Why do lower ranked schools have high initial cutoff points

[ashasnarf]

Why is it that schools that are lower ranked (but still good) have such stringent cutoff points (need >90/100) to receive immediate acceptances. Have these schools not learned that over the years people with really good numbers/profiles don't typically go to these schools. Is it really worth their time to accept people who are not likely to go to their school. It seems to me that you focus on people who are likely to come to your school first and then consider some of these stellar applicants. People with >32 MCAT and >3.7 GPA are not going to come to schools like MCP/Hahnemann, Albany, Temple,etc because in all liklihood they are going to get into higher ranked schools. Now I know that rank of a school is not the only parameter by which people choose schools, but am I right or wrong in general??? Why not short circuit the long waiting times and delays in applicants having to wait for acceptances, by giving acceptances to students who typically go to that respective school. You would think that afer all these years a school would have enough knowledge an experience to pick applicants that would most likely come their school. Can anyone explain to me the logic of giving an Temple acceptance (minus scholarship $$$money) to someone with a 35 MCAT/3.9 GPA. I think one would be hard pressed to explain the rational of this acceptance. The only reason someone with those stats would go to Temple is if they got a full ride or something pretty damn close to it. I am just fed up with the length of time that this process is taking. My god, my application to some schools has been complete for over 4 months. In this same period of time we have removed 1 million tons of debris from the world trade center disaster site, and nearly completed a military campaign in Afghanistan. Now I know that we are future doctors, and that patience is a virtue, but anyone who has been in a hospital knows that when stuff needs to get done it, it get done!!! Example}} I called Albert Einstein to check on my status and they told me I was missing my letters of recc. I asked if they could be there in the office but that they have not been opened yet, and the lady in the office said that this was highly probable. Now I have to tell you that Einstein has been feeding me this bull for like three months. We are all reasonable people but come on. I swear on all that is holy that if I was in that admissions office I could in one week file every single letter of reccomendation sent to that office. How hard can it be to open a packet, photocopy some forms, and check mark off that the file has all its needed letters. Even if it takes 20 minutes a pocket that (3packets/hour)(8hrs)=24packets a day (24)(30days)= 720 packets a month now this is a lot off applications , and 20 minutes is a boat load of time , and this is only one person working on this. If you had three people or more doing this not counting extra time like overtime or weekends, there is no excuse for this sort of delay. If I was the dean of admissions I would tell my staff lets doubletime it and in one weekend we will all come in here and bang out the bulk of these boxes in our offices. But as is typically usual, common sense and a little bit of dedication on the parts of some medical school id somehow missed. Somebody please tell mne I'm right or tell me to get lost! Anways, thanks to those of you who took to the time to read this post and for responding.

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[THE instiGATOR]

With medical school admission being such a crapshoot, applicants with high stats sometimes do not recieve more than one acceptance. If "low ranked" schools assume that these people will receive better offers, they lose the opportunity to take well-qualified students in. Medical schools, for the most part, are looking out for their own well-being.

 

[ashasnarf]

Hey SwampMan you got insomnia or are you usually up at this hour? Also describe yourself,so that I can recall you from the Albany interview. Where else have you applied/accepted/expereincesin this crazy process so far!!

 

[SMW]

You need to calm down. The world is not perfect, and never will be, and getting angry that it's not is not good for your mental health. The reason schools like Albany accept people with higher stats (and you should consider that a considerable part of that rating is based on essays, LOR's, EC's, and interviews) is that schools would like to move up in the rankings. So obviously they are never going to move up, if they don't admit the people with higher stats. The quality of a school is in large measure due to the quality of its student body. Better students will attract better professors, and the school will improve, get more grants, etc. I'm sure that these changes do occur in med schools, although it's hard to see it in just a few year's span of time. Hope this answers your question. (I too would like to get in there and re-organize these admissions offices, but cut them a little slack in this year of the AMCAS debacle!)

 

[ashasnarf]

Swampman, I agree with a lot that you havesaid, but I am going to disagree somewhat with what you have written here. If you have a 3.9 and 32+ MCAT and can only get into one low ranked school, than I am goingto take a leap of faith andsay that that person is probably doing something wrong inthe interview stage. Those numbers I mentioned above will get you a ton of interviews if you apply to a enough schools and make sure that you also apply to a wide diversity of schools. I find it hard to beleive that there are many people out there with these numbers who get into only one school and have mastered their interviews. Also, how many people at temple etc do you think havesuch numbers or better? I am willing to say less than 10% maybe closer to 5%. Let's talk some more, where else are you interviewing, we should try to meet up on the interview circuit. It ice to talk to a a fellow night owl!! PEACE

 

[TwoSteveSquared]

Top schools accept like 350 peeps for 150 spots, schools like NYMC will accept like 700. What that means is, that lower ranked schools will accept top applicants and good applicants, whereas top schools just accept top applicants. The better schools can be more selective because they keep a higher percentage of who they accept.

Oh, the idea that schools like NYMC and Finch don't ignore top applicants is untrue, cause my friend at Hopkins (who got into into about 8 schools with his 3.9/33) did not get interviews at NYMC, Finch, or MCPHU.

 

[daisygirl]

Ashasnarf,
As it has been said many times, this process is a crapshoot. I have a freind that was rejected from every ,what HE considered, "safety school" (MCP, NYMC, etc). His MCAT score was a 37T and he had ~4.0 GPA. He only got into one school and it was not an ivy. It just goes to show that med schools really take more than just the stats into consideration, needless to say- you can have stellar stats but it does not guarantee you admission. Also in the case of my freind, the majority of his rejections were given without him having an interview (no ivy's interviewed him and very few middle/low ranked schools interviewed him).

In case you were interested, I called Einstein today to see if they received my LOC. It was sent to them last week. They told me that they are a month behind in the mail.

