Why MD, not DO?

[willen101383]

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The fact of the matter is, once you start practicing you will be earning a paycheck. If people don't like that you're an osteopathic physician, they can leave your practice. You won't need to look far to find a new patient to take their spot. You will always be paid. You won't have to worry about not making a salary because you went to a college of osteopathic medicine.

There's no point to argue about international practice rights because all aid organizations such as Doctors without Borders allow participation of ALL US-trained physicians. And, be honest, how many people are truly going to practice in another country? Borders are closed to physicians in various countries if those people weren't trained there.

Will I match an allopathic urology spot as a DO? No, I won't. But neither will the majority of US allopathic students. These fields are selective due to competition. Degree is secondary. DOs can apply to their own residencies (since most exist in both worlds).

There is a lot of misinformation on this forum. Everyone thinks they are going to be God's gift to medicine. Guess what? No, you probably won't be. You'll go about your day, working under an organization such as a hospital, and earn the paycheck you deserve. I've never see an attending degrade another based on their degree.

This country needs physicians. You will have a job. Screw the people that think the letters DO make you less-qualified.

Thanks! Ive been waiting for someone else to come help me out in here!!

 

[Bacchus]

http://nucleus.pcom.edu/cps/pcom_content/StdAffairs/Career/DO/Match_List_2011_Philadelphia.pdf

Here is another thing for you to read: my school's match list for the class of 2011.

Where is this on Nucleus? I cannot find it for the life of me.

 

[willen101383]

The fact of the matter is, once you start practicing you will be earning a paycheck. If people don't like that you're an osteopathic physician, they can leave your practice. You won't need to look far to find a new patient to take their spot. You will always be paid. You won't have to worry about not making a salary because you went to a college of osteopathic medicine.

There's no point to argue about international practice rights because all aid organizations such as Doctors without Borders allow participation of ALL US-trained physicians. And, be honest, how many people are truly going to practice in another country? Borders are closed to physicians in various countries if those people weren't trained there.

Will I match an allopathic urology spot as a DO? No, I won't. But neither will the majority of US allopathic students. These fields are selective due to competition. Degree is secondary. DOs can apply to their own residencies (since most exist in both worlds).

There is a lot of misinformation on this forum. Everyone thinks they are going to be God's gift to medicine. Guess what? No, you probably won't be. You'll go about your day, working under an organization such as a hospital, and earn the paycheck you deserve. I've never see an attending degrade another based on their degree.

This country needs physicians. You will have a job. Screw the people that think the letters DO make you less-qualified.

Thanks! Ive been waiting for someone else to come help me out in here!!

And to add to this: Everyone also thinks they will come into med school and become some academic rockstar. This ISNT THE CASE. Most people will come into med school and become average med students. Med school is hard, the hours are tough, ive personally been sitting at my desk right here for 12 hours now (the joys of neuro).....I have a masters before coming here and ive taken a lot of this crap before, and yet im still an average med student like most students in my class.

EDIT: Whoa glitch in the matrix.

 

[willen101383]

Where is this on Nucleus? I cannot find it for the life of me.

Dude where is ANYTHING on nucleus lol. I just googled PCOM match list 2011

 

[235009]

to answer the OP first....the top 3 reasons you should definitely choose US MD over DO if at all possible:

1. COMLEX.
It is notoriously a poorly made test and more and more allo residencies have stopped accepting it (from what i've heard) so not only do you have to struggle through this terribly written exam but you almost have to take the USMLE steps in addition!

2. Clinical rotations at DO schools are generally sub-par.
From hearing the experiences of friends at (well respected) DO schools and from reading threads on sdn it is obvious that the experience during clinical years at some (most?) DO schools is more similar to the experience at caribbean schools than it is to US MD schools.
At a certain DO school in NY there are 40+ clinical sites scattered throughout a 100+ mile radius with zero standardization and what seems like complete decentralization. This is clearly a byproduct of not having your own hospital. I was also told by a DO resident at my US MD school that the clinical rotations were far less rigorous at his school.
So while pre-clinical years might be similar no matter where you go once you get to third year the inferiority of some (most?) DO schools might become glaringly obvious. Those same DO schools are very well served by premeds who only care/ask about the preclinical years when interviewing and completely overlook what really matters.

