2017 Nontrad Applicants' Progress Thread

[QofQuimica]

I'm in a pickle with two job offers

One is a lab position with a very respectable (top 2 in it's field) institution doing clinical research
and
One is as an associate for one of the most influential medicine distribution non profit (mix of advocacy/fieldwork)

same pay, same benefits, both really great opportunities

idk what to do.

NGO. You already have plenty of research experience, enough to apply MD/PhD even. Branch out; there's a whole world outside the lab. And it will give you a lot more interesting fodder to discuss at interviews than, "hey, guess what, today I went to the lab again. And yesterday, I went to the lab. And two days ago, I...."

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[tetley]

NGO. You already have plenty of research experience, enough to apply MD/PhD even. Branch out; there's a whole world outside the lab. And it will give you a lot more interesting fodder to discuss at interviews than, "hey, guess what, today I went to the lab again. And yesterday, I went to the lab. And two days ago, I...."

I actually considered MD/PhD but I don't know if I can handle 7+ years

I actually reached out to my academic advisor and he said to do NGO for those reasons you gave


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[Gibbward]

Great questions!
I've been a clinical research scientist for years. I have something like 3+ years and over 3,000 hours of lab time. I was kind of itching for a change of pace

Both have flexible schedules, with the lab job easier on taking time off. I also like my lab team, but a lot of them are leaving this summer, so it might be all new faces come August. I know nobody at the NGO, but maybe that's a good thing? Commuting isn't an issue with either because I live close to the lab, and the other job would relocate me to the same distance from their office.

Being an associate, I would do the clinical research on the medicines we are using, and help design things like intervention programs and medical education for providers in our target countries AND do the field work to implement them
On the other hand, the lab offers a big degree of creative freedom for me because I have already done so well there

It really just comes down to the known vs. the unknown

Sounds like you've got a pretty tough decision on your hands! I'd personally take the advocacy job. It'll expand your skill set and it connects pretty nicely to your background in doing clinical research. Plus there's also what Q pointed out. At the end of the day though, which job would you be more motivated to wake up in the morning for?

 

[tetley]

the bar is pretty low, considering that in my pre-medicine career, I used to sigh every morning before entering my office

 

[QofQuimica]

the bar is pretty low, considering that in my pre-medicine career, I used to sigh every morning before entering my office

Try something new. The opportunities to do something off the beaten path like this with basically no repercussions if it doesn't work out are relatively limited for most people because of other life responsibilities. No one will think twice about you doing this for the short term since you're planning to leave anyway for med school. You have nothing to lose.

Interestingly, I sigh every evening before entering the hospital....found out today that a colleague gave notice. You people need to hurry up and finish med school/residency. We are desperate for help here. :-/

 

[banana_phone]

Question, and hoping one of you kind people might be able to help. Pre-Allo scares me.

I withdrew from my Master's in Education program. I just came to the (rather late) realization that a letter from the registrar/dean at that university that indicates I withdrew in good standing might be wise, and is even required for some schools. Would this be something I could submit to interfolio or would it need to be sent directly to AMCAS? Its not exactly an LOR but is listed as such on the GWU and Loyola websites. I'm unsure how to proceed.

 

[banana_phone]

@gribear I would wait and provide that for any school that asks.

I ended up emailing all the admissions offices, so far they have really different responses on what they want. Some don't care for it at all, others require an official letter. It doesn't seem like they consider it an LOR, so I think I can just send it separately to their offices.

I swear, our non-trad applications are so much more complicated. Makes me wish I would have made the decision to be a physician as an undergrad!

But hey, our applications would be a lot less interesting that way.

 

[hurtem&healem]

Since most of us are on to prewriting secondaries, I was hoping for opinions on content.

