David Newman allegations

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thank you....I was on my phone earlier and couldn't figure out how to link this. It's one of the most useful things ever put on youtube

As an aside, my wife is an attorney and her line verbatum is:

"If I ever go missing, and the police knock on your door and want to talk to you, and you do so without a lawyer, then I am going to kick your ass when I turn up."

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One of my best friends is the prosecuting attorney for our home town. He is pals with and fond of the police force. Nevertheless, he tells me that if the police ever want to question me I should clam up tight. "It'll be really uncomfortable, but it's what you should do."

Dr. Newman's silence is not a demonstration of guilt. It's a demonstration of prudence.
 
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As an aside, my wife is an attorney and her line verbatum is:

"If I ever go missing, and the police knock on your door and want to talk to you, and you do so without a lawyer, then I am going to kick your ass when I turn up."
Yep....pretty much my name and "I'm sorry but I'll need to speak with my representation first"
 
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Yep....pretty much my name and "I'm sorry but I'll need to speak with my representation first"

I'm supposedly the bleeding heart liberal of the forum (it's a touch of a mischaracterisation) but even I know not to talk to police unless I'm reporting a crime. Family of criminal defense attorneys. I learned really early the sort of **** that they will do if they presume you are guilty. My father saw half of "making a murderer" and just stopped and said "this is all pretty normal for the police in a criminal case". He was completely non plussed ans had seen it all before, and that's a documentary about police planting evidence and falsifying their way through a court case.
 
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I'm supposedly the bleeding heart liberal of the forum (it's a touch of a mischaracterisation) but even I know not to talk to police unless I'm reporting a crime. Family of criminal defense attorneys. I learned really early the sort of **** that they will do if they presume you are guilty. My father saw half of "making a murderer" and just stopped and said "this is all pretty normal for the police in a criminal case". He was completely non plussed ans had seen it all before, and that's a documentary about police planting evidence and falsifying their way through a court case.
I didn't click on the youtube link in this thread because I've already seen that talk 5-6 times but the lawyer speaking wraps up with a former cop who is now an attny that says the exact same thing....he's literally telling people, "you cannot trust us at all, shutup and stop talking"
 
You really should stop. You clearly don't understand how the law works.

Care to explain your interpretation of the law beyond just saying he should keep his mouth shut? If he is innocent, and his lawyer simply said "these allegations are baseless and when the evidence comes to light I will be exonerated", how would that negatively affect him assuming there is none of his semen anywhere and he really did nothing wrong? To be clear I'm not saying he should talk to the police, smear the victim or go off on some crazy YouTube or podcast rant, but a carefully crafted statement of innocence through his lawyer. And if he did do something wrong then I agree with you all, he should stfu.
 
Care to explain your interpretation of the law beyond just saying he should keep his mouth shut? If he is innocent, and his lawyer simply said "these allegations are baseless and when the evidence comes to light I will be exonerated", how would that negatively affect him assuming there is none of his semen anywhere and he really did nothing wrong? To be clear I'm not saying he should talk to the police, smear the victim or go off on some crazy YouTube or podcast rant, but a carefully crafted statement of innocence through his lawyer. And if he did do something wrong then I agree with you all, he should stfu.

I can see the NY Daily News headline now:

"Prominent NYC doctor says victim's claims are 'baseless'. Indicates that 'evidence will come to light' before bragging 'I will be exonerated' but refuses to answer further questions or reply to requests for comment."
 
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Why say anything at all, and risk the chance of incriminating yourself...less is more. As Marlon Brando would have it...its best to be deaf, dumb and blind...until your lawyered up and/or in court.
 
Care to explain your interpretation of the law beyond just saying he should keep his mouth shut? If he is innocent, and his lawyer simply said "these allegations are baseless and when the evidence comes to light I will be exonerated", how would that negatively affect him assuming there is none of his semen anywhere and he really did nothing wrong? To be clear I'm not saying he should talk to the police, smear the victim or go off on some crazy YouTube or podcast rant, but a carefully crafted statement of innocence through his lawyer. And if he did do something wrong then I agree with you all, he should stfu.
Here's the thing you don't seem to understand. He can't win this (at least in the court of public opinion). That battle is lost. He can only lose more or less at this point. Shutting up prevents him from losing more. That's the best he can hope for.
 
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Care to explain your interpretation of the law beyond just saying he should keep his mouth shut? If he is innocent, and his lawyer simply said "these allegations are baseless and when the evidence comes to light I will be exonerated", how would that negatively affect him assuming there is none of his semen anywhere and he really did nothing wrong? To be clear I'm not saying he should talk to the police, smear the victim or go off on some crazy YouTube or podcast rant, but a carefully crafted statement of innocence through his lawyer. And if he did do something wrong then I agree with you all, he should stfu.

No. Others have adequately explained it. If you haven't changed your opinion yet, you clearly just aren't going to "get it."
 
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I'm supposedly the bleeding heart liberal of the forum (it's a touch of a mischaracterisation) but even I know not to talk to police unless I'm reporting a crime.

I may be competing for this role, now that I violated my policy of refusing to talk politics on the forum.

I just watched the video. It was excellent, and I must admit, that I learned a lot from it. The police officer was also very helpful, and he said two really profound things:

1) The tendency of speaking to interrupt periods of silence.
2) The fact that even though our law functions based on "innocent until proven guilty," the reality is that most average people start from the converse: "guilty until proven innocent." Already this is the case for Dr. David Newman. Right now, "things look bad" for him, and the semen sample "will exonerate him." So, in the public eye, he is guilty until proven innocent... which sucks. It means that if you are accused of something, you're already screwed, no matter what.
 
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I may be competing for this role, now that I violated my policy of refusing to talk politics on the forum.

I just watched the video. It was excellent, and I must admit, that I learned a lot from it. The police officer was also very helpful, and he said two really profound things:

1) The tendency of speaking to interrupt periods of silence.
2) The fact that even though our law functions based on "innocent until proven guilty," the reality is that most average people start from the converse: "guilty until proven innocent." Already this is the case for Dr. David Newman. Right now, "things look bad" for him, and the semen sample "will exonerate him." So, in the public eye, he is guilty until proven innocent... which sucks. It means that if you are accused of something, you're already screwed, no matter what.
 
I’m an OK surgeon now but almost never got a chance, since I nearly got fired as a resident.

22 y.o. AA male GSW x 3 to the back. CXR with maybe some haze in the LLL. Lines placed. O2 mask on, tachycardic but who wouldn’t be? I’m zoned in on a couple of sketchy B.P.’s, hemodynamic instability in the setting of penetrating injury to the back being an absolute indication for laparotomy. The bullets couldn’t have hit the aorta or an iliacs, if so the guy would be dead by now, so I’m thinking low pressure retroperitoneal injury? Renal vein? Spleen? Something in zone III? a mesenteric vessel? ****. New, young ER attending in a white button down oxford shirt and a tie wants to put in a left chest tube. Massive hemothorax ain’t the problem, the volume of blood that you would need to give you hypovolemic shock parked in the thorax won’t give you that x-ray but whatever, my PGY2 he needs the practice, so I tell him to prep.

It’s more than the usual degree of chaos, even for 1am at Luke’s. The guy had been shot by the cops so blue waves keep crashing into the trauma bay door requiring regular dispersement. Not that the cops give the impression of actually giving a ****, it’s December of 2004, Ferguson is a decade away and this was in the days when cops still shot young black guys in Harlem because it was part of their job description. Still they were curious to see just what type of paperwork was going to have to be filled out. Patient himself seemed to be opting for the form that didn’t have a time of death on it. The lad is definitely showing bit more spunk than you would expect from someone en-route to his reward via exsanguination but sometimes they can fool you. The other guests to the party were some nurses, my team of exhausted pissed-off surgical residents wishing they were anywhere except responding to a trauma call with me as the chief, and the ER team, maybe six of them all delighted for a distraction from asthma attacks, UTI’s and drug seekers, hoping to see something like on TV and lead by that tense looking attending in the white button down oxford and tie, looking like a guy from NASA in the 60s.

