/myspace, get a feeling of the school and surrounding area vicariously through some student you've never met, and be forced to make the decision of where to spend the next 4 years of our lives and upwards of $80,000 of student loans on a place we've never visited. that would save us so much money on traveling expenses.
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gochi said:
Exactly. I would so attend this school.
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You don't pick up sarcasm well, hey?
 
gochi said:
To be honest, it seems to be more of a personal matter for people to visit schools.

How different will a grad school look or feel relative to your friendly undergraduate school?

There should atleast be an option for video-conferencing. As long as it does not overshadow the interest of an applicant for the school.

Not to mention, it would save the school some $ aswell.
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I think from the schools' perspectives it would NOT save money nor would it be an acceptable means of selection. The purpose of the interview is not only for the admissions committees to hear your responses to their questions; it is also to ensure that you are able to present yourself in a respectable, professional manner. Chatting it up on webcam is not an appropriate option, which is why it is not offered as an option.

I think the only situations where acceptances are made without in-person interviews at some schools are when the student is applying from across the world.
 
gochi said:
first of all, its "eh"

second, i realized it was sarcasm after reading the first word of that paragraph lol.
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I'll say whatever I want to say. I was not confident you would pick up on the word "eh". Get some punctuation and capitalization in there, too.

...or iz liek this eazyer fur yew 2 understand? Lolz
 
if you meet in person you get to observe someone's body language and that says a lot about your confidence level...aka whether you are a good bullsh*tter or if you really know what your talking about. Plus its more nerve racking, and thats more fun...some people really can't keep their composure in person (not always in a bad way)...but honestly people use their body language to communicate more then they do their actual words and that is very important for health care professionals.

You need to be able to convey yourself in a way that your patients can feel comfortable, in addition you need to pick up on the body language of your patient (or interviewer in this case) to be a good health care professional. In that respect, to some people this comes naturally, while others may need some practice...but they can tell when you are just full of crap and when you are really legitimate in that interview. Its very important too meet in person
 
Oh, and in your response to "its such a waste of money" to meet in person....well hell you are going to be 200,000+ in debt when you graduate school whats a couple hundred to travel to get in...seriously.
 
EyeWitness said:
200,000+ !!! I don't think so! Knock that 200 in half, you're scaring me.
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Well, count your tuition, living expenses, other misc expenses...its 50K a year just about, times 4 years...thats 200K...now if your parents help you out you're in better shape...but if you're paying for it all yourself in loans...add interest, yea its 200K in debt when you graduate. Cost of equipment is included in that (which as a student u get discounts so utilize it). Anywho, yea you should know what your getting into money wise...its really OK if you are willing to do it and you want to do it...but if you're just in it because "you think you might like it" think again. Its a good career, but its what you make of it...some people drop out because they decide they don't like it. In that respect I think experience is key prior to entering school...esp if its such a big investment. Its like buying a house though, you going to school more appreciates your value and the amount of money you are capable of making just comparing that to someone with an undergrad degree, on averege you will make more. Its just something to think about, a reality, but not something you should freak out about if you know this is what you want to do. I dont think anything of it...its worth it to me.
 
DrRobs said:
Well, count your tuition, living expenses, other misc expenses...its 50K a year just about, times 4 years...thats 200K...now if your parents help you out you're in better shape...but if you're paying for it all yourself in loans...add interest, yea its 200K in debt when you graduate. Cost of equipment is included in that (which as a student u get discounts so utilize it). Anywho, yea you should know what your getting into money wise...its really OK if you are willing to do it and you want to do it...but if you're just in it because "you think you might like it" think again. Its a good career, but its what you make of it...some people drop out because they decide they don't like it. In that respect I think experience is key prior to entering school...esp if its such a big investment. Its like buying a house though, you going to school more appreciates your value and the amount of money you are capable of making just comparing that to someone with an undergrad degree, on averege you will make more. Its just something to think about, a reality, but not something you should freak out about if you know this is what you want to do. I dont think anything of it...its worth it to me.
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Do they at least give you free contacts and I also need new new glasses, both frames and lenses!?
 
DrRobs said:
Oh, and in your response to "its such a waste of money" to meet in person....well hell you are going to be 200,000+ in debt when you graduate school whats a couple hundred to travel to get in...seriously.
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as long as the school is accredited, there should be nothing else of concern.

its not so much about the money, rather the time invested.

