Why do people advise premeds to go to the “cheaper” med school when med school name matters so much?

[CidHighwind]

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To me it doesn’t make sense. Sure if all you want to do is rural primary care, pick cheaper. That said, I remember people saying that med school ranking doesn’t matter or that the debt situation is more important. I’m sure if you get a free ride to a school that’s ranked #25 vs having to pay full price for a school ranked #24, that can make sense. It doesn’t make sense to forgo going to a top #10 school because you got a free ride at an unranked school. Doing so limits where you can go. Sure if you graduate AOA and get top percentile scores on Steps you’ll be okay, but why put that stress on yourself? A lot of people from “name brand” schools get in to much nicer residencies, and many don’t have ridiculous step scores. “It’s who you know”, well guess which place will have faculty that are well connected and “in the know” where their letters will have a bigger impact? Guess where it will be easier to crank out research to make you competitive? I know some people are lucky in that their “cheap in-state school” is UCSF or UWash, but I’m not talking about that. I’m just saying that regardless of what anyone tells you, name of medical school matters, and most PDs even say as much.

My only thinking is that people want other applicants to drop those top schools so they can get off the waitlist.

 

[thumbz]

According to the 2018 program director survey, across ALL SPECIALTIES, 50% of PD's consider med school prestige when inviting for interview, and they give it a weighting of 3.8 on their considerations (which is in the bottom quarter of the aggregate weighting, the average weighting is closer to 4.3). When it comes to making the rank list a paltry 36% actually take it into consideration and give it the same weighting of 3.8.

In interviewing and ranking, class quartile is rated higher and given more weighting...

Source: https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/NRMP-2018-Program-Director-Survey-for-WWW.pdf

tl;dr - still pick the cheap school

 

[proudofmykids]

Btw, Med school prestige is quite down the list for evaluation into Residency.

Another point of view...
Look at residency match lists....
Don’t need a T10...
Look at a T30 like USC Keck, or T50 Miami Miller.
Both give full tuition scholarships and both programs have great match lists.
If you are not comfortable with the trade off, do what’s right for You.

Are you facing this decision?

 

[CidHighwind]

According to the 2018 program director survey, across ALL SPECIALTIES, 50% of PD's consider med school prestige when inviting for interview, and they give it a weighting of 3.8 on their considerations (which is in the bottom quarter of the aggregate weighting, the average weighting is closer to 4.3). When it comes to making the rank list a paltry 36% actually take it into consideration and give it the same weighting of 3.8.

In interviewing and ranking, class quartile is rated higher and given more weighting...

Source: https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/NRMP-2018-Program-Director-Survey-for-WWW.pdf

tl;dr - still pick the cheap school

But it’s still important. In addition, one only has to look at the school name on a residency profile page to figure out how much it matters.

Btw, Med school prestige is quite down the list for evaluation into Residency.

Another point of view...
Look at residency match lists....
Don’t need a T10...
Look at a T30 like USC Keck, or T50 Miami Miller.
Both give full tuition scholarships and both programs have great match lists.
If you are not comfortable with the trade off, do what’s right for You.

Are you facing this decision?

Those are all still very good schools. When I say “top”, I mean top 40. Not the myopic view most people have on here where they try to compare top 5 vs top 25.

 

[The Knife & Gun Club]

Really it depends on the difference between the schools. I was just saying in another thread it’s not the rank itself that matters, it’s other factors like access to good mentorship, networking, and learning opportunities.

For example Miami Miller is ranked around #50, but we have the #1 optho program in the nation. So if you want to do optho, going to UM is likely superior to going to many top 20 schools. Conversely our OBGYN Dept is a hot mess. FIU, the unranked school 20 minutes away from us, has strong OBGYN mentorship opportunities. Their students routinely match better than UMs in OBGYN.

so as you can see it’s more complex than just rank. You need to assess the strength of the mentorship and education at each school.

 

[Schwifty]

If you are between a top 10 (or top 20) school and a cheap no name in state school, I would say go to the top school, but going to a top 50 school for an extra $100k in debt probably isn't worth it. This is one of those situations where you can't really add a blanket statement to apply to everyone, its gonna come down to what schools someone was accepted too, what they want to specialize in, the cost difference, etc.

