Why do doctors keep prescribing CIIs to addicts?

[SpartanLaser]

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There's a couple people in the pharmacy I work at that get narcotic painkillers every time they come in for years. It doesn't appear they are in any sorts of pain (boy do they have energy to yell when our some of the meds go on back order) and are always paying cash for it (sometimes upwards of 500 dollars).

Why would the same doctors keep prescribing massive amounts of narcotics to these people without thinking twice that they're addicts/selling the CIIs on the streets? Don't doctors have the least bit of common sense? Stuff like percocet sig: take 1-2 tablets every 4 to 6 hours as needed for pain FOR THE LAST 3 YEARS. I can understand if they recently had a procedure....but to be under pain meds constantly for years. If the doctors don't think they're getting people addicted, they're effing blind.

 

[DinosaurJr]

Because the doctors want to get paid.

 

[amox]

There's a couple people in the pharmacy I work at that get narcotic painkillers every time they come in for years. It doesn't appear they are in any sorts of pain (boy do they have energy to yell when our some of the meds go on back order) and are always paying cash for it (sometimes upwards of 500 dollars).

Why would the same doctors keep prescribing massive amounts of narcotics to these people without thinking twice that they're addicts/selling the CIIs on the streets? Don't doctors have the least bit of common sense? Stuff like percocet sig: take 1-2 tablets every 4 to 6 hours as needed for pain FOR THE LAST 3 YEARS. I can understand if they recently had a procedure....but to be under pain meds constantly for years. If the doctors don't think they're getting people addicted, they're effing blind.

I live in Florida, and this is a raging problem.

Every day I work, I get AT LEAST 5 phone calls asking for oxy 30's, and I see over 5+ scripts in the store for the same thing. All of which are turned down, because we honestly done keep it.

Florida is also meth central, and we quit selling PSE at our store... My safety is more important than profits.

Perhaps doctors care about $ more than safety of others on the streets, and that individuals healthcare? I hope not...

 

[Its Z]

ehh let the natural selection play itself out... that's the best way to convert the "addiction genes" into a recessive mode.

We aint natural selection police. And it can't be policed anyways. So why not make some money off of it..

 

[Jabberwocky12]

I think another part of the issue are the lawsuits and ethical issues associated the meds. Obviously this isn't all encompassing for doctors. However, a doctor might often have a hard enough time trying to determine if a patient is faking pain or not, and if a patient is in legitimate pain and the doctor refuses to write then lawsuits could occur. Or at the very least, the doctor is causing unnecessary pain to someone who really needs help and I wouldn't want that on my conscience.

We all know people can be very convincing when they need to be and so it makes it even harder for a doc. Obviously this isn't the only reason; some docs do get into some things they shouldn't like drug rings or kickbacks/deals of some kind and things like that.

But I do know some docs who say that they try to police a little bit but pain management has some ethical and legal implications that other specialties don't.

 

[SpartanLaser]

What appalls me is that the doctors don't seem to give a crap about getting all these people addicted to CIIs and neither do they seem to be taking any responsiblity for it too. Pharmacists are telling people "Be sure to take food with so and so", "avoid prolonged exposure to sunlight after taking this med". And we get stuff like Zpak Quantity # 196 Take 2 tablets by mouth on day 1 and 1 tablet days 2-5". So where does the other 190 tablets go? Doctors don't even seem to care about what they write on their scripts not to mention it looks like chicken scratch. Some of them write their initials on the part of the script that says "PRINT YOUR NAME HERE" so we end up wasting time calling up the offices to find out who the prescriber is while patient has to wait in pain.

Makes me want to think...Is anyone in the healthcare field watching out for patients these days other than the pharmacy staff?

 

[WVUPharm2007]

There's this fella that gets #120 Oxy 80s...#360 Oxy 30s for "breakthrough.

At the going street rate of $1 per mg...dude is getting about $240,000 in street value oxy per year...

...

Maybe I should just get RXs for pain management and retire. Walk them up to a dealer for $.60 on the street dollar...about $150k a year of tax free living...