Oxford shirt dude is now standing at the foot of the bed, Pete’s on patient’s left giving some lidocaine at the 5th intercostal space and posterior axillary line getting ready to put the chest tube in and I’m standing behind Pete trying to figure out what happens next. I’m the senior surgeon in the room, closest surgical attending is maybe half and hour away and if we’ve got to do an emergent exploratory laparotomy it’s my problem and frankly I’d rather pass. It would be nice to think my conservative stance was on account of higher principles, a wish to spare homeboy a big midline incision, a lifetime of adhesions and a few days in house getting over his ileus but in reality I just wanted to get back to sleep. My two year old is not all that into sleeping and my wife nine months pregnant is not all that into not being grouchy. I’d been working all day and had to be in the OR all the next day. Yup, this was when things sucked but not in the “crap I’ll be home tonight at 5:30 rather than 4:30 and have to cut short my time at the gym” sucked, or in the “it’s so difficult to decide, should we ditch the kids and go to Santiago or London next month honey?” sucked, but in the “when will this **** end and how can I get another twenty minutes of sleep” way. Perhaps you can relate? Anyways, an unnecessary ex-lap might not be doing shot-guy any favors but it would ruin my night for sure. So when oxford-shirt-with-tie ER attending calls for a couple mg of morphine to be given IV to spare the patient a bit of discomfort from the chest tube insertion I say I’d rather skip it. Morphine can cause a transient drop in blood pressure and another couple low BP’s on the monitor and I’m obliged to open this guy up (and stay awake for another couple of hours) so I’d rather not have it on board confounding the situation.

Most ER guys differ to the surgeons, after all, they have only the haziest idea of what happens once the patient leaves the trauma bay, understand their limitations and sensibly stay out of the way. But this guy is different; he has his own ideas, probably went to a lecture recently on “pain being the sixth vital sign” or some such bull**** and he says “I’m going to give morphine.” This gets my attention, I explain, quickly, why this is bad idea. 3 minutes of pain from the chest tube insertion vs dropping the blood pressure and forcing my hand to do an exploratory laparotomy based on information confounded by narcotic is an easy decision. “Better not” I say. Unbelievably, he is not dissuaded, his team is looking on and he takes a stand. He tells me he’s the attending physician, he is board certified, he is in charge of this patient while the patient is in the ER and he is going to give the morphine.

It is at this point that certain things are alleged. The surgical team is on record that in calm and respectful tones their chief guided the care of the patient with a graceful firm and steady hand to it’s successful conclusion. Bless them. Meanwhile, the ER team over the ensuing days spilled a fair amount of ink all alleging this and alleging that. Something to the effect that allegedly the senior surgeon at the trauma told the attending emergency medicine physician in the white short sleeved oxford that each was the same amount of time out of medical school with the only difference between the two being that one had done a short residency and one had not. That the ER attending's lack of judgment was a threat to this patient, and that therefore the ER attending should get **** out of this trauma bay and find someone with an earache to treat before he hurt somebody. It is agreed upon by all parties that at about this point the ER attending dismissed the senior surgical resident from the case ordering the surgical resident to leave the area at which point it has been alleged that the senior surgical resident inquired as to weather said ER attending possessed the skill set to open the abdomen or chest and control an exsanguinating injury? Furthermore it has been alleged that the senior surgeon then pointed out that since dismissing the only person currently in the hospital with the ability to treat this potentially life threatening injury would be equivalent to murder, perhaps the ER attending should just go borrow one of the cops guns and shoot the patient himself and get it over with. It has also been alleged that the when the attending in the short sleeved white shirt, now bright red in the face, insisted that he was the physician in charge of the care of the patients in his emergency room and physically attempted to give the morphine via the IV, the senior surgeon in the room, who was six inches taller and 50 pounds heavier than him and had played a whole lot of college rugby positioned his body in such a manner to make such actions impossible and, it has been alleged, in doing so threw a body block that nearly knocked the ER attending over.

The chest tube returned nothing. The BP’s stabilized and later we learned that the gun shot wounds that we thought we were seeing were really fragments from the frangilble bullets that NYC cops use. These bullets are designed to break apart when they miss their target so as to cause minimal damage when they ricochet off things. The guy went home/to jail the next day.

With that trauma over the next one began. Young white-short-sleeved-oxford guy screamed for blood. He demanded dismissal of the surgical resident, he demanded that the medical board launch an investigation, he demanded formal sanctions, he demanded the senior surgical resident be banned from the ER. He got a lot of snickering from the Department of Surgery and a dripping letter of apology.

So why bring this up?

David Newman was the guy I had to push out of the way. He was a wanker then, he's a wanker now.
 
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I may be competing for this role, now that I violated my policy of refusing to talk politics on the forum.

I just watched the video. It was excellent, and I must admit, that I learned a lot from it. The police officer was also very helpful, and he said two really profound things:

1) The tendency of speaking to interrupt periods of silence.
2) The fact that even though our law functions based on "innocent until proven guilty," the reality is that most average people start from the converse: "guilty until proven innocent." Already this is the case for Dr. David Newman. Right now, "things look bad" for him, and the semen sample "will exonerate him." So, in the public eye, he is guilty until proven innocent... which sucks. It means that if you are accused of something, you're already screwed, no matter what.
I've talked to a few colleagues about the allegations against Dr. Newman. In at least two cases, the physician hadn't heard anything of the allegations until we discussed it. Interesting, they almost automatically assumed he was guilty.
 
I’m an OK surgeon now but almost never got a chance, since I nearly got fired as a resident.

22 y.o. AA male GSW x 3 to the back. CXR with maybe some haze in the LLL. Lines placed. O2 mask on, tachycardic but who wouldn’t be? I’m zoned in on a couple of sketchy B.P.’s. hemodynamic instability in the setting of penetrating injury to the back being an absolute indication for laparotomy. The bullets couldn’t have hit the aorta or an iliacs, if so the guy would be dead by now, so I’m thinking low pressure retroperitoneal injury? Renal vein? Spleen? Something in zone III? a mesenteric vessel? ****. New, young ER attending in a white button down oxford shirt and a tie wants to put in a left chest tube. Massive hemothorax ain’t the problem, the volume of blood that you would need to give you hypovolemic shock parked in the thorax won’t give your that x-ray but what whatever, My PGY2 he needs the practice, so I tell him to prep.

It’s more than the usual degree of chaos, even for 1am at Luke’s. The guy had been shot by the cops so the usual blue waves keep crashing into the trauma bay door requiring regular dispersement. Not that the cops give the impression of actually giving a ****, it’s December of 2004, Ferguson is a decade away and this was in the days when cops still shot young black guys in Harlem because it was part of their job description. Still they were curious to see just what type of paperwork was going to have to be filled out. Patient himself seemed to be opting for the form that didn’t have a time of death on it. The lad is definitely showing bit more spunk than you would expect from someone en-route to his reward via exsanguination into his belly, his thorax or his retroperitioneam but sometimes they can fool you. The other guests to the party were some nurses, my team of exhausted pissed-off surgical residents who wishing they were anywhere except responding to a trauma call with me as the Chief, and the ER team, maybe six of them all delighted for a distraction from asthma attacks, UTI’s and drug seekers, hoping to get to see something like on TV and lead by that tense looking attending in the white button down oxford and tie. Looking like a guy from NASA in the 60s.

