Wilmer warning

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Watch out! A resident at Wilmer quit a few months ago! I tried to ask about this during my interview there, but they were very evasive about why. They said she just didn't like ophthalmology. I don't believe it.

Has anyone else heard anything? Was the resident kicked out of the program?

I've heard rumors that Wilmer is a malignant place.

 

[golfman]

Watch out! A resident at Wilmer quit a few months ago! I tried to ask about this during my interview there, but they were very evasive about why. They said she just didn't like ophthalmology. I don't believe it.

Has anyone else heard anything? Was the resident kicked out of the program?

I've heard rumors that Wilmer is a malignant place.

Sounds like somebody who desperately wants to go to Wilmer and is trying to scare everybody else out of ranking it highly. If you had more than 3 posts I may give you some more credibility.

I've heard great things about it, and I currently know people who work there and love it.

 

[Visionary]

I have to agree that creating an SDN account with the username "warning," creating a thread bashing one of the top institutions in the world, as well as digging up two other old threads on said program to post the same thing is rather strange. As golfman pointed out, residents quit residency programs in all specialties from time to time. No institution is immune, and the reason is usually a dissatisfaction with the chosen specialty, or medicine in general, that is only realized once in training. You claim you don't have any information about this particular resident, then state you've heard the program is malignant. Pretty obvious you have an agenda. Cease or you are asking to be banned.

 

[speyeder]

Trying to scare other applicants in order to improve your own chances of getting in to Wilmer is pretty transparent and disgraceful. Your actions lend insight into your character and the picture that we're getting is not very flattering.

 

[MstaKing10]

This post is almost comical. Warning? Are you serious? You really need to spend some time working on your morals/ethics and stop wasting it here.

 

[johnbl]

i am an ophthalmologist in practice about 25 yrs.. busy cataract practice...i can tell you for a fact that most of the folks that come out of residency at Wilmer are subjected to humiliation and bs ..nothing has changed there..id recommend you look elsewhere..Lots of programs that are great elsewhere

 

[golfman]

i am an ophthalmologist in practice about 25 yrs.. busy cataract practice...i can tell you for a fact that most of the folks that come out of residency at Wilmer are subjected to humiliation and bs ..nothing has changed there..id recommend you look elsewhere..Lots of programs that are great elsewhere

Oooh this is one of my all-time favorite troll moves. Create a 2nd fake username to defend the ridiculous post you made with the first fake username.

Give it up. I hope everybody ranks Wilmer #1 just so you don't match there. Troll.

 

[speyeder]

i am an ophthalmologist in practice about 25 yrs.. busy cataract practice...i can tell you for a fact that most of the folks that come out of residency at Wilmer are subjected to humiliation and bs ..nothing has changed there..id recommend you look elsewhere..Lots of programs that are great elsewhere

warning = johnbl

 

[johnbl]

i can assure you i am for real..i have no agenda or secondary gain to lie..Wilmer will never have a shortage of residents.. I trained at university of pittsburgh under stuart brown/jack kennerdell and then did a retina fellowship at MEEI. i gave up surgical /medical retina in 1999 because i was doing a lot of cataract surgery and the add on RDs and endopthalmitis stuff was beating me up. Retina is like general surgery..lots more after hrs in office and OR..not what i was looking for...we have a full time retina guy and that works out fine..the knowledge still serves me well when looking at a macula on a 2wk post op cataract with a premium IOL who isnt seeing normally...

 

[johnbl]

my daughter decided after graduating from UVA she wanted to go into medicine and is completing a yr of all her sciences..she takes the MCAT this spring and i was trying to update my knowledge on the test as I took it many moons ago when i was at Emory. I stumbled on this site on the way to learn more and happened to see this resident section. just trying to give my perspective..a lot has changed since i came out of training in Pittsburgh in the mid 80s

 

[johnbl]

residents do quit for a number of reasons including a good friend of mine ..in our first yr ,his dad a dentist passed away and his mom was dxed with breast cancer 6 months later. He told me he really had little interest in medicine and did it to impress his dad..he completed the residency..however ended up with MS/leukemia..still alive. Fortunately he had a great disability policy..he got out of medicine at about 40 yr old..couldnt operate anymore and went to law school. He does some legal work on the side and is still hanging in there...for you young folks...get a lot of disability insurance. never know what is around the corner and you need it...it isnt cheap but you dont want to be dependant on govt or someone else.