 

[meister]

There's just no way that someone's in chronic pain if they are physically capable of picking up a prescription at a pharmacy. Also I'm gonna abuse my position as the arbiter of prescription medications to judge all my customers and be condescending even though I wasn't ever inside the examination room and quite literally have no idea what transpired there. Hurf.

 

[MindOverMatter]

 

[owlegrad]

Put yourself in the shoes of a pain management clinic. Let's assume that there are enough people who need their pain managed for such places to exist.

Can you imagine trying to play King Salomon on every patient you see? How exactly do you decide who is faking? I know who we do it in the pharmacy - if you have a script for oxy, you are an addict who sells on the side. Also, no insulin patients ever buy needles, only addicts.

 

[TonyRx]

Yea, we get phone calls and scripts for roxi's and oxy's all day here in South Florida...it becomes comical after a while. My wife also works for Walgreens, and 2 days ago she had front row seats to an undercover SWAT bust on the pain clinic next door to her store. Part of a 3 clinic bust that day, took in several MD's and a Pharmacist. It's an uphill battle and almost a lost cause for the police, addicts will always find a way and someone will always sell to them.

 

[WhiteSnows]

It is better than going back to heroin. IF there is no oxy, criminals will find another drug to satisfy their addictions.

 

[crazybob]

Put yourself in the shoes of a pain management clinic. Let's assume that there are enough people who need their pain managed for such places to exist.

Can you imagine trying to play King Salomon on every patient you see? How exactly do you decide who is faking? I know who we do it in the pharmacy - if you have a script for oxy, you are an addict who sells on the side. Also, no insulin patients ever buy needles, only addicts.

What about asking questions about what they feel and what they have tried, and then asking for random details about that in between? Ones who are faking might have a hard time keeping their story straight.

 

[eagles22]

You also have to consider the difference between dependence and addiction. The two situations produce similar behaviors which can confused for each other. Not saying it's always the case, but it is some of the time.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

What about asking questions about what they feel and what they have tried, and then asking for random details about that in between? Ones who are faking might have a hard time keeping their story straight.

If it was that easy, this wouldn't be a problem.

 

[Ackj]

Maybe I should just get RXs for pain management and retire. Walk them up to a dealer for $.60 on the street dollar...about $150k a year of tax free living...

And since you're reporting zero income to the govt, you can qualify for welfare too 👍

 

[Ackj]

What about asking questions about what they feel and what they have tried, and then asking for random details about that in between? Ones who are faking might have a hard time keeping their story straight.

"I'm in a lot of pain, nothing else has worked"

What's your next question?

 

[crazybob]

"I'm in a lot of pain, nothing else has worked"

What's your next question?

"What have you tried so far?"

And if they list a bunch, be like "now, what was the second one you tried?" Just to catch them off guard. Then you can look at your list and know if they're lying or if they can keep their story straight up to that point.

 

[Tinkerbell22]

Florida is also meth central, and we quit selling PSE at our store... My safety is more important than profits.

where do you live in Florida? i lived in Florida for 23 years, but have never heard of a meth problem... i've seen numerous people turn into pill addicts, crack, etc... but never meth.

i do have family in rural north/central Florida... so maybe the meth problem is coming from Georgia... who knows.

There's just no way that someone's in chronic pain if they are physically capable of picking up a prescription at a pharmacy. Also I'm gonna abuse my position as the arbiter of prescription medications to judge all my customers and be condescending even though I wasn't ever inside the examination room and quite literally have no idea what transpired there. Hurf.

have you ever even seen a pain clinic script? when a girl who looks like she is 15 years old skips into the pharmacy with a script from "South Florida Pain Clinic/etc" and asks if we have "roxis" 30mg... written for some ridicuous number in the hundreds... yeah, they're getting judged... it's called protecting your lisence.

"What have you tried so far?"

And if they list a bunch, be like "now, what was the second one you tried?" Just to catch them off guard. Then you can look at your list and know if they're lying or if they can keep their story straight up to that point.

and then you are promptly yelled at.

 

[crazybob]

and then you are promptly yelled at.

I don't think that matters.