3. Very difficult to match well.
This has already been discussed to death in this thread and elsewhere.

And to add to this: Everyone also thinks they will come into med school and become some academic rockstar. This ISNT THE CASE. Most people will come into med school and become average med students. Med school is hard, the hours are tough, ive personally been sitting at my desk right here for 12 hours now (the joys of neuro).....I have a masters before coming here and ive taken a lot of this crap before, and yet im still an average med student like most students in my class.

.....and that's why you should go to a US MD school if at all possible. you hear many people who settle for a DO school say that it's ok because they're going to be in the top 10% of their class and match into their dream specialty anyway but chances are that won't happen.

DO programs generally have lower GPA/MCAT standards than MD programs. So people who actually invested time in people rather than grades and pointless checklist ECs during undergraduate education tend to suffer in MD selection criteria.
😍

probably one of the dumbest things i've ever read on sdn. if your grades are poor and you bombed the mcat because you were "investing time in people" (whatever that means) your priorities were completely out of whack.

 

[Political]

This thread is like Every possible sentiment, thought, or argument on the subject matter has been spammed all over the boards for years. There's even a wiki article on it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_MD_and_DO_in_the_United_States

/thread

Did anyone else get the feeling that the wiki article was heavily biased 😵

 

[EnergyDrink]

probably one of the dumbest things i've ever read on sdn. if your grades are poor and you bombed the mcat because you were "investing time in people" (whatever that means) your priorities were completely out of whack.

Easy there. I was mocking the claim that DOs are more personable.

My apologies.

 

[mipp0]

http://nucleus.pcom.edu/cps/pcom_content/StdAffairs/Career/DO/Match_List_2011_Philadelphia.pdf

Here is another thing for you to read: my school's match list for the class of 2011.

With all due respect, that is not an impressive match list. I have never doubted DOs can match into competitive residencies, but the best residencies usually come with the best hospitals, pay, programs, location, and future opportunities.

All residencies are not made equal; far from it, some are quite sub-par and malignant.

Even a DO attending on this forum noted that to say that DOs and MDs have equal opportunities is ludicrous, although I know this is not the point you were trying to make.

 

[varsityblue]

Wait, don't DOs train with MDs during residency?

 

[CodeBlu]

Not everyone is interested in chiropractic medicine... 😉

This.

http://whatstheharm.net/chiropractic.html

that being said... when I was hurting the other week... I went to the chiro and it was instant relief. But I'm wary about letting them touch my neck... there's a lot of stuff that runs through there, and I don't care how low amplitude their thrust is... it could kill you.

 

[Gut Shot]

Trust me, there arent 30% of all graduating DOs walking around matchless each year.

Hmm, so what's the success rate for the DO match?

 

[theseeker4]

I don't think anybody would laugh at me. As a patient, you have a choice. Unless you're unconscious, you can decide if you want someone as your doctor.

DOs may be glorified chiropractors in the rest of the world but seems to me that they are second-rate MDs in the States so why settle?

:troll:

 

[xXIDaShizIXx]

Says the premed...🙄

You are a funny guy.

I'm not trying to start anything. It was just funny to me. I come from a smaller town in Alabama and there are a lot of misconceptions about the whole M.D./D.O. thing. I agree with you - you are a doctor regardless of the letters behind your name and as long as you treat your patients right that is really all that matters. 🙂

 

[DinoSaysRawr]

With all due respect, that is not an impressive match list. I have never doubted DOs can match into competitive residencies, but the best residencies usually come with the best hospitals, pay, programs, location, and future opportunities.

All residencies are not made equal; far from it, some are quite sub-par and malignant.

Even a DO attending on this forum noted that to say that DOs and MDs have equal opportunities is ludicrous, although I know this is not the point you were trying to make.

