Considering spouse in medical school choice?

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wagonwheel23

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I had an interview with a faculty member on Friday that led to a number of very personal questions about my relationship (partner of 3 years) and whether I would be able to maintain my relationship while becoming a doctor. Yes, it was as uncomfortable as it sounds, and he or she explicitly said that my relationship was destined for failure. I am proud of myself for maintaining my composure, and I can only imagine what his or her report to the admissions committee is going to sound like...

SO, now that this is top of mind, how are you balancing your medical school dreams with the dreams of your spouse/partner? I mean this specifically in regards to location. Is your partner willing to move locations? Would you say no to the medical school that is the best fit for you curriculum/student/faculty wise because the location won't be ideal for your partner? Have you had these kinds of conversations yet?

Thanks everyone. I just can't shake what this faculty member said to me, so I'd love to hear how other people are thinking about it.

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I had an interview with a faculty member on Friday that led to a number of very personal questions about my relationship (partner of 3 years) and whether I would be able to maintain my relationship while becoming a doctor. Yes, it was as uncomfortable as it sounds, and he or she explicitly said that my relationship was destined for failure. I am proud of myself for maintaining my composure, and I can only imagine what his or her report to the admissions committee is going to sound like...

SO, now that this is top of mind, how are you balancing your medical school dreams with the dreams of your spouse/partner? I mean this specifically in regards to location. Is your partner willing to move locations? Would you say no to the medical school that is the best fit for you curriculum/student/faculty wise because the location won't be ideal for your partner? Have you had these kinds of conversations yet?

Thanks everyone. I just can't shake what this faculty member said to me, so I'd love to hear how other people are thinking about it.
Depends on who you're with, how much you care about them, and how important your career is to you. I chose my school largely because I could remain close to my girlfriend and friends, and it just happened to also fit a lot of my other needs. We've made things work by making sure to do the 3.5 hour each way drive once a week to see each other on the weekends (we alternate- one week I'll go down, the next week she'll come up). Many of my classmates haven't been so lucky- I'd say about 50% of their relationships had ended by the end of first year, and now that they had time with their partners over the summer, another batch of relationships seems to be ending. I'd be surprised if 25-30% of us kept things together by the start of third year at this rate. The ones that seem to be surviving are those that either are not long distance, involve marriage/children (but certainly don't get married and have kids just to force yourself to stay with someone lol- most of these are our older, previously married students, not fresh marriages), and those that frequently visit/see their partners. Keep in mind that, even sans medical school, most relationships of people in their early 20s don't end up working out- relationships ending are often a function of life that is simply sped up or exacerbated by the stress of school, but those breakups are ones that would have often happened regardless.
 
I'd challenge you to think about what happened in your interview as being possibly more healthy and supportive than you're making it sound. I'd challenge you to not actually take this interviewers comments personally. If you're still upset, these may feel like ridiculous suggestions, but I encourage you to try.

Yes, absolutely, some interviewers say and do really stupid things. That's one reason it's smart to apply broadly. But it's likely that this interviewer has seen lots of relationships fail in med school, residency and practice. It's likely that she went through that heartache herself. It's possible that she wants to make sure you have a chance to understand the stress that your relationship will be under. It's possible she wants to make sure you know how important it is to have support during med school and residency and that it's therefore extremely important that you take steps to protect your relationship, or to end it if you and your partner are not being realistic or honest with each other about what you're willing to put up with.

Watch the PBS Nova series that followed 7 Harvard med students for 14 years. It should be called "how I wrecked my first (and second and third) marriage" instead of Doctors Diaries. http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/body/doctors-diaries.html. If you're smart (and brave) you'll watch it with your partner.

Best of luck to you.
 
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Thanks @DrMidlife. I think he/she did have my best interests at heart. I simply wasn't expecting the conversation to go that way, so it caught me off guard. I really appreciate your perspective and recommendations!
 
SO, now that this is top of mind, how are you balancing your medical school dreams with the dreams of your spouse/partner? I mean this specifically in regards to location. Is your partner willing to move locations? Would you say no to the medical school that is the best fit for you curriculum/student/faculty wise because the location won't be ideal for your partner? Have you had these kinds of conversations yet?

