Emt b vs. Emt i

[larpleston]

I'm currently certified as an EMT B. I've logged several hundred hours of clinical experience but I'm not really satisfied with how much I'm allowed to do. I'm pre med, so it's not as if I'm going to make a career out of it, but would adcoms be significantly more impressed if I was an EMT I?

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[236116]

No. Everyone and their brother is an EMT. Only go for advanced training if you intend to pursue a career.

 

[NeuroChaos]

What is the difference in emt b and emt I?

obviously I can't give you any advice. since i donot even know the terms.
I am just asking for my own knowledge. thanks!

 

[larpleston]

No. Everyone and their brother is an EMT. Only go for advanced training if you intend to pursue a career.

I know it might seem like everyone is certified from reading this site, but believe me, the vast majority of pre meds are not EMTs.

Neurochaos: The difference between B and I is in what they are allowed to do. EMT Is have more advanced training so they can sometimes intubate, start an IV, and some can administer additional medications.

 

[236116]

What is the difference in emt b and emt I?

obviously I can't give you any advice. since i donot even know the terms.
I am just asking for my own knowledge. thanks!

Mostly the drug box.

I know it might seem like everyone is certified from reading this site, but believe me, the vast majority of pre meds are not EMTs.

Honey, it's done, it's trite, and if you don't want to be a medic, don't take medic training.

 

[armybound]

you know there are more important things in life than what an adcom would think about something you did.

 

[236116]

you know there are more important things in life than what an adcom would think about something you did.

blasphemy!!!

 

[larpleston]

Mostly the drug box.


Honey, it's done, it's trite, and if you don't want to be a medic, don't take medic training.

Not to sound combative, but EVERYTHING has been done. And EMTs are a necessary part of the community, so to call it "trite" is a little bit ignorant. It's not as if I'm going to sit in a hospital waiting room and twiddle my thumbs for my clinical experience - which is what most pre meds do.

Just out of personal curiosity, what original things did you do for clinical experience as a pre med?

Also, jurrasicpark, EMT Is can do several additional things, but EMT Bs and Is can administer the same medications. The primary difference is that EMT Is can perform more invasive procedures.

Edit: Jurrasic, I just looked at one of your threads from a couple of weeks ago and it looks like you were thinking of becoming an EMT. I'm curious as to why you want to do it if it's trite and unoriginal.

On a side note, what the hell is with calling me "honey"? You're 24, you're not really as mature and seasoned of an individual as your posts intend to portray. C'mon, you're still under the average age of somebody entering med school.

 

[brianjg]

I personally pursued EMT-I training, but not really to make it look good on an app. But, I got AMAZING clinical experiences working PT (or so) for an ambulance on an Indian Reservation. It actually is quite a bit more training, and what you are allowed to do varies from state to state. In my state, we can intubate (with proper continuing education and skill validation), start IV, and give a few additional medications (IV dextrose and nebulized medications, namely, perform manual defibrillation, cardiac monitoring, and other things as directed). If you have some extra time and can use your training to get a job and some more clinical experience, go for it.

 

[235009]

Not to sound combative, but EVERYTHING has been done. And EMTs are a necessary part of the community, so to call it "trite" is a little bit ignorant. It's not as if I'm going to sit in a hospital waiting room and twiddle my thumbs for my clinical experience - which is what most pre meds do.

Just out of personal curiosity, what original things did you do for clinical experience as a pre med?

Also, jurrasicpark, EMT Is can do several additional things, but EMT Bs and Is can administer the same medications. The primary difference is that EMT Is can perform more invasive procedures.

Edit: Jurrasic, I just looked at one of your threads from a couple of weeks ago and it looks like you were thinking of becoming an EMT. I'm curious as to why you want to do it if it's trite and unoriginal.

On a side note, what the hell is with calling me "honey"? You're 24, you're not really as mature and seasoned of an individual as your posts intend to portray. C'mon, you're still under the average age of somebody entering med school.

you go girl!

i agree that while getting certified as an EMT might be somewhat common among premeds actually having significant experience as an EMT is not so common. It is also one of the absolute best clinical experiences you can get as a premed!

to OP: i think the difference between an what an EMT B and an EMT I can do differs by state....so if EMT Is can do a very significant amount in your state and you can get really good experience from it then by all means go for it. it would generally be a great experience but also would give you tons to write about on your apps and tons of stories to pull from at interviews.