It's not? 😕

 

[Omppu27]

DOs claim the holistic side, but ultimately, if a DO doesn't use OMM, there is no difference in how MDs and DOs treat patients. It is a claim DO schools make, but in reality, it just doesn't work like that. You wouldn't notice a difference.

Willen beat me to it.

Agreed.

I shadowed a pediatrician yesterday and there was a DO also working there. If he wasn't wearing his white coat, I wouldn't have noticed a difference.

 

[SellerAl]

Wait, don't DOs train with MDs during residency?

In some cases they can.

 

[HurricaneKatt]

Dont people have self esteem? Who cares what it says on your coat? You are a DOCTOR and thats all that matters.

👍👍

 

[willen101383]

With all due respect, that is not an impressive match list. I have never doubted DOs can match into competitive residencies, but the best residencies usually come with the best hospitals, pay, programs, location, and future opportunities.

All residencies are not made equal; far from it, some are quite sub-par and malignant.

Even a DO attending on this forum noted that to say that DOs and MDs have equal opportunities is ludicrous, although I know this is not the point you were trying to make.

Yeah not impressive when you compare it to your mid to high tier MD school. It wasnt posted to show "impressiveness." It was posted to show that DOs arent "pigeonholed" into certain specialties like that poster had suggested.

Either way, I am sure you havent read many of my other posts on this subject, but I more or less discourage anyone from going the DO route if they think they could be successful going MD. The extra crap you need to deal with just isnt worth it. Of course if the choice comes down to not be a doctor vs be a doctor, you know what the logical choice is. Sure as a premed (and hell even as an early M1) I was one of the "rabid pro DO types," but that isnt the case anymore. But I still have no problem coming here and shooting down the insane misconceptions premeds have regarding the pathway.

The DO pathway (I can only speak for my school PCOM) still produces excellent grads who I would be willing to say are on par with your average MD grad out there. Sure, obviously MDs are goign to match into the more competitive allo programs etc. But they should, the ACGME programs were set up and designed for PGY training for MD students, not DO students. And furthermore the idiocy behind the AOAs "DO residencies are for DOs only" makes me wonder why the ACGME even lets DOs match. Thats what you get when you have a malignant organization running the show for DOs. Theyre more interested in keeping DOs in the past, than acknowledging most grads want change, wont practice OMM, and dont think they are different from MDs in anyway. Sadly, I doubt things will change on that front, because out of every DO class there are always 2 or 3 insane pro OMM nutcases willing to repopulate the AOA.

Anyways, not sure why you said "even a DO attending said DOs dont have equal opportunities." I dont think I ever hinted that I thought that, quite the contrary.

 

[willen101383]

In some cases they can.

Come on man. In MOST cases they can. With the exception of elite ivory tower type programs you will usually find DOs. There are even a ton of dually accredited residency programs out there. Students from my school even share the same rotation sites with multiple other MD programs in the city (drexel, temple, jefferson, and maybe even Penn because we do rotate at Pennsylvania hospital which is Penn.)

 

[willen101383]

It's not? 😕

The fact of the matter is that is a pretty good match list for a DO school regardless of what he thinks. Rads at dartmouth? A bunch of ACGME gas matches? Sure you are obviously going to see "higher level" stuff at an MD program, but for a DO school those are pretty impressive matches.

 

[willen101383]

This.

http://whatstheharm.net/chiropractic.html

that being said... when I was hurting the other week... I went to the chiro and it was instant relief. But I'm wary about letting them touch my neck... there's a lot of stuff that runs through there, and I don't care how low amplitude their thrust is... it could kill you.

Dont be a dick codeblu. As an avid poster here I expected more from you. You know there is a difference between your average DO physician and a chiropractor. Sure the OMM gurus are just glorified chiros but that represents maybe 1% of the DO population.

 

[Ebola4Breakfast]

I applied DO and MD this application season. Aside from more research opportunities on the MD side, some (but certainly not all) DO schools not wanting to discuss clinical rotations, and the inclusion of OMM on the DO side, I didn't see a huge difference in schools. The same can be said of the students I encountered. They were all bright, motivated, and friendly. Maybe I just didn't interview at the right (or wrong?) schools.

