Your best guess about pharmacist future role with medical marijuana

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mahogie

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How much new opportunity there will be in the industry if/when it becomes legalized?

Would you guess many pharmacists would make the move to independantly owned dispensaries/pharmacies or big pharma would stranglehold the industry?

What is your guess on the chances of this being sustainable business model?

Do you think it will be gov't mandated requirement that a pharmacist would have to do that "prescription." I know that is not the case now, but it isn't legal now, either.

Can you imagine having permission to grow the plant and also dispense it from your pharmacy?

It all just seems like the Wild Wild West in terms of which route it may go with the unrealized potential for me. I am just curious as to what the doctors in the profession think and want to hear thoughts.
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If it becomes legal and regulated federally, and if it becomes financially viable, I imagine you'll see everyone slingin...er, I mean...dispensing it.

You'll have people on bluelight.ru and opiophile.org discussing whether or not Rite Aid or CVS has the best stuff...with tips on how to attempt to fake glaucoma and bone cancer, naturally...

What they would probably do, if it does get to that point, is come to the realization that having patients inhale incinerated plant fumes isn't exactly a healthy idea. They will likely develop a smokeless nebulizer or HFA inhaler formulation that would remove plant soot from the equation.
 
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So you don't think you'll have to have any medical qualifications to distribute something deemed medical? Also, that link you posted was pretty funny if it wasn't so pathetic.

The whole smokeless thing you brought up seems interesting. I may show my ignorance here, but isn't that just a vaporizer?
 
Until the dosage can be standardized and a non-toxic dosage form is routinely available, I don't think anything is going to come of medical marijuana. The only legend product without a known amount of active ingredient is a green tea extract cream, I don't see marijuana being the second.

Decriminalization is another story all together, but legitimate medical use on a federally-approved basis seems to be a long way off.
 
pharmacists wont be involved in this. it will be a separate thing all together. if you are asking if there is a way to make money from it from a pharmacists point of view? the answer is no

if you are asking to make money from a shop owner point of view? answer is yes
if from a prescribing physician? answer is yes
 
Praziquantel86 said:
Until the dosage can be standardized and a non-toxic dosage form is routinely available, I don't think anything is going to come of medical marijuana. The only legend product without a known amount of active ingredient is a green tea extract cream, I don't see marijuana being the second.

Decriminalization is another story all together, but legitimate medical use on a federally-approved basis seems to be a long way off.
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Thank you for phrasing it better than I could! I believe in medical marijuana and know of several people who used it successfully with the full knowledge and cooperation of their doctors. While I do not believe in the legalization of marijuana, I do believe in its decriminalization, meaning that someone who grows their own or buys enough for their own use should not be considered a criminal. I also see no difference between growing your own pot and making your own beer and wine. There are millions of people who should not smoke pot; there are millions of people who should not have beer and wine either.

As for Marinol, many people for whom it's prescribed flat out refuse to take it because the side effects are worse than the condition it's being used to treat. From what I've seen, it's mainly used as an appetite stimulant.

My sister lives in San Diego, and when I visited her a few years ago, I noticed a pink and lavender building on a street corner near the Hillcrest neighborhood, which is their main gay district. I asked if it was a gay bar, and she said no, it was a medical marijuana dispensary. Had it been open, I would have requested that we stop by there and go in! Really! I'd love to visit a place like that.
 
Praziquantel86 said:
Until the dosage can be standardized and a non-toxic dosage form is routinely available, I don't think anything is going to come of medical marijuana. The only legend product without a known amount of active ingredient is a green tea extract cream, I don't see marijuana being the second.

Decriminalization is another story all together, but legitimate medical use on a federally-approved basis seems to be a long way off.
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Forgive me if this is a dumb question (I haven't started school yet), but why can't they standardize dosage or research non toxic dosage forms? Is it only because it's not approved for medicinal use by federal law? I'm assuming it's not that there's something "special" about marijuana versus some other plant-derived medicine.