No one has provided a solid reason as to why e-interviews would be a bad idea.
 
gochi said:
as long as the school is accredited, there should be nothing else of concern.

its not so much about the money, rather the time invested.

No one has provided a solid reason as to why e-interviews would be a bad idea.
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Okay, so say you do have a video interview or phone interview. And then, hypothetically, the school in question accepts you based on said interview and you decide to attend that school. What guarantee is there that you will actually like the campus and the environment - ei. people, location, facilities, faculty, clinic, program? And if you don't like those things about the school, wouldn't you want to transfer to a different school/program? Maybe you didnt like the particular program so much so that you decided to drop out and actually rethink going into optometry?

Now from the school's prospective, why would they want to risk their income on someone who is rogue enough to not visit the school and do research (by research i mean traveling to the school, taking a tour and investigating the campus, students and faculty), while running the risk that they will enroll and later decide to drop out? if a student drops out, then the school looses that student's tuition money, and thus, the school loses out on income.

Youre thinking about video interviewing with a rather selfish motive, but in reality, interview day is to make sure that the both the admissions committee likes the potential student, as well as the student likes the school. This best done in a face to face interview and school tour.
 
gochi said:
as long as the school is accredited, there should be nothing else of concern.

its not so much about the money, rather the time invested.

No one has provided a solid reason as to why e-interviews would be a bad idea.
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Then by your statement, I assume you'll be attending NOVA, right? If nothing else matters, then you should be satisfied there.

And you're worried about the day or two invested going to an interview? What about the overall time spent at the university? Ya know, those 4 years? No big.

If you lack such a motivation to show commitment to a school that you want to attend, the school won't have any desire to count on you as being a committed student.
 
EyeWitness said:
200,000+ !!! I don't think so! Knock that 200 in half, you're scaring me.
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Knock that number in half up here in Canada or perhaps if you qualify for in-state tuition. Otherwise, don't kid yourself. You're going to be handing over $200,000+ before you get that O.D. in the US.
 
oceanblue392 said:
Okay, so say you do have a video interview or phone interview. And then, hypothetically, the school in question accepts you based on said interview and you decide to attend that school. What guarantee is there that you will actually like the campus and the environment - ei. people, location, facilities, faculty, clinic, program? And if you don't like those things about the school, wouldn't you want to transfer to a different school/program? Maybe you didnt like the particular program so much so that you decided to drop out and actually rethink going into optometry?

Now from the school's prospective, why would they want to risk their income on someone who is rogue enough to not visit the school and do research (by research i mean traveling to the school, taking a tour and investigating the campus, students and faculty), while running the risk that they will enroll and later decide to drop out? if a student drops out, then the school looses that student's tuition money, and thus, the school loses out on income.

Youre thinking about video interviewing with a rather selfish motive, but in reality, interview day is to make sure that the both the admissions committee likes the potential student, as well as the student likes the school. This best done in a face to face interview and school tour.
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wow, did you even attempt to read my post?

if the admissions comittee does invite you to an interview, then already you have met the requirements. there should be really nothing else to do beyond this point besides attending the interview which can be done through the web.

surprisingly, the tuition argument is a good point, but I highly doubt an interviewer can determine a students future events\troubles\issues etc.
 
gochi said:
if the admissions comittee does invite you to an interview, then already you have met the requirements. there should be really nothing else to do beyond this point besides attending the interview which can be done through the web.
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Not true. When you're invited for an interview, you have met PART of the requirements. The interview aspect is the opportunity for the schools to judge your non-quantifiable characteristics. Yes, your personal statement and LORs are aspects of this in your application, but these things cannot make up for meeting the applicant in person. They don't just consider how you answer questions. They consider how you interact with your peers and how you present yourself--neither of which can be assessed via webcam.

If you still don't think it's important for you to see the school firsthand, I doubt anything anyone says can convince you otherwise... but I think it's ridiculous to think you could make that decision without seeing the school first.
 
gochi said:
wow, did you even attempt to read my post?

if the admissions comittee does invite you to an interview, then already you have met the requirements. there should be really nothing else to do beyond this point besides attending the interview which can be done through the web.

surprisingly, the tuition argument is a good point, but I highly doubt an interviewer can determine a students future events\troubles\issues etc.
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Thats not true at all. I read your posts, and it seems like you have no idea how the admissions process works for optometry school. Do you have any experience with the interview process? You have not met all of the requirements when you have been extended an interview. The interview itself is a large portion of the admissions process. Additionally, many schools have interview day essays - how can that be done over the internet?