I'm an MS3, been with my partner for over a decade, and we have one kid. In terms of location, yes, I went with my second choice school because my partner did not want to move to the city of my first choice (due to limited employment options, long horrible winters, far from family). While I loved the curriculum, culture, and teaching hospitals of my first choice, my marriage and partner's happiness were far more important in my equation. So far, no regrets -- I'm at a great school, and my marriage is still intact. :) Likewise, when I apply to residencies next year, my rank list will be heavily weighted towards where my partner would like to be.

And as a side note, my partner actually used to work for one of the doctors featured in the Nova documentary that DrMidlife mentioned, which did influence my perspective...
 
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ms2, long time married w/ kids....one of my classmates lost a marriage already. Large divorce rate in medical life.

I turned down a number of places to put my wife near her family during my school...I'll try the same for residency but you don't really get 100% control over that.... I don't get invited to speak at student panels because I say med school is harmful to families. I view it like chemo.....it can buy you a chance at a new life but you may want to die during the process ;). It will be harder than you think so be sure you are both really, truly on board.
 
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Thanks everyone. I just can't shake what this faculty member said to me, so I'd love to hear how other people are thinking about it.

Every interviewer I've had (7, from 4 schools) has asked me some questions like this. What does my spouse do? What does he think of my plans to go to medical school? How often will we see each other if I attend this school? Do we have/plan to have kids? (Yes, I know they are not supposed to ask that last question. It has not stopped anyone from doing so.)

The first time this happened I was a little annoyed. It seemed too personal, and it felt like they were interviewing my spouse rather than me. The more I thought about it, the more I realized that it is well-intentioned. They do not want students to have an emotional breakdown in the middle of such an expensive education, if they can help it. In the later interviews I was expecting these questions and had (what I think are) good answers.

To the more general question you asked: Originally I intended to apply only to the couple of cities where my husband can work. Once May/June rolled around I wimped out of that approach, because most of the schools in those cities are far far reaches for me, and I so much do not want to go through this process again. I talked it over with my husband and we agreed that I should apply more broadly, and consider schools that are a direct plane flight away, preferably with flights from a low-cost airline. That opened up many, many more possibilities, and I have 8 II right now, spread across the country. I've been very honest with my husband about the interview cycle and my thoughts on each school that I visit. He's open to the possibility that I could pick a "better" school (not necessarily highest ranked) that is relatively far away from him over one that I am not as enthusiastic about that is just an hour or two down the road. The final choice will be a joint decision, based on a lot of factors, but it is good to know that he supports my choice, whatever it will be.
 
Thanks @gyrfalcon. I hope I didn't tank myself with my answers.... I stayed composed and I feel that my thoughts on this matter are relatively realistic (although I was interrupted when giving nearly every answer, so it's hard to say how complete my thoughts came across). But, I suppose I'll find out soon enough.
 
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I had an interview with a faculty member on Friday that led to a number of very personal questions about my relationship (partner of 3 years) and whether I would be able to maintain my relationship while becoming a doctor. Yes, it was as uncomfortable as it sounds, and he or she explicitly said that my relationship was destined for failure. I am proud of myself for maintaining my composure, and I can only imagine what his or her report to the admissions committee is going to sound like...

SO, now that this is top of mind, how are you balancing your medical school dreams with the dreams of your spouse/partner? I mean this specifically in regards to location. Is your partner willing to move locations? Would you say no to the medical school that is the best fit for you curriculum/student/faculty wise because the location won't be ideal for your partner? Have you had these kinds of conversations yet?

Thanks everyone. I just can't shake what this faculty member said to me, so I'd love to hear how other people are thinking about it.
It is unfortunate this was asked because it biases decisions that both the applicant and interviewer might make. Medical school interviewers are actually forbidden to ask these questions, and this interviewer would get into trouble if you made some noise about it.

I went through medical school married, and had three children by the time I was out of training. Hand on heart I will tell you that this career absolutely needs a supportive partner, or the relationship won't last. It takes a VERY secure/selfless partner to weather the training period and/or (hopefully and) a very determined student to shield them from it. I've seen many colleagues with high maintenance partners absolutely struggle when they are made to feel guilty for working. This will be your career, vocation, and hobby for the rest of your life, I promise you. You'll be studying constantly for the next 10 years (the MCAT and medical school are merely the tip of the iceberg; I'm 11 years in and I still have exams this week), you'll be gone a lot, and you'll be tired when you're home.

The best advice I can give you is to make a special effort to recognize your partner's effort at every point--let them know they are appreciated. An applicant is accepted to medical school, but a partner (and family) experience everything the trainee will experience.