I've seen "dispensaries" popping up like weeds in some cities. It sort of seems odd that one requires no actual schooling to dispense something that's a C-1 (whether it should be or not is a separate question). In talking with various people, it comes across that the reason they want to get it taxed has more to do with who controls the money from marijuana versus any actual benefit to a patient. People involved in these things are afraid "big pharma" is going to swoop in, "medicalize" it, and steal their hard-earned (?) profits.

My own feelings on the matter are a little more complicated. I just don't see why it should be treated differently than any other drug if it becomes approved at the federal level for medicinal use.
 
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pharmschooler said:
Forgive me if this is a dumb question (I haven't started school yet), but why can't they standardize dosage or research non toxic dosage forms? Is it only because it's not approved for medicinal use by federal law? I'm assuming it's not that there's something "special" about marijuana versus some other plant-derived medicine.
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The problem with smoked marijuana as a dosage is that the plant has many, many active components, the ratios of which vary from plant to plant. The "main" active ingredient, D9-THC, has been standardized and medicinalized in the U.S. as dronabinol (Marinol). Which, by the way, isn't all that popular of a drug. The Canadians have a sublingual spray, Sativex, which includes D9-THC and another component (can't think of which it is off the top of my head), which is also not too popular a drug.

So the debate becomes is there some component in marijuana that is pharmacologically and isn't one of these two that makes marijuana a better drug than Marinol or Sativex? Is direct inhalation a better route of administration than oral or sublingual? I think the answer to both of those questions is yes, but I don't think that it's so much better than smoked marijuana to account for the near complete avoidance of the two commercially available products.

My opinion is that the marijuana lobby is simply using medicinal marijuana as an excuse to get it more widely available. I don't think it's a better drug than the alternatives, and I certainly don't think it meets the FDA criteria of safe and effective for use in its current form. Just my opinion, take it or leave it.
 
Praziquantel86 said:
My opinion is that the marijuana lobby is simply using medicinal marijuana as an excuse to get it more widely available.
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I'm tempted to believe the same thing, but in some areas of the country, believing this causes people to paint you as unsympathetic to the ordeals of AIDS, pain, and cancer patients.
 
pharmschooler said:
I'm tempted to believe the same thing, but in some areas of the country, believing this causes people to paint you as unsympathetic to the ordeals of AIDS, pain, and cancer patients.
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I really don't care if I appear unsympathetic. To make informed decisions as a medical professional (on a grand scale, at least) you have to remove yourself from the emotional component. Does the FDA appear unsympathetic for pulling Avastin for metastatic breast cancer? Absolutely. Did they make the right decision using the data they have? Absolutely.

Policy decisions need to be made without looking at individuals and anecdotes. To support those decisions, you need to have a thick skin and faith in yourself as a provider.
 
Praziquantel86 said:
I really don't care if I appear unsympathetic. To make informed decisions as a medical professional (on a grand scale, at least) you have to remove yourself from the emotional component. Does the FDA appear unsympathetic for pulling Avastin for metastatic breast cancer? Absolutely. Did they make the right decision using the data they have? Absolutely.

Policy decisions need to be made without looking at individuals and anecdotes. To support those decisions, you need to have a thick skin and faith in yourself as a provider.
Click to expand...
I like your style. I'll keep this in mind as I move forward.
 
Political columnist Richard Brookhiser used marijuana to control chemotherapy-induced nausea when Zofran, then the only 5-HT3 antagonist, stopped working :( (not unusual for chemo patients) and after a couple of cycles, he couldn't even stand the smell of it, so his wife made tea, which he drank, and it worked.

He addressed the issue that this would create a lot of potheads, and he said that it was the ultimate aversion therapy: "If you associate marijuana with hospital odors, nurses slapping your arm to raise a vein for chemotherapy, and that little American Standard logo on the inside of your toilet bowl, trust me, you're not going to want to smoke it for fun." He also said that he was surprised at how easy it was to get once he mentioned that he was looking for it - that it seemed half the people he and his wife knew were dealers or knew someone who was. :eek: One amusing anecdote was all the hole in the wall storefronts in his NYC neighborhood that sold two things: Metallica t-shirts and gadgets for hiding your stash. His favorite was the Budweiser can with the bottom that screwed off. :laugh:

When I was in school, a lady who cut my hair used marijuana to control seizures. The only drug that worked for her as of then was Tegretol, and she refused to take it because for her, the side effects were worse than having seizures. Whenever she experienced a seizure prodrome, she would take a hit off a joint, and that was usually enough to stop the seizure dead in its tracks. Her doctors knew what she was doing, and were fine with it.
 