 

[CidHighwind]

If you are between a top 10 (or top 20) school and a cheap no name in state school, I would say go to the top school, but going to a top 50 school for an extra $100k in debt probably isn't worth it. This is one of those situations where you can't really add a blanket statement to apply to everyone, its gonna come down to what schools someone was accepted too, what they want to specialize in, the cost difference, etc.

Your first statement is my point. The difference matters less the better the schools being compared are.

 

[Dr panda]

You can always look at match list. I live nearby 2 schools. One is research heavy top 20 with 3.8/518 average accepted stats and another one is low tier state school with 505 average MCAT. People from both schools successfully match top specialties (ortho/derm) in same proportions. Many people from state school match Vandy, Case, Cleveland clinic, Mayo type programs, obviously not Harvard but still great places.

 

[Goro]

But it’s still important. In addition, one only has to look at the school name on a residency profile page to figure out how much it matters.



Those are all still very good schools. When I say “top”, I mean top 40. Not the myopic view most people have on here where they try to compare top 5 vs top 25.

There are at least 50 schools in the "Top 40". "Prestige" is more like Harvard/Stanford class schools. After that, the only people who care about it are pre-meds and med school deans.

 

[CidHighwind]

There are at least 50 schools in the "Top 40". "Prestige" is more like Harvard/Stanford class schools. After that, the only people who care about it are pre-meds and med school deans.

Just because there’s a lot doesn’t mean it doesn’t help. On SDN anything not Harvard isn’t “elite”, but that’s not how it works. Also PDs care about it. I’ve had residency interviews where they remarked about my medical school being “good”.

You can always look at match list. I live nearby 2 schools. One is research heavy top 20 with 3.8/518 average accepted stats and another one is low tier state school with 503 average MCAT. People from both schools successfully match top specialties (ortho/derm) in same proportions. Many people from state school match Vandy, Case, Cleveland clinic, Mayo type programs, obviously not Harvard but still great places.

What do the bottom of those match list look like?

 

[Angus Avagadro]

Just remember, that Ivy diploma wont pay one dollar toward your 300k med school debt. Medicaire doesnt pay you more if you graduate from Harvard or Joe State Med school. Lower student debt means alot over the next 10 to 20 yrs. It's a very personal decision and might hinge on your goals. If you for sure want academia, it's a simple answer. If you want clinical practice, then not as important. You can always go from academia to clinical practice, not as easy the other way around.

 

[CidHighwind]

Just remember, that Ivy diploma wont pay one dollar toward your 300k med school debt. Medicaire doesnt pay you more if you graduate from Harvard or Joe State Med school. Lower student debt means alot over the next 10 to 20 yrs. It's a very personal decision and might hinge on your goals. If you for sure want academia, it's a simple answer. If you want clinical practice, then not as important. You can always go from academia to clinical practice, not as easy the other way around.

But if you want to match into Derm, optho, ortho, nsgy, urology, ENT, top IM program, etc, then going to the higher ranking school will help one get into those residencies and potentially increase their lifetime earnings. Why go to an unranked school that specializes in primary care when that isn’t what one can go somewhere that can get them easier access to anything?

Also even if you want to go to private practice, a lot of “good” practices want residents from “name” programs to sell to their affluent patients.

 

[Mad Jack]

According to the 2018 program director survey, across ALL SPECIALTIES, 50% of PD's consider med school prestige when inviting for interview, and they give it a weighting of 3.8 on their considerations (which is in the bottom quarter of the aggregate weighting, the average weighting is closer to 4.3). When it comes to making the rank list a paltry 36% actually take it into consideration and give it the same weighting of 3.8.

In interviewing and ranking, class quartile is rated higher and given more weighting...

Source: https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/NRMP-2018-Program-Director-Survey-for-WWW.pdf

tl;dr - still pick the cheap school

If you want to land in a top program in a competitive field though, name matters. Also name can carry you into a field that might not otherwise be possible, as analyses of Harvard's match lists in the past demonstrated

 

[Lawpy]

Just remember, that Ivy diploma wont pay one dollar toward your 300k med school debt. Medicaire doesnt pay you more if you graduate from Harvard or Joe State Med school. Lower student debt means alot over the next 10 to 20 yrs. It's a very personal decision and might hinge on your goals. If you for sure want academia, it's a simple answer. If you want clinical practice, then not as important. You can always go from academia to clinical practice, not as easy the other way around.