 

[Tinkerbell22]

I don't think that matters.

it matters that you're never going to get anywhere by asking those questions

 

[Sparda29]

There's just no way that someone's in chronic pain if they are physically capable of picking up a prescription at a pharmacy. Also I'm gonna abuse my position as the arbiter of prescription medications to judge all my customers and be condescending even though I wasn't ever inside the examination room and quite literally have no idea what transpired there. Hurf.

I see what you did there. 🙂

OP: My cousin has some form of reactive arthritis/rheumatoid. 20 years old and already taking Morphine, Oxycontin, etc regularly, on top of the monthly monoclonal antibody injections and corticosteroid pills daily. The corticosteroids have had worse side effects on him than the narcotics.

 

[Requiem]

meister made the most insightful comment in this thread, and was promptly ignored.

more fun to judge and paint everyone in a certain light eh? requires less thinking and empathy. are there patients with an addiction (a biological disease no less)? absolutely. are there patients with legitimate pain issues? absolutely. I also know for a fact short of medically examining the patient and getting a complete medical history you are not in a place to know what's going on. Furthermore, discussing your customers/patients so callously is unprofessional regardless.

 

[apteryx]

I think a lot of people here are calloused due to the fact that are a lot of abusers. My mom is a nurse at an office that happens to get a lot of medicaid patients (seeing as how only two offices in the surrounding area use medicaid). One MD at the office gives out tons of narc scripts. New patients are always showing up at the office specifically asking for this doctor, because "my mom/brother/aunt/whoever has him", and they refuse anyone else, only to get an oxy script from said MD. My mom tells me he's a genuine guy who believes all these people are in pain. A week ago, the DEA/FBI/whoever sent a letter to him and the office that he's being investigated. Consequently, no more oxy scripts to be written from the office.

I know this isn't every case, but obviously this has to be happening all the time across the country. While some of this hate may be unfounded, you have to understand how much of this crap comes across the counter. I try not to judge anyone regardless of what they look/seem like, but on the other hand, you can't always play the fool.

 

[Socrates25]

There's 4 major problems at work here:

1. Massive oversupply of doctors. If you dont script it, the guy down the street will. Its a big time incentive to give out whatever the patient wants with no questions asked.

2. $$$$. Cash under the table for drugs is a big motivator. However, I dont think this accounts for a bulk of the poor scripting practices.

3. Have any of you actually told a patient NO that you are making an independent decision not to give them medicine? I'm not talking about the copout excuse of "we dont stock it" or "its on backorder." I'm talking about a straight-up denial of "Yes we have that drug but we refuse to give it to you." Thats a lot harder than it sounds. Its also a big explanation of why doctors cave in and give out the meds. Its not as easy as you think it is to determine who is having real pain either.

4. Doctors get blasted from both sides. For every editorial in the newspapers that cries out about narcotic overscripting, there's another article stating that doctors ignore patient's complaints of pain and arent being compassionate enough. We cant win regardless of what we do.

Back to the $$$$ issue. Money isnt the primary motivator because doctors dont get paid for scripts unless they are running an under the table cash only practice which is illegal in most states. I get paid $30 by insurance regardless of whether I script narcotics or not. It does go back to the PCP oversupply issue though, as knowing that there are 50 other doctors in the city that will script the drugs puts pressure on you to keep your patient panel protected.

 

[wezvidz]

2. $$$$. Cash under the table for drugs is a big motivator. However, I dont think this accounts for a bulk of the poor scripting practices.

In FL you'd be wrong. I talked to a nice patient of mine on a slow night in detail about the pain clinics he'd visited before he got on his Suboxone (which he was nearly completely weaned off of). Says you bring your MRI to first visit showing any slight bulge of any disc and boom, green light. They accept cash only, $250 per visit or thereabouts. After the first visit, each month he would pay his $250, see the Dr for <5 minutes to get the scripts written and be out the door. These docs make INSANE money doing this all day.

3. Have any of you actually told a patient NO that you are making an independent decision not to give them medicine? I'm not talking about the copout excuse of "we dont stock it" or "its on backorder." I'm talking about a straight-up denial of "Yes we have that drug but we refuse to give it to you." Thats a lot harder than it sounds. Its also a big explanation of why doctors cave in and give out the meds. Its not as easy as you think it is to determine who is having real pain either.

