Disclosing depression/ADD/HSV2 etc on pre-enrollment -- truly private? not looking for ethics debate

[nmg]

So I have been accepted to a med school (yay!) and have just received their physical form. Their physical feels *very* invasive, more so than physical forms I've seen online for other medical schools, and with no mention of "might impact technical standards/ pt contact" blatantly asks:

- if I have ever had depression
-any other medical, physical, or psychological conditions
-and to list all medications, allergies, operations, and family history. Jeebus.

I wanted to confirm that these pre-admissions forms are typically in a private file for use in a medical emergency, and not accessible by professors or to future residency people. What about the hypothetical case where a professor or residency program specifically requested to see my entire private file? Anyone know if that ever happens? Anyone with experience there?

What are your guys' opinions on listing:
- depression - mild, medicated but no leaves, hospitalizations, etc
- ADD - same
- birth control
- SSRIs and ADD-specific medications?
- HSV2 -- (genital herpes, me and ~25% of the young adults in the US, many of whom don't even know it. Sue me. Won't influence my practice unless I'm doing something with a patient I sure as sh** shouldn't be doing.) Asymptomatic, no treatment or meds ever taken or needed

Obviously I can't lie, and I probably have to list the ADD meds in terms of passing the drug test.
We're pushing back against mental health stigma, so I guess I'm more concerned about the HSV2 + the birth control (how dare I be sexually active, *gasp*, what a slattern).

My doc would be willing to leave off the birth control and HSV2, but I'm a stickler for complete honesty.

I don't think any of this would be grounds to withdraw an admissions offer. So I guess, I'm totally fine making some poor admissions person faint from shock at the licentiousness of my life choices, but I don't want it to impact my future career.

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[darkjedi]

Your physical forms will likely go to your student health office and not your school, the administration should have no access to it as it would be a HIPAA violation.

Its your medical record, list what you think your primary care doctor should know. Your history really isn't that interesting to begin with, so I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that the med school would even care to begin with.

 

[Instatewaiter]

So I have been accepted to a med school (yay!) and have just received their physical form. Their physical feels *very* invasive, more so than physical forms I've seen online for other medical schools, and with no mention of "might impact technical standards/ pt contact" blatantly asks:

- if I have ever had depression
-any other medical, physical, or psychological conditions
-and to list all medications, allergies, operations, and family history. Jeebus.

I wanted to confirm that these pre-admissions forms are typically in a private file for use in a medical emergency, and not accessible by professors or to future residency people. What about the hypothetical case where a professor or residency program specifically requested to see my entire private file? Anyone know if that ever happens? Anyone with experience there?

What are your guys' opinions on listing:
- depression - mild, medicated but no leaves, hospitalizations, etc
- ADD - same
- birth control
- SSRIs and ADD-specific medications?
- HSV2 -- (genital herpes, me and ~25% of the young adults in the US, many of whom don't even know it. Sue me. Won't influence my practice unless I'm doing something with a patient I sure as sh** shouldn't be doing.) Asymptomatic, no treatment or meds ever taken or needed

Obviously I can't lie, and I probably have to list the ADD meds in terms of passing the drug test.
We're pushing back against mental health stigma, so I guess I'm more concerned about the HSV2 + the birth control (how dare I be sexually active, *gasp*, what a slattern).

My doc would be willing to leave off the birth control and HSV2, but I'm a stickler for complete honesty.

I don't think any of this would be grounds to withdraw an admissions offer. So I guess, I'm totally fine making some poor admissions person faint from shock at the licentiousness of my life choices, but I don't want it to impact my future career.

I wouldn't be so sure this won't get back to administrators. Was this sent by a private doctor's office or by the school?

Keeping the depression could be useful since it is very common for people to have exacerbations of depression during medical school and schools have been making a concerted effort to improve the mental health of their students.

With regard to genital herpes, you nor the school get any benefit by disclosing this. Unless you have herpetic whitlow or are rubbing your vagina all over everything, it makes no difference disclosing or not.

So, either keep both off or keep the depression and leave off the herp.

 

[Goro]

Just be aware that med school is a furnace, and I've seen it break even healthy students.

 

[DokterMom]

There is NOTHING surprising or even mildly eyebrow-raising in your medical history @nmg Of course you're on birth control. And as you correctly observe, herpes is very common. As is ADD and mild depression.

Please stop worrying that you're not 'perfect enough' and show the kind of compassion to yourself and your own 'imperfections' that you would want from your physicians and will provide to your future (also flawed) patients.

 

[takeurmeds02]

@DokterMom I'm not saying anything new but It's very telling of our medical education system requisites and the resultant misunderstanding of expectations.

Often, as applicants, we feel that we need to have a spotless record and that we're not allowed to be flawed (regular) humans. Granted you do need to be an upstanding citizen (whatever that may mean) but a lot times, we fear not being flawless enough yet stellar enough to be accepted into the medical fold.

It's making us neurotic.

I suppose that's life with almost any competitive field you decide to pursue but I wonder if it's becoming damaging in a way.