I think the people who pick top schools over cheap schools know that and are able to pay off their debts fairly easily since they're able to match wherever they want. Also many top schools give a lot of financial aid that makes them cheaper than state schools.

I agree it's a personal decision in the end to make, and it's a bad idea to let SDN have an influence over such decisions.

 

[Angus Avagadro]

But if you want to match into Derm, optho, ortho, nsgy, urology, ENT, top IM program, etc, then going to the higher ranking school will help one get into those residencies and potentially increase their lifetime earnings. Why go to an unranked school that specializes in primary care when that isn’t what one can go somewhere that can get them easier access to anything?

Also even if you want to go to private practice, a lot of “good” practices want residents from “name” programs to sell to their affluent patients.

Look at the match lists at Joe State school. They match all of those specialties. Most practices aren't real concerned about where you graduated or did your residency. Are you board eligible/certified? What expertise do you bring to the practice?. Might it help you get hired or a residency, all things considered? Yeah, it could provide and edge. You still have to be a competetive applicant for competetive specialties. Meaning, you will be looking at AOA or top 10 to 20 % at an upper tier program and have research and Top board scores. Just because you get in an upper tier school doesnt mean you will be an upper tier student
49 out of 100 students at Harvard graduate in the bottom half of their class. You have to do the math and make the best decision for you. Good luck and best wishes

 

[CidHighwind]

Look at the match lists at Joe State school. They match all of those specialties. Most practices aren't real concerned about where you graduated or did your residency. Are you board eligible/certified? What expertise do you bring to the practice?. Might it help you get hired or a residency, all things considered? Yeah, it could provide and edge. You still have to be a competetive applicant for competetive specialties. Meaning, you will be looking at AOA or top 10 to 20 % at an upper tier program and have research and Top board scores. Just because you get in an upper tier school doesnt mean you will be an upper tier student
49 out of 100 students at Harvard graduate in the bottom half of their class. You have to do the math and make the best decision for you. Good luck and best wishes

It’s hard to figure out which 49 are the bottom half by looking at the match list though...

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Just because you get in an upper tier school doesnt mean you will be an upper tier student

Pretty much guarantees you'll go to an upper tier residency. So....

 

[Dr panda]

What do the bottom of those match list look like?

Just opened match list again to go over it one more time. Bottom is basically community programs, but I have noticed few people who matched NYU, Yale, Hopkins, UChicago, and Baylor. For a school with 505 MCAT that is kinda impressive.

 

[Angus Avagadro]

Pretty much guarantees you'll go to an upper tier residency. So....

So... you do the math like I said earlier. It's a personal decision. Do you want to pay the price of an expensive school or go to a less expensive state school. Are recent ortho grads from the University of Toledo unable to find jobs and driving for Uber? Insurance pays the same regardless where you did your training.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

So... you do the math like I said earlier. It's a personal decision. Do you want to pay the price of an expensive school or go to a less expensive state school. Are recent ortho grads from the University of Toledo unable to find jobs and driving for Uber? Insurance pays the same regardless where you did your training.

Depends on what your career aspirations are. As someone who doesn't think pre-meds really have a good grasp on what they want in a career (despite what they might think) I believe that if you're comparing a top 20 school and a school at the opposite end of the spectrum you should always go to the higher ranked school. Top 20 vs Top 40 vs top 60 doesn't matter, we can agree on that point. However if the difference is large then pick the higher ranked school.

 

[Dr panda]

Depends on what your career aspirations are. As someone who doesn't think pre-meds really have a good grasp on what they want in a career (despite what they might think) I believe that if you're comparing a top 20 school and a school at the opposite end of the spectrum you should always go to the higher ranked school. Top 20 vs Top 40 vs top 60 doesn't matter, we can agree on that point. However if the difference is large then pick the higher ranked school.

Most people are not in the position of picking between state school and top 10 though...