Oxford shirt dude is now standing at the foot of the bed, Pete’s on patient’s left giving some lidocaine at the 5th intercostal space and posterior axillary line getting ready to put the chest tube in and I’m standing behind Pete trying to figure out what happens next. I’m the senior surgeon in the room, closest surgical attending is maybe half and hour away and if we’ve got to do an emergent exploratory laparotomy it’s my problem and frankly I’d rather pass. It would be nice to think my conservative stance was on account of higher principles, a wish to spare homeboy a big midline incision, a lifetime of adhesions and a few days in house getting over his ileus but in reality I just wanted to get back to sleep. Katherine is two and not all that into sleeping, Angela nine months pregnant and not all that into not being grouchy, I’d been working all day and had to be in the OR all the next day. Yup, this was when things sucked but not in the “crap I’ll be home tonight at 5:30 rather than 4:30 and have to cut short my time at the gym” sucked, or in the “it’s so difficult to decide, should we ditch the kids and go to Santiago or London next month honey?” sucked, but in the “when will this **** end and how can I get another twenty minutes of sleep” way. Perhaps you can relate? Anyways, an unnecessary ex-lap might not be doing shot-guy any favors but, it would ruin the night for sure. So when oxford-shirt-with-tie ER attending calls for a couple mg of morphine to be given IV to spare the patient a bit of discomfort from the chest tube insertion I say I’d rather skip it. Morphine can cause a transient drop in blood pressure and another couple low BP’s on the monitor and I’m obliged to open this guy up (and stay awake for another couple of hours) so I’d rather not have the it on board confounding the situation.

Most ER guys differ to the surgeons, after all, they have only the haziest idea of what happens once the patient leaves the trauma bay, understand their limitations and sensibly stay out of the way. But this guy is different; he has his own ideas, probably went to a lecture recently on “pain being the sixth vital sign” or some such bull**** and he says “I’m going to give morphine.” This gets my attention, I explain, quickly, why this is bad idea. 3 minutes of pain from the chest tube insertion vs dropping the blood pressure and forcing my hand to do an exploratory laparotomy based on information confounded by narcotic is an easy decision. “Better not” I say. Unbelievably, he is not dissuaded, his team is looking on and he takes a stand. He tells me he’s the attending physician, he is board certified, he is in charge of this patient while the patient is in the ER and he is going to give the morphine.

It is at this point that certain things are become alleged. The surgical team is on record that in calm and respectful tones their chief guided the care of the patient with a graceful firm and steady hand to it’s successful conclusion. Bless them. Meanwhile, the ER team over the ensuing days spilled a fair amount of ink all alleging this and alleging that. Something to the effect that allegedly the senior surgeon at the trauma allegedly told the attending emergency medicine physician in the white short sleeved oxford that were each the same amount of time out of medical school the only difference being the two was that one had done a short, easy residency. That his that his lack of judgment was threat to this patient, and that the ER attending should get **** out of this trauma bay and find someone with an earache to treat before he hurt somebody. It is agreed upon by all parties that at some point the ER attending dismissed the senior surgical resident from the case ordering the surgical resident leave the area at which point it has been alleged that the senior surgical resident inquired if said ER attending possessed the skill set to open the abdomen or chest and control an exsanguinating injury? Furthermore it has been alleged that the senior surgeon then pointed out that since dismissing the only person currently in the hospital with the skill set to treat this potential life threatening injury would be equivalent to murder, perhaps the ER attending should just go borrow one of the cops guns and shoot the patient himself and get it over with. It has also been alleged that the when the attending in the short sleeved white shirt, now bright red in the face, insisted that he was the physician in charge of the care of the patients in his emergency room and physically attempted to give the morphine via the IV, the senior surgeon in the room, who was six inches taller and 50 pounds heavier than him and had captained his college rugby team positioned his body in such a manner to make such actions impossible and, it has been alleged, in doing so threw a body block that nearly knocked the ER attending over.

The chest tube returned nothing. The BP’s stabilized and later we learned that the gun shot wounds that we thought we were seeing were really fragments from the frangilble bullets that NYC cops use. These bullets are designed to break apart when they miss their target so as to cause minimal damage when they ricochet off things. The guy went home/to jail the next day.

With that trauma over the next one began. Young white short-sleeved oxford guy screamed for blood. He demanded dismissal of the surgical resident, he demanded that the medical board launch an investigation, he demanded formal sanctions, he demanded the senior surgical resident be banned from the ER. He got a lot of snickering from the Department of Surgery and a dripping letter of apology

So why bring this up?

David Newman was the guy I had to push out of the way. News story comes as little surprise to me.

Ummm... Since David Newman is not here to defend himself, this is hardly the time or place for this. Pretty inappropriate in my opinion.
 
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I’m an OK surgeon now but almost never got a chance, since I nearly got fired as a resident.

22 y.o. AA male GSW x 3 to the back. CXR with maybe some haze in the LLL. Lines placed. O2 mask on, tachycardic but who wouldn’t be? I’m zoned in on a couple of sketchy B.P.’s. hemodynamic instability in the setting of penetrating injury to the back being an absolute indication for laparotomy. The bullets couldn’t have hit the aorta or an iliacs, if so the guy would be dead by now, so I’m thinking low pressure retroperitoneal injury? Renal vein? Spleen? Something in zone III? a mesenteric vessel? ****. New, young ER attending in a white button down oxford shirt and a tie wants to put in a left chest tube. Massive hemothorax ain’t the problem, the volume of blood that you would need to give you hypovolemic shock parked in the thorax won’t give your that x-ray but what whatever, My PGY2 he needs the practice, so I tell him to prep.

It’s more than the usual degree of chaos, even for 1am at Luke’s. The guy had been shot by the cops so the usual blue waves keep crashing into the trauma bay door requiring regular dispersement. Not that the cops give the impression of actually giving a ****, it’s December of 2004, Ferguson is a decade away and this was in the days when cops still shot young black guys in Harlem because it was part of their job description. Still they were curious to see just what type of paperwork was going to have to be filled out. Patient himself seemed to be opting for the form that didn’t have a time of death on it. The lad is definitely showing bit more spunk than you would expect from someone en-route to his reward via exsanguination into his belly, his thorax or his retroperitioneam but sometimes they can fool you. The other guests to the party were some nurses, my team of exhausted pissed-off surgical residents who wishing they were anywhere except responding to a trauma call with me as the Chief, and the ER team, maybe six of them all delighted for a distraction from asthma attacks, UTI’s and drug seekers, hoping to get to see something like on TV and lead by that tense looking attending in the white button down oxford and tie. Looking like a guy from NASA in the 60s.

Oxford shirt dude is now standing at the foot of the bed, Pete’s on patient’s left giving some lidocaine at the 5th intercostal space and posterior axillary line getting ready to put the chest tube in and I’m standing behind Pete trying to figure out what happens next. I’m the senior surgeon in the room, closest surgical attending is maybe half and hour away and if we’ve got to do an emergent exploratory laparotomy it’s my problem and frankly I’d rather pass. It would be nice to think my conservative stance was on account of higher principles, a wish to spare homeboy a big midline incision, a lifetime of adhesions and a few days in house getting over his ileus but in reality I just wanted to get back to sleep. Katherine is two and not all that into sleeping, Angela nine months pregnant and not all that into not being grouchy, I’d been working all day and had to be in the OR all the next day. Yup, this was when things sucked but not in the “crap I’ll be home tonight at 5:30 rather than 4:30 and have to cut short my time at the gym” sucked, or in the “it’s so difficult to decide, should we ditch the kids and go to Santiago or London next month honey?” sucked, but in the “when will this **** end and how can I get another twenty minutes of sleep” way. Perhaps you can relate? Anyways, an unnecessary ex-lap might not be doing shot-guy any favors but, it would ruin the night for sure. So when oxford-shirt-with-tie ER attending calls for a couple mg of morphine to be given IV to spare the patient a bit of discomfort from the chest tube insertion I say I’d rather skip it. Morphine can cause a transient drop in blood pressure and another couple low BP’s on the monitor and I’m obliged to open this guy up (and stay awake for another couple of hours) so I’d rather not have the it on board confounding the situation.

Most ER guys differ to the surgeons, after all, they have only the haziest idea of what happens once the patient leaves the trauma bay, understand their limitations and sensibly stay out of the way. But this guy is different; he has his own ideas, probably went to a lecture recently on “pain being the sixth vital sign” or some such bull**** and he says “I’m going to give morphine.” This gets my attention, I explain, quickly, why this is bad idea. 3 minutes of pain from the chest tube insertion vs dropping the blood pressure and forcing my hand to do an exploratory laparotomy based on information confounded by narcotic is an easy decision. “Better not” I say. Unbelievably, he is not dissuaded, his team is looking on and he takes a stand. He tells me he’s the attending physician, he is board certified, he is in charge of this patient while the patient is in the ER and he is going to give the morphine.