 

[johnbl]

the other thing i tell residents i have worked with and my daughter. in the end..you want a residency where you get lots of good exposure..va hospitals, free clinics, private practices etc.if you dont do a zillion cataracts as a resident..dont sweat it..your technique and the way you do things will continue to evolve and will be much different than it was 5, 10 yrs earlier..you always need to adapt your surgical skills to be the best....dont get complacent.. i see it all the time in older and younger opthals.

 

[Eyefixer]

No offense John, but your statements and advice are typical of someone who has been out of touch with academic ophthalmology for a long time (i.e. your statement about trying to learn re whats going on via the internet, etc. ). I have been around ophthalmology all my life and when I was in your daughters shoes this is the same advice I was getting from docs at your level. Nowdays, it's actiually much more complex that that. Do you want to do academics? Going to a place with lots volume, VAs, etc. and not a good name, won't help you career, sorry. Same goes if you want to work for the goverment, NIH, NEI, etc. Going to Wilmer or a like institution will open LOTS of doors. es, it's not an easy residency and they are heavily geared towards a career in academics, but you rip the benefits after. Ex: most Wilmer grads for the last 10 years get #1 choice of fellowship (a few get 2nd). It's not a cush residency by any means and you do work hard but you don't get "abused" as you suggested (I am actually not sure what that means). In my opinion, part of the problem is the selection of particular residents; I think Wilmer needs to revamp their way of selecting/ranking and do a better job identifying appropriate candidates for the program (not just someone who scored 280 on USMLE step I). Overall, I think it's a great program. Ophthalmology world is small and you do become a part of a very exclusive "club" for the rest of you career. Besides, there is nothing like seeing a patient's name change and saying "Oh, ok" when you tell them you trained at Wilmer. That's an almost daily occurrence for me 🙂

 

[junkemail86]

Nobody can claim that Wilmer isn't an academic powerhouse with great clinical training. But I must say that when I interviewed there last year, the residents were the least happy of the 17 programs I interviewed at. Probably partly due to the demanding atmosphere, partly due to the self-selecting population that goes to such a rigorous program. I'm not saying that it's a bad or malignant program, or to avoid it. Just something to watch for during interview day. I'm sure a lot of people might agree with my assessment, but still choose to go there because it is such a career boost. I am curious to see if the decrease in program size this year affects their reputation though.

 

[Apple99]

It should be noted that Wilmer is dropping 2 spots this year as they are dropping one of their community hospitals so residents will lose some cataract numbers and have more frequent call compared to earlier years. As a former resident I would want to stress that it is a great place but you will work very hard. First year you have ACS rounds starting at 6am, then lectures and then clinic/rotation and then maybe call..so be prepared.

 

[johnbl]

most programs are quite solid today and I agree if you came from Bascom, Wilmer, etc ..it never hurts to have those credentials behind you..However, at the end of the day..i have seen crappy surgeons out of Wilmer and good surgeons out of lesser programs. Get the best training possible obviously. If you like a Socratic , traditional, lets try to make you feel stupid type of residency program....there are plenty of those. I remember when Dick Greene ( oculo-pathology) and others at Wilmer used to try to humiliate the residents..Personally, i found it offensive and what was wrong with medicine in general. My point is know what type of environment you best learn and seek out that type of program

 

[johnbl]

your observations confirm my point. Look at the type of learning environment that exists and ask is this the type of environment where I will excell. At Pittsburgh in the mid 80s..a lot was expected of us..however we were never humiliated, pimped or treated like pieces of crap..Some of my contemporaries could not say the same

 

[johnbl]

eyefixer.. i went to this site simply to learn more about the mcat..not to learn what is happening in the field of ophthalmology..your comments about being out of the loop in regards to academic medicine are interesting given you know nothing about my situation either.

 

[johnbl]

Wilmer residents are well prepared and very sharp. At the end of the day, our society does acknowledge the Harvard/Princeton college grads. I am fortunate to have a Harvard Retina Fellowship certificate (MEEI) in the hall of my office

 

[Eyefixer]

eyefixer.. i went to this site simply to learn more about the mcat..not to learn what is happening in the field of ophthalmology..your comments about being out of the loop in regards to academic medicine are interesting given you know nothing about my situation either.

I got enough from your post to make my conclusion, so we will have to agree to disagree. Having done your training in the 80's you have practiced in the "golden age" of medicine, at least you likely caught the tail end of it. Current medical students and recent grads are in the different situation entirely having to deal with astronomical student loans, disappearing private practice opportunities, etc. I believe you have to seek every advantage you possibly can. Advice like "go to the program with a VA and county hospital" is no longer enough. Sorry.