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WVUPharm2007 said:
If it becomes legal and regulated federally, and if it becomes financially viable, I imagine you'll see everyone slingin...er, I mean...dispensing it.

You'll have people on bluelight.ru and opiophile.org discussing whether or not Rite Aid or CVS has the best stuff...with tips on how to attempt to fake glaucoma and bone cancer, naturally...

What they would probably do, if it does get to that point, is come to the realization that having patients inhale incinerated plant fumes isn't exactly a healthy idea. They will likely develop a smokeless nebulizer or HFA inhaler formulation that would remove plant soot from the equation.
Click to expand...

this. but aside from that, comparing it with the stuff we currently dispense to people on the reg... i've seen oxys and xanax destroy people's lives far worse... so maybe i'm just biased. plus, if you already have a pretty serious disease, i'm not sure if inhaling smoke would really make things all that much worse.
 
Those crazy people at the FDA require standardized dosing for all medications. Smoking a natural product doesn't meet that requirement. They also require solid evidence that a drug works.
 
LMFAO @ non toxic dosage forms. Are you suggesting this plant extract is like digoxin? There are people who smoke ounces of this **** a day, and taking 2 tablets instead of 1 will NOT kill you. Next thing people will say is that taking 2 ginseng tablets is deadly. OH GOD THE PATIENT TOOK 2 MARINOL INSTEAD OF 1 MARINOL TIME TO GASTRIC LAVAGE

Fact is, if pharmacists aren't involved, there's another stake in our pitiful "profession".
 
pfaction said:
LMFAO @ non toxic dosage forms. Are you suggesting this plant extract is like digoxin? There are people who smoke ounces of this **** a day, and taking 2 tablets instead of 1 will NOT kill you. Next thing people will say is that taking 2 ginseng tablets is deadly. OH GOD THE PATIENT TOOK 2 MARINOL INSTEAD OF 1 MARINOL TIME TO GASTRIC LAVAGE

Fact is, if pharmacists aren't involved, there's another stake in our pitiful "profession".
Click to expand...
1. I think they were referring to the fact that inhaling hot particles into your lungs isn't typically a positive, no matter what the particles are.

2. You're obviously really bitter. You should step back and take a look at yourself; going to med school from pharmacy school will *not* solve this problem.
 
meister said:
any amount of THC is non-toxic hope this helps
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You left out "form", which changes the meaning of the quote. Smoking is toxic - I think that is what was meant by "toxic dosage form".

And everything is toxic at high enough concentrations including water. But you already knew that. ;)
 
Forget traditional smoking altogether. The patient could use a vaporizer which spares their lungs from the harshness and cuts down on the amount of marijuana needed to get the same effects.
 
In New Mexico, the medical marijuana program is run by the NM Department of Health and, as far as I know, our state board of pharmacy has absolutely nothing to do with it. Producers are approved by the state, and they can grow and dispense marijuana. Patients can also get approval to grow their own. Pretty much no pharmacist involvement at all from what I've read and seen.

Some doctors are carving themselves out a nice little niche, though, advertising themselves as offering "low-cost medical marijuana evaluations."
 
As soon as I am grown up and graduated and everything is legalized, I am opening my own dispensary. I already have the design and layout in mind, it is going to be hot !

I've been dreaming of having one for a while and no I don't smoke weed.
 
If a pharmacy gets involved with "medical" marijuana, they can loose their DEA license.
 
genesis09 said:
If a pharmacy gets involved with "medical" marijuana, they can loose their DEA license.
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but that would only apply now since it still has no medical use under federal law... i'm guessing they are talking about a situation where it is approved by the US govt.
 
