worried about clinical experience?

[wblack]

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Although I have 100+ hours of shadowing, I only have 80 hours of clinical exposure through phlebotomy in a hospital over 4 months. I recently started volunteering at a local hospital in June for 6 hours a week. If I apply now, would med schools consider the number of hours I volunteered starting this June or would they consider it rushed? I applied to several hospital the year previously and was told to wait for several months for medical clearance, volunteer vacancy, etc. but in the end, either the hospital closed down or they severely limited volunteers so my hours did not meet their availability. My non-clinical is good (3 hours per week for few years) though.

 

[cwrig14]

I'm in a similar situation. I have about 80 hours of volunteering across 3 specialties and around 50 hours of clinical volunteering. I'm currently adding to that total at 4hours/week. I've worked in a pharmacy over the last 2 years for 8-12 hours/ week during the school year and full time during the summer, which I believe is clinically relevant, but not technically a "clinical" experience.
Sorry to hijack your thread, but I'm curious as to others takes on our similar situations.

 

[mohad]

I only have 50 hours of clinical volunteering, within the past semester and a half or so. I'm pretty worried myself, but I'll apply and see what happens.

 

[Praefectus]

I never understood why people think that clinical volunteering was a big deal. You're simply the hospital's pledge, doing the scut work while people with real jobs laugh at your stupidity to work for free.

 

[cwrig14]

I never understood why people think that clinical volunteering was a big deal. You're simply the hospital's pledge, doing the scut work while people with real jobs laugh at your stupidity to work for free.

Haha interesting take and I can't argue against it. It just seems like clinical volunteering (unless you have an abundance of other clinical experiences and volunteer work) is a requisite for applying to medical school. For those who support themselves financially, these expectations can be difficult to meet, and it can be disheartening when you compare your clinical EC stats to others. I'm not saying it can't be done, as I'm sure numerous financially independent applicants on SDN have exceptional clinical EC stats, but it's a difficult feat, especially for those who committed to a career in medicine late in their undergraduate career.

 

[wblack]

I never understood why people think that clinical volunteering was a big deal. You're simply the hospital's pledge, doing the scut work while people with real jobs laugh at your stupidity to work for free.

Speaking honestly, you are right. But adcoms still want to see volunteering, no matter how menial the experience may be. When shadowing, most of us did nothing but watch the doc treat patients but it is still required. It may be that you have to make the best of each experience and test yourself on whether do you really see yourself a fit for this profession. I think I am a fit but you still have to show that you did the time.

 

[music2doc]

I never understood why people think that clinical volunteering was a big deal. You're simply the hospital's pledge, doing the scut work while people with real jobs laugh at your stupidity to work for free.

This is why the best applicants avoid hospital volunteering. The people I kept meeting on the interview trail rarely had hospital volunteering as their experience. Most had worked in actual clinical positions, had volunteered as medical assistants (at a free clinic), etc. I don't think I met a single person whose clinical experience was what you describe. I definitely didn't meet anyone who seemed weak on their clinical, research, or academic backgrounds. I only interviewed at upper-50% MD programs, though, so maybe at schools like Drexel, Wayne State, or RVU you'd see more of the students with mediocre experiences interviewed....

(FYI: Even without a cert/license, you may be able to get some excellent clinical experience at a free clinic. There's a reason I advocate for them. Just recently, I was talking with a girl I've mentored who is about to apply. I trained her at a local clinic and she now works with patients with a fair amount of independence. She told me about a patient whose intake she had completed not too long ago that inspired her to work with underserved populations here in the States. Listening to her speak about it was quite convincing as to what she wants to do. She didn't do any complex procedure. She didn't save this woman's life. She simply listened. The most critical part of her interaction had nothing to do with medical skills. It simply required that she was there for the patient. She actually DOES get to have similar time with the patients at the hospital as well, though, because the nurses there know she's a hard worker and they trust her with the patients. If you're a good volunteer, you can get good clinical experience even in a hospital setting. It's all about how you interact with others.)

 

[music2doc]

You'll find hospital volunteers at all schools, you probably just didn't look hard enough. 🙄

However, entry-level clinical positions are generally more rewarding than hospital volunteering. As with most experiences the work will be what you make of it. You'll undoubtedly have a better (and more worthwhile) experience if you take the initiative to interact with doctors and foster relationships that allow you more responsibility in the clinical setting. Volunteers will never be allowed to participate in procedures, but it doesn't mean the experience isn't valuable.