The schools I am applying to all have some version of the "anything else not addressed on the AMCAS," question. I grew up in a military household and we consistently moved every 3 years or so, including a couple European countries, a Middle Eastern country, time in the Midwest, and finished on the East Coast where I've remained since. I definitely think it had a positive effect on my worldview, but I was really young during the time overseas and it was all very long ago--I will be 34 by the time I matriculate. I have plenty of other examples of being exposed to/working with those from other cultures, etc. already covered on the AMCAS, but only a brief mention of 3 months spent in southeast Asia a few years ago. I know the typical advice is to leave out anything done before "the college years," but where this spans my first 18 years of life, is it noteworthy enough to devote an essay to?

In some instances the essay is optional, so I could just drop it altogether. It is mandatory for a couple, though, and I'm currently at a loss as to what I would write instead. Maybe why I'm compelled to apply to only a handful of schools in a narrow geographic area (my spouse's support network and career), which also explains why I transferred universities in my "Junior" year, but I feel like that's kinda weak, too. Like, "I'm committed to medicine, but only if I can stay local." It's true, but against the "medicine at all costs" mentality a lot of SDN folks espouse as necessary.

What are the rest of you writing for this question? We've all most likely already written about previous careers and how we came to medicine; bringing up old (12+years in my case) crappy grades is typically discouraged... what's left?

 

[tetley]

I heard from a dean that if you have the opportunity and want to explain something you think is an extraordinary circumstance or a challenge that you think helps define you, that is the place to do it. I think if you honestly believe it is a big part of who you are (which it seems like) you would be selling yourself short by NOT putting it down

 

[@Hazel-rah]

• Edit: Moving my question, wrong forum, sorry.

 

[ChrisMack390]

FINALLY marked as complete. I'm pretty annoyed that my first transcript was lost in the mail, but it all comes out in a wash, right?

 

[KaBoom'd]

Another veteran checking in - I held off until my MCAT score came in today. Good luck everyone!

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[Dr. Jan Itor]

Got my MCAT scores in today (518 woohoo!) and have a meeting on Thursday with the school that I'm (hopefully) applying to EDP. Then I can finally submit and stop making changes every other day.

 

[brainnurse]

Got my MCAT scores in today (518 woohoo!) and have a meeting on Thursday with the school that I'm (hopefully) applying to EDP. Then I can finally submit and stop making changes every other day.

Whoooo, awesome score, congratulations!

I'm pretty antsy to get verified since I submitted Day 1, though I know it's wayyyyy early in the cycle. Plus I have a million foreign credits transferred to multiple US schools, so I really don't blame them for taking their time. I can just imagine these verifiers passing my account around saying, "WTF, dude, YOU do this one!" =/

Have to buckle down and create a system for my secondary writing now. I'm kinda looking forward to that part, though. We'll see how I feel in a couple of weeks.

Oh, what kind of deadline are you giving your LoR writers? I have a few last minute attendings who are willing to write me strong letters. I told one end of July. That ok?

 

[Dr. Jan Itor]

Oh, what kind of deadline are you giving your LoR writers? I have a few last minute attendings who are willing to write me strong letters. I told one end of July. That ok?

I asked in January with a deadline of late April. I'm still waiting on 2 of my 5 letter-writers. Of course, the two that I'm waiting on are from professors who taught pre-req courses so they probably know that I don't actually need the letters yet.

 

[brainnurse]

@brainnurse whats up with those wait times for verification? Seems like its taking forever on that thread.

For LOR writers I'd just set an earlier deadlines. As someone that's asked pretty often for professional lors, I'm not going to start working on it until its close to when the requester needs it.

Honestly, I don't know what the normal wait time is. I'm assuming this is pretty standard, though I saw some really early verifications last week. I'd feel weird calling AMCAS when it's only been a week and they don't submit till next week. What do you think?

Also, thanks for the advice on LOR deadlines. I'll set them a tad earlier from now on. I already have several but these are from big wig teaching attendings and I want their letters quite badly, haha.

 

[brainnurse]

I asked in January with a deadline of late April. I'm still waiting on 2 of my 5 letter-writers. Of course, the two that I'm waiting on are from professors who taught pre-req courses so they probably know that I don't actually need the letters yet.

Haha, you and your liiieees! I got my pre-req academic LoRs way early, because I knew they'd be the hardest ones to track down once summer hit.