 

[johnbl]

eyefixer....it is no more competitive in the larger cities today than it was 20yrs ago.(the saturation is the same) *if you have an edge and are good..you will probably be fine. *We both agree..You are 4 yrs out from Wilmer in California and reading some of your other posts...you arent exactly enamored with things.. did Wilmer really open extra doors?? *I really am curious

 

[Eyefixer]

eyefixer....it is no more competitive in the larger cities today than it was 20yrs ago.(the saturation is the same) *if you have an edge and are good..you will probably be fine. *We both agree..You are 4 yrs out from Wilmer in California and reading some of your other posts...you arent exactly enamored with things.. did Wilmer really open extra doors?? *I really am curious

Thanks for doing a background check on me hotshot. Since I don't know you, your curiosity doesn't really interest me. Maybe the reason you are not doing retina anymore is because MEEI retina fellows have some of the lowest surgical numbers, eh? And, by the way, to the forum.

 

[tm12]

1

 

[johnbl]

what you do in residency or fellowship doesnt correlate with what one does when in practice.. I didnt do that many cases as a retinal fellow..but had plenty of business when i got out.. I was fortunate i could pick and choose what i wanted to do..thats one of the advantages to having a very large optometric referral network. They just want the surgery done right

 

[johnbl]

hardly a security check,...you posted the info on another thread

 

[EyeGuy15]

eyefixer,

Chill out dude. The guy is just giving his perspective. Seeing as how you went to Wilmer, I am sure you are pretty smart, but you seem to have the social skills of a pizza box(not surprising, the top students in med school are usually like that). Relax buddy. 99% of patients do not care where you went to residency as long as your reputation is solid in the community and you have semi-decent personal skills when you see patients. Maybe you work with that 1 percent, but also maybe it just helps you feel warm inside. 😍

 

[tm12]

eyefixer,

Chill out dude. The guy is just giving his perspective. Seeing as how you went to Wilmer, I am sure you are pretty smart, but you seem to have the social skills of a pizza box(not surprising, the top students in med school are usually like that). Relax buddy. 99% of patients do not care where you went to residency as long as your reputation is solid in the community and you have semi-decent personal skills when you see patients. Maybe you work with that 1 percent, but also maybe it just helps you feel warm inside. 😍

seriously...I hope he doesn't represent the average Wilmer grad...
I would definitely never refer a patient to a doctor who looked down on their colleagues like that.

 

[Eyefixer]

@eyeguy15-

The guy is just giving his perspective

this is true, however, in his original post he is flat out bashing Wilmer :

most of the folks that come out of residency at Wilmer are subjected to humiliation and bs ..nothing has changed there..id recommend you look elsewhere..

Is this an advice an ATTNEDING with over 20 year experience should give to prospective residents? What is the source of his information? I can tell you from first hand experience that this is not true.

@tm12-

I would definitely never refer a patient to a doctor who looked down on their colleagues like that.

Thanks for heads up! Now good luck with interviews and a successful match (seriously) !

 

[johnbl]

My observations were based on about 4 Grand Rounds . I remember Richard Greene MD,, their oculo-pathologist on two occasions really berating and in a nasty way insulting the resident who was presenting and discussing the case. I remember turning to another ophthalmologist who i met earlier that am and saying, this guy is really inappropriate. Several Wilmer friends of mine at the time told me he was a flammer and this was typical of him and a couple of other older attendings. I guess, all programs have some less than stellar role models in the end. My statement that this is pervasive at Wilmer was not fair or correct and i apologize to eyefixer and others i may have offended. Anyone coming out of Wilmer is going to be superbly prepared no matter where they go or what they do. I highly recommend to all folks looking at various residency programs.. go to their resident lectures, to grand rounds....This will give you an idea how all these physicians interact. Is the interaction such that you will accel?? feel intimidated??

@eyeguy15- this is true, however, in his original post he is flat out bashing Wilmer :



Is this an advice an ATTNEDING with over 20 year experience should give to prospective residents? What is the source of his information? I can tell you from first hand experience that this is not true.

@tm12-

Thanks for heads up! Now good luck with interviews and a successful match (seriously) !