Constantly. I'm accustomed to going through the motions of it now.

The new store I've been at for 3 months was narc central, and people knew no matter if there clinic was 50 miles south and their license address was 50 miles north, we'd fill for them. We've since drastically cut down on how much oxycodone we order and only fill it for people with licenses of the town we're located in, and we direct neighboring town people to find a local store to fill at.

They even know when our outside vendor delivery arrives each day and we know he's out front because instantly a line of 20+ people will form in front of the pharmacy. They were waiting in the parking lot and run in to see if we got our CII order. Even filling for only locals now and telling half the people in line I can't fill for them, we're sold out within an hour each week.

Then we spend the rest of the week telling every other person at dropoff with an oxy Rx and every other phone call asking if we have it to check back later. The problem is sickeningly huge down here and I'm not sure what the authorities are doing (or can do) to stifle it.

Even worse is FL is one of the few states without a centralized online prescription tracking system, where we really need it since all these people pay cash. I hear it's in the works though.

 

[rph3664]

You also have to consider the difference between dependence and addiction. The two situations produce similar behaviors which can confused for each other. Not saying it's always the case, but it is some of the time.

Not really. When a person is dependent on drugs, their quality of life goes up. When a person is addicted to drugs, their quality of life goes down.

 

[Tinkerbell22]

In FL you'd be wrong. I talked to a nice patient of mine on a slow night in detail about the pain clinics he'd visited before he got on his Suboxone (which he was nearly completely weaned off of). Says you bring your MRI to first visit showing any slight bulge of any disc and boom, green light. They accept cash only, $250 per visit or thereabouts. After the first visit, each month he would pay his $250, see the Dr for <5 minutes to get the scripts written and be out the door. These docs make INSANE money doing this all day.

Constantly. I'm accustomed to going through the motions of it now.

The new store I've been at for 3 months was narc central, and people knew no matter if there clinic was 50 miles south and their license address was 50 miles north, we'd fill for them. We've since drastically cut down on how much oxycodone we order and only fill it for people with licenses of the town we're located in, and we direct neighboring town people to find a local store to fill at.

They even know when our outside vendor delivery arrives each day and we know he's out front because instantly a line of 20+ people will form in front of the pharmacy. They were waiting in the parking lot and run in to see if we got our CII order. Even filling for only locals now and telling half the people in line I can't fill for them, we're sold out within an hour each week.

Then we spend the rest of the week telling every other person at dropoff with an oxy Rx and every other phone call asking if we have it to check back later. The problem is sickeningly huge down here and I'm not sure what the authorities are doing (or can do) to stifle it.

Even worse is FL is one of the few states without a centralized online prescription tracking system, where we really need it since all these people pay cash. I hear it's in the works though.

Truth. I don't think people outside of the major pain clinic areas understand just how bad it is. I know people I went to high school with who are healthier than I am... and they are going to these places, paying 500 dollars for an MRI to get a "diagnosis", and then paying an additional 250/month for maintenance appointments. Then they go sell the pills for serious $$$ and take maybe one or two before their appointments so they have the drug in their system in case of a urine test. I'd rather fill an Rx for someone who became an addict after major injury/illness than the hundreds of people using the health care system to profit and be lazy *** street pharmacists.

 

[ValeRx]

There's just no way that someone's in chronic pain if they are physically capable of picking up a prescription at a pharmacy. Also I'm gonna abuse my position as the arbiter of prescription medications to judge all my customers and be condescending even though I wasn't ever inside the examination room and quite literally have no idea what transpired there. Hurf.

... and you couldn't possibly be lied to by a drug-seeking patient who is faking their condition. You also could never have your script pad stolen either. Our job is to make sure that patients have legitimate scripts so that WE don't get punished for your dumb-ass mistakes.

 

[ValeRx]

meister made the most insightful comment in this thread, and was promptly ignored.

more fun to judge and paint everyone in a certain light eh? requires less thinking and empathy. are there patients with an addiction (a biological disease no less)? absolutely. are there patients with legitimate pain issues? absolutely. I also know for a fact short of medically examining the patient and getting a complete medical history you are not in a place to know what's going on. Furthermore, discussing your customers/patients so callously is unprofessional regardless.

