DUI Complications

[Jeffrety]

The people in this thread are nicer than the typical IA thread so its good to see compassion and understanding being thrown around. OP: you need to expunge those offenses if possible then apply and dont say yes to any criminal charge questions. If they cant be expunged you need two things: 1) spacing from the event. Im talking about 7 years minimum. Second: Show that youve changed by doing community service work for an equally long period. But by that point your MCAT and prereqs will be expired so I hope you in this for the long haul.

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[FutureDrB]

I don't know what state you live in, but you can get a pardon from the governor if you are truly rehabilitated and the offenses are preventing you from getting jobs due to your record. It depends on the state/governor and how many pardons he actually does for misdemeanors. After the pardon, you can take it back to the court for expungement. Every state is different on their leniency so it's good to get a free consultation from a lawyer. In my state, he often pardons such offenses due to age, time passed, rehabilitation work done, proof of inability to find jobs, etc. it's worth a shot.

Here in Texas, you can't get a misdemeanor pardoned, only a felony. There are options for misdemeanors, such as an Order of Nondisclosure, which "hides" the offense from 3rd party background check companies, but even an Order of Nondisclosure won't prevent your record from being seen if you are applying to a public service position (Medical, Teacher, etc.) or applying for any type of state license. So, they're pretty much pointless unless you plan on applying for some type of corporate position.

As for felonies, about 250 people apply each year. Of those, the Texas Board of Pardons and Paroles recommends 30-35 to the Governor. Of those, he picks roughly 5. I've spent years going through that process and didn't get passed the Board review. When I first applied in 2010, I thought mine would get walked through taking into consideration how much time had gone by and how much I'd accomplished, degrees, public service, current employment, etc. NOPE. So if a person like me can't get a pardon, I don't know what in the world the Board is looking for.

With that said, there is a misconception about pardons and expungements. It may vary by state, but I discovered that here, even if you get a pardon and expungement, it's still there. Once I discovered that, I stopped caring about trying to fight to get it off my record. Sadly, once you make a mistake, that's game over. I don't know who in the world came up with the idea of leaving incidents on your record for life...makes absolutely no sense. I mean who is the same person they were 10, 15, or 20 years ago. Criminal records should work like credit records. But, unfortunately they don't. That's life.

 

[YankeeCandle1141]

You need to save your time and money. This story doesnt have a happy ending.

I know you think people will forgive this.....but you gotta remember that every school gets thousands of applications to sift through, and 99.9% of them dont have any DUIs. I wouldn't even open your file.

 

[mathnerd88]

You need to save your time and money. This story doesnt have a happy ending.

I know you think people will forgive this.....but you gotta remember that every school gets thousands of applications to sift through, and 99.9% of them dont have any DUIs. I wouldn't even open your file.

What's interesting is that even Edward-VCOM even asks you if you've ever had a speeding ticket!

"Have you ever been charged with a speeding ticket, misdemeanor, felony, summary charge, or any other criminal charge (whether or not you were convicted or even if you were told it was expunged as these will often show up on the background check)? If yes, specify if you were or were not convicted of the charge. If you were not convicted, list what the status of the charge is. This includes traffic violations but excludes parking violations."

 

[YankeeCandle1141]

What's interesting is that even Edward-VCOM even asks you if you've ever had a speeding ticket!

Adcoms are practically begging you to give them a good reason to reject you.

Its not fair, but thats how it is.

 

[Lucy Arnez]

.

 

[AwayFromReality]

Adcoms are practically begging you to give them a good reason to reject you.

Its not fair, but thats how it is.

I doubt they'll reject an applicant for a few speeding tickets

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

What's interesting is that even Edward-VCOM even asks you if you've ever had a speeding ticket!

"Have you ever been charged with a speeding ticket, misdemeanor, felony, summary charge, or any other criminal charge (whether or not you were convicted or even if you were told it was expunged as these will often show up on the background check)? If yes, specify if you were or were not convicted of the charge. If you were not convicted, list what the status of the charge is. This includes traffic violations but excludes parking violations."

This type of stuff is bull****. A speeding ticket? Come on, and if someone gets a record expunged, my understanding is they had to prove to the state some kind of rehabilitation or that they were wrongly arrested; so to me it should be illegal for schools to ask this. They are basically saying "we want to re-judge you beyond what the state has. If the state accuses you, we believe, but if they expunge, well, that's for us to decide if they were right."