It is at this point that certain things are become alleged. The surgical team is on record that in calm and respectful tones their chief guided the care of the patient with a graceful firm and steady hand to it’s successful conclusion. Bless them. Meanwhile, the ER team over the ensuing days spilled a fair amount of ink all alleging this and alleging that. Something to the effect that allegedly the senior surgeon at the trauma allegedly told the attending emergency medicine physician in the white short sleeved oxford that were each the same amount of time out of medical school the only difference being the two was that one had done a short, easy residency. That his that his lack of judgment was threat to this patient, and that the ER attending should get **** out of this trauma bay and find someone with an earache to treat before he hurt somebody. It is agreed upon by all parties that at some point the ER attending dismissed the senior surgical resident from the case ordering the surgical resident leave the area at which point it has been alleged that the senior surgical resident inquired if said ER attending possessed the skill set to open the abdomen or chest and control an exsanguinating injury? Furthermore it has been alleged that the senior surgeon then pointed out that since dismissing the only person currently in the hospital with the skill set to treat this potential life threatening injury would be equivalent to murder, perhaps the ER attending should just go borrow one of the cops guns and shoot the patient himself and get it over with. It has also been alleged that the when the attending in the short sleeved white shirt, now bright red in the face, insisted that he was the physician in charge of the care of the patients in his emergency room and physically attempted to give the morphine via the IV, the senior surgeon in the room, who was six inches taller and 50 pounds heavier than him and had captained his college rugby team positioned his body in such a manner to make such actions impossible and, it has been alleged, in doing so threw a body block that nearly knocked the ER attending over.

The chest tube returned nothing. The BP’s stabilized and later we learned that the gun shot wounds that we thought we were seeing were really fragments from the frangilble bullets that NYC cops use. These bullets are designed to break apart when they miss their target so as to cause minimal damage when they ricochet off things. The guy went home/to jail the next day.

With that trauma over the next one began. Young white short-sleeved oxford guy screamed for blood. He demanded dismissal of the surgical resident, he demanded that the medical board launch an investigation, he demanded formal sanctions, he demanded the senior surgical resident be banned from the ER. He got a lot of snickering from the Department of Surgery and a dripping letter of apology

So why bring this up?

David Newman was the guy I had to push out of the way. News story comes as little surprise to me.
"I once got in an argument with this guy, so he obviously ejaculated into the face of his patient."
 
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Whether inappropriate or not...that surgeons ability to keep a reader engaged and on his tippy toes must be acknowledged :)
 
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I’m an OK surgeon now but almost never got a chance, since I nearly got fired as a resident.

22 y.o. AA male GSW x 3 to the back. CXR with maybe some haze in the LLL. Lines placed. O2 mask on, tachycardic but who wouldn’t be? I’m zoned in on a couple of sketchy B.P.’s. hemodynamic instability in the setting of penetrating injury to the back being an absolute indication for laparotomy. The bullets couldn’t have hit the aorta or an iliacs, if so the guy would be dead by now, so I’m thinking low pressure retroperitoneal injury? Renal vein? Spleen? Something in zone III? a mesenteric vessel? ****. New, young ER attending in a white button down oxford shirt and a tie wants to put in a left chest tube. Massive hemothorax ain’t the problem, the volume of blood that you would need to give you hypovolemic shock parked in the thorax won’t give your that x-ray but what whatever, My PGY2 he needs the practice, so I tell him to prep.

It’s more than the usual degree of chaos, even for 1am at Luke’s. The guy had been shot by the cops so the usual blue waves keep crashing into the trauma bay door requiring regular dispersement. Not that the cops give the impression of actually giving a ****, it’s December of 2004, Ferguson is a decade away and this was in the days when cops still shot young black guys in Harlem because it was part of their job description. Still they were curious to see just what type of paperwork was going to have to be filled out. Patient himself seemed to be opting for the form that didn’t have a time of death on it. The lad is definitely showing bit more spunk than you would expect from someone en-route to his reward via exsanguination into his belly, his thorax or his retroperitioneam but sometimes they can fool you. The other guests to the party were some nurses, my team of exhausted pissed-off surgical residents who wishing they were anywhere except responding to a trauma call with me as the Chief, and the ER team, maybe six of them all delighted for a distraction from asthma attacks, UTI’s and drug seekers, hoping to get to see something like on TV and lead by that tense looking attending in the white button down oxford and tie. Looking like a guy from NASA in the 60s.

Oxford shirt dude is now standing at the foot of the bed, Pete’s on patient’s left giving some lidocaine at the 5th intercostal space and posterior axillary line getting ready to put the chest tube in and I’m standing behind Pete trying to figure out what happens next. I’m the senior surgeon in the room, closest surgical attending is maybe half and hour away and if we’ve got to do an emergent exploratory laparotomy it’s my problem and frankly I’d rather pass. It would be nice to think my conservative stance was on account of higher principles, a wish to spare homeboy a big midline incision, a lifetime of adhesions and a few days in house getting over his ileus but in reality I just wanted to get back to sleep. Katherine is two and not all that into sleeping, Angela nine months pregnant and not all that into not being grouchy, I’d been working all day and had to be in the OR all the next day. Yup, this was when things sucked but not in the “crap I’ll be home tonight at 5:30 rather than 4:30 and have to cut short my time at the gym” sucked, or in the “it’s so difficult to decide, should we ditch the kids and go to Santiago or London next month honey?” sucked, but in the “when will this **** end and how can I get another twenty minutes of sleep” way. Perhaps you can relate? Anyways, an unnecessary ex-lap might not be doing shot-guy any favors but, it would ruin the night for sure. So when oxford-shirt-with-tie ER attending calls for a couple mg of morphine to be given IV to spare the patient a bit of discomfort from the chest tube insertion I say I’d rather skip it. Morphine can cause a transient drop in blood pressure and another couple low BP’s on the monitor and I’m obliged to open this guy up (and stay awake for another couple of hours) so I’d rather not have the it on board confounding the situation.

Most ER guys differ to the surgeons, after all, they have only the haziest idea of what happens once the patient leaves the trauma bay, understand their limitations and sensibly stay out of the way. But this guy is different; he has his own ideas, probably went to a lecture recently on “pain being the sixth vital sign” or some such bull**** and he says “I’m going to give morphine.” This gets my attention, I explain, quickly, why this is bad idea. 3 minutes of pain from the chest tube insertion vs dropping the blood pressure and forcing my hand to do an exploratory laparotomy based on information confounded by narcotic is an easy decision. “Better not” I say. Unbelievably, he is not dissuaded, his team is looking on and he takes a stand. He tells me he’s the attending physician, he is board certified, he is in charge of this patient while the patient is in the ER and he is going to give the morphine.

It is at this point that certain things are become alleged. The surgical team is on record that in calm and respectful tones their chief guided the care of the patient with a graceful firm and steady hand to it’s successful conclusion. Bless them. Meanwhile, the ER team over the ensuing days spilled a fair amount of ink all alleging this and alleging that. Something to the effect that allegedly the senior surgeon at the trauma allegedly told the attending emergency medicine physician in the white short sleeved oxford that were each the same amount of time out of medical school the only difference being the two was that one had done a short, easy residency. That his that his lack of judgment was threat to this patient, and that the ER attending should get **** out of this trauma bay and find someone with an earache to treat before he hurt somebody. It is agreed upon by all parties that at some point the ER attending dismissed the senior surgical resident from the case ordering the surgical resident leave the area at which point it has been alleged that the senior surgical resident inquired if said ER attending possessed the skill set to open the abdomen or chest and control an exsanguinating injury? Furthermore it has been alleged that the senior surgeon then pointed out that since dismissing the only person currently in the hospital with the skill set to treat this potential life threatening injury would be equivalent to murder, perhaps the ER attending should just go borrow one of the cops guns and shoot the patient himself and get it over with. It has also been alleged that the when the attending in the short sleeved white shirt, now bright red in the face, insisted that he was the physician in charge of the care of the patients in his emergency room and physically attempted to give the morphine via the IV, the senior surgeon in the room, who was six inches taller and 50 pounds heavier than him and had captained his college rugby team positioned his body in such a manner to make such actions impossible and, it has been alleged, in doing so threw a body block that nearly knocked the ER attending over.