My biggest concerns about going DO were:

1) Money
The cost of going DO is substantially higher than going to a state MD school. I'm no rock star, so I'm certainly not going to get financial aid from anyone. I have to consider the cash flow of it all.

2) Clinicals
Some schools have notoriously bad clinicals. Easy solution: avoid those schools. I did my best to ask as many questions as possible about the clinical years during interviews. Not everyone was forthcoming... but at least then I could cross them off the list. Alternatively, other DO schools seemed to have excellent clinicals.

3) Testing
DO residency positions are basically non-existent in the geographical area I want to reside. That means I might need to take both the COMLEX and the USMLE to be competitive for an ACGME residency slot. That didn't sound like fun.

Overall, it's a different means to the same end.
There are advantages and disadvantages to it, just like everything else in life.

 

[Mbeas]

Glad to see so many informed people here 👍

I want to write more, but I'm at work and typing from my phone. Maybe later...

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[willen101383]

Glad to see so many informed people here 👍

I want to write more, but I'm at work and typing from my phone. Maybe later...

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Read the whole thread lol. For every informed person there is another with horrible misinformation

 

[235009]

Easy there. I was mocking the claim that DOs are more personable.

My apologies.

oops. maybe u should consider a more sarcastic emoticon next time 🙂

 

[Bacchus]

This.

http://whatstheharm.net/chiropractic.html

that being said... when I was hurting the other week... I went to the chiro and it was instant relief. But I'm wary about letting them touch my neck... there's a lot of stuff that runs through there, and I don't care how low amplitude their thrust is... it could kill you.

I'd hate to think you're serious. Medical education allows us to screen patients and modify OMM techniques appropriately.

I'm baffled you posted such a poor-thought-out argument.

 

[DeterminedDoc]

Everyone on here who's claiming them to be the same and equally respectable degrees are all MD students or MDs, so their opinions are meaningless when they have the better degree. i.e. if I'm a millionaire its like me telling you $10,000 isn't much money. To you its a lot, but to me it makes no difference.

MD degrees are advantageous because:

1) Better residency placements and better options when it comes to specializing

2) No need to take the COMLEX in addition to the USMLE (DOs need to do both if you want an allo residency)

3) There are plenty of people who have MDs and don't do residency but get other jobs like medical consulting, writing, and a plethora of other things you can't do with a DO degree.

4) People know what an MD is.

There are the ones off the top of my head. Ultimately all these DO lovers are right in that they are both doctors and there isn't much difference in the work itself. Unless you think that list makes a difference, then it becomes pretty subjective and on an individual basis for why people go MD or DO.

My reason is that I just suck way too much and don't really have the luxury of being able to choose anymore. Beggars can't be choosers. But that's just me and in no way reflects on other people who are actually successful in life who are DOs.

 

[SellerAl]

This.

http://whatstheharm.net/chiropractic.html

that being said... when I was hurting the other week... I went to the chiro and it was instant relief. But I'm wary about letting them touch my neck... there's a lot of stuff that runs through there, and I don't care how low amplitude their thrust is... it could kill you.

not codeblu's top game right here

 

[tkim]

3) There are plenty of people who have MDs and don't do residency but get other jobs like medical consulting, writing, and a plethora of other things you can't do with a DO degree.

DO's can't get consulting jobs, writing jobs? Really?

 

[flatearth22]

Not everyone is interested in chiropractic medicine... 😉

This.

http://whatstheharm.net/chiropractic.html

that being said... when I was hurting the other week... I went to the chiro and it was instant relief. But I'm wary about letting them touch my neck... there's a lot of stuff that runs through there, and I don't care how low amplitude their thrust is... it could kill you.

Dont be a dick codeblu. As an avid poster here I expected more from you. You know there is a difference between your average DO physician and a chiropractor. Sure the OMM gurus are just glorified chiros but that represents maybe 1% of the DO population.