 

[ChubbyChaser]

I dont think its worth all the time in order to move up from a b to an I

 

[larpleston]

you go girl!

i agree that while getting certified as an EMT might be somewhat common among premeds actually having significant experience as an EMT is not so common. It is also one of the absolute best clinical experiences you can get as a premed!

to OP: i think the difference between an what an EMT B and an EMT I can do differs by state....so if EMT Is can do a very significant amount in your state and you can get really good experience from it then by all means go for it. it would generally be a great experience but also would give you tons to write about on your apps and tons of stories to pull from at interviews.

LOL, I'm a guy but thanks.

 

[235009]

LOL, I'm a guy but thanks.

i still stand by my previous comment

 

[socmob]

I interview for my school, and while it's true that there's plenty of EMT-Bs (I was one too), I don't see EMT-I's very often. I 100% support doing it for multiple reasons. It allows you to be significantly more involved as an EMT, giving you better clinical exposure, better experiences, and more to talk about on interviews and in your PS. But also, you learn (and practice) very useful skills as an EMT-I such as phlebotomy and intubation. I regret not becoming an EMT-I, myself. G'luck!

 

[scrubsaresexy]

I'm not sure where you're running out of, but in Maryland, some counties have a jurisdictional IV-Technician program. I took that (still waiting for my card...grr) and learned a lot and can start doing an invasive procedure as soon as I get the aforementioned card. It took two weekends and 12 hours of time in a Baltimore ER getting sticks, so it's not a huge time commitment.

Also, I thought it was interesting that my instructor is an MD and still is a vollie (on the fire side as well). I spoke with him about continuing EMS while in med school because I was concerned about how feasible it would be, and he basically said that was how he stayed sane for those four year. So if you're considering still running during med school, you might want to get your EMT-I. I think my instructor let his paramedic lapse once he got his MD but he used it through med school.

Also, jurassic, there's (basically) two kinds of EMTs out there. Some EMTs love riding in the rig with the lights and sirens, love telling people that they're an EMT, etc etc. That's great; we need EMTs and we need young people in the field to replace those who move on. Then there's also people who love riding in the rig, love talking about EMS, but who would also keep doing what they're doing if they got no recognition at all for what they do. So please consider that before you make blanket statements about all premed EMTs. It's not all about the resume, and some people actually really, really love what they do.

 

[cavalier329]

if youre doing it because you want to improve what an adcom thinks of you then dont do it.

Besides when it comes down to it...that difference will probably not change a schools decision about you.

 

[larpleston]

if youre doing it because you want to improve what an adcom thinks of you then dont do it.

Besides when it comes down to it...that difference will probably not change a schools decision about you.

If you read my post you would know that I am doing it because I want to. I said that very plainly. But of course a strengthened resume is also a good reason. Plenty of people take jobs to make themselves better for their next job. People always put medicine on this enormous pedestal. Not everyone in the medical field is doing it because they're a saint who would work for one penny an hour. Just read some of the physician's forums and you'll see that there are few if any gods there.

 

[146233]

Moving to EMS forum.

 

[Narmerguy]

you know there are more important things in life than what an adcom would think about something you did.

Certainly true but I don' t see why it shouldn't be a consideration if you're on the fence about something.

 

[cavalier329]

I read your post...and your question was, "would adcoms be significantly more impressed if I was an EMT I?"

if you want to do it because you WANT to then why ask here? You seem to be allowing the opinions of adcoms dictate your actions. This is something I don't believe in.

You asked for opinions, I gave you mine. I wouldn't do it if the main reason is to boost your shot at med school because I don't think it will do this.


You said you logged hundreds of hours, if thats the case, then you are probably well advanced in your time as a college premed student. If you become an EMT-I then how much time will you really have to practice with your cert? If you plan to continue EMS in med school then that may be a different story. In my area of NY...right outside NYC, there is little if any work for EMT-Is. The pay difference doesnt make the cert worth it at all.

If, however, you don't plan to continue as an EMT, which you seem to have hinted at, then I don't see what the point is. You mention that you aren't happy with the scope with which you currently practice with as a B. If you don't wanna continue EMS then another year or so of the same wouldn't make a difference, would it?