The chest tube returned nothing. The BP’s stabilized and later we learned that the gun shot wounds that we thought we were seeing were really fragments from the frangilble bullets that NYC cops use. These bullets are designed to break apart when they miss their target so as to cause minimal damage when they ricochet off things. The guy went home/to jail the next day.

With that trauma over the next one began. Young white short-sleeved oxford guy screamed for blood. He demanded dismissal of the surgical resident, he demanded that the medical board launch an investigation, he demanded formal sanctions, he demanded the senior surgical resident be banned from the ER. He got a lot of snickering from the Department of Surgery and a dripping letter of apology

So why bring this up?

David Newman was the guy I had to push out of the way. News story comes as little surprise to me.

You two could have stopped your pissing contest and given him some fentanyl.....
 
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I’m an OK surgeon now but almost never got a chance, since I nearly got fired as a resident.

22 y.o. AA male GSW x 3 to the back. CXR with maybe some haze in the LLL. Lines placed. O2 mask on, tachycardic but who wouldn’t be? I’m zoned in on a couple of sketchy B.P.’s. hemodynamic instability in the setting of penetrating injury to the back being an absolute indication for laparotomy. The bullets couldn’t have hit the aorta or an iliacs, if so the guy would be dead by now, so I’m thinking low pressure retroperitoneal injury? Renal vein? Spleen? Something in zone III? a mesenteric vessel? ****. New, young ER attending in a white button down oxford shirt and a tie wants to put in a left chest tube. Massive hemothorax ain’t the problem, the volume of blood that you would need to give you hypovolemic shock parked in the thorax won’t give your that x-ray but what whatever, My PGY2 he needs the practice, so I tell him to prep.

It’s more than the usual degree of chaos, even for 1am at Luke’s. The guy had been shot by the cops so the usual blue waves keep crashing into the trauma bay door requiring regular dispersement. Not that the cops give the impression of actually giving a ****, it’s December of 2004, Ferguson is a decade away and this was in the days when cops still shot young black guys in Harlem because it was part of their job description. Still they were curious to see just what type of paperwork was going to have to be filled out. Patient himself seemed to be opting for the form that didn’t have a time of death on it. The lad is definitely showing bit more spunk than you would expect from someone en-route to his reward via exsanguination into his belly, his thorax or his retroperitioneam but sometimes they can fool you. The other guests to the party were some nurses, my team of exhausted pissed-off surgical residents who wishing they were anywhere except responding to a trauma call with me as the Chief, and the ER team, maybe six of them all delighted for a distraction from asthma attacks, UTI’s and drug seekers, hoping to get to see something like on TV and lead by that tense looking attending in the white button down oxford and tie. Looking like a guy from NASA in the 60s.

Oxford shirt dude is now standing at the foot of the bed, Pete’s on patient’s left giving some lidocaine at the 5th intercostal space and posterior axillary line getting ready to put the chest tube in and I’m standing behind Pete trying to figure out what happens next. I’m the senior surgeon in the room, closest surgical attending is maybe half and hour away and if we’ve got to do an emergent exploratory laparotomy it’s my problem and frankly I’d rather pass. It would be nice to think my conservative stance was on account of higher principles, a wish to spare homeboy a big midline incision, a lifetime of adhesions and a few days in house getting over his ileus but in reality I just wanted to get back to sleep. Katherine is two and not all that into sleeping, Angela nine months pregnant and not all that into not being grouchy, I’d been working all day and had to be in the OR all the next day. Yup, this was when things sucked but not in the “crap I’ll be home tonight at 5:30 rather than 4:30 and have to cut short my time at the gym” sucked, or in the “it’s so difficult to decide, should we ditch the kids and go to Santiago or London next month honey?” sucked, but in the “when will this **** end and how can I get another twenty minutes of sleep” way. Perhaps you can relate? Anyways, an unnecessary ex-lap might not be doing shot-guy any favors but, it would ruin the night for sure. So when oxford-shirt-with-tie ER attending calls for a couple mg of morphine to be given IV to spare the patient a bit of discomfort from the chest tube insertion I say I’d rather skip it. Morphine can cause a transient drop in blood pressure and another couple low BP’s on the monitor and I’m obliged to open this guy up (and stay awake for another couple of hours) so I’d rather not have the it on board confounding the situation.

Most ER guys differ to the surgeons, after all, they have only the haziest idea of what happens once the patient leaves the trauma bay, understand their limitations and sensibly stay out of the way. But this guy is different; he has his own ideas, probably went to a lecture recently on “pain being the sixth vital sign” or some such bull**** and he says “I’m going to give morphine.” This gets my attention, I explain, quickly, why this is bad idea. 3 minutes of pain from the chest tube insertion vs dropping the blood pressure and forcing my hand to do an exploratory laparotomy based on information confounded by narcotic is an easy decision. “Better not” I say. Unbelievably, he is not dissuaded, his team is looking on and he takes a stand. He tells me he’s the attending physician, he is board certified, he is in charge of this patient while the patient is in the ER and he is going to give the morphine.

It is at this point that certain things are become alleged. The surgical team is on record that in calm and respectful tones their chief guided the care of the patient with a graceful firm and steady hand to it’s successful conclusion. Bless them. Meanwhile, the ER team over the ensuing days spilled a fair amount of ink all alleging this and alleging that. Something to the effect that allegedly the senior surgeon at the trauma allegedly told the attending emergency medicine physician in the white short sleeved oxford that were each the same amount of time out of medical school the only difference being the two was that one had done a short, easy residency. That his that his lack of judgment was threat to this patient, and that the ER attending should get **** out of this trauma bay and find someone with an earache to treat before he hurt somebody. It is agreed upon by all parties that at some point the ER attending dismissed the senior surgical resident from the case ordering the surgical resident leave the area at which point it has been alleged that the senior surgical resident inquired if said ER attending possessed the skill set to open the abdomen or chest and control an exsanguinating injury? Furthermore it has been alleged that the senior surgeon then pointed out that since dismissing the only person currently in the hospital with the skill set to treat this potential life threatening injury would be equivalent to murder, perhaps the ER attending should just go borrow one of the cops guns and shoot the patient himself and get it over with. It has also been alleged that the when the attending in the short sleeved white shirt, now bright red in the face, insisted that he was the physician in charge of the care of the patients in his emergency room and physically attempted to give the morphine via the IV, the senior surgeon in the room, who was six inches taller and 50 pounds heavier than him and had captained his college rugby team positioned his body in such a manner to make such actions impossible and, it has been alleged, in doing so threw a body block that nearly knocked the ER attending over.

The chest tube returned nothing. The BP’s stabilized and later we learned that the gun shot wounds that we thought we were seeing were really fragments from the frangilble bullets that NYC cops use. These bullets are designed to break apart when they miss their target so as to cause minimal damage when they ricochet off things. The guy went home/to jail the next day.

With that trauma over the next one began. Young white short-sleeved oxford guy screamed for blood. He demanded dismissal of the surgical resident, he demanded that the medical board launch an investigation, he demanded formal sanctions, he demanded the senior surgical resident be banned from the ER. He got a lot of snickering from the Department of Surgery and a dripping letter of apology

So why bring this up?

David Newman was the guy I had to push out of the way. News story comes as little surprise to me.

Great story. It doesn't really seem relevant at all though.
 
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Well, it would be relevant if he fondled the trauma patient and did the same thing he was accused of... Otherwise, no!
 
I’m an OK surgeon now but almost never got a chance, since I nearly got fired as a resident.