I'd hate to think you're serious. Medical education allows us to screen patients and modify OMM techniques appropriately.

I'm baffled you posted such a poor-thought-out argument.

not codeblu's top game right here

CodeBlu making the metamorphosis from the Silver Surfer to Galactus right in front of our eyes

 

[Mbeas]

Read the whole thread lol. For every informed person there is another with horrible misinformation

I should have used the sarcastic emoticon...my apologies

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[willen101383]

DO's can't get consulting jobs, writing jobs? Really?

That made me LOL as well.

Keep the misinformation coming! This is one of the more fun threads on SDN in a long time.

 

[willen101383]

I should have used the sarcastic emoticon...my apologies

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I should have had my sarcasm detector turned on, I just figured that since u were on ur phone you didnt read all the replies.

 

[Mbeas]

Damn this phone

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[willen101383]

Not necessarily...

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Good catch, missed that one.

Taking the USMLE makes you more marketable to ACGME programs, but its not required for many many allo programs. (I am taking it).

 

[Mbeas]

That made me LOL as well.

Keep the misinformation coming! This is one of the more fun threads on SDN in a long time.

I swear...this is pathetic. I feel like I'm being trolled

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[Starlightembers]

That made me LOL as well.

Keep the misinformation coming! This is one of the more fun threads on SDN in a long time.

Well, to be fair (from my admittedly limited knowledge of consulting), it might be hard for a DO to land a job at a top firm such as McKinsey as they tend to look at the prestige of the institution. That said, most MDs coming from lesser ranked/unranked schools would likely have a difficult time, too. *

I overall agree with you, though. Some of the comments on this thread are...interesting.

*I could be wrong, though. As I said, this is just what I have heard.

 

[willen101383]

Well, to be fair (from my admittedly limited knowledge of consulting), it might be hard for a DO to land a job at a top firm such as McKinsey as they tend to look at the prestige of the institution. That said, most MDs coming from lesser ranked/unranked schools would likely have a difficult time, too.

I overall agree with you, though. Some of the comments on this thread are...interesting.

Of course, I agree also. If you are looking to ascend into some research heavy field, get a job in academic medicine, etc....prestige matters. For people seeking to graduate, practice medicine in the trenches of community hospitals all over the country (most people) than where you went to med school is irrelevant. I have zero interest in having a leadership position anywhere, I want to be a good doc, help my patients feel better, earn a good salary, and just have a comfortable life and hopefully love my job. A DO degree is plenty sufficient for that.

Lets not forget that you cant just lump all DO schools into one basket, just like you cant lump all MD schools into one basket. My school has 115 years of history in this city, is very well known and well respected, and grads tend to be well matched. Other brand new schools, while probably fine, lack this "well knownness." They also dont have a massive alumni base etc. There is a massive difference between DO schools...and frankly I wouldnt even think of going to a few of them.

 

[mipp0]

The fact of the matter is that is a pretty good match list for a DO school regardless of what he thinks. Rads at dartmouth? A bunch of ACGME gas matches? Sure you are obviously going to see "higher level" stuff at an MD program, but for a DO school those are pretty impressive matches.

@willen...

It isn't impressive against many "lower tier" MD schools, but I agree it is a very impressive match for a DO school (I have seen others). I don't mean to be a dick when I say this, and I have been very impressed by your honesty about your DO experience and the DO experience in general.

I was expecting a "rabid pro-DO" argument (per usual), with the DO side arguing that they are more personable, humanistic versus the machine-minded, cold blooded MDs.

I also agree with you in that (based on anecdotal evidence) DO physicians don't utilize OMM (?) and DO=MD in terms of responsibilities within the same field.

At the end of the day, DO=MD=Physician.

Overall, you portrayed DOs very fairly and well and am glad you were here to make your case and dispel a lot of misconceptions. You sound like a cool guy 👍

EDIT: Also, just so that we're clear, I think excellent, top DOs can match very well into psychiatry, family medicine, internal medicine, etc. at some of the best MD residencies.