On the contrary, he made the most useless post in this thread. In fact, it was so pointless that no-one bothered to reply to it.

 

[ucrx]

"What have you tried so far?"

And if they list a bunch, be like "now, what was the second one you tried?" Just to catch them off guard. Then you can look at your list and know if they're lying or if they can keep their story straight up to that point.

Have you been tried on many drugs to treat a condition without success? I can't possibly tell you the order we tried different migraine medications on me before we found the one that worked. It really wouldn't be an effective method.

Not really. When a person is dependent on drugs, their quality of life goes up. When a person is addicted to drugs, their quality of life goes down.

And people who are actually in pain but not completely treated often act similarly to people who are addicted. They need more medications than they are getting, so try to fill early and take more than prescribed. Also, there are people with addictions who have legitimate pain issues. Are we supposed to ignore a pain issue because of addiction?

 

[Requiem]

On the contrary, he made the most useless post in this thread. In fact, it was so pointless that no-one bothered to reply to it.

Oh yes. In a thread where everyone is sitting around j**king each other off about how much money everyone's making selling these narcs (for some reason the pharmacies themselves or the pharmacist's salaries aren't included) and how rampant drug abuse / illegitimate prescribing is, it is dumbfounding how people don't swarm around the post which calls out this thread's inherent mistake.

Absolutely dumbfounding.

It's a lack of knowledge (ignorance) which started this thread, and a lack of knowledge and wanting to be heard which continues it.

Thread should be closed IMO.

 

[pharmschooler]

Couldn't a lot of this be solved simply by having a state or nationwide record keeping system for CIIs? It would be a heck of a lot easier to check out who's doctor shopping for inappropriate prescriptions this way. This is done a lot of places; why not across the US?

Then you can deal with the patient's actual problems instead of trying to figure out whose script is legit and whose isn't. And we wouldn't need to have some ridiculous argument where pharmacists get upset by blatant Rx misuse, and doctors subsequently get mad that their infallibility is called into question.

 

[p-rog]

Oh yes. In a thread where everyone is sitting around j**king each other off about how much money everyone's making selling these narcs (for some reason the pharmacies themselves or the pharmacist's salaries aren't included) and how rampant drug abuse / illegitimate prescribing is, it is dumbfounding how people don't swarm around the post which calls out this thread's inherent mistake.

Absolutely dumbfounding.

It's a lack of knowledge (ignorance) which started this thread, and a lack of knowledge and wanting to be heard which continues it.

Thread should be closed IMO.

I see the faults on both sides of this argument, but I have to say, you guys really do seem to be burying your heads in the sand.

This video has been posted on this site before, but it really does a good job of pointing out just how out of hand the problem is:

http://www.hulu.com/watch/100279/vanguard-the-oxycontin-express

 

[eagles22]

Not really. When a person is dependent on drugs, their quality of life goes up. When a person is addicted to drugs, their quality of life goes down.

Yes, but in order to maintain that quality (like not being in a ton of pain), pseudo-active behaviors are seen in the dependent. After a while the same amount of drug ain't gonna work as well, and they start to ask for early refills just like an addict does. You can't always tell who is who.

 

[StevePerry]

There's a couple people in the pharmacy I work at that get narcotic painkillers every time they come in for years. It doesn't appear they are in any sorts of pain (boy do they have energy to yell when our some of the meds go on back order) and are always paying cash for it (sometimes upwards of 500 dollars).

Why would the same doctors keep prescribing massive amounts of narcotics to these people without thinking twice that they're addicts/selling the CIIs on the streets? Don't doctors have the least bit of common sense? Stuff like percocet sig: take 1-2 tablets every 4 to 6 hours as needed for pain FOR THE LAST 3 YEARS. I can understand if they recently had a procedure....but to be under pain meds constantly for years. If the doctors don't think they're getting people addicted, they're effing blind.

Hey everyone, it appears that Dorothy just left Kansas...