22 y.o. AA male GSW x 3 to the back. CXR with maybe some haze in the LLL. Lines placed. O2 mask on, tachycardic but who wouldn’t be? I’m zoned in on a couple of sketchy B.P.’s. hemodynamic instability in the setting of penetrating injury to the back being an absolute indication for laparotomy. The bullets couldn’t have hit the aorta or an iliacs, if so the guy would be dead by now, so I’m thinking low pressure retroperitoneal injury? Renal vein? Spleen? Something in zone III? a mesenteric vessel? ****. New, young ER attending in a white button down oxford shirt and a tie wants to put in a left chest tube. Massive hemothorax ain’t the problem, the volume of blood that you would need to give you hypovolemic shock parked in the thorax won’t give your that x-ray but what whatever, My PGY2 he needs the practice, so I tell him to prep.....


So you are a d@#k with a bad temper who got into a big d@#k contest with an attending when you were a resident and you are just d@#ish enough to hold that grudge so that when said attending is accused of a crime for which he cannot defend himself in public or on this forum you smear him further with a banal and poorly written diatribe demonstrating your lack of understanding of the use of opiates in trauma and the English language?


Cool story bro.....
 
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I’m an OK surgeon now but almost never got a chance, since I nearly got fired as a resident.

22 y.o. AA male GSW x 3 to the back. CXR with maybe some haze in the LLL. Lines placed. O2 mask on, tachycardic but who wouldn’t be? I’m zoned in on a couple of sketchy B.P.’s. hemodynamic instability in the setting of penetrating injury to the back being an absolute indication for laparotomy. The bullets couldn’t have hit the aorta or an iliacs, if so the guy would be dead by now, so I’m thinking low pressure retroperitoneal injury? Renal vein? Spleen? Something in zone III? a mesenteric vessel? ****. New, young ER attending in a white button down oxford shirt and a tie wants to put in a left chest tube. Massive hemothorax ain’t the problem, the volume of blood that you would need to give you hypovolemic shock parked in the thorax won’t give your that x-ray but what whatever, My PGY2 he needs the practice, so I tell him to prep.

It’s more than the usual degree of chaos, even for 1am at Luke’s. The guy had been shot by the cops so the usual blue waves keep crashing into the trauma bay door requiring regular dispersement. Not that the cops give the impression of actually giving a ****, it’s December of 2004, Ferguson is a decade away and this was in the days when cops still shot young black guys in Harlem because it was part of their job description. Still they were curious to see just what type of paperwork was going to have to be filled out. Patient himself seemed to be opting for the form that didn’t have a time of death on it. The lad is definitely showing bit more spunk than you would expect from someone en-route to his reward via exsanguination into his belly, his thorax or his retroperitioneam but sometimes they can fool you. The other guests to the party were some nurses, my team of exhausted pissed-off surgical residents who wishing they were anywhere except responding to a trauma call with me as the Chief, and the ER team, maybe six of them all delighted for a distraction from asthma attacks, UTI’s and drug seekers, hoping to get to see something like on TV and lead by that tense looking attending in the white button down oxford and tie. Looking like a guy from NASA in the 60s.

Oxford shirt dude is now standing at the foot of the bed, Pete’s on patient’s left giving some lidocaine at the 5th intercostal space and posterior axillary line getting ready to put the chest tube in and I’m standing behind Pete trying to figure out what happens next. I’m the senior surgeon in the room, closest surgical attending is maybe half and hour away and if we’ve got to do an emergent exploratory laparotomy it’s my problem and frankly I’d rather pass. It would be nice to think my conservative stance was on account of higher principles, a wish to spare homeboy a big midline incision, a lifetime of adhesions and a few days in house getting over his ileus but in reality I just wanted to get back to sleep. Katherine is two and not all that into sleeping, Angela nine months pregnant and not all that into not being grouchy, I’d been working all day and had to be in the OR all the next day. Yup, this was when things sucked but not in the “crap I’ll be home tonight at 5:30 rather than 4:30 and have to cut short my time at the gym” sucked, or in the “it’s so difficult to decide, should we ditch the kids and go to Santiago or London next month honey?” sucked, but in the “when will this **** end and how can I get another twenty minutes of sleep” way. Perhaps you can relate? Anyways, an unnecessary ex-lap might not be doing shot-guy any favors but, it would ruin the night for sure. So when oxford-shirt-with-tie ER attending calls for a couple mg of morphine to be given IV to spare the patient a bit of discomfort from the chest tube insertion I say I’d rather skip it. Morphine can cause a transient drop in blood pressure and another couple low BP’s on the monitor and I’m obliged to open this guy up (and stay awake for another couple of hours) so I’d rather not have the it on board confounding the situation.

Most ER guys differ to the surgeons, after all, they have only the haziest idea of what happens once the patient leaves the trauma bay, understand their limitations and sensibly stay out of the way. But this guy is different; he has his own ideas, probably went to a lecture recently on “pain being the sixth vital sign” or some such bull**** and he says “I’m going to give morphine.” This gets my attention, I explain, quickly, why this is bad idea. 3 minutes of pain from the chest tube insertion vs dropping the blood pressure and forcing my hand to do an exploratory laparotomy based on information confounded by narcotic is an easy decision. “Better not” I say. Unbelievably, he is not dissuaded, his team is looking on and he takes a stand. He tells me he’s the attending physician, he is board certified, he is in charge of this patient while the patient is in the ER and he is going to give the morphine.

It is at this point that certain things are become alleged. The surgical team is on record that in calm and respectful tones their chief guided the care of the patient with a graceful firm and steady hand to it’s successful conclusion. Bless them. Meanwhile, the ER team over the ensuing days spilled a fair amount of ink all alleging this and alleging that. Something to the effect that allegedly the senior surgeon at the trauma allegedly told the attending emergency medicine physician in the white short sleeved oxford that were each the same amount of time out of medical school the only difference being the two was that one had done a short, easy residency. That his that his lack of judgment was threat to this patient, and that the ER attending should get **** out of this trauma bay and find someone with an earache to treat before he hurt somebody. It is agreed upon by all parties that at some point the ER attending dismissed the senior surgical resident from the case ordering the surgical resident leave the area at which point it has been alleged that the senior surgical resident inquired if said ER attending possessed the skill set to open the abdomen or chest and control an exsanguinating injury? Furthermore it has been alleged that the senior surgeon then pointed out that since dismissing the only person currently in the hospital with the skill set to treat this potential life threatening injury would be equivalent to murder, perhaps the ER attending should just go borrow one of the cops guns and shoot the patient himself and get it over with. It has also been alleged that the when the attending in the short sleeved white shirt, now bright red in the face, insisted that he was the physician in charge of the care of the patients in his emergency room and physically attempted to give the morphine via the IV, the senior surgeon in the room, who was six inches taller and 50 pounds heavier than him and had captained his college rugby team positioned his body in such a manner to make such actions impossible and, it has been alleged, in doing so threw a body block that nearly knocked the ER attending over.

The chest tube returned nothing. The BP’s stabilized and later we learned that the gun shot wounds that we thought we were seeing were really fragments from the frangilble bullets that NYC cops use. These bullets are designed to break apart when they miss their target so as to cause minimal damage when they ricochet off things. The guy went home/to jail the next day.

With that trauma over the next one began. Young white short-sleeved oxford guy screamed for blood. He demanded dismissal of the surgical resident, he demanded that the medical board launch an investigation, he demanded formal sanctions, he demanded the senior surgical resident be banned from the ER. He got a lot of snickering from the Department of Surgery and a dripping letter of apology

So why bring this up?

David Newman was the guy I had to push out of the way. News story comes as little surprise to me.

I'm glad the patient did well under his care.
 
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Admittedly, it is a difficult relationship between the senior surgery resident and a brand new EM attending, since--like was mentioned--they both have the same number of training years. I think the best way to deal with this is mutual respect and collegiality. Yes, I think the brand new EM attending should exhibit a certain level of modesty, but conversely, the senior surgery resident should show mutual respect. Further, the senior surgery resident should note that even a PGY-9 is still a resident, and an attending is an attending. That's just the way the cookie crumbles.

Further, EM is *NOT* an easy residency. EM is extremely stressful, and our surgery friends should not underestimate it and what we do.
 