 

[CidHighwind]

Just opened match list again to go over it one more time. Bottom is basically community programs, but I have noticed few people who matched NYU, Yale, Hopkins, UChicago, and Baylor. For a school with 505 MCAT that is kinda impressive.

Is this 505 MCAT school an HBCU by any chance? Yes while it’s true that if you’re an all star you have a chance of going anywhere, why not just set yourself up for success easier by going to a “better” school.

So... you do the math like I said earlier. It's a personal decision. Do you want to pay the price of an expensive school or go to a less expensive state school. Are recent ortho grads from the University of Toledo unable to find jobs and driving for Uber? Insurance pays the same regardless where you did your training.

Are you just pretending not to get our point? It’s one thing to choose to stay at UCLA on a scholarship vs going to WashU at full price, another to go to newer MD school that has a mission statement of making primary care doctors over WashU because a handful of those students from the graduating class matched well.

 

[Dr panda]

Is this 505 MCAT school an HBCU by any chance? Yes while it’s true that if you’re an all star you have a chance of going anywhere, why not just set yourself up for success easier by going to a “better” school.

No, it is just a state school with relatively small number of URMs (~8% total for AA, NA, Hispanics). 1/3 are Asians.
Sometimes better school means doubling the debt and moving to another side of the country.

 

[CidHighwind]

No, it is just a state school with relatively small number of URMs (~8% total for AA, NA, Hispanics). 1/3 are Asians.
Sometimes better school means doubling the debt and moving to another side of the country.

-“1/3 are Asians.

So is it a Cali school then?

 

[Dr panda]

-“1/3 are Asians.

So is it a Cali school then?

Where did you see a Cali school with 505 MCAT?

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Most people are not in the position of picking between state school and top 10 though...

Every year there are posts from people with Top 20 acceptances and full rides to unranked state schools.... based on the OP I assumed this is the scenario they are talking about.

 

[Goro]

-“1/3 are Asians.

So is it a Cali school then?

That stat is pretty much true for ALL MD schools

 

[KnightDoc]

But it’s still important. In addition, one only has to look at the school name on a residency profile page to figure out how much it matters.



Those are all still very good schools. When I say “top”, I mean top 40. Not the myopic view most people have on here where they try to compare top 5 vs top 25.

I think you might be confusing cause and effect. There is no question that top schools attract top students. The PD survey says they care about prestige, but not a lot. The question that you are asking then boils down to, does going to a T40 school provide a given student an advantage, and the answer seems to be "no."

Students in top programs do well because they are top students. The implication seems to be they would be top students wherever they went, and the fact that top residencies have graduates from all sorts of schools tends to bear this out.

Cause and effect -- would a given student from a T40 school who matches into a top residency have been overlooked if s/he went to a state school? PDs say "no," but you might believe otherwise, which is great, because that will free up a seat at a perfectly good state school for someone who wants to control debt. 🙂

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

I think you might be confusing cause and effect. There is no question that top schools attract top students. The PD survey says they care about prestige, but not a lot. The question that you are asking then boils down to, does going to a T40 school provide a given student an advantage, and the answer seems to be "no."

Students in top programs do well because they are top students. The implication seems to be they would be top students wherever they went, and the fact that top residencies have graduates from all sorts of schools tends to bear this out.

Cause and effect -- would a given student from a T40 school who matches into a top residency have been overlooked if s/he went to a state school? PDs say "no," but you might believe otherwise, which is great, because that will free up a seat at a perfectly good state school for someone who wants to control debt. 🙂

Go to any top school's match list. Have fun trying to figure out which of those matches are the people at the bottom of the class with below average Step scores and applications.

 

[CidHighwind]

Go to any top school's match list. Have fun trying to figure out which of those matches are the people at the bottom of the class with below average Step scores and applications.

This. Most “top schools” have Step averages in the 230s, but you’d think they were all 260s/AOA by the match list.

 

[curbsideconsult]

Most everyone's advice (mine included) come from n=1 experience and/or passing along experiences their friends and colleagues have endured.

The people who advise pre-meds to go to the cheaper school are probably the ones who are about as happy as they can be in their careers and resent the fact that they could have done the exact same thing but have gone to a cheaper school and come away with a greater net income at that point in life.