You still havent provided a good answer to my question: how can the school and the potential student know that they are a good fit for each other unless the student does a face to face interview and tour of the campus?
 
oceanblue392 said:
Thats not true at all. I read your posts, and it seems like you have no idea how the admissions process works for optometry school. Do you have any experience with the interview process? You have not met all of the requirements when you have been extended an interview. The interview itself is a large portion of the admissions process. Additionally, many schools have interview day essays - how can that be done over the internet?

You still havent provided a good answer to my question: how can the school and the potential student know that they are a good fit for each other unless the student does a face to face interview and tour of the campus?
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If the interview process is so relevant because it's a large portion of the interview process, then how do you explain the students who get into the respective schools w/o attending an interview? If the interview was such a big deal, then it should be mandatory for all applicants.

To answer your question, I guess the only way to know your compatibilty with the school and vice-versa, is if you visit and spend some time with the school/faculty. However, that is completely pointless. Did you interview or even take a tour or talk with faculty at your undergraduate school? No.

All optometry schools have one solid objective, which is to educate their students. Everything and anything else, pertaining to the school, is of personal preference which can be dissected just by reasearching or talking to class mates. However irrelavant, a visit to the school or talking to faculty/students etc. will produce similar conclusions/answers about the school enviorment/ppl etc, which you can obtain easily by researching.
 
OpticalBlackOut said:
Well, you're not going to be at school 100% of the time.
Half the time, you'll be off campus- how can you gauge the environment without visiting the area?
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why does that even matter? USA is not a third world country.
 
gochi said:
If the interview process is so relevant because it's a large portion of the interview process, then how do you explain the students who get into the respective schools w/o attending an interview? If the interview was such a big deal, then it should be mandatory for all applicants.
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And just how many students get into schools w/o an interview...how many programs do that? Maybe only the top 3-5% of students? If the interview weren't such a big deal, why dont ALL schools accept without interviews? That is by no means common practice. It only happens with TOP students when there is no question as to their academic performance.

gochi said:
To answer your question, I guess the only way to know your compatibilty with the school and vice-versa, is if you visit and spend some time with the school/faculty. However, that is completely pointless. Did you interview or even take a tour or talk with faculty at your undergraduate school? No.
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undergraduate school is a completely different situation, and is completely irrelevant to your own argument. Undergraduate schools can rely on sheer numbers to support themselves, completely different from graduate programs. How many people drop out of undergrad? Now think about how many people drop out of optometry programs? If just 1 person drops out of a graduate program, their tuition to the school has a much higher percentage impact on the schools income than if 1 person from an undergraduate class of a few thousand dropped out. Undergraduate programs can rely year after year on waves of new applicants as well as transfers. Graduate programs, by the numbers, dont have that luxury - optometry schools dont want you to drop out or transfer, unless its absolutely necessary.

gochi said:
Everything and anything else, pertaining to the school, is of personal preference which can be dissected just by reasearching or talking to class mates. However irrelavant, a visit to the school or talking to faculty/students etc. will produce similar conclusions/answers about the school enviorment/ppl etc, which you can obtain easily by researching.
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Judging from my interview experience at ICO, PCO, SCO, NOVA and Berkeley, that is not true for me and im guessing 99% of the other applicants.

Are you the sort of guy that would buy a car without test driving it? Because you can just do research online, and talk to people who have driven it before to learn about it. What happens if that new drivers seat just doesnt fit you - just doesnt provide you with any back support?
Unlike my car analogy, you cant have tuition money returned to you and there is no warranty if something at the school doesnt work for you once you get there.
 
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gochi said:
If the interview process is so relevant because it's a large portion of the interview process, then how do you explain the students who get into the respective schools w/o attending an interview? If the interview was such a big deal, then it should be mandatory for all applicants.
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The percentage of students who get in without an interview is so minimal. There's a reason why you don't base policies on outliers-- they are extreme situations and don't apply to the majority of cases. UCBSO used to have a policy that those in the top 10% of applicants were automatically accepted without an interview several years ago, but they changed that policy so that ALL their qualified applicants must be interviewed. Clearly UCBSO knows how to run a great program, and they must have encountered problems with those students who weren't interviewed prior to acceptance to change the policy. I think for the most part, the students that are accepted anywhere without in-person interviews are those students who live abroad or have extenuating circumstances preventing them from attending an interview. Not because they're too lazy and cheap, or don't have the foresight to understand how crucial the interview process is.

gochi said:
To answer your question, I guess the only way to know your compatibilty with the school and vice-versa, is if you visit and spend some time with the school/faculty. However, that is completely pointless. Did you interview or even take a tour or talk with faculty at your undergraduate school? No.
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Explain how knowing whether you would be compatible with the school you plan on spending four years at is pointless. Please, enlighten me.