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I wasn't around at the time but dont' remember him being a fresh ED attending in 2004 since I was in one of his volunteer research programs as a pre-med in 2002. Either way don't get into pissing matches with attendings when you're a resident, even if they're in other departments. Even if you think you're correct. Leave that to when you're an attending
 
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Great story. It doesn't really seem relevant at all though.

It is quite relevant, assuming osler's story is true, because it speaks to ego and character. The current allegations about sexual assault and humiliation are also about inflated ego and questionable character.
 
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It is quite relevant, assuming osler's story is true, because it speaks to ego and character. The current allegations about sexual assault and humiliation are also about inflated ego and questionable character.
wait, osler is charge with sexual assault too? Because he basically described a shouting match between two egos over who was more correct in how to care for a trauma patient. Is every doctor that gets into a heated discussion with colleagues capable of doing such an act as described? because I will have to call the police on good portion of doctors I've worked with.
 
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wait, osler is charge with sexual assault too? Because he basically described a shouting match between two egos over who was more correct in how to care for a trauma patient
You are entitled to your interpretation of osler's narrative. It doesn't mean everyone else sees it your way.
 
It is quite relevant, assuming osler's story is true, because it speaks to ego and character. The current allegations about sexual assault and humiliation are also about inflated ego and questionable character.
Doctors with inflated egos ejaculate on people's faces? Dear lord, we should send the FBI the member list of the AANS!
 
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wait, osler is charge with sexual assault too?
You are entitled to your interpretation of osler's narrative. It doesn't mean everyone else sees it your way.
He said he pushed an attending out of the way when he was a resident over whether or not was able to receive pain medication and that there were disagreements between two departments over whether said action was acceptable. Only pseudointellectual babble can use that as proof of an action 12 years later. If that's enough to make someone guilty, then any doctor accused of any crime is guilty because I know very few physicians who never got into arguments with other doctors before.
 
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Doctors with inflated egos ejaculate on people's faces? Dear lord, we should send the FBI the member list of the AANS!

I legitmately just did a spit-take of a hot toddy.

Its cold as balls here and i just spewed my warm alcoholic drink. I would be angry if I wasnt laughing so hard.
 
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Doctors with inflated egos ejaculate on people's faces? Dear lord, we should send the FBI the member list of the AANS!
I was merely pointing out the relevancy of osler's post because everyone else seemed so dismissive/insulting to him. The allegations regarding Dr. David Newman involve humiliating sexual assaults of 2 female patients, but the alleged actions are a result of inflated ego and questionable character, which osler's narrative ( if true) also exposes. On Feb. 23, the ER physician defendant will have his day in court to dismiss the allegations if they are false. But right now there are a lot of discussions about the allegations because this physician has happily made himself a public figure through his book, his podcasts, his research, his public speaking engagements.
 
He said he pushed an attending out of the way when he was a resident over whether or not was able to receive pain medication and that there were disagreements between two departments over whether said action was acceptable. Only pseudointellectual babble can use that as proof of an action 12 years later.
I think you need to set aside your Attending status loyalties and keep an open mind to osler's post. Osler didn't say the 11 year old previous event proved guilt or innocence re: the current allegations. Osler made no attempt to portray himself as a Medical Knight in Shining Armor. In fact, that's why osler's account seemed believable. Osler's point was - to paraphrase - "Hey, guys, contrary to the shock and disbelief remarks made by a few other colleagues, here's my experience with this guy: "So why bring this up? David Newman was the guy I had to push out of the way. He was a wanker then, he's a wanker now." Osler's remarks will have no bearing on the outcome of the case - DNA results will decide the case regarding the January allegations.
 
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I was merely pointing out the relevancy of osler's post because everyone else seemed so dismissive/insulting to him. The allegations regarding Dr. David Newman involve humiliating sexual assaults of 2 female patients, but the alleged actions are a result of inflated ego and questionable character, which osler's narrative ( if true) also exposes. On Feb. 23, the ER physician defendant will have his day in court to dismiss the allegations if they are false. But right now there are a lot of discussions about the allegations because this physician has happily made himself a public figure through his book, his podcasts, his research, his public speaking engagements.


Lemme go out on a limb here...


It's sad to be posting (Osler x 3 posts 2 in this thread) and defending yourself (Hyde more posts but mysteriously pops up in this thread) at the same time.

Baseless accusations are the bread and butter of this thread.
 
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Lemme go out on a limb here...It's sad to be posting (Osler x 3 posts 2 in this thread) and defending yourself (Hyde more posts but mysteriously pops up in this thread) at the same time.

Sorry to tell you this but the limb you put yourself on is weak and omg, it just broke. Get thee to an EMD asap! I'm a tired MS1 who has not posted the past few months for obvious reasons. This case has captivated my attention because I read Dr. Newman's book previously and was considering EM as a specialty in the future. Dr. Newman has been a leading voice in the specialty but if he did the alleged dastardly deeds, he should pay the price. EM does not need false idols.
 
Lemme go out on a limb here...


It's sad to be posting (Osler x 3 posts 2 in this thread) and defending yourself (Hyde more posts but mysteriously pops up in this thread) at the same time.

Baseless accusations are the bread and butter of this thread.

Sorry to tell you this but the limb you put yourself on is weak and omg, it just broke. Get thee to an EMD asap! I'm a tired MS1 who has not posted the past few months for obvious reasons. This case has captivated my attention because I read Dr. Newman's book previously and was considering EM as a specialty in the future. Dr. Newman has been a leading voice in the specialty but if he did the alleged dastardly deeds, he should pay the price. EM does not need false idols.


+pity+
 
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I’m an OK surgeon now but almost never got a chance, since I nearly got fired as a resident.

22 y.o. AA male GSW x 3 to the back. CXR with maybe some haze in the LLL. Lines placed. O2 mask on, tachycardic but who wouldn’t be? I’m zoned in on a couple of sketchy B.P.’s, hemodynamic instability in the setting of penetrating injury to the back being an absolute indication for laparotomy. The bullets couldn’t have hit the aorta or an iliacs, if so the guy would be dead by now, so I’m thinking low pressure retroperitoneal injury? Renal vein? Spleen? Something in zone III? a mesenteric vessel? ****. New, young ER attending in a white button down oxford shirt and a tie wants to put in a left chest tube. Massive hemothorax ain’t the problem, the volume of blood that you would need to give you hypovolemic shock parked in the thorax won’t give you that x-ray but whatever, my PGY2 he needs the practice, so I tell him to prep.

It’s more than the usual degree of chaos, even for 1am at Luke’s. The guy had been shot by the cops so blue waves keep crashing into the trauma bay door requiring regular dispersement. Not that the cops give the impression of actually giving a ****, it’s December of 2004, Ferguson is a decade away and this was in the days when cops still shot young black guys in Harlem because it was part of their job description. Still they were curious to see just what type of paperwork was going to have to be filled out. Patient himself seemed to be opting for the form that didn’t have a time of death on it. The lad is definitely showing bit more spunk than you would expect from someone en-route to his reward via exsanguination but sometimes they can fool you. The other guests to the party were some nurses, my team of exhausted pissed-off surgical residents wishing they were anywhere except responding to a trauma call with me as the chief, and the ER team, maybe six of them all delighted for a distraction from asthma attacks, UTI’s and drug seekers, hoping to see something like on TV and lead by that tense looking attending in the white button down oxford and tie, looking like a guy from NASA in the 60s.

