Will a Masters Program in Biology help?

[andrewmalanga]

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I am in the process of applying to Brooklyn College's Graduate Biology program. The courses are quite similar to those of the basic sciences (e.g. genetics, biochemistry, micro, etc) but at a graduate level. I did quite well in a lot of my undergrad pre-reqs, but I also screwed up a number of times because of my lack of maturity at the time. It has been a while since undergrad. That said, if I were to go to school full-time, ace my classes, get some research under my belt, and create some new contacts, do you think this would be a worthy investment of my time and money for the purpose of attaining admissions into a good med school (i.e. one here the States... SUNY Downstate would be a dream)?
Please note, that I do not have any interest in attending Hunter's post-bac program. Brooklyn all the way.

 

[andrewmalanga]

Yeah, that is the response I was fearing. Thanks for the honest opinion. It may be back to the drawing board.

 

[stoptouchingme]

adcoms look at graduate programs as some grade inflated.

I have noticed that you and some other posters have alluded to this quite a few times. Do you have any proof of this? I fail to see why adcoms would look at a good graduate GPA and brush it off because they assume that it is a result of grade inflation. As you may have noticed, SDN is full of people with 3.9 undergrad GPA's with MCAT score way below 28. So, in my opinion some undergrads apparently have inflated grades. At least it seems that way. Why isn't this a factor?

 

[brdmadgrl82]

I was advised by a physician friend to do the post-bac instead of a masters that didn't require alot of the pre-reqs. The reason being that I would be getting a post-bac from a great University compared to one that is not so great and "may inflate grades". I am happy with the decision I made because my University has an awesome med school that I hope to apply to, in addition a higher rate of acceptance for the students who go through the school. I would suggest looking into a good post-bac program at an excellent school.

 

[andrewmalanga]

The pre-reqs to this bio program are very similar to med school pre-reqs. As far as the "prestige" of the university goes, it is a CUNY school that is well respected here in the city. It's not Columbia or NYU, but then again, most of us average folks who have bills to pay (and without parents who contribute) could not afford those programs anyway.
I do not see why science coursework at a graduate level and performing research would not suffice, especially as a full-time student.
It's not like I would be going to an art school, or to a community college. (Not knocking those places, but...). Also, I nailed a lot of my undergrad pre-reqs, but I had a few hiccups along the way.

 

[brdmadgrl82]

The pre-reqs to this bio program are very similar to med school pre-reqs. As far as the "prestige" of the university goes, it is a CUNY school that is well respected here in the city. It's not Columbia or NYU, but then again, most of us average folks who have bills to pay (and without parents who contribute) could not afford those programs anyway.
I do not see why science coursework at a graduate level and performing research would not suffice, especially as a full-time student.
It's not like I would be going to an art school, or to a community college. (Not knocking those places, but...). Also, I nailed a lot of my undergrad pre-reqs, but I had a few hiccups along the way.

I know what you mean as far as tuition (my husband and I are not excited about all my student loans at the moment!) Whatever you decide I'm sure it will be a good choice, I wish you good luck 🙂

 

[mspeedwagon]

I agree with the poster below. If you ace hard core science masters it will help slightly (if you get a poor GPA it will kill your chances). It's much better to take undergraduate courses to raise your chances (assuming a sub-par undergraduate GPA).

I've seen many adcoms on here, and the one I talked to, say that they pretty much expect a 4.0 or close to it from a graduate program. The reason for this, I believe, is that most applicants from graduate school they see have very high graduate GPAs (they liked the subject enough to pursue graduate school in it, so they want to see mastery). A low graduate GPA is actually much more rare than a low undergraduate GPA among applicants.

Graduate school is by no means required for medical school and it does not enhance your chances. Spend your time working on your undergrad GPA/MCAT and, after those are solid, ECs. Don't waste your time/money. It would help to have a sense of where you are starting from to provide better recommendations (my advice to someone with a 2.0 would be different that to someone with a 3.3, but in neither case would I recommend a graduate degree [aside from an SMP]).

While a hard core science masters program will help, there is some perceptions that adcoms look at graduate programs as some grade inflated. Additionally, they will not change your undergrad GPA . You may want to consider a master's level specifically designed a post-bacc. Or, if I recall, SUNY/Downstate has master's level biomed programs.

 

[andrewmalanga]

I really do appreciate all the different perspectives here. Thanks guys and gals.

 

[mspeedwagon]

And it is for this very reason I decided to take biochemistry at a top tier state university instead of a community college (even though the class way one tenth as much at the cc and it was taught by the same teacher, using the same book, syllabus and exams). At the end of the day, perception tends to be at least as, if not more so, important as reality.

Story on perceptions by adcoms. I was talking to admissions director at a new york med school discussing a student who had taken summer organic chem at a middle of the road state college. The Admissions Director suggested that the student should have taken it at the SUNY University Center which was some distance further away. Her reasoning was she certainly thought the University center had a much more rigorous course than the lowly state college. At that point I laughed a little and she scowled at me what is so funny. Turns out that the same professor teaching the University lecture in the morning, then drove and taught the State College lecture in the afternoon. He had been doing this for nearly 20 years giving the same exact course (and I mean the same) with exactly the same exams at both campuses. Ready for the kicker? He was a faculty member of middling little state college!

Moral to the story is that perceptions matter , whether justified or not. The argument isn't whether or not the biology masters at BC is as good or better than undergrad pre-reqs, its perception.

 

[andrewmalanga]

And it is for this very reason I decided to take biochemistry at a top tier state university instead of a community college (even though the class way one tenth as much at the cc and it was taught by the same teacher, using the same book, syllabus and exams). At the end of the day, perception tends to be at least as, if not more so, important as reality.

You do realize that we are NOT talking about a community college right? Brooklyn College is by no means a community college, junior college, etc.

 

[mspeedwagon]

Yes, I do. I know NY colleges well ((gf is in a NY resident and student at Upstate) and most of my friends live in NYC), but I was giving an extreme example of where only perception matters. Even if the same professor taught the exact same class at Brooklyn College and Columbia the latter would get more recognition (even though, in such a case, it is completely NOT fair).

You do realize that we are NOT talking about a community college right? Brooklyn College is by no means a community college, junior college, etc.

 

[andrewmalanga]

Yes, I do. I know NY colleges well (gf is in a NY resident and student at Upstate) and most of my friends live in NYC), but I was giving an extreme example of where only perception matters. Even if the same professor taught the exact same class at Brooklyn College and Columbia the latter would get more recognition (even though, in such a case, it is completely NOT fair).

alright, cool. just wanted to check. i do appreciate the input though.

 

[TicDocDoh]

1) prior to the explosive growth of formal post-bacc programs in the past decade and the change in applicant demographics (remember it wasn't that long ago when 26 years of age was considered the cut off for medical applicants to apply, I kid you not

Gonnif,
Just out of curiosity (and digressing completely from the original topic of this thread), what was the impetus behind the epiphany medical schools finally had that opened up the doors to medical students >26 years of age? And, when did this epiphany happen?

 

[NTF]

As far as GPA repair go, taking additional ugrad (especially upper level sci) courses is much more productive. MA's are generally viewed more as interesting ECs than demonstrative of academic excellence.