 

[KaBoom'd]

Have to buckle down and create a system for my secondary writing now. I'm kinda looking forward to that part, though. We'll see how I feel in a couple of weeks.

Has anyone started pre-writing from last year's threads? I'm still basking in the uneasy relief of having submitted primaries.

 

[amber80]

@KaBoom'd I should be but am also taking a break after primaries. I also applied to several that have a decent pre-secondary screening.

I am not working on secondaries. I have put some thoughts down on what I would like to say for any additional information type questions, but that is it.
I have filled out secondaries during a previous application cycle for many of the schools I am reapplying to. So I have been through the process before.


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[hurtem&healem]

Has anyone started pre-writing from last year's threads? I'm still basking in the uneasy relief of having submitted primaries.

I'm applying to a very short list of schools, which I've known for about a year now, so I've known the prompts I'd be writing on basically since they were posted last cycle. Not that I wrote them that long ago or have been actively working on them, but I have been mulling them over every month or two. That made it easy to bang out drafts of most of them within a couple days.

Very few are unique, anyway:
"What have you been doing since filing the AMCAS?" (clinical work, more shadowing, having hobbies )
"How do you add to the diversity of the class?" (I'm aged/experienced)
"What's with the decade+ between your freshman year and finishing undergrad?"
"Anything else we should know?"

Copy, paste, tailor for character limit/subtle difference in wording of prompt. 90% done with first drafts. Though I'm sure there will be massive editing/total rewrites when it comes time to submit.

 

[hurtem&healem]

I have filled out secondaries during a previous application cycle for many of the schools I am reapplying to. So I have been through the process before.

Do you feel the secondaries had a major impact on not getting accepted? Any in particular that you think you totally missed the mark on?

 

[amber80]

Do you feel the secondaries had a major impact on not getting accepted? Any in particular that you think you totally missed the mark on?

I would say that my answers became more refined as I filled out more and more secondaries. Maybe when I re-read the initial ones I thought I could phrase my point in a more palatable way. Also I thought of additional information I could add. Keeping that in mind perhaps one would then fill out one or two secondaries for schools that are not top 5 for you or are reach schools. But it really depends on each individual.
I can't answer if my secondaries had major impact. I would think that varies by school and individual reviewers. All I can say is, do your best, try to weed out any grammar or spelling mistakes. I think your grades and list of activities, MCAT, i.e. your application as a whole is what determines if you are successful. The quality of pool of applicants will also have an impact. In my personal assessment the contents of your primary are more important than the secondary unless there are red flags in the secondary. Again that is just my personal opinion. What I have learned is that the admissions process is a black box. Agonizing over it doesn't change the outcome.

I am pretty confident I know what the main problem with my application was the last time I applied and it was not my secondaries.


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[amber80]

My opinion is that what I do is more important that what I say. As long as what I say in the primary and secondary does not raise concerns or leaves major gaps in my story. To me my grades, MCAT performance, list of activities, and LORs say what I have done. But I am not the adcom .


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[tetley]

I requested my letters starting back in September. The only hold out that I have is my research advisor who has been on grant review the past couple weeks


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[brainnurse]

Verified, yayyy.

 

[Dr. Jan Itor]

My meeting with the admissions department went something like this:

"We strongly recommend against applying EDP."
"What's your MCAT score?"
"Yes! Apply EDP! Go home, hit the submit button, and email me!"



I have never been so nervous to submit something before. The app is getting put away before I find any typos.

 

[brainnurse]

My meeting with the admissions department went something like this:

"We strongly recommend against applying EDP."
"What's your MCAT score?"
"Yes! Apply EDP! Go home, hit the submit button, and email me!"



I have never been so nervous to submit something before. The app is getting put away before I find any typos.

Oh hell yes, that's awesome!

 

[Dr. Jan Itor]

And verified!

 

[mavric1298]

Gahhhhhhh I just found a huge copy/paste error I somehow missed in one of my activities. There is 3 stray words from a deleted sentence, and I only caught it today when I finished copying over from AMCAS to aamcomas. I seriously checked over everything a million times I dunno how I missed that. Is what it is, but that's going to bother me now for the whole cycle. "I swear I'm not careless!"