The thing is, all of these potheads going "maaaann, this should be legal" will still not be able to acquire it legally. Oxys are legally available for medicinal purposes, but people use them illegally. If marijuana is made legal for medicinal purposes, potheads sitting around getting high will still be doing something illegal. Nobody is seriously considering making it an OTC or non-regulated item, so it's not like everybody will turn into a pothead if some law gets passed.

Still, the dosage form needs serious work if it were to be FDA approved. Smoking is unhealthy, no matter what you're smoking. If inhalation is somehow necessary for drug delivery, maybe HFA or nebulizer, but I really doubt that this method is essential.
 
pfaction said:
LMFAO @ non toxic dosage forms. Are you suggesting this plant extract is like digoxin? There are people who smoke ounces of this **** a day, and taking 2 tablets instead of 1 will NOT kill you. Next thing people will say is that taking 2 ginseng tablets is deadly. OH GOD THE PATIENT TOOK 2 MARINOL INSTEAD OF 1 MARINOL TIME TO GASTRIC LAVAGE
Click to expand...

Are you arguing that smoking is in fact not bad for you? I think RJ Reynold's might be hiring.

The drug itself is very non-toxic, I won't argue with that. Probably moreso that the vast majority of other drugs on the market. However, that doesn't limit the alteration in mentation or the lack of proven efficacy for the drug.

pfaction said:
Fact is, if pharmacists aren't involved, there's another stake in our pitiful "profession".
Click to expand...

What's your problem anyways? Have you not been getting enough hugs lately? We all get it, you hate pharmacy. Have fun with that.
 
cheburashka said:
As soon as I am grown up and graduated and everything is legalized, I am opening my own dispensary. I already have the design and layout in mind, it is going to be hot !

I've been dreaming of having one for a while and no I don't smoke weed.
Click to expand...

Not sure if you're joking, but my Business major friend and I have been thinking of the same thing for years. It'll be part pharmacy and part coffee shop featuring pre-rolled/baked/juiced products. Ours will be hotter! :cool:

P.S. Possibility of happening: ~2%
 
Swishers said:
Not sure if you're joking, but my Business major friend and I have been thinking of the same thing for years. It'll be part pharmacy and part coffee shop featuring pre-rolled/baked/juiced products. Ours will be hotter! :cool:

P.S. Possibility of happening: ~2%
Click to expand...

you would probably have to move out of this here bible belt first in order to make that happen... lol
 
Perfect video on a subject:

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/user/schmoyoho#p/a/736C3116AD309B58/1/jbc2NaLuv1A[/YOUTUBE]
 
cheburashka said:
Perfect video on a subject:

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/user/schmoyoho#p/a/736C3116AD309B58/1/jbc2NaLuv1A[/YOUTUBE]
Click to expand...

Let me help you with that.


[YOUTUBE]jbc2NaLuv1A[/YOUTUBE]

All you have to do is use this part of the link: jbc2NaLuv1A
 
owlegrad said:
Let me help you with that.


[YOUTUBE]jbc2NaLuv1A[/YOUTUBE]

All you have to do is use this part of the link: jbc2NaLuv1A
Click to expand...

Thank you, owlie. :luck:
 
rxlea said:
Tope and pfaction should go have a beer together. Or smoke a joint :smuggrin:
Click to expand...

:rolleyes:

I couldn't give a crap about marijuana as a plant until it is legalized and a distribution center is established. It is pretty much available orally and as mentioned vaporization (which I know a lot of people will use) diminishes risk severely.

I deleted a paragraph about what I feel about pharmacy. That's my gift to you.
 
pfaction said:
:rolleyes:

I couldn't give a crap about marijuana as a plant until it is legalized and a distribution center is established. It is pretty much available orally and as mentioned vaporization (which I know a lot of people will use) diminishes risk severely.

I deleted a paragraph about what I feel about pharmacy. That's my gift to you.
Click to expand...


:laugh:

I am not being sarcastic - that line really cracked me up.
 
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