So again, if its for med school don't do it because it probably won't change much since you won't have too much time to even be a practicing EMT I and get anything out of it. However, if you are unhappy with your current scope, would like to expand your horizons, will be continuing to practice and there are jobs for EMT Is in your area then go for it.

 

[Narmerguy]

i still stand by my previous comment

Haha

 

[AdmiralChz]

This is a great thread, and it is too bad it was moved to the EMS forum by zipmedic and not kept on the pre-med forums. It has some great info for premeds looking into EMS as clinical experience.

I would disagree that being an EMT is "common" among pre-meds, given the amount of time it takes to become certified (it's not like getting a CPR or Lifeguard cert!). But even if you do believe this, my experience with EMS (5+ years) has revealed 2 types of individuals and they are split about 50-50:

1 - People who are doing it solely so they can put it on an application. These people do not engage well in patient interactions, and do not interact with the rest of the rescue squad very well. Believe me, especially in college towns, there are quite a few of these (and I know some of the fellow EMS people around will agree!).

2 - People who genuinely enjoy the patient interaction and have a strong, positive experience with EMS. I personally joined EMS because of a family friend, and the experiences I have had actually led me into the field of medicine (I was all business before).

If done correctly, being an EMT can be hugely rewarding and give unbelievable clinical experiences. It has come up in all of my interviews, and I have gotten VERY strong responses to it. I was also able to get strong LORs from the squad.

EMT-I takes quite a while to get, however (1-1.5 years after EMT-B and that's just to get certified and does not include the time to get released!). The responsibility of the EMT-I cannot be understated and would ABSOLUTELY impress adcoms!! Unfortunately, getting to EMT-I is very time consuming and often night classes are not offered for it, so it may not be very feasible.

I personally am an EMT-Enhanced in Virginia, which is basically inbetween a EMT-B and an EMT-I, and I absolutely love it. However, EMT-E is strictly a Virginia thing (but other certs like that are around in other states...), so that probably won't apply to you.

Also keep in mind that during medical school you can also bridge to EMT-P. I have had many friends do this, and I plan to do it myself and the bridge time is minimal since you will have taken all of the required classes (all that would be needed would be hospital clinical time).

So if you want to go to the next level, have at it! But know that it takes a HUGE time commitment, and you may not have much time before med school admissions unless you decide to take some time off. Either way, you can't go wrong!

I hope this helps!!!

 

[psychbender]

I'll go ahead and echo what nearly everyone else on this thread has already stated: do not do it for the adcoms, do it if you want to still run.

I ran as an EMT-B for a while before becoming a Virginia EMT-I (I-99), so was not ALS until shortly before medical school. If not for the fact that I continue to run all through school, it would not have been worth it. It was brought up during all of my interviews, but I cannot be sure whether it actually helped in the admissions process. The clinical experience and comfort with skills definitely helps later on in medical school, but again, not for admissions.

AdmiralChz: I don't know if you are aware, but the Virginia EMT-E is, actually, what most states refer to as EMT-I (I-85). Our version of the Intermediate is much closer to paramedic, and if you head a bit farther southwest in the state, it essentially is paramedic (really no difference in protocols down here). With regards to challenging paramedic in Virginia, are you sure you can do it as an Enhanced? I, and everyone else that I know who has done it, have been Intermediates/Cardiac Techs, so I'm just curious. I have a buddy who is an Enhanced provider right now, and will be starting med school next year who would be interested in the challenge if it is available to Es.

 

[AdmiralChz]

I'll go ahead and echo what nearly everyone else on this thread has already stated: do not do it for the adcoms, do it if you want to still run.

I ran as an EMT-B for a while before becoming a Virginia EMT-I (I-99), so was not ALS until shortly before medical school. If not for the fact that I continue to run all through school, it would not have been worth it. It was brought up during all of my interviews, but I cannot be sure whether it actually helped in the admissions process. The clinical experience and comfort with skills definitely helps later on in medical school, but again, not for admissions.