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[Eccesignum]

Gahhhhhhh I just found a huge copy/paste error I somehow missed in one of my activities. There is 3 stray words from a deleted sentence, and I only caught it today when I finished copying over from AMCAS to aamcomas. I seriously checked over everything a million times I dunno how I missed that. Is what it is, but that's going to bother me now for the whole cycle. "I swear I'm not careless!"


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I think we've all done the same thing Put the application down, don't look at it again til it's time to review it for interviews. You'll only drive yourself bonkers otherwise!

 

[Iz_FtB]

Hi everyone.

Canadian applicant wrapping up a PhD here. Read through the entire thread, you guys are awesome. Really curious how these next few months will play out for all of us!

Submitted my primary last Monday, a bit surprised to see AAMC still dealing with primaries submitted on the opening day. Premeds seriously don't mess around.

 

[QofQuimica]

Don't stress, guys. If you didn't catch it after multiple re-reads, odds are good the adcoms won't either. I guarantee you that no one else is reading your app as closely as you are. And the human brain is pretty amazing in terms of how it fills in the blanks when words are missing without you even being consciously aware of doing it.

 

[tetley]

MCAT done, hallelujah
Apparently I didn't think it was as hard as everyone else. I hope that isn't a sign that I didn't do well

 

[mavric1298]

How you feel about the test doesn't have a good correlation with how you did. There was actually some data that indicated that people that felt badly ended with higher then their predicted scores and vise versa, and the thinking was that the test had answers that inherently have uncomfortable answers, and "trick" comfortable answers. I'll see if I can dig up the info on that, it's been a while since I took it (I believe it was data TPR put together on its students)


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[tetley]

look at this guy, raining down on my parade over here

How you feel about the test doesn't have a good correlation with how you did. There was actually some data that indicated that people that felt badly ended with higher then their predicted scores and vise versa, and the thinking was that the test had answers that inherently have uncomfortable answers, and "trick" comfortable answers. I'll see if I can dig up the info on that, it's been a while since I took it (I believe it was data TPR put together on its students)


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[libahli]

How you feel about the test doesn't have a good correlation with how you did. There was actually some data that indicated that people that felt badly ended with higher then their predicted scores and vise versa, and the thinking was that the test had answers that inherently have uncomfortable answers, and "trick" comfortable answers. I'll see if I can dig up the info on that, it's been a while since I took it (I believe it was data TPR put together on its students)


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This.

I walked out of the exam legitimately thinking I had scored a full 10 points lower than what I ended up getting. Thank goodness I was wrong!

Main reason for my discomfort was the fact that I had become so used to getting my score immediately for all the practice exams I had taken, that when I had to wait longer than 5 minutes for my real score, my perception got completely distorted.

I will say this - I don't envy your waiting! That was probably one of the hardest months of my life, considering the fact that I truly thought I did terribly.

 

[amber80]

Recently heard about the CASPer test that some schools are requiring/recommending this year. And now I am reading that some sort of prep is recommended for it so that you know how to answer the questions. Sigh! Another hoop to jump through. But I have head med school faculty complaining about certain personality traits of current med students and how they would like to assess them.

Then I hear that a lot of people pay for prep for MMI style med school interviews. Another sigh! If I did get interviews this cycle I was going to practice but not pay for prep. But it seems like I may not measure up by self prep.
Anybody else surprised by this? Am I the only one who doesn't know this already?


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[brainnurse]

Recently heard about the CASPer test that some schools are requiring/recommending this year. And now I am reading that some sort of prep is recommended for it so that you know how to answer the questions. Sigh! Another hoop to jump through. But I have head med school faculty complaining about certain personality traits of current med students and how they would like to assess them.

Then I hear that a lot of people pay for prep for MMI style med school interviews. Another sigh! If I did get interviews this cycle I was going to practice but not pay for prep. But it seems like I may not measure up by self prep.
Anybody else surprised by this? Am I the only one who doesn't know this already?