 

[raptorcage]

Here in Texas, you can't get a misdemeanor pardoned, only a felony. There are options for misdemeanors, such as an Order of Nondisclosure, which "hides" the offense from 3rd party background check companies, but even an Order of Nondisclosure won't prevent your record from being seen if you are applying to a public service position (Medical, Teacher, etc.) or applying for any type of state license. So, their pretty much pointless unless you plan on applying for some type of corporate position.

As for felonies, about 250 people apply each year. Of those, the Texas Board of Pardons and Paroles recommends 30-35 to the Governor. Of those, he picks roughly 5. I've spent years going through that process and didn't get passed the Board review. When I first applied in 2010, I thought mine would get walked through taking into consideration how much time had gone by and how much I'd accomplished, degrees, public service, current employment, etc. NOPE. So if a person like me can't get a pardon, I don't know what in the world the Board is looking for.

With that said, there is a misconception about pardons and expungements. It may vary by state, but I discovered that here, even if you get a pardon and expungement, it's still there. Once I discovered that, I stopped caring about trying to fight to get it off my record. Sadly, once you make a mistake, that's game over. I don't know who in the world came up with the idea of leaving incidents on your record for life...makes absolutely no sense. I mean who is the same person they were 10, 15, or 20 years ago. Criminal records should work like credit records. But, unfortunately they don't. That's life.

I'm sorry, I blatantly missed the Texas part of your profile. I knew they were strict, but not that strict. That's terrible that for such menial offenses as you listed he pardons essentially only 5 per year. Yes there is a HUGE misconception of pardons vs expungement. It varies, state to state. My state, for example, a pardon from the governor would allow expungement to the federal level, whereas some states do not make that distinction. Some would only be expunged to the state level. I am sorry to hear that your state works this way. I wish you only the best, you're a good guy, it's unfortunate when the world can't see through past wrongs.

 

[raptorcage]

You need to save your time and money. This story doesnt have a happy ending.

I know you think people will forgive this.....but you gotta remember that every school gets thousands of applications to sift through, and 99.9% of them dont have any DUIs. I wouldn't even open your file.

Thank you.

 

[mathnerd88]

This type of stuff is bull****. A speeding ticket? Come on, and if someone gets a record expunged, my understanding is they had to prove to the state some kind of rehabilitation or that they were wrongly arrested; so to me it should be illegal for schools to ask this. They are basically saying "we want to re-judge you beyond what the state has. If the state accuses you, we believe, but if they expunge, well, that's for us to decide if they were right."

Haha, this is ridiculous. I got a red light traffic camera ticket last year and it did not show up in any record whatsoever. It isn't even reportable to insurance or any DMV/RMV databases. I just paid the fine and that's it. They can't prove who was driving the car either at the time of offense.

 

[raptorcage]

And I've actually been going through a retrial due to the information from NY not being applicable in my home state for the past 3 months or so. If this comes through since I have both an Ny and home state lawyer, the charges will hopefully be dropped. I wanted to know IF not what are my chances.

Not accepting guilt in a trial does not mean I don't feel guilty- it's been over a year of counseling and I just wake up everyday feeling ashamed. It's indescribable.

 

[mathnerd88]

And I've actually been going through a retrial due to the information from NY not being applicable in my home state for the past 3 months or so. If this comes through since I have both an Ny and home state lawyer, the charges will hopefully be dropped. I wanted to know IF not what are my chances.

Not accepting guilt in a trial does not mean I don't feel guilty- it's been over a year of counseling and I just wake up everyday feeling ashamed. It's indescribable.

So every charge will be dropped? Or your DUI will become 1st offense?

Did you have to pay a lot in fines and insurance rate hikes?

 

[raptorcage]

That's not an excuse for my actions, I'm once again doing what legal advice tells me for my best interest. If it's inadmissible, it's inadmissible. I just want this to be done with. It's been almost 3 years and I want the best for my future, yes, but, at the same time, I'm sooooooo tired

 

[raptorcage]

It would be my first offense, making me eligible for expungement (again, at my state, the federal level). I have completed more than their requirements, but if I have to do them again I will.

 

[raptorcage]

Fines are paid, insurance dropped me...have to find another one

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

It would be my first offense, making me eligible for expungement (again, at my state, the federal level). I have completed more than their requirements, but if I have to do them again I will.

If your record is expunged, you can certainly apply to schools that won't ask about offenses and truthfully answer no to convictions. If this is the case, you will compete the same way any other candidate would. I know, for example, the MD applications even say explicitly not to list something expunged.