My last statement you highlighted there was a bit sarcastic, but I agree you'll find them anywhere. I didn't really "look" for them at interviews, but I met a lot of fellow interviewees and they all had interesting stories to tell. They had all done things with patients. Now that I am meeting my fellow incoming M1s, most have worked as employees in a clinical setting. Most have also done some very interesting research. And many have done interesting volunteering -- one girl, for instance, started an overseas non-profit to serve a part of the world that is almost unknown to us as Americans but is even more impoverished (and less in vogue) than most of Africa.

The difference, I think, is that the successful ones are successful anywhere. See the part I added to my post. That girl HAS been successful as a hospital volunteer. At the same time, she is one of the most humble AND successful people I know. That makes her someone the nurses are willing to trust. As a result, she actually gets to interact with the patients above and beyond what most hospital volunteers do. It's also important to realize that participating in procedures or providing actual medical care is not the "important part" of volunteering. It's actually the LEAST important part (and really only allowed if you have a cert/license). The most important part is the interaction with patients.

 

[wblack]

Bump. Sorry but any more feedback on this.

 

[Tappinfool66]

I was actually wondering about clinical volunteering too. If you have a lot of shadowing and have enough exposure to medicine through that to be sure enough that you want to be a doctor to apply to medical school, do you have to do clinical volunteering? Obviously volunteer work is important to an application, but does it have to be clinical or can it be another type of volunteering that you do simply because you enjoy it?

 

[wblack]

I was actually wondering about clinical volunteering too. If you have a lot of shadowing and have enough exposure to medicine through that to be sure enough that you want to be a doctor to apply to medical school, do you have to do clinical volunteering? Obviously volunteer work is important to an application, but does it have to be clinical or can it be another type of volunteering that you do simply because you enjoy it?

Through shadowing, volunteering in non-clinical settings, and personal medical problems, I am definite that I want to be a physician. But numbers still matter and that is my prime concern. I am currently volunteering and I enjoy it very much, meeting patients and helping them but they want long term commitment which is short in my case. Any other opinions on this?

 

[MedPR]

Only 80 hours over 16 weeks?

 

[wblack]

Only 80 hours over 16 weeks?

Yes, I had 40 hours in clinic phlebotomy over a span of a month, and then another 40-50 over the span of 4 months at ~3hr/week. This was last year until august.
This year, starting last month, I am doing 3-6 hours per week at a local hospital (depending on their schedule).
Throughout this time, I continued to shadow physicians in primary care as I already shadowed some specialists previously.

 

[eagles22]

Speaking honestly, you are right. But adcoms still want to see volunteering, no matter how menial the experience may be. When shadowing, most of us did nothing but watch the doc treat patients but it is still required. It may be that you have to make the best of each experience and test yourself on whether do you really see yourself a fit for this profession. I think I am a fit but you still have to show that you did the time.

People make way too big a deal out of volunteering. You know what matters? Getting good grades and MCAT scores. Those take skill, dedication, and intelligence. That will set you apart. People who succeed in medical school are smart and hard working, and grades and MCAT scores are the best indicators of those. Worry about those before you even think about the fluff on top of the application.

Most volunteer opportunities, anyone can do. Shadowing takes feet and a pulse. Volunteering at a hospital takes some free time. Not too impressive if you ask me. Please don't waste your time getting in the "required" volunteering at the expense of something that is significantly more important.

FWIW, I got in to med school with 0 shadow hours and like 10 hours of non-healthcare related volunteering. I did have good grades and MCAT scores.

 

[wblack]

People make way too big a deal out of volunteering. You know what matters? Getting good grades and MCAT scores. Those take skill, dedication, and intelligence. That will set you apart. People who succeed in medical school are smart and hard working, and grades and MCAT scores are the best indicators of those. Worry about those before you even think about the fluff on top of the application.

Most volunteer opportunities, anyone can do. Shadowing takes feet and a pulse. Volunteering at a hospital takes some free time. Not too impressive if you ask me. Please don't waste your time getting in the "required" volunteering at the expense of something that is significantly more important.

FWIW, I got in to med school with 0 shadow hours and like 10 hours of non-healthcare related volunteering. I did have good grades and MCAT scores.

Correct but my grades are 3.95 and 31 MCAT (8VR - 3rd repeat 2 years apart). so I need to have the "fluff" and many schools have told me that numbers are not everything as they reject many applicants with stellar numbers. I am just worried as I am a reapplicant and do not wish to get rejected as I love medicine.