And yes, the majority of students I know at my undergrad visited at least once. Personally, I visited 10+ times because I had friends here before I came.

gochi said:
All optometry schools have one solid objective, which is to educate their students. Everything and anything else, pertaining to the school, is of personal preference which can be dissected just by reasearching or talking to class mates. However irrelavant, a visit to the school or talking to faculty/students etc. will produce similar conclusions/answers about the school enviorment/ppl etc, which you can obtain easily by researching.
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The optometry schools are concerned with producing excellent ODs-- not just educating. That means that all aspects of what makes an optometrist great are considered. Many of those aspects involve diadactic training and are indeed things that can be directly taught; however, some aspects that go into being an excellent OD are characteristics that are innate to a student's personality and will only be nurtured through experiences during school.

Even the most rigorous and prestigious of schools will not be able to transform a student without the proper foundations of compassion, the ability to reason, and the ability to relate to other patients and colleagues into an excellent optometrist. So how do they deal with those students who lack those foundations that cannot be taught? Simple. They weed them out through the interview process where their deficiencies are most apparent.


oceanblue392 said:
Judging from my interview experience at ICO, PCO, SCO, NOVA and Berkeley, that is not true for me and im guessing 99% of the other applicants.

Are you the sort of guy that would buy a car without test driving it? Because you can just do research online, and talk to people who have driven it before to learn about it. What happens if that new drivers seat just doesnt fit you - just doesnt provide you with any back support?
Unlike my car analogy, you cant have tuition money returned to you and there is no warranty if something at the school doesnt work for you once you get there.
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Agreed.
 
Unless all schools do not clearly enforce reasons like you guys have, however common they may be, then the notion that interviews are pointless is still probable.

Compatibilty with the school is a personal preference, which should only matter if you treat it as an important factor. For me, I really dont care where I spend 4 years while completing a degree, as long as it is not crapy NOVA.

Ha, there is no way an Optometry school can produce a good or bad OD. That depends on the person and his/her circumstances. And so what if they managed to produce a bad OD? Not like we are paying them to enhance our skills/personality etc. Schools could care less about what type of OD you become.

For you who have been to interviews, how long did the actual 1on1 interview take?
 
gochi said:
Unless all schools do not clearly enforce reasons like you guys have, however common they may be, then the notion that interviews are pointless is still probable.

Compatibilty with the school is a personal preference, which should only matter if you treat it as an important factor. For me, I really dont care where I spend 4 years while completing a degree, as long as it is not crapy NOVA.

Ha, there is no way an Optometry school can produce a good or bad OD. That depends on the person and his/her circumstances. And so what if they managed to produce a bad OD? Not like we are paying them to enhance our skills/personality etc. Schools could care less about what type of OD you become.

For you who have been to interviews, how long did the actual 1on1 interview take?
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Thats not true...schools do care about what type of OD you become because you are going to represent optometry as a whole profession and a "bad egg" can reflect on the image of the whole profession. Don't think of optometry as each individual, esp when we are trying so hard to be recognized for our abilities and expand our scope of practice. Actually we took a class about this last semester, in addition to classes to help re-enforce the doctor/patient relationship. To some it is more natural to be empathic and be a good doctor, and to others they have to work at it. Judging from your attitude, you need to work on it.
 
DrRobs said:
Thats not true...schools do care about what type of OD you become because you are going to represent optometry as a whole profession and a "bad egg" can reflect on the image of the whole profession. Don't think of optometry as each individual, esp when we are trying so hard to be recognized for our abilities and expand our scope of practice. Actually we took a class about this last semester, in addition to classes to help re-enforce the doctor/patient relationship. To some it is more natural to be empathic and be a good doctor, and to others they have to work at it. Judging from your attitude, you need to work on it.
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😕

need work on what?
 
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