 

[jl lin]

Here's the bottom line as I see.it. Whether MD or DO, and depending on your specialty, you will still be held to the same standard of practice. People should shoot for excellence in practice regardless of their school or title. If the licenses carry the same expectations and weight, then the only difference may be academic. . .

Also, a DO can get sued just as quickly as an MD.

 

[flatearth22]

Here's the bottom line as I see. Whether MD or DO, and depending on your specialty, you will still be held to the same standard of practice. People should shoot for excellence in practice regardless of their school or title. If the license carries the same expectations and weight, then the only difference may be academic. . .

Agreed. A major reason that many people reapply even after being accepted from a DO school or pick a Carib/Foreign MD school over a DO acceptance is, sadly, lay prestige and family/cultural pressure of getting the "golden MD." This is especially true of Asian/Indian families where titles and prestige is a pretty big thing. My parents wanted me to apply to Carib schools as a backup instead of DO schools for this very reason (we also have roots in the Caribbean but that wasn't their major motivation....the MD over DO was). They'd rather have their kid go through hell in the Carib and fight tooth and nail just to land a FM residency in inner-city Detroit (gross) but end up with the almighty MD rather than get a lowly DO stateside and be able to land a decent Gas, IM, EM, etc. residency. They're not the only ones - just look at the hoards of Indians and Asians at places like SGU, Ross, etc.....many of whom had the stats for DO but didn't even apply or turned it down for the foreign MD. One of my Indian friends even said her mom told her that she would be more "marriageable" with an MD than she would with a DO

 

[willen101383]

@willen...

It isn't impressive against many "lower tier" MD schools, but I agree it is a very impressive match for a DO school (I have seen others). I don't mean to be a dick when I say this, and I have been very impressed by your honesty about your DO experience and the DO experience in general.

I was expecting a "rabid pro-DO" argument (per usual), with the DO side arguing that they are more personable, humanistic versus the machine-minded, cold blooded MDs.

I also agree with you in that (based on anecdotal evidence) DO physicians don't utilize OMM (?) and DO=MD in terms of responsibilities within the same field.

At the end of the day, DO=MD=Physician.

Overall, you portrayed DOs very fairly and well and am glad you were here to make your case and dispel a lot of misconceptions. You sound like a cool guy 👍

Thanks and I apologize if I was a dick at all, I am just used to dealing with people on this board who just repeat things they have heard in absence of any truth and it really rubs me the wrong way. I try to be pretty honest with my opinions, and doing anything else but that would be doing a disservice to people that come after me. I would hate to see someone matriculate at a DO school and expecting another, based on reading the posts of some of these "rabid pro DO" jabrones (and like I said I was one of them a few years back).

There are people who would fit well at a DO school based on their needs and situations, and there are others that I would NEVER recommend a DO school to. For dudes like me who graduated with a horrible GPA...subsequently fixed the issue with a masters.....DO schools are a lifeline. Like I mentioned somehwere above, even with 70 credits of almost all As (2 Bs in 6 credit classes when I had my retinal detachment during grad school dammit) my GPA was still a 2.9 something. It would have been a huge waste of money to apply MD because I knew damn well some computer wouldnt even let me past. I knew DO schools would take the time to actually look at my app and say "hmm this is interesting, lets bring this guy in for an interview....oh and look at his 5 years of full time clinical work after college....yeah lets DEF bring this guy in." I think the pathway sucks in some ways, I HATE OMM, I am pissed I have to take the COMLEX and USMLE to make myself more marketable, I hate the way the AOA runs things and ignores the desires of modern day grads...but hey its better than the alternative is it not? I could be sitting in a lab still making barely enough to support myself vs being a doctor and having a career I love and living a good life someday (hopefully). But if someone is lucky enough to have a great undergrad GPA and MCAT by all means go the path of least resistance (MD). Lying and saying the DO pathway isnt without more challenges isnt right to do.

Oh, and I dont see any difference in my classmates and any other MD students I know. They are all annoying, neurotic, gunneresque and a general misery to be around 🙂

 

[K31]

I'd hate to think you're serious. Medical education allows us to screen patients and modify OMM techniques appropriately.