 

[dgroulx]

I was studying for a law review and I found a case in my law book. A pharmacist thought it was his duty to stop people from obtaining narcotics, when in fact, it is his job to dispense. He was always rude to the pain patients, would lie and say things were out of stock, and refuse to fill some scripts. This behavior got him fired. Something to think about for those in retail.

Do not judge people who do not appear to be in pain, because if their medication is working then they will not be in pain. Usually legit patients are on morphine, or one of the long acting brand drugs. People on the street in Florida only want Oxycontin or Roxicodone 30mg (blue ones only). Any other script is most likely valid.

I could usually tell the forged scripts - they would have both Roxicodone and Xanax on the same script. A legit doctor would not mix CII and CIV meds on the same script. Those I would always call on. In Florida, we learn to recognize the good doctors from the bad. I've called the sheriff many times. Florida needs to do what they did in Washington, use only tamper proof pads for all prescriptions. Florida only uses them for Medicaid.

They have closed down most of the pain clinics in Tampa, but they seem to pop back up in other locations. One MD was actually put on trial here, but he was acquitted. The problem is, the MD they decided to go after was a legit pain guy. What they need to go after are the guys who open up in strip malls, without any traditional exam rooms. Those docs are just in it to make a quick buck.

 

[dgroulx]

On the contrary, he made the most useless post in this thread. In fact, it was so pointless that no-one bothered to reply to it.

No, his opinion is shared by pharmacists and we don't get on as often. Pain is a disease state and people should not be judged. Those who do should maybe rethink their career choice.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Up here there is this PCP whose wife is the inspector for the DEA. Dude runs a straight cash pill mill...he's untouchable.

 

[GamecockPharmD]

I fill a TON of CIIs at my pharmacy in SC. On several occasions I've had people call asking if we fill CIIs from Florida. I've seen a few of these and turned them away. A pharmacist I know was fined $2500 for filling a CII from Florida when he was floating at my store. There are several pain clinics nearby and I am constantly filling out DEA 222 forms. Sometimes I wonder if I'll pop up on someones radar for filling so many controls. Most of the patients that come to my pharmacy are on Medicaid. We can argue all day on physician prescribing practices, but we can all agree that there is a major prescription drug abuse problem all over this country. There is a prescription monitoring system here but it can take a while to update. Sometimes it is effective, sometimes it isn't. To fix this problem, every state needs an online prescription drug monitoring program that prescribers and pharmacists have access to that updates quickly and efficiently. The other solution is to have every state require drug tests for all Medicaid recipients to weed out those that really need it and those who abuse the system. Before I get flamed, I know that may be discrimination, etc., but lets be real. Medicaid is bankrupting this country. Politicians would rather cut Medicare, which every hard-working taxpayer contributes to instead of putting a stop to those who abuse the system.

 

[GamecockPharmD]

3. Have any of you actually told a patient NO that you are making an independent decision not to give them medicine? I'm not talking about the copout excuse of "we dont stock it" or "its on backorder." I'm talking about a straight-up denial of "Yes we have that drug but we refuse to give it to you." Thats a lot harder than it sounds. Its also a big explanation of why doctors cave in and give out the meds. Its not as easy as you think it is to determine who is having real pain either.

I've done this a few times. Most recently, I told a girl that I believed she was doctor shopping and I told her that I would not fill her prescription. She left the store crying, although I wasn't mean to her, just honest. Of course, I said this after calling her insurance company, calling other pharmacies, etc. I called the next morning to get the Rx canceled, which the physician agreed to do. Of course she came in about 20 minutes before closing time. I had another guy recently that came in with his arm in a sling thinking he could fool me. DUR reject for duplicate therapy, Percocet 10/325 filled at another pharmacy. Called the ER and told the doc. The doc said he was a pain in the ass, cancel the script, and hopefully he'd leave me alone. I told him that the physician and I both feel like you are doctor shopping, which is illegal. The guy took off so fast it was hilarious. I'm sick of people like this wasting my time.

 

[JackBeanstalk]

You look like a chicken, walk like a chicken, coo like a chicken...you'll be choked like a chicken. Making judgements is human nature and not isolated to pharmacists. But we can all agree there's a fine line and to thread lightly, practice with discretion.

