2000 Days of Pharmacy: 500 Days of Summer, Pharmacy Edition (expectations vs reality)

[PharmtoCS]

	Expectations	Reality
P1	President of 3 clubs, intern in hospital pharmacy, 3.8 GPA	General of one club, hospital pharmacy intern, 3.8 GPA
P2	Completed summer internship in pharmaceutical industry, still president of 3 clubs	Overwhelmed with school, had to quit internship, GPA 2.3, steps foot in retail pharmacy for the first time but hates it
P3	Completed 2nd summer internship in pharmaceutical industry	Wants to do residency, cumulative GPA 2.7
P4	Lands residency or fellowship	Does not land residency or fellowshp]ip
Graduation	Starts residency or fellowship	Nothing lined up
1 year after graduation	Finishes residency or fellowship, lands unicorn job or decides to go onto PGY2	Forced to move 500+ miles away from home to the middle of nowhere. Floating for 32 hours each week at chain retailer for $50/hour
2 years after graduation	Working at a unicorn job in super-saturated city of choice	Hours cut down to 16 per week, new grads start at $45/hour. Work conditions continue to worsen with no end in sight but you're stuck because you still have $200k student loans to pay off.

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[DagS132]

Sorry this happened to you. I hope that most of the current graduating class don't get it as bad as you did.

 

[PharmtoCS]

Sorry this happened to you. I hope that most of the current graduating class don't get it as bad as you did.

It's what the average new grad will go through and possibly worse.

 

[DagS132]

It's what the average new grad will go through and possibly worse.

I hope they don't get it as bad as you did. I have two friends that just graduated and am worried they will see the same fate as you according to what you posted. I am genuinely worried they will end up like you or worse but I got my fingers crossed.

 

[Saiyo]

Is this you? Wow no wonder you are so salty all the time.

 

[BC_89]

Well, if you wish to beat that dead horse, I am glad it came in the form of an open salt shaker covered with a compare and contrast lay-out point. Carry on

 

[Pharmacy is a Scam]

	Expectations	Reality
P1	President of 3 clubs, intern in hospital pharmacy, 3.8 GPA	General of one club, hospital pharmacy intern, 3.8 GPA
P2	Completed summer internship in pharmaceutical industry, still president of 3 clubs	Overwhelmed with school, had to quit internship, GPA 2.3, steps foot in retail pharmacy for the first time but hates it
P3	Completed 2nd summer internship in pharmaceutical industry	Wants to do residency, cumulative GPA 2.7
P4	Lands residency or fellowship	Does not land residency or fellowshp]ip
Graduation	Starts residency or fellowship	Nothing lined up
1 year after graduation	Finishes residency or fellowship, lands unicorn job or decides to go onto PGY2	Forced to move 500+ miles away from home to the middle of nowhere. Floating for 32 hours each week at chain retailer for $50/hour
2 years after graduation	Working at a unicorn job in super-saturated city of choice	Hours cut down to 16 per week, new grads start at $45/hour. Work conditions continue to worsen with no end in sight but you're stuck because you still have $200k student loans to pay off.

I would wager that most of the pre-pharms who read these forums are from Southern California, so “forced to move 500+ miles away from home to the middle of nowhere” is not in the vocabulary of any of these kids. What is more likely to happen is straight unemployment for 1 year post-graduation into uber driver 2 years out into career change 3 years out, because this is the most practical option for them as they “can’t leave Socal.”

 

[PSOP Student]

Song in the background: She's like the wind
Tom: I hate this song!
Bus driver: Son, you're gonna have to exit the vehicle.

 

[TerryTerry]

I would wager that most of the pre-pharms who read these forums are from Southern California, so “forced to move 500+ miles away from home to the middle of nowhere” is not in the vocabulary of any of these kids. What is more likely to happen is straight unemployment for 1 year post-graduation into uber driver 2 years out into career change 3 years out, because this is the most practical option for them as they “can’t leave Socal.”

YUP. Pharmacies 500 miles away have better candidates within 5 miles.

 

[mentos]

Song in the background: She's like the wind
Tom: I hate this song!
Bus driver: Son, you're gonna have to exit the vehicle.

That is a great song!