 

[Crayola227]

Before I filled this out, I would contact Student Health, any contact on the form, and ask them the questions you asked us re: who sees this?

If this is just going to a private Student Health file WITH A SEPARATE EHR, fully disclose it's fine.

I disagree with instatewaiter in that I'll say:
none of your medical history you've disclosed here is an issue aside from mental health

even then, it doesn't sound like you have too much to fear

if the question is like "have you EVER had...." with no qualifiers like I'm going into, then you must say yes

if the question is "do you currently have a mental health condition that impacts your ability to xyz"
even on meds you can say no in my book
if it currently IS NOT impacting your ability in any way you're just taking meds.
I say you can say no here because the *entire* statement is not accurate.

if the question is "do you have a mental health condition that you are taking meds for" yes

if the question is "have you ever had a mental illness that has impacted your ability to xyz"
you could still say no depending, if it never caused anything that can be picked out in your app like IA, gaps, bad grads, I think this can be answered no
if there is a history of it impacting you, than you better say yes because it could come up

if the question is "have you ever had/currently have a mental health condition that *could* affect your ability"
you are being asked to read the future which I think is bull****, here I would say yes
and as you guessed I'm pretty conservative with feeling like one must disclose but here I think it's hard to say to say no because it's hard to defend an answer that depression *never* could

you just really need to read the question be able to defend your answer as accurate in a nit picky way

never lie!
this is just my opinion and could be wrong
if you really want to be sure consult an attorney, preferably one with either experience with ADA, education, employment, or medical licensing law

if this is not going to be very private, I would still be more worried over revealing a history of depression over a history of ADD
I could go into why but won't right now
I think because ADD/controlled on meds w/ history of success in school strikes less fear than if depression relapses
with depression I think there is more fear for what will happen to your productivity/quitting and your insight than there is with ADD
that said, I think for career's sake there's more stigma for depression but all mental illness is still stigmatized and still causes enough discrimination I would still tell you to keep it as secret from your CAREER as you can
notice I said career, not personal medical providers with whom you are protected by HIPPAA

I'll refer you to this post for more links on the topic
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/thr...hile-in-medical-school.1199578/#post-17752269

tldr:
med schools don't care about minor somatic things they don't see impacting performance, like a hx of HSV
they are actually probably glad you're on BC because they don't want to deal with you getting pregnant, or your PMS
I don't know how they view ADD, I imagine if anything they're just glad *this* student's stims are legal at least?
ask your school about confidentiality and what they do to address/treat "burn out"/depression (fair questions that don't really "out" you ATM)
never lie on forms, always OK to ask who sees them, but think about your privacy don't give more info than you must
never ignore mental health seek help BUT protect your privacy

 

[cbrons]

I sometimes wonder how Crayola has enough time to write novel-length responses to threads.

Sent from my SM-N910P using SDN mobile

 

[Crayola227]

I sometimes wonder how Crayola has enough time to write novel-length responses to threads.

Sent from my SM-N910P using SDN mobile

Excellent question.

A clue to the mystery is where I am writing from. My location is "Dante's Inferno, 7th Circle, Middle Ring."
Sometimes I type sometimes I dictate from my location in hell.

 

[Goro]

This info allows your school to HELP you in times of trouble. If your ADD gets in the way of your learning, you can get accommodations.

The #1 cause of med students to be dismissed or withdraw from programs is mental illness.

So I have been accepted to a med school (yay!) and have just received their physical form. Their physical feels *very* invasive, more so than physical forms I've seen online for other medical schools, and with no mention of "might impact technical standards/ pt contact" blatantly asks:

- if I have ever had depression
-any other medical, physical, or psychological conditions
-and to list all medications, allergies, operations, and family history. Jeebus.

I wanted to confirm that these pre-admissions forms are typically in a private file for use in a medical emergency, and not accessible by professors or to future residency people. What about the hypothetical case where a professor or residency program specifically requested to see my entire private file? Anyone know if that ever happens? Anyone with experience there?

What are your guys' opinions on listing:
- depression - mild, medicated but no leaves, hospitalizations, etc
- ADD - same
- birth control
- SSRIs and ADD-specific medications?
- HSV2 -- (genital herpes, me and ~25% of the young adults in the US, many of whom don't even know it. Sue me. Won't influence my practice unless I'm doing something with a patient I sure as sh** shouldn't be doing.) Asymptomatic, no treatment or meds ever taken or needed

Obviously I can't lie, and I probably have to list the ADD meds in terms of passing the drug test.
We're pushing back against mental health stigma, so I guess I'm more concerned about the HSV2 + the birth control (how dare I be sexually active, *gasp*, what a slattern).

My doc would be willing to leave off the birth control and HSV2, but I'm a stickler for complete honesty.

I don't think any of this would be grounds to withdraw an admissions offer. So I guess, I'm totally fine making some poor admissions person faint from shock at the licentiousness of my life choices, but I don't want it to impact my future career.

 

[piii]

Is this normal? My school hasn't asked me for any in depth medical history.