The people who advise pre-meds to go to the biggest name school they can get into are probably resenting their experience of not being able match into the most competitive specialties and believe it was because of the name of the school and not their grades/scores/interview skills.

All we can do is consume as much data as we can and make the decision for ourselves. What (do you think) will you be happy with in the end? If you want to go to a big name school with more debt, go for it if you think that will increase your overall satisfaction with career and life. If having a lot less debt will make you happier and you don't care about the big name, then go that route. Of course, the best option would be is if you could get a big name on a hefty scholarship.

 

[KnightDoc]

Go to any top school's match list. Have fun trying to figure out which of those matches are the people at the bottom of the class with below average Step scores and applications.

You're saying that 100% of a top school's match list is at great, desirable residencies? Nobody matches at less than awesome residencies, regardless of what their scores look like? Really??? Does this extend beyond Harvard, Stanford, Hopkins and Penn to Chicago, Vanderbilt and Northwestern? If so, I stand corrected.

I know that top schools have awesome lists, but I think it's because they are top-heavy with great students. I just cannot believe, based on common sense and the PD survey, that most of those people would be screwed if they didn't go to top schools, since, by definition, they would be just as talented wherever they went. HMS is so far beyond my reach that I wouldn't know what it would mean to go there, but are you really saying that I, being the exact same person that I am, would have vastly different outcomes depending on whether I went to Vanderbilt or Miami?

 

[CidHighwind]

You're saying that 100% of a top school's match list is at great, desirable residencies? Nobody matches at less than awesome residencies, regardless of what their scores look like? Really??? Does this extend beyond Harvard, Stanford, Hopkins and Penn to Chicago, Vanderbilt and Northwestern? If so, I stand corrected.

I know that top schools have awesome lists, but I think it's because they are top-heavy with great students. I just cannot believe, based on common sense and the PD survey, that most of those people would be screwed if they didn't go to top schools, since, by definition, they would be just as talented wherever they went. HMS is so far beyond my reach that I wouldn't know what it would mean to go there, but are you really saying that I, being the exact same person that I am, would have vastly different outcomes depending on whether I went to Vanderbilt or Miami?

Yes, all those top 20 schools have pretty baller match lists.

 

[proudofmykids]

You're saying that 100% of a top school's match list is at great, desirable residencies? Nobody matches at less than awesome residencies, regardless of what their scores look like? Really??? Does this extend beyond Harvard, Stanford, Hopkins and Penn to Chicago, Vanderbilt and Northwestern? If so, I stand corrected.

I know that top schools have awesome lists, but I think it's because they are top-heavy with great students. I just cannot believe, based on common sense and the PD survey, that most of those people would be screwed if they didn't go to top schools, since, by definition, they would be just as talented wherever they went. HMS is so far beyond my reach that I wouldn't know what it would mean to go there, but are you really saying that I, being the exact same person that I am, would have vastly different outcomes depending on whether I went to Vanderbilt or Miami?

I tend to agree, too students product top stats (s

I think you might be confusing cause and effect. There is no question that top schools attract top students. The PD survey says they care about prestige, but not a lot. The question that you are asking then boils down to, does going to a T40 school provide a given student an advantage, and the answer seems to be "no."

Students in top programs do well because they are top students. The implication seems to be they would be top students wherever they went, and the fact that top residencies have graduates from all sorts of schools tends to bear this out.

Cause and effect -- would a given student from a T40 school who matches into a top residency have been overlooked if s/he went to a state school? PDs say "no," but you might believe otherwise, which is great, because that will free up a seat at a perfectly good state school for someone who wants to control debt. 🙂

I fully agree. Someone just posted data showing like 70% correlation between mcat/gpa and Step Scores.
Most of the people at the T20 are way more likely to recommend a strong student to go to >T80 for very large cost savings. The opposite is rarely true as >T80 programs average stats would covet the success of the higher stat students at the T20.

