Could someone clarify internship/residency for me?

[circulus vitios]

From my understanding you apply to residency programs your fourth year of medical school. Residency lasts from 3-7 years with the option of doing a fellowship in your given field. Internship is one year in length, and is before residency. Does internship year count towards one of your residency years? Is a "5 year general surgery residency" 1 year of internship + 4 years residency? Or 1 year internship + 5 residency?

Could someone better explain preliminary surgery/medicine years? I've read they can be used as a stepping stone into general surgery or emergency medicine as a PGY-2 (after you complete that preliminary year) if you don't match into those fields (and didn't manage to get a spot in the scramble)?

Thanks.

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[LizzyM]

You've pretty much got it; the first year after medical school is the first year of residency also known as the internship year or PGY1 (post-graduate year 1).

Some specialties including anesthesiology, radiology, neurology, and psychiatry and some of the surgical subspecialties (ophthomology, etc) may require a preliminary year during which you become more experienced with the basics of medicine and /or surgery before beginning residency.

 

[Law2Doc]

Could someone better explain preliminary surgery/medicine years? I've read they can be used as a stepping stone into general surgery or emergency medicine as a PGY-2 (after you complete that preliminary year) if you don't match into those fields (and didn't manage to get a spot in the scramble)?

Thanks.

Just to clarify what Lizzy said and try to correct the above statement of the OP, the preliminary year is not exactly what you describe. A number of specialties (all of the ROAD specialties, neurology, etc) are what is known as "advanced" residencies, meaning you match into them during the match in March of your fourth year, but are required to do a year of medicine or surgery first before you can begin -- they will only take you as a second year resident. So you must first complete a preliminary year which you also apply to and try to match into during the same match. (Yes it means going on two sets of interviews). So no, generally you aren't shooting for a preliminary year if you don't match or through the scramble, you are shooting for one because you do match into an advanced program and need to do your PGY-1 year first. So no these aren't so much "fallback" positions as things you are lining up intentionally because your ultimate target program requires it. To muddy the waters, there are also "transitional" year programs which are less intensive and designed to let undecided folks test the waters in a number of fields, but these tend to get snapped up by the top folks going into the ROAD specialties because they tend to be a more cushy way to spend the year.

 

[circulus vitios]

Just to clarify what Lizzy said and try to correct the above statement of the OP, the preliminary year is not exactly what you describe. A number of specialties (all of the ROAD specialties, neurology, etc) are what is known as "advanced" residencies, meaning you match into them during the match in March of your fourth year, but are required to do a year of medicine or surgery first before you can begin -- they will only take you as a second year resident. So you must first complete a preliminary year which you also apply to and try to match into during the same match. (Yes it means going on two sets of interviews). So no, generally you aren't shooting for a preliminary year if you don't match or through the scramble, you are shooting for one because you do match into an advanced program and need to do your PGY-1 year first. So no these aren't so much "fallback" positions as things you are lining up intentionally because your ultimate target program requires it. To muddy the waters, there are also "transitional" year programs which are less intensive and designed to let undecided folks test the waters in a number of fields, but these tend to get snapped up by the top folks going into the ROAD specialties because they tend to be a more cushy way to spend the year.

But they can be treated as fall backs, correct? One of my fears is not getting into a residency I want.

 

[Perrotfish]

Slight correction: the shortest residencies are 2 years after Internship. You can be clear of your training pipeline in 3 years if you want FP or primary care.

 

[circulus vitios]

General surgery residency is five years total, correct? 1 year internship + 4 years residency? Or 1 year internship + 5 years residency?

 

[LizzyM]

For the love of God, man. Would you worry about getting into medical school first and worry about getting the residency of your choice a few years down the road.

You are spending too much time and psychic energy on something that could change 5 times before you are at the point where you need to take a decision.

 

[Law2Doc]

But they can be treated as fall backs, correct? One of my fears is not getting into a residency I want.

As Lizzy suggested, there is no reason to fear not getting into a residency you want until you even get to med school and get a better sense of what you want. What you think you'll like you may not, and vice versa -- nearly everybody changes their mind at least once.

While folks who are applying to competitive residencies that require preliminary programs sometimes end up with just the prelim program, that should never really be the goal or regarded as a desirable fallback. Good feedback from deans and mentors, and heavy-handed advising, usually will steer you away from residency choices where you won't have a good shot at matching. If you think you aren't going to match, then no, you don't usually apply to a prelim program; it's usually smarter to not apply and spend a year researching and improving your stats.

 

[Pedsbro]

For the love of God, man. Would you worry about getting into medical school first and worry about getting the residency of your choice a few years down the road.

Seriously, one thing at a time...

And it's 5 years (for most programs). 1 internship year +4 additional years of residency. This AMA website should warm your heart and keep you busy for hours... http://www0.ama-assn.org/vapp/freida/spcindx/0,,TR,00.html

 

[circulus vitios]

For the love of God, man. Would you worry about getting into medical school first and worry about getting the residency of your choice a few years down the road.

You are spending too much time and psychic energy on something that could change 5 times before you are at the point where you need to take a decision.

I'm paranoid so I can just see myself messing up on my USMLE/COMLEX exams and getting stuck in a specialty I really don't like for the rest of my life. I really need to lighten up, right.