Oxford shirt dude is now standing at the foot of the bed, Pete’s on patient’s left giving some lidocaine at the 5th intercostal space and posterior axillary line getting ready to put the chest tube in and I’m standing behind Pete trying to figure out what happens next. I’m the senior surgeon in the room, closest surgical attending is maybe half and hour away and if we’ve got to do an emergent exploratory laparotomy it’s my problem and frankly I’d rather pass. It would be nice to think my conservative stance was on account of higher principles, a wish to spare homeboy a big midline incision, a lifetime of adhesions and a few days in house getting over his ileus but in reality I just wanted to get back to sleep. My two year old is not all that into sleeping and my wife nine months pregnant is not all that into not being grouchy. I’d been working all day and had to be in the OR all the next day. Yup, this was when things sucked but not in the “crap I’ll be home tonight at 5:30 rather than 4:30 and have to cut short my time at the gym” sucked, or in the “it’s so difficult to decide, should we ditch the kids and go to Santiago or London next month honey?” sucked, but in the “when will this **** end and how can I get another twenty minutes of sleep” way. Perhaps you can relate? Anyways, an unnecessary ex-lap might not be doing shot-guy any favors but it would ruin my night for sure. So when oxford-shirt-with-tie ER attending calls for a couple mg of morphine to be given IV to spare the patient a bit of discomfort from the chest tube insertion I say I’d rather skip it. Morphine can cause a transient drop in blood pressure and another couple low BP’s on the monitor and I’m obliged to open this guy up (and stay awake for another couple of hours) so I’d rather not have it on board confounding the situation.

Most ER guys differ to the surgeons, after all, they have only the haziest idea of what happens once the patient leaves the trauma bay, understand their limitations and sensibly stay out of the way. But this guy is different; he has his own ideas, probably went to a lecture recently on “pain being the sixth vital sign” or some such bull**** and he says “I’m going to give morphine.” This gets my attention, I explain, quickly, why this is bad idea. 3 minutes of pain from the chest tube insertion vs dropping the blood pressure and forcing my hand to do an exploratory laparotomy based on information confounded by narcotic is an easy decision. “Better not” I say. Unbelievably, he is not dissuaded, his team is looking on and he takes a stand. He tells me he’s the attending physician, he is board certified, he is in charge of this patient while the patient is in the ER and he is going to give the morphine.

It is at this point that certain things are alleged. The surgical team is on record that in calm and respectful tones their chief guided the care of the patient with a graceful firm and steady hand to it’s successful conclusion. Bless them. Meanwhile, the ER team over the ensuing days spilled a fair amount of ink all alleging this and alleging that. Something to the effect that allegedly the senior surgeon at the trauma allegedly told the attending emergency medicine physician in the white short sleeved oxford that were each the same amount of time out of medical school the only difference being the two being that one had done a short residency and one had not. That the ER attending's lack of judgment was threat to this patient, and that therefore the ER attending should get **** out of this trauma bay and find someone with an earache to treat before he hurt somebody. It is agreed upon by all parties that at some point the ER attending dismissed the senior surgical resident from the case ordering the surgical resident leave the area at which point it has been alleged that the senior surgical resident inquired if said ER attending possessed the skill set to open the abdomen or chest and control an exsanguinating injury? Furthermore it has been alleged that the senior surgeon then pointed out that since dismissing the only person currently in the hospital with the skill set to treat this potentially life threatening injury would be equivalent to murder, perhaps the ER attending should just go borrow one of the cops guns and shoot the patient himself and get it over with. It has also been alleged that the when the attending in the short sleeved white shirt, now bright red in the face, insisted that he was the physician in charge of the care of the patients in his emergency room and physically attempted to give the morphine via the IV, the senior surgeon in the room, who was six inches taller and 50 pounds heavier than him and had captained his college rugby team positioned his body in such a manner to make such actions impossible and, it has been alleged, in doing so threw a body block that nearly knocked the ER attending over.

The chest tube returned nothing. The BP’s stabilized and later we learned that the gun shot wounds that we thought we were seeing were really fragments from the frangilble bullets that NYC cops use. These bullets are designed to break apart when they miss their target so as to cause minimal damage when they ricochet off things. The guy went home/to jail the next day.

With that trauma over the next one began. Young white-short-sleeved-oxford guy screamed for blood. He demanded dismissal of the surgical resident, he demanded that the medical board launch an investigation, he demanded formal sanctions, he demanded the senior surgical resident be banned from the ER. He got a lot of snickering from the Department of Surgery and a dripping letter of apology.

So why bring this up?

David Newman was the guy I had to push out of the way. He was a wanker then, he's a wanker now.

Serious question: Is this story a troll? I mean this guy is the most hilarious caricature of a surgeon I've ever heard. The narcissistic and irrelevant humblebrags about cutting gym time short, world travelling, or being big, tall and captaining his old rugby team. The not so subtle digs at EM, cops, and basically everyone who isn't the OP. The high school lit writing style that makes it obvious that he thinks he could be a pulitzer prize winner if he wasn't too busy crushin' puss and saving lives. The only way this story could have been more of a cliche is if he had somehow worked his max bench into it.
 
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Whether inappropriate or not...that surgeons ability to keep a reader engaged and on his tippy toes must be acknowledged :)

And his lack of recognition that no matter which specialty is CONSULTING on the patient in the ER, until that patient is ADMITTED to surgery or to the hospital, they are the ER PHYSICIAN'S responsibility 100%. This has been tested in a court of law. So the ER physician was right in this situation: it doesn't matter if the dude in training is a PGY-35 or has board certifications in every specialty known, it is the ER physician's patient until a formal transfer (i.e., formal order) is in the chart.

Having said that, I usually listen to my consultants. If they are concerned about blood pressure drop with morphine, I would probably use fentanyl or not anything at all. However, 2 mg of morphine or 50 mcg of fentanyl rarely drops a blood pressure >5 mmHg.
 
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Baseless accusations are the bread and butter of this thread.

If you say so...

But oddly enough, the NNT website has dropped Dr. Newman's name from the team list of physicians. Previously he was editor-in-chief and one of the founding team members.
 
If you say so...

But oddly enough, the NNT website has dropped Dr. Newman's name from the team list of physicians. Previously he was editor-in-chief and one of the founding team members.


40c674c88606b351e6b0df07a4bfc734e7c1326b97eb7ee502d6304a6523b5a3.jpg
 
And his lack of recognition that no matter which specialty is CONSULTING on the patient in the ER, until that patient is ADMITTED to surgery or to the hospital, they are the ER PHYSICIAN'S responsibility 100%. This has been tested in a court of law. So the ER physician was right in this situation: it doesn't matter if the dude in training is a PGY-35 or has board certifications in every specialty known, it is the ER physician's patient until a formal transfer (i.e., formal order) is in the chart.

Having said that, I usually listen to my consultants. If they are concerned about blood pressure drop with morphine, I would probably use fentanyl or not anything at all. However, 2 mg of morphine or 50 mcg of fentanyl rarely drops a blood pressure >5 mmHg.

After reading his post the only impression I got was that he was a egotistical dic-k (not Newman). Seems like he should have been fired (for assaulting another doctor).
 
After reading his post the only impression I got was that he was a egotistical dic-k (not Newman).
Osler's style of writing was somewhat tongue-in-cheek. Osler was presenting what he knew would be unpopular facts in a humorous way. I found it entertaining to read as compared to the dry humorless text I am required to plow through and commit to memory daily.
 
Osler's style of writing was somewhat tongue-in-cheek. Osler was presenting what he knew would be unpopular facts in a humorous way. I found it entertaining to read as compared to the dry humorless text I am required to plow through and commit to memory daily.

Anecdotes are not facts.
 
Serious question: Is this story a troll? I mean this guy is the most hilarious caricature of a surgeon I've ever heard. The narcissistic and irrelevant humblebrags about cutting gym time short, world travelling, or being big, tall and captaining his old rugby team. The not so subtle digs at EM, cops, and basically everyone who isn't the OP. The high school lit writing style that makes it obvious that he thinks he could be a pulitzer prize winner if he wasn't too busy crushin' puss and saving lives. The only way this story could have been more of a cliche is if he had somehow worked his max bench into it.

I don't think he's ortho.
 
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Osler's style of writing was somewhat tongue-in-cheek. Osler was presenting what he knew would be unpopular facts in a humorous way. I found it entertaining to read as compared to the dry humorless text I am required to plow through and commit to memory daily.

I didnt say it wasnt funny.

I'm just saying if he was trying to show something about Newman's "unprofessional" behavior he ironically convinced me only of the opposite (that he is incredibly unprofessional)
 
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