 

[Angus Avagadro]

Depends on what your career aspirations are. As someone who doesn't think pre-meds really have a good grasp on what they want in a career (despite what they might think) I believe that if you're comparing a top 20 school and a school at the opposite end of the spectrum you should always go to the higher ranked school. Top 20 vs Top 40 vs top 60 doesn't matter, we can agree on that point. However if the difference is large then pick the higher ranked school.

Agreed, but if you dont get in to higher ranked school, it is not gloom and doom. Not to pick on Toledo, but Google their program and look at their residents. All nice looking people and I'm sure at the top of.their respective med school classes. No ivy leaguers there. Yet they will get hired when they finish and paid no differently than someone from U penn or Harvard. They will be fine. Some students dont go to some upper tier schools because of cost or family concerns. Since you and I dont pay other peoples bill's, we should not encourage them to take on.more debt than they are comfortable with in order to attend a "higher tier school or program". This is why I say its a personal decision and to do the math and see if its right for you.It's alright. Those ortho residents from Toledo will be fine.
You and I talk around each other a lot, yet agree on most things. You remind me of myself when I was your age. You have some serious potential. Keep striving for excellence.

 

[Med Ed]

It doesn’t make sense to forgo going to a top #10 school because you got a free ride at an unranked school.

The small number people faced with this decision almost always choose the T10 option. So you can rest easy.

 

[theKingLT]

This thread is comparing apples to oranges. Top residency programs don't equate to more money. People who like money will choose the scholarship and people who like prestige and/or academia will choose the higher ranked school. Pre-meds tend to choose prestige if deciding between the two bc most come from affluent backgrounds with little care for money (it's hard to value something you've always had).

BTW med school prestige may be somewhat limiting in the realm of your career, but in the grand scheme of what you can and can't do in your life, hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of debt is a hell of a lot more limiting

 

[CidHighwind]

The small number people faced with this decision almost always choose the T10 option. So you can rest easy.

True, but by the rhetoric of some posters on here you’d think it was 50/50.

 

[CidHighwind]

This thread is comparing apples to oranges. Top residency programs don't equate to more money. People who like money will choose the scholarship and people who like prestige and/or academia will choose the higher ranked school. Pre-meds tend to choose prestige if deciding between the two bc most come from affluent backgrounds with little care for money (it's hard to value something you've always had).

BTW med school prestige may be somewhat limiting in the realm of your career, but in the grand scheme of what you can and can't do in your life, hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of debt is a hell of a lot more limiting

If the “more prestigious” school will allow a student to match into Derm or optho over IM/FM (assuming that’s what they want to do), then yes, going to that school will in fact allow them to make more money...

 

[Etopn23]

So full coa at a top 20 vs partial scholarship at a top 5? Where do you draw the line?

 

[CheGuevaraMD]

Medicine is undergoing a bifurcation that we see in many other professions. With the opening of many new med schools and the DO merger, there will be tons of minimally competent physicians in years to come. If you are okay with a bare minimum sort of career, go to the cheapest med school possible. If you want to do ANYTHING other than clinical practice in a noncompetitive specialty, go to the brand name school. School name can help (or haunt) you for the rest of your career, especially in competitive specialties, research/academia, policy, business, etc. etc.

 

[CidHighwind]

So full coa at a top 20 vs partial scholarship at a top 5? Where do you draw the line?

Marginal benefit, and using top 20 just ignores everything already posted. Full coa at a school in the 70s-80s vs full price for a top 20 would be more realistic. Or heck, let’s go full insane: full ride at a good DO school with a 10k yearly stipend or pay 400k for a private top 30.

Medicine is undergoing a bifurcation that we see in many other professions. With the opening of many new med schools and the DO merger, there will be tons of minimally competent physicians in years to come. If you are okay with a bare minimum sort of career, go to the cheapest med school possible. If you want to do ANYTHING other than clinical practice in a noncompetitive specialty, go to the brand name school. School name can help (or haunt) you for the rest of your career, especially in competitive specialties, research/academia, policy, business, etc. etc.

Medicine is unique in that anyone that graduates from any school and passes their boards (Carribean included) has access to the same jobs. In Law, some would say it’s not even worth doing it if you can’t get into a T14 school.

 

[Lawpy]

why are people assuming top schools don't offer aid?? financial aid plays a major role and can make the top schools cheaper than state schools

 

[Med Ed]

True, but by the rhetoric of some posters on here you’d think it was 50/50.