 

[Eyefixer]

Just so you are aware, Dr. Greene passed away from complications of diabetis in 2010 at the age of 76. He was replaced by Dr. Eberhart, the sweetest most kind person I have ever met.

http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/wilmer/employees/cvs/Eberhart.html

I think Dr. Greene was the last of the "old Wilmer" stock you are referring to. I think Wilmer is a great program and anyone who is lucky enough to match there will do great both as a clinician and in their career. The fact that the program is going BACK to 5 residents per year is a big POSITIVE. I wish we had 5 when I trained there. All 5 will be with Wilmer faculty at all times and not scattered all around Baltimore covering urgent clinics and taking cakll for outside hospital ERs and at the same time getting very little surgery from these places.

 

[johnbl]

thanks for the update Eyefixer.. Your last paragraph describing the current program indeed sounds like the best of all worlds.

 

[jsh1986]

MEEI lost a 1st yr resident this year bc she got an offer from McKinsey. Unless there is a pattern to losing residents at top places, dont read too much into it. Top places attract top people who have lots of options, for better or for worse. This resident clearly had no real interest in ophtho, or medicine, generally.

Watch out! A resident at Wilmer quit a few months ago! I tried to ask about this during my interview there, but they were very evasive about why. They said she just didn't like ophthalmology. I don't believe it.

Has anyone else heard anything? Was the resident kicked out of the program?

I've heard rumors that Wilmer is a malignant place.

 

[abu barney]

This thread just re-inforced my contempt for pricks who think their fancy degrees puts them in a special "club" (as someone put it) or gives them magical clinical abilities. The best surgeons I've seen came from pretty standard programs but the guys with the biggest mouths tend to be from the fancy places. It's difficult for sure to get in and I'm sure those who do are very qualified applicants but that doesn't necessarily translate to being an excellent clinician...

But using guerilla tactics to discredit a program to enhance your odds of getting in -- that is lame.

 

[jsh1986]

People can become very easily seduced at the top programs, get it in their head that they are brilliant gods, stop actually working hard, and just fall off the proverbial cliff. Couldn't agree with your post more...at best, where you are training is merely a reflection of how good you were x number of years ago...says little about your current skills.

This thread just re-inforced my contempt for pricks who think their fancy degrees puts them in a special "club" (as someone put it) or gives them magical clinical abilities. The best surgeons I've seen came from pretty standard programs but the guys with the biggest mouths tend to be from the fancy places. It's difficult for sure to get in and I'm sure those who do are very qualified applicants but that doesn't necessarily translate to being an excellent clinician...

But using guerilla tactics to discredit a program to enhance your odds of getting in -- that is lame.

 

[johnbl]

guys..in the end your residency gives you hopefully a solid knowledge base and sound surgical skills. The way you do surgery and the procedures change over time.. New procedures become available and older ones go by the wayside..Good example is the refractive area..I started doing rk in the early 90s..stopped when I started PRK with the laser . PRK was safer and more effective and stable than RK.. LASIK followed in the late 90s..PRK still very good and in fact is done more often than in the early 2000-2004 period. In other words, the surgical arena is constantly evolving. You may have been an ace surgical resident but not kept up and vice versa. My point is after awhile, it dont friggin matter where you trained as long as you had a good foundation. The more pathology you see as a resident the better, however you will continue to add to your knowledge base as time goes on. If your program is very weak and your pathology exposure is lacking..then it may be very difficult to know what you need ..Most programs today will give you the requisite pathology in 3yrs.

 

[Visionary]

guys..in the end your residency gives you hopefully a solid knowledge base and sound surgical skills. The way you do surgery and the procedures change over time.. New procedures become available and older ones go by the wayside..Good example is the refractive area..I started doing rk in the early 90s..stopped when I started PRK with the laser . PRK was safer and more effective and stable than RK.. LASIK followed in the late 90s..PRK still very good and in fact is done more often than in the early 2000-2004 period. In other words, the surgical arena is constantly evolving. You may have been an ace surgical resident but not kept up and vice versa. My point is after awhile, it dont friggin matter where you trained as long as you had a good foundation. The more pathology you see as a resident the better, however you will continue to add to your knowledge base as time goes on. If your program is very weak and your pathology exposure is lacking..then it may be very difficult to know what you need ..Most programs today will give you the requisite pathology in 3yrs.

These are valid points. Fact is that the top tier programs are good if you really want to pursue academics and/or secure a top fellowship in a competitive subspecialty, such as retina. Most programs, however, will provide you with solid training in the fundamentals of comprehensive ophthalmology. As johnbl says, you will hone much of what you practice once you are out on your own, and that holds true for comprehensive and subspecialty docs. Contrary to popular belief, most patients do not know or care where you trained, as long as you take good care of them.