Edit: the location of my medical school, residency, fellowship, and first professional posts were all chosen with my partner's preference. That was the least I could do.

Best of luck!
 
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In application cycle currently; my partner and I chose particular areas so that their profession would not be dwindled (mainly due to boards/licensure varying between states) and I could shine. My choice in schools (if I have that opportunity to pick and choose) will have my partner's input also. We already went through this for their profession and now it's my turn; compromising goes both ways! :D
 
It is unfortunate this was asked because it biases decisions that both the applicant and interviewer might make. Medical school interviewers are actually forbidden to ask these questions, and this interviewer would get into trouble if you made some noise about it.

I went through medical school married, and had three children by the time I was out of training. Hand on heart I will tell you that this career absolutely needs a supportive partner, or the relationship won't last. It takes a VERY secure/selfless partner to weather the training period and/or (hopefully and) a very determined student to shield them from it. I've seen many colleagues with high maintenance partners absolutely struggle when they are made to feel guilty for working. This will be your career, vocation, and hobby for the rest of your life, I promise you. You'll be studying constantly for the next 10 years (the MCAT and medical school are merely the tip of the iceberg; I'm 11 years in and I still have exams this week), you'll be gone a lot, and you'll be tired when you're home.

The best advice I can give you is to make a special effort to recognize your partner's effort at every point--let them know they are appreciated. An applicant is accepted to medical school, but a partner (and family) experience everything the trainee will experience.

Edit: the location of my medical school, residency, fellowship, and first professional posts were all chosen with my partner's preference. That was the least I could do.

Best of luck!

My spouse is in business and his schedule is already incredibly difficult and time-consuming. Some exception there with weekends, but even then, he's inundated with emails of "urgency" regularly. I believe busy careers mean that couples/families have to go the extra mile to make things work--a lot of give and take.

Long distance relationships are mostly a big issue for couples, and reasonably so.

If kids are small, well, you better be able to afford a live-in nanny or something like that.

I will not be able to move 3,000 miles away to attend MS. It just wouldn't make sense for at least a dozen reasons. As a non-trad in a long-term, committed relationship, we have to be reasonable, but we also have to be willing to make some compromises. I don't really look at this question as much different from if you have a child, and say, for IDK, a court-appointed reason, the parent could NOT take the child away to MS with them. So, then what is the parent going to do? The parent is going to apply to schools close to where the child must stay. When you are married, you have started a family, period--children or not. At least that's the way I look at it. I made that commitment well before any other, and so did my husband. There's no guarantees on anything, and I do know of some long-distance couples/families that somehow manage to make it work. I think they are the exception and not the rule. I also know a number that have tried it, and the "experiment" was a miserable failure.

About them asking the question in the first place, this sounds quite familiar to another question that was deemed inappropriate by people and would also be deemed as unallowable for a job interview--at least within my region. I think if the interviewee mentioned the situation in the first place, they can get away with it--at least apparently med school adcom people can. I have no idea why they are allowed to get away with it, but whatever. Sometimes they do ask questions that are on the side of things that I would, out of an abundance of caution, just move past--such as focusing on gender or sexual orientation or religion or marriage/relationship status. Those areas fall under the "It's really no one's business unless I make it so," and "Do you ask the same question of those of the other gender? " Safest bet is to avoid these kinds of questions altogether, but apparently according to some people here at SDN, adcoms get some extra leeway it seems.

The original question or even similar ones are not necessarily bad questions to ask, it's just that to me, they should come before an applicant has interviewed. I mean, it's a good reason why there are places like SDN to discuss these things ahead of time and reflect on them. I just don't think they are appropriate for interviews b/c they cross boundaries--and it's really not the interviewer's job to play, "Have you thought about how this is going to affect your personal life or whatever kind of questions?" By the time the applicant reaches the interview process, this should be settled, and it's not for anyone else to step into those personal boundary areas at that time. The applicant has made their decision--even w/o the fullness of deliberation that they should have taken. If they have not, that is something they will have to work out. You will not have every applicant sort out every thing in their lives in order to evaluate if they are perfect or near perfect or better applicants than others. It's not a therapy session, it's an interview. You don't go into personal areas during professional interviews, and this should not be any different from graduate school application. Employers stand to lose money too when they have applicants that have unresolved personal issues than can affect the job. In fact, they aren't being paid to take on the employee, and it's a lose situation for them often enough when there are such conflicts. Nevertheless, employers are not permitted to get into these areas upon interview.
 
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