AdmiralChz: I don't know if you are aware, but the Virginia EMT-E is, actually, what most states refer to as EMT-I (I-85). Our version of the Intermediate is much closer to paramedic, and if you head a bit farther southwest in the state, it essentially is paramedic (really no difference in protocols down here). With regards to challenging paramedic in Virginia, are you sure you can do it as an Enhanced? I, and everyone else that I know who has done it, have been Intermediates/Cardiac Techs, so I'm just curious. I have a buddy who is an Enhanced provider right now, and will be starting med school next year who would be interested in the challenge if it is available to Es.

Ah, I did not know that (and I always wondered what I-85 was).

For challenging Paramedic, I understand that you can do it after your first 2 years (after class time). One of my friends challenged directly from being EMT-E, and another actually challenged from EMT-B (If you were going for EMT-P regularly, EMT-E is not a required certification on the way, just EMT-B). From what I understand, it just takes a minimal amount of extra class time and extra clinical time to challenge the NREMT-P test. Hope this helps.

Intermediates are also almost substitutes for Paramedics in Charlottesville as well, and in most locales in Virginia.

 

[psychbender]

For challenging Paramedic, I understand that you can do it after your first 2 years (after class time). One of my friends challenged directly from being EMT-E, and another actually challenged from EMT-B (If you were going for EMT-P regularly, EMT-E is not a required certification on the way, just EMT-B). From what I understand, it just takes a minimal amount of extra class time and extra clinical time to challenge the NREMT-P test. Hope this helps.

Hmmmm, the documents from the Virginia OEMS that talk about the challenge process stated that you had to be current Virginia ALS, or previous Virginia ALS, but current BLS (in addition to completing 2 years of medical school, or being a PA or NP). I think, though, that we may be talking about different processes, as the challenge does not involve extra class or clinical time, just documentation of current/past certification, a transcript from med school, and your medical director signing off stating that you have done X number of various skills and assessments. Then, you can sit for the national registry exams, and request Virginia reciprocity.

 

[pseudoknot]

Hmmmm, the documents from the Virginia OEMS that talk about the challenge process stated that you had to be current Virginia ALS, or previous Virginia ALS, but current BLS (in addition to completing 2 years of medical school, or being a PA or NP). I think, though, that we may be talking about different processes, as the challenge does not involve extra class or clinical time, just documentation of current/past certification, a transcript from med school, and your medical director signing off stating that you have done X number of various skills and assessments. Then, you can sit for the national registry exams, and request Virginia reciprocity.

This is correct. You can do it if you are current or former (<2 years expired) VA ALS, including Enhanced. The regulations don't appear to provide for this if you're only BLS.

I think you need to document 50 ALS calls that you led in the field under a paramedic preceptor, as well as a number of specific skills that can be done either in the hospital or in the field. In this sense the challenge process could involve additional field time.

The relevant policies from OEMS are here:
http://www.vdh.virginia.gov/OEMS/Training/TPAM/Policies/T-660.pdf
http://www.vdh.virginia.gov/OEMS/Training/TPAM/Policies/T-238.pdf
http://www.vdh.virginia.gov/OEMS/Training/TPAM/Forms/TR-37 - PA & NP Competency Summary.pdf

 

[COMedic2Doc]

Regarding the original question about advancing to an EMT-I, do not do this unless you can use this with the EMS system you're in and use it well (many Metropolitan cities don't even recognize Is beyond being an Advanced provider to a Basic, but due to the availability of Paramedics don't really get to practice or use their skills due to the Physician Advisor's comfort level, and/or the Paramedics on scene being comfortable, at least here in Colorado).

Also, do not go after this cert for the adcom, only do this if you really, truly have the desire, time, and money (unless you're being sponsored by an agency, which is even better). I completely understand being bored as a Basic, and can sympathize with that feeling as it was something I faced when I went from Basic to Intermediate, and then eventually to Paramedic. Originally, I went to Intermediate because I was in a system that recognized EMT-Is and was allowed to run as one once finished with school and certification. I went to Paramedic to improve my income, experience, skill level for my Hazmat/Disaster team to fill a need that we had at the time, and because Intermediates aren't recognized here for the most part except for in Volunteer systems whose Physician Advisors are comfortable with EMT-Is.