You may have an excessively dim view of one's career prospects coming out of a cheap state medical school. I will use the University of Mississippi School of Medicine's 2019 match list as an example:

ENT (6) - UCSD, UNC, LSU-NO, UMissx3
Ophtho (3) - UTSW, Vanderbilt, UMiss
Derm (2) - UAB, Vanderbilt
Ortho (5) - MCG, Tulane, Greenville, UMissx2

They also had the obligatory IM match at Johns Hopkins. It's not exactly Harvard, but it's hard to argue that attending this medical school condemns one to rural primary care.

 

[CidHighwind]

You may have an excessively dim view of one's career prospects coming out of a cheap state medical school. I will use the University of Mississippi School of Medicine's 2019 match list as an example:

ENT (6) - UCSD, UNC, LSU-NO, UMissx3
Ophtho (3) - UTSW, Vanderbilt, UMiss
Derm (2) - UAB, Vanderbilt
Ortho (5) - MCG, Tulane, Greenville, UMissx2

They also had the obligatory IM match at Johns Hopkins. It's not exactly Harvard, but it's hard to argue that attending this medical school condemns one to rural primary care.

1. 16 students out of how many?
2. You neglected to talk about the majority of their match list doing primary care...

 

[Med Ed]

1. 16 students out of how many?

About 160 or so.

2. You neglected to talk about the majority of their match list doing primary care...

Okay.

***NEWSFLASH***
November 24, 2019
Jackson, Mississippi

It has recently been discovered that a large percentage of students at the University of Mississippi School of Medicine, a public institution with a mission to "training skilled and compassionate physicians to provide high-quality and equitable health care particularly to the state’s residents, including diverse and underserved populations", match into primary care fields.

Whoda thunk it?

 

[CidHighwind]

About 160 or so.



Okay.

***NEWSFLASH***
November 24, 2019
Jackson, Mississippi

It has recently been discovered that a large percentage of students at the University of Mississippi School of Medicine, a public institution with a mission to "training skilled and compassionate physicians to provide high-quality and equitable health care particularly to the state’s residents, including diverse and underserved populations", match into primary care fields.

Whoda thunk it?

Read my previous posts. I already mentioned schools that have mission statements about serving the underserved.

 

[Med Ed]

Read my previous posts.

No thanks.

 

[CidHighwind]

No thanks.

So you just want to argue and then conclude you’re right? Whatever, collect your likes from your “sick burn” 🙄

 

[getdown]

A few things:

1. School name plays a role but a limited role in residency selection.

2. Looking at match lists to determine competitiveness of schools is really silly. You assume that everyone wants to go into a competitive surgical sub or dermatology and therefore, only the weakest applicants end up in IM/psych/FM. Not only is that insulting to those specialties, it's insulting to those people who genuinely want to go into those specialties. Furthermore, you have no idea how many of each individual class actually wanted to go to derm. If everyone in Harvard wanted to go to derm but only matched 2 but Univ. Miss. matched 2/2 which one do you think is better? Just because a school happens to match more does not show it's inherently more valuable than another school ... it speaks to the quality of the individual students accepted into that school. Those same students given the same opportunity would have succeeded regardless of where they would have ended up in medical school. Those 2 U of Miss students who matched derm in my example could very well be Harvard caliber applicants who decided to stay in Mississippi for their own personal reasons.

3. Being heavily in debt will play a larger role in what jobs you're willing to take coming out of residency. You won't be able to take that job with a better lifestyle but pays less over the higher paying more stressful job because you need the money for loans and your growing family.

4. Physician compensation will vary depending on region. Living in California will depress your income compared to living in a less desirable state.

5. Generally speaking, this country needs more IM/FM doctors than they do specialists. The epidemic of obesity and chronic medical conditions plaguing this country will not be addressed by a dermatologist or surgical sub specialist. So instead of knocking on these specialties, you should be glad people go into them or no one will be able to take care of you or your loved ones when you're older. Imagine an Orthopedic surgeon trying to manage anyone's high blood pressure or diabetes medications. Yeah, I didn't think so.