I'm sure this pharmacist was passing judgement and look what happened.

http://washingtonexaminer.com/local/crime-punishment/2011/06/walter-reed-army-doctor-accused-peddling-painkillers?category=86

 

[aboveliquidice]

There's just no way that someone's in chronic pain if they are physically capable of picking up a prescription at a pharmacy. Also I'm gonna abuse my position as the arbiter of prescription medications to judge all my customers and be condescending even though I wasn't ever inside the examination room and quite literally have no idea what transpired there. Hurf.

This...

OP - you better shake your skewed opinions now. There is a major difference between dependence and addiction, but not in the context of panic. They present the same, especially when you tell someone (who is dependent) they may have to go without. I work with veterans that are absolutely dependent now; I can only imagine what they will look like in 30 years. Perhaps a lot like our current Vietnam vets.

Don't turn off your brain, but don't turn off your compassion either. You owe it to all of your patients. Including (especially) those that may need more help.

 

[meister]

The entire concept of drug scheduling and the DEA itself and all of this drug war bullsh*t regulation on narcotics only engenders this kind of attitude and makes it so that the use of these medications even when indicated is frowned upon. Makes me sick.

 

[owlegrad]

The entire concept of drug scheduling and the DEA itself and all of this drug war bullsh*t regulation on narcotics only engenders this kind of attitude and makes it so that the use of these medications even when indicated is frowned upon. Makes me sick.

I sometimes wonder if certain people would prefer that addicts take street drugs. At least when pharmaceuticals are abused the quality of the product can be assured. Not saying I want to feed anyone's addiction or supply product to the diversion market, but honestly it seems preferable than the alternative. Just a random thought on the subject.

I have similar thoughts concerning needles. I hate when I work with pharmacists that won't sell needles to junkies. Do you prefer that they share?! Some things are a matter of public health.

 

[joetrisman]

I have similar thoughts concerning needles. I hate when I work with pharmacists that won't sell needles to junkies. Do you prefer that they share?! Some things are a matter of public health.

Ditto. It kills me as the Rph has the say on if we can sell and most of the rphs I work with won't sell to anyone that doesn't have an insulin rx. I think "yeah we can just pay for their medicaid funded interferon when they get hep C from sharing used needles..." 🙄

 

[owlegrad]

Ditto. It kills me as the Rph has the say on if we can sell and most of the rphs I work with won't sell to anyone that doesn't have an insulin rx. I think "yeah we can just pay for their medicaid funded interferon when they get hep C from sharing used needles..." 🙄

I hadn't considered the job security angle. I like it. 😉

 

[Rockinacoustic]

I have similar thoughts concerning needles. I hate when I work with pharmacists that won't sell needles to junkies. Do you prefer that they share?! Some things are a matter of public health.

The best is when I get asked for 1/2", 30G, 10cc needles. After I alert them I only have 3/10, 1/2, and 1cc, they get confused and are unsure which ones they want. If I'm feeling like a smart ass, I'll ask them how many units of insulin they are using. This is usually followed by a tirade of how their father/girlfriend/dog is out in the car (parked in the fire zone of course) in diabetic coma. Upon being yelled at, I check their ID and send them happily on their way.

As long as you have ID, I could care less what you're using them for.

 

[StevePerry]

I have similar thoughts concerning needles. I hate when I work with pharmacists that won't sell needles to junkies. Do you prefer that they share?! Some things are a matter of public health.

Why don't you go ahead and fill us in and quote any state law word for word that says that every retail pharmacy should also double as a needle exchange program for non-diabetic (or non - any-other-supervised-medical-condition) drug abusers because it is a matter of public health.

 

[VeraShield]

So, here's a question. Why does the U.S. account for 80% of the world's use of opioid pain medications, and 99% of the world's hydrocodone use?

http://abcnews.go.com/US/prescripti...r-americans-pain-medication/story?id=13421828

Do we just complain more?

Knowing nothing about Florida, I was surprised to find out that 98 of the top 100 physicians buying oxycodone are in Florida. Hopefully those new pill mill bills actually do something. 😱