 

[raptorcage]

If your record is expunged, you can certainly apply to schools that won't ask about offenses and truthfully answer no to convictions. If this is the case, you will compete the same way any other candidate would. I know, for example, the MD applications even say explicitly not to list something expunged.

Exactly. The hope is to get this completely expunged. We filed a year ago for a governors pardoned (more so given out in my state if your professional license not suspended- but that you cannot find work due to the misdemeanor(s). It can take up to 3 yrs. I would like to move closer to home to be with my mom can she's 72 and has dementia but I can't bc I leave this job I'll never have another- the clinical team (my doctors) went to bat for me to the board saying I've never came to work or been impaired, that I always put my patients first (I work with peds). The Gubernatorial board ultimately want higher Ed ppl to keep doing their thing, and I have multiple letters that confirm my sobriety, so with a governors pardon the court really has no choice but to expunge.

Either way, there are 2 plans. I'm not sure how I feel about them bc I still feel the guilt and shame, but my lawyers doing his thing, thank god, I don't have to show up. I told him I accepted the consequences, but when he found out it could be a mistrial- I think he shat himself and his blog lit up. I do t want to be a law puppet, but part of me gets excited for a fresh start. I don't know. I visited her tonight and she called me my cousins names. Anyway. I know I'm wrong, I'm a terrible person , a drunk, a killer, whatever else was said in this thread, but I do have a lot of people in the medical community across 7 states who personally know me and believe in me

 

[FutureDrB]

Haha, this is ridiculous. I got a red light traffic camera ticket last year and it did not show up in any record whatsoever. It isn't even reportable to insurance or any DMV/RMV databases. I just paid the fine and that's it. They can't prove who was driving the car either at the time of offense.

That is one good thing about Texas' legal system. All traffic camera tickets are null and void as of like a year ago. Some cities still try to issue them, but you don't have to pay them anymore. Even the cops will tell you not to pay them. Basically, it was determined that a machine can't legally issue you a ticket, because of what you said above that's underlined. In addition, the police/city aren't even the ones who operate those machines. They are run by 3rd party providers, often based in other states.

 

[Tommyguns89]

That is one good thing about Texas' legal system. All traffic camera tickets are null and void as of like a year ago. Some cities still try to issue them, but you don't have to pay them anymore. Even the cops will tell you not to pay them. Basically, it was determined that a machine can't legally issue you a ticket, because of what you said above that's underlined. In addition, the police/city aren't even the ones who operate those machines. They are run by 3rd party providers, often based in other states.

I wish I had a realistic shot at getting into Texas schools as an out of stater.

 

[FutureDrB]

I wish I had a realistic shot at getting into Texas schools as an out of stater.

You and me both my friend. Darn TCOM and their no grade replacement policy.

 

[JibsGuy52]

Save your money and don't apply. Harsh, but true. A second DUI is one of the worst things you could have on an application in my opinion.

Speaking from a man who lost a family member to drunk driving.

 

[Goro]

My school doesn't ask for such trivia, but I suspect what they're looking for is a pattern of recklessness.

For example, how would you, as a student interviewer, deal with an applicant who had, say, seven speeding tickets in a five year period?

That's not a bad interview question, either!

This type of stuff is bull****. A speeding ticket? Come on, and if someone gets a record expunged, my understanding is they had to prove to the state some kind of rehabilitation or that they were wrongly arrested; so to me it should be illegal for schools to ask this. They are basically saying "we want to re-judge you beyond what the state has. If the state accuses you, we believe, but if they expunge, well, that's for us to decide if they were right."

 

[njtrimed]

Yes- after consulting with my lawyer I do only need to list the one DUI. It shows up on the background check through certiphi and other resources it lists that the charge was moved up from a first offense to a second. Thus, legal advice told me to only list the one DUI charge, then explain the NY charge and how it affected the state charge. But in his terms "I've legally been charged only once with a DUI- no first record exists." (Literally- that's how I kept my professional license...they didn't see a first charge/reason). That was also my lawyers doing. And That is his legal advice. Disclaimer- not condoning, saying these things are ok, this is what my lawyer said when I talked to him last week.

Of course, when I wrote it, it wasn't cut and dry in legal terms. It was the truth and what I've learned. There was no question of culpability, etc. it he onl advice I followed was admitting to the DUI(singular) and the DWAI. This post is purely in terms of legality that was referenced above.