I graduated 5 years ago and had a classmate who was too good for retail so she didn't bother applying cause she was going to do residency. When graduation came, I asked where she was doing her residency and said she didn't match. I asked what she was going to do and she said she had an interview with Walmart. Never heard of her again.

 

[Hels2007]

That's why thou shalt underpromise and overdeliver.

I personally entered pharmacy school with no expectations and honestly thought I would work for Walgreens my entire career (I started as a freshman in college and I loved it, it sure beat the call center job I held the summer between high school and college!). Ended up in a unicorn job. I say it's all thanks to my crush on an Italian soccer player the summer after my P-1 year. I originally got involved with all the clubs so I could arrange an exchange to Germany for the World Cup - then the same activities ended up helping me win my top-choice fellowship.

 

[angelsplight]

Floating jobs are truly miserable. When I graduated a few months ago, I struggled to get interviews even for floater positions and eventually did get a few and was denied. Ended up picking up a FT position for a lower wage at an independent but at least I'm kinda enjoying working. Recently I got another 2 interview calls for floater positions that turned me down already which I found odd as heck but I'm guessing those new floaters they hired bailed within a month but I declined the interview cause I rather keep my minimal stress stress job (I'm one of the very fortunate few with no student loans because family) at a lower pay then work like my friend who complains that he's literally had almost no free time because of all the ridiculous schedule and travel time as a floater.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

lol pre-pharms or current pharm students are hating this post with a passion b/c they are now forced to accept it.

 

[PharmtoCS]

lol pre-pharms or current pharm students are hating this post with a passion b/c they are now forced to accept it.

They'll go through the 5 stages of grief starting with denial. Next follows anger, bargaining, depression, and acceptance.

It brings to mind a few posters on the Pharmacy forum that are new grads or soon to be who don't want to do retail or even residency and have come to terms that they might have to go back to school.

 

[deleted562805]

Floating jobs are truly miserable. When I graduated a few months ago, I struggled to get interviews even for floater positions and eventually did get a few and was denied. Ended up picking up a FT position for a lower wage at an independent but at least I'm kinda enjoying working. Recently I got another 2 interview calls for floater positions that turned me down already which I found odd as heck but I'm guessing those new floaters they hired bailed within a month but I declined the interview cause I rather keep my minimal stress stress job (I'm one of the very fortunate few with no student loans because family) at a lower pay then work like my friend who complains that he's literally had almost no free time because of all the ridiculous schedule and travel time as a floater.

Positive side is you have the chance to something else on the side while you are on that floating job, since you have no loans

 

[PharmtoCS]

The longer version:

Pre-pharmacy

Pharmacist: Don't go into pharmacy.

Student: But pharmacy is my dream!

Pharmacist: Ok, fine. Make sure you choose the cheapest school. Borrow as little as possible. Work while you're in school.

Student: But I want to stay in Southern California! I will apply for hospital jobs.

P2

Student: I just completed my community IPPE. I hate retail!

Pharmacist: Better start bolstering that GPA now. You'll need it for residency.

Student: I better quit my internship and focus on grades!

P4

Student: I didn't match with a residency program!

Pharmacist: Beggars can't be choosers. 70% of the jobs are in retail and you've got a lot of loans there to pay off.

New grad with an offer

New grad: Yay! I got an offer!

Pharmacist: For how much per hour, and how many hours do you get?

New grad: $45 an hour. No guarantee of how many hours. My DM told me usually 32, although some people have been getting as little as 8 per week.

Pharmacist: You can move to a less saturated city.

New grad: Who would ever want to live in [insert flyover city]?!

1 year later

Experienced pharmacist: For $45/hour you really shouldn't be putting in 3 hours of unpaid overtime each shift. You're burning yourself out, and you're putting patient safety at risk by cutting corners like that. How do you manage to give all these flu shots?

New grad: But I want to impress my DM with my hard work! I am hoping to get more hours and hopefully a staff position. I have LOANS!