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Ughh, I feel so uncomfortable when practicing interviews. I don't wanna have to pay to feel uncomfortable.

In other news, anyone else feel weird chasing down letter writers because they didn't sign their letter and/or didn't put it on a letterhead?

 

[Labrat07]

Ughh, I feel so uncomfortable when practicing interviews. I don't wanna have to pay to feel uncomfortable.

In other news, anyone else feel weird chasing down letter writers because they didn't sign their letter and/or didn't put it on a letterhead?

How do you know they didn't sigh their letter or put it on a letterhead?? Does interfolio tell you or amcas/aacoma ?

 

[ChrisMack390]

How do you know they didn't sigh their letter or put it on a letterhead?? Does interfolio tell you or amcas/aacoma ?

Interfolio will share this info without compromising the confidentiality of the actual content of the letter.

 

[ChrisMack390]

you can email interfolio and they'll get back to you same day with an answer.

If you are as impatient/anxious as I am, you can call and get an instant answer

 

[banana_phone]

vent moment - I thought I had accurately calculated my AMCAS cGPA, but it dropped by .06 after verification. Probably meaningless, but still stings! Since it brought me from 3.8x to 3.7x , I'm a bit bummed.

Also, AMCAS corrected a TON of my coursework and I can't for the life of me figure out what the corrections were. Anybody else encounter this? I'm tempted to call and ask, because it looks like I'm an idiot who can't enter things correctly when I look at my AMCAS now. For my entire first year of college, they changed my terms to "41" and "42" instead of S1 and S2...

 

[Labrat07]

I'll trade you

Lol, I thought the same thing.

 

[libahli]

vent moment - I thought I had accurately calculated my AMCAS cGPA, but it dropped by .06 after verification. Probably meaningless, but still stings! Since it brought me from 3.8x to 3.7x , I'm a bit bummed.

Also, AMCAS corrected a TON of my coursework and I can't for the life of me figure out what the corrections were. Anybody else encounter this? I'm tempted to call and ask, because it looks like I'm an idiot who can't enter things correctly when I look at my AMCAS now. For my entire first year of college, they changed my terms to "41" and "42" instead of S1 and S2...

AMCAS did the same thing to me re your #2 - basically they changed the term type from the semester system to the 4-1-4 system. They told me it was based on what that college told them and not to worry about it.

I actually called them about something else (because they randomly decided to lower the credits for two classes from three credits each to two credits each - super weird but they're saying that's what they want so whatever).

 

[brainnurse]

If you are as impatient/anxious as I am, you can call and get an instant answer

This. They were pretty forthcoming.

Watch out for AMCAS corrections and make sure your prerequisites are still being met. They "corrected" my transcript and took out my Chem II lab for some reason. I have over 200 credits so I almost missed it. I contacted them and they fixed it within a few days.

 

[Labrat07]

Just got my first secondary (DO)! Kinda feels real now.

Woot, Let's go!!

Comrades,
Don't forget to download the excel @Eccesignum post weeks earlier. It help a lot

 

[Eccesignum]

Woot, Let's go!!

Comrades,
Don't forget to download the excel @Eccesignum post weeks earlier. It help a lot

I'll toss it here again so people don't have to hunt for it.

 

[sunshinefl]

Got my MCAT back yesterday: (1st and only)

508 total--125, 128, 127, 128

Just wanted to share my update with my non-trad friends...

 

[Labrat07]

Got my MCAT back yesterday: (1st and only)

508 total--125, 128, 127, 128

Just wanted to share my update with my non-trad friends...

Congratulation!!

 

[banana_phone]

Question. Does anybody know how secondaries are sent out? I know via email, but do they just send them to the email address we have on file with AAMC? I made a specific email for the application cycle to stay organized, and just updated my AAMC account with this email address. I tried to do it in AMCAS but didn't see a place to do so. Will schools send the secondary to the new email, as its been updating with AAMC and primaries have yet to be sent to schools?