I don't plan on applying for a long while until I have proven to myself and those around me that I am I worthy candidate.

I hate to sound harsh, but if I was reviewing your application now or even five years from now, I would seriously doubt your decision-making skills. You're focusing too much on the technicality; the fact is, you were caught driving while impaired (BAC is irrelevant) and you didn't learn your lesson the first time. Period. Plus, you weren't a kid when this happened. If you got an underage DUI at 19 and truly learned your lesson and never did it again, I'd see it as more of an adolescent transgression. But you drove impaired at 25 and again at 28 years old. I'm all about second and even third chances, but in my mind, DUI is one of those things where strike 2, you're out. I question whether someone who does this twice should even be allowed a driver's license ever again, let alone a license to practice medicine. I'm sorry, OP. I'm sure you're a very good person, but I wouldn't want you treating my kids...

On another note, does anyone know how this whole thing works with VCOM (and other schools? I'm not verified yet so I don't know who does this) asking about traffic offenses? I have definitely had 2-3 moving violations over the last 15-20 years, but I honestly don't even remember what or when. For example, I got pulled over 5 or 6 years ago for speeding <15mph over the limit, and ended up with a different ticket with no points, maybe for a broken tail light or something. How do you do a background check on yourself to find these things? I have nothing to hide, but I don't want it to look like I'm trying to falsify something when I honestly just can't remember tickets from 6-17 years ago!

 

[raptorcage]

Save your money and don't apply. Harsh, but true. A second DUI is one of the worst things you could have on an application in my opinion.

Speaking from a man who lost a family member to drunk driving.

I am so sorry that you lost a loved one to a selfish and stupid decision, such as my own. I thank you for the advice.

 

[yanks26dmb]

OP..perhaps youd be better suited for law school.

 

[raptorcage]

OP..perhaps youd be better suited for law school.

I feel it's because you're insinuating I'm lying, but there comes a point when I have to let there be external peace, despite the fact it's not internal.

 

[yanks26dmb]

I feel it's because you're insinuating I'm lying, but there comes a point when I have to let there be external peace, despite the fact it's not internal.

Not at all.

I actually went the law school route myself before realizing it wasn't for me.

It was just an honest opinion based on this thread.

 

[JibsGuy52]

I am so sorry that you lost a loved one to a selfish and stupid decision, such as my own. I thank you for the advice.

Best of luck.

 

[Monkitty]

We should really call it the Criminal Injustice system. In so many cases (I would toss the OP's case and FutureDrB's cases into this category) the stigma of breaking the law is a stain you can never wash off.

It's supposed to be the Department of Corrections. About making amends, turning your life around and being forgiven by society.

But society doesn't really forgive anymore.

Best of luck OP and FutureDrB

 

[FutureDrB]

We should really call it the Criminal Injustice system. In so many cases (I would toss the OP's case and FutureDrB's cases into this category) the stigma of breaking the law is a stain you can never wash off.

It's supposed to be the Department of Corrections. About making amends, turning your life around and being forgiven by society.

But society doesn't really forgive anymore.

Best of luck OP and FutureDrB

I'm all for people paying their debts to society. Myself included. "Do the crime, do the time."

The problem is that our criminal justice system requires those debts be paid for life, not just while you're on probation or incarcerated. Society wonders why there are repeat offenders...granted, some people simply never learn their lesson, but I think the majority of repeat offenders are so because they really have no other option...at least in the short term. Those who aren't educated or have any skill to offer, feel that when they have a criminal record hanging over their head, what's the point in trying.

Being uneducated and/or untrained is certainly not an excuse to commit additional offenses, but it is the stark reality. I've always found it ironic and somewhat comical that courts hand down sentences with the intention of "rehabilitating" individuals...exclaiming, go get a job and become a productive member of society...oh and by the way, you now have a record that will prevent you from doing that.

Develop a rational criminal record system, and you will see a 70+ percent drop in repeat offenses. (ie. Years the incident stays on your record based on the severity of the crime.) Just seems like common sense to me. But, sadly common sense is lacking in our society, especially in the realm of public policy.

 

[Favoritefarm]

You should switch careers. Even if a med school takes a chance on you, a residency program probably will not especially if you plan to do anything competitive or in a desirable program, and if a residency program takes a chance on you, you will have a tough time getting a lisence... some states have 0% tolerance. It's too much of an uphill battle.