Experienced pharmacist: This is what happens when you don't listen. You choose to go into a saturated field and pick one of the most expensive schools possible without ever having worked in a pharmacy. You realize that you hate retail only after you're halfway done with school so you gun for a residency which you did not land. Most of the jobs are in retail but even though you hate it, you are desperate to get more hours because you are drowning in $200k+ student loans. You try to impress your DM by cutting corners and putting in more unpaid hours but you are only setting a new normal and making it worse for everyone else. We keep trying to give you real world advice but you keep ignoring it and digging yourself into a deeper hole. I wish you the best of luck trying to climb out of that $200k hole when jobs and opportunities are limited.

tl;dr We keep giving advice to students to reduce their student loan burdens and stand up for themselves and the profession but they keep digging themselves deeper and deeper.

 

[mentos]

But it's my passion!!

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

I feel like those who only want to do clinical/residency are the ones who couldn't go to med school and had to settle for pharmacy lol

 

[TerryTerry]

I feel like those who only want to do clinical/residency are the ones who couldn't go to med school and had to settle for pharmacy lol

schools promote those thing so much during the course though. As the result, they barely prepare students for true pharmacy work settings...

 

[mentos]

schools promote those thing so much during the course though. As the result, they barely prepare students for true pharmacy work settings...

They seriously need to teach them how to use a cash register and pick up the phone. These are skills that most new grads have never done before.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

schools promote those thing so much during the course though. As the result, they barely prepare students for true pharmacy work settings...

I knew nothing about reimbursements, PBMs, and how pharmacy made money in general coming out of school. I'm sure most that work in chain or hospital aren't aware either...

I mean it makes sense from a school's perspective. They don't want the students to find out about it since once they figure it out, they'll realize how jacked up pharmacy world is. So just keep on pushing for clinical knowledge and provider status, hoping that one day they could be like doctors. While doctors don't really care about pharmacists and some don't even know that we have a doctorate degree lol Plus, i'm sure PBMs are funneling millions on schools to keep a lid on these issues. Pharmacists and technicians can complain about how messed up pharmacy is right now all day long but they can't do anything about it if they don't know the reason for it.... They'll just keep on working even if you have to work like a slave.

How is it that the schools don't address the biggest issue in our profession? the fact there are no jobs...

 

[Gombrich12]

I feel like those who only want to do clinical/residency are the ones who couldn't go to med school and had to settle for pharmacy lol

I doubt this is as true as it once was. It's more likely those people end up at DO schools or NP/PA programs these days.

 

[angelsplight]

I feel like those who only want to do clinical/residency are the ones who couldn't go to med school and had to settle for pharmacy lol

Not really. Most of the females in my class chose residency because they heard about how nice of a job it is, being able to sit down and relax all day and it is something you could easily even do while childbearing at get paid a lot. Meanwhile for the guys...Yeah most of those just didn't want to deal with medical school or felt it was too late to go for med already.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

Not really. Most of the females in my class chose residency because they heard about how nice of a job it is, being able to sit down and relax all day and it is something you could easily even do while childbearing at get paid a lot. Meanwhile for the guys...Yeah most of those just didn't want to deal with medical school or felt it was too late to go for med already.

Are you being sarcastic or serious? You can sit and relaxing in your residency? Or you can sit and relax while working at a hospital? Neither are true. Unless youre working at a hospital thats about to bankrupt and close down and you have no work.

i love this “most of my classmate” claims lol well “most of my male classmates” wanted to do residency so they could claim how big of their male genitalia they have lol

 

[angelsplight]

Are you being sarcastic or serious? You can sit and relaxing in your residency? Or you can sit and relax while working at a hospital? Neither are true. Unless youre working at a hospital thats about to bankrupt and close down and you have no work.

i love this “most of my classmate” claims lol well “most of my male classmates” wanted to do residency so they could claim how big of their male genitalia they have lol

Residency is hell but the clinical pharmacist I did my rotations at for 3 hospitals just sat around pretty much all day. The clinical pharmacist only left their seat for lunch, morning rounds and afternoon rounds. Outside of that, yeah they just sat around all day. That may have contributed to why there have been some staff cuts I heard them complain about while I was there. No matter which floor they were assigned to, they just pretty much sat in the computer rooms of those floors. All of those other task such as pain rounds, counseling for new blood thinner medications, grabbing medication list from patient or pharmacies, or asking nurses if a specific requested lab was performed were pretty much always left to the students doing residencies or rotations there. And of course, those pharmacist were usually alumni of the school so that's where some of the students in the class get that idea of how pharmacist positions work at hospitals.