I'm baffled you posted such a poor-thought-out argument.

Ah yes, the application of those evidence-based guidelines from all the peer-reviewed papers studying the differences between OMM techniques and in which cases they are best used.

 

[willen101383]

Ah yes, the application of those evidence-based guidelines from all the peer-reviewed papers studying the differences between OMM techniques and in which cases they are best used.

And again, you do realize that most DO students dont buy into this right?

Ive been asking for actual well designed studies supporting OMM since I stepped foot into med school....and havent seen any yet.

Either way, Ill never use OMM after i graduate.

 

[Athina]

Yeah thats simply not true. You havent even started medical school yet, and thus know nothing of the reality of the situation. Your opinion is thus meaningless. Furthermore, you are Canadian, which further distances you from reality of medical practice in the United States.

So what are you going to to at 2am when you come into the ER with a blown aneurysm/ruptured appendix spilling **** into your abdomen/insert medical emergency here; and the only doc available to treat you is (gasp) a DO???

Bet your opinions of the doc who proceeds to save your life will change a bet, EH?

Also, you should probably change your status from "medical student" to "premed" so that you arent advertising yourself as something you are not.

I'm not a premed. I'm in a 5 year medical program and in medical school. If you're so hung up on semantics, you should change your status to DO student.

 

[gettheleadout]

Everyone on here who's claiming them to be the same and equally respectable degrees are all MD students or MDs, so their opinions are meaningless when they have the better degree. i.e. if I'm a millionaire its like me telling you $10,000 isn't much money. To you its a lot, but to me it makes no difference.

For the record, multiple posters in this thread are students at DO schools. We don't have a separate user status for "osteopathic medical student."

 

[K31]

Look here though. 95% us md matched PGY-1, to ~70% DO. http://www.nrmp.org/data/resultsanddata2011.pdf
That is what I was referring to for the match data.

Again, this doesnt account for DO students leaving the MD match for the DO match.

If you enter BOTH matches (the DO match occurs first), and you match DO you are automatically withdrawn from the MD match.

I believe it does actually take into account those matching in the DO match. Those who apply both DO and MD and match DO are withdrawn from the MD match. Thus they do not actually participate in the MD match and are not counted in the NRMP statistics.

If you look on page 17 of the linked document, it gives the breakdown of what happens to the applicants. Of 3172 total DO students and graduates who applied, 789 withdrew pre-match (presumably mostly those who matched to osteopathic programs) and 175 did not submit a rank list. That leaves 2178 DOs in the match, of whom 1561 matched to PGY-1 positions.

 

[Mbeas]

@willen...

EDIT: Also, just so that we're clear, I think excellent, top DOs can match very well into psychiatry, family medicine, internal medicine, etc. at some of the best MD residencies.

And surgery and other ROADS specialties. Not sure why you picked three of the easiest fields to list for "top DO's"...came off as kinda insulting (not saying that was your intention)

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[willen101383]

I'm not a premed. I'm in a 5 year medical program and in medical school. If you're so hung up on semantics, you should change your status to DO student.

Wow, a 5 year program eh? Either way are clearly a narcissistic douche, no matter what your status in life. If that was an option I would, but clearly I am a medical student so I fall into the category I am listed in. It would behoove you to grow up a little, and realize the world doesnt revolve around you. Hopefully as you progress through med school you learn a little humility; before you start pushing your classmates, patients, and future coworkers away with your arrogance.

 

[K31]

And again, you do realize that most DO students dont buy into this right?

Ive been asking for actual well designed studies supporting OMM since I stepped foot into med school....and havent seen any yet.

Either way, Ill never use OMM after i graduate.

I realize that. I've discussed OMM with several friends who are in DO schools and they all think it's crap. I've worked with a number of DO residents and attendings and never seen it used once.

The resistance to evidence-based evaluation of osteopathic techniques from the osteopathic establishment (not most DO's) remains my primary objection to DO training.