 

[Dr. Kermit]

Ashasnarf-

I also think you need to calm down about lower ranked schools. As I told you before about Temple, they started interviewing relatively early and while I don't think they've filled up their class, they are in the process of sorting through all of their material. I know from a lot of the people that I talked to at my interview that the class had students anywhere from 3.3s-3.9s and 26-37 MCATs. There was even a student who had a 3.9/37 and that was his only acceptance b/c he only applied to Philly schools. You can't assume that people with higher stats will go elsewhere, you don't know if there are financial, family, personal reasons to choose one school over another.

 

[Dr. Kermit]

I also forgot to add that at Temple, the admissions process following the interview is that the interviewer has to write a full report and then submit that the committee. The committee then votes on the applicant and it must be unanimous, not majority rules.

For Hahnemann, the student interviewer and faculty interviewer compile a report about the applicant and then send it to a third reviewer. One of these three will present you to the committee and then a vote is taken. It's a majority rules decision.

The problem with you and Einstein is that a member of the Einstein's admissions committee reads through the applicants to find something remarkable about the application. So, they cannot interview you until they find your letters.

Hang in there and stop being so hyper. Shouldn't you be studying for finals anyway!

 

[sandflea]

i echo everyone else's comments that you need to calm down. a student's stats are not the be-all and end-all of admissions, and as we all know, are not the definitive criteria governing how good a med student/doctor they'll be. high stats are *NOT* a guarantee of *anything* in this process. and why on earth should a med school resolve themselves only to students of 'lower' stats because they assume that higher-stats students will go elsewhere? schools have the right to interview and admit whoever they want. rankings are entirely subjective and relative anyway.

and you're wrong in assuming that the majority of students will automatically attend the higher ranked school--i highly doubt this is actually true. there are too many factors involved in choosing a med school. this is especially true as an increasingly older population enters med school--many applicants these days have families, are already settled in one area, and may have a preference for one school over another for these kinds of reasons. i applied to 20 schools and i honestly have no idea where any of them are ranked. i chose them all based on their educational qualities and what i felt they had to offer *me* as a student. remember that the lowest-ranked student at the lowest-ranked school still becomes a doctor. in all honesty, while the process isn't perfect, i think the majority of med schools do a damn good job of organizing everything, considering they have to compile applications for 5000+ applicants, who have bits and pieces arriving all over the place. give them a break. they *are* getting it done. ask anyone who's been on multiple interviews or who holds an acceptance.

and your applications have been complete for four whole months? so what?! you may never hear a single peep out of anyone until may when they reject you, if that's what they decide. no one is obligated to interview you or act on your application within a certain time frame. be thankful that you haven't been rejected yet--your situation could be a lot worse. applying to med school is a long waiting game; you may not have a place to go until next august, and it's only december! you need to be patient.

 

[Dr. Kermit]

I hate to sound like someone who writes on TPR board, but after I responded in this post and your Temple post, I thought that you genuinely had an interest in MCP or Temple. Then I found another post where you write about waiting a year so that you can get into a top 20 school! I hate to say this, but somewhere on this board is a post about accepting an offer and deferring and the reapplying. If you're accepted to a school this year and you choose not to take the acceptance, then you apply next year, there are questions on most of the secondaries I completed that ask:
1- Did you apply before
2- Were you accepted and why did you choose not to attend.

If you want to be a doctor, then any med school Allopathic or Osteopathic will do it. A lot of the top-20 schools are public schools too so waiting a year can't even guarantee you an acceptance there as many public schools still favor their qualified residents over a better qualified out of state resident.

As the previous poster said, it is only December. With the AMCAS debacle and mediocre stats, I never even expected to hear from 7/15 schools before December let alone be accepted. Heck, I know three of my schools won't even reject me until the bitter end of March, April or May. I had one friend who didn't even know she was going to med school until the middle of July and she had a 3.5 and 35 MCAT from Hopkins. So, sit tight, calm down, and enjoy the holidays.

 

[lake show]

ashasnarf, sorry to be harsh, but it sounds like you are one of those typical med school applicants who thinks numbers and rankings are of all mighty importance. if someone applied to albany (yes not the highest ranked school) with a 38/4.0, then don't you think the school has an obligation to accept him if the committee thinks he can cut it? i sure as hell wouldn't want the committee to start accepting and rejecting based on their "chance of going to the school". i applied to schools that i really wanted to go, not schools based on their rankings. i hope you did too, or else it doesn't look like your going to med school for the more noble reasons (not that it's a necessity though).

it also looks like you're oversimplifying the whole application process. sure, i hate that it takes so much freakin time, but these secretaries or whoever work on them are not part time help. they are probably salaried all year long, and i sure as hell wouldn't want to be photocopying and opening mail all day for 6 months straight. plus, most of the time goes into the recommendation process with the committee i would think. i say give them a break; most of them are doing a good job, the others i would say are due to staff shortage.

 

[CoffeeCat]

Don't lower ranked schools accept applicants with high stats in part to have an artificially high "accepted applicants" GPA/MCAT? It's accepted and not matriculated applicants' scores that are reported, right?

 

[Scooby Doo]

Originally posted by corleone:
•i sure as hell wouldn't want the committee to start accepting and rejecting based on their "chance of going to the school" •••

Sorry to burst your bubble...but yep! That's what they do dear. They like to have a high matriculation to accepted ratio as possible. And that's definitely a huge factor that goes into it. Is this person sincere about wanting to come here? Big Question...and if the committee thinks the person will not go, then they will most likely put them on the waitlist or reject them!

 

[lake show]

sorry, i think sincerity is a valid reason to reject. rejecting someone based on the fact that because they have a high MCAT and GPA they probably will not go to that particular school is different.