Interesting comments on the I-85, as here it's a grandfathered-in status so to speak and all the programs upgraded to I-99. Also, all I-85s were forced to go to I-99 after a few brief years of the new I-99 curricula. Brief description of skill differences, and at least here EMT-Bs (even with IV) and EMT-Is are very, very different:

Drugs: ACLS drugs, Morphine, NTG, Albuterol, Atrovent, Lasix, D-50 and Glucagon, Reglan, Zofran, and some others including some Benzos.
Skills: Intubation, LMA, Combitube, Defibrillation (Electrical Cardioversion is reserved for the Paramedic level), Needle-D, EJ IVs, 3-lead EKG, and some others

Here's a link for our Rule 500 (basically sets the acts that are permitted without waivers, but leaves it up to the Physician Advisor to choose from the Rule 500 for protocols, etc.). Colorado has been seen as being more liberal than many states for our ALS providers, as a side note to this reference.
www.dora.state.co.us/medical/rules/500.pdf

To the OP, have you considered becoming an ED Tech? ED Tech experience is many times highly advanced, and it gives you the chance to work with several Clinicians to see the differences in various approaches to patients. Also, you probably will not have to advance to the next level of EMS. Good luck with your decision, and feel free to PM me if there's any questions that I can assist you with in advancing between certification levels.

 

[ArkansasRanger]

I'm currently certified as an EMT B. I've logged several hundred hours of clinical experience but I'm not really satisfied with how much I'm allowed to do. I'm pre med, so it's not as if I'm going to make a career out of it, but would adcoms be significantly more impressed if I was an EMT I?

Impressed? Probably not. Most of them probably don't even know I's exist out there. Around here it's only another semester of classes on top of basic so I say go for it. Then once you're in med school you'll know how to stick those veins and be good at it while everyone else won't be. LOL

 

[traumasurg]

Does anyone know any emt-b advanced or emt-I programs near south Alabama/Florida panhandle?

 

[MedicFL]

You wont find any EMT-I programs in FL because the state does not use the EMT-I level. They only have EMT-B and EMT-P..

 

[9ECHO1]

You wont find any EMT-I programs in FL because the state does not use the EMT-I level. They only have EMT-B and EMT-P..

MedicFL brings up a good point. EMS structure typically varies by state. In some states, the scope of practice for the different providers is different in every county.

 

[Arjuna]

I'm currently certified as an EMT B. I've logged several hundred hours of clinical experience but I'm not really satisfied with how much I'm allowed to do. I'm pre med, so it's not as if I'm going to make a career out of it, but would adcoms be significantly more impressed if I was an EMT I?

Moving up just for the sake of impressing adcoms is a courageous effort, but I think even if you pass the class with flying colours (on top of the class) if you're not truly interested in the environment and field experience of EMS, you shouldnt really consider EMT-I, or even EMT-B. Not to say that I didnt do so; I dont like being at my fire station too much, because the people there simply dont get along too well with me; most are already married and thrice my age, and the ones that aren't, just drink booze and party all other days. In other words, they are there to stick to EMS as a career. Even if they are volunteering, they will stick to their EMT post, and eventually move up in the organization after chatting up the others in the station through what I like to call "Fire talk". Let me tell you, living with firemen is not an easy task; they tend to be very hot headed and macho minded. Indeed, when they find out that your career goals do not include becoming a rescuer/firefighter/paramedic, their attitude COMPLETELY takes a turn for the worse. I made the mistake of telling my preceptors about my career goals, and needless to say, they werent too happy about it. I hate to say it, but I think inadequacy and an inferiority complex of sorts is also at play when premeds enter the fireservice, and we all have seen and heard banter among both EMTs and between EMTs and nurses about how Doctors dont know ****, and how a top class Paramedic is smarter than a doctor who graduated at the bottom of his class. Its all just bitter feelings. Docs will always know more and earn more and will get more respect than anyone in the EMS field. Sheesh I did go on a rant there. Hope you got the beginning jist though.

 

[Dwindlin]

Arjuna are you EMS only? I ask because honestly if you're EMS that is probably the bigger reason they give you flack (in my experience) . I'm in a similar position, I am a Firefighter and Medic and work 2 jobs, both fire department based. I get along with everyone great, now that wasn't the case until I showed an interest in the fire side of things. When I first started I was a "civilian medic" and most of the guys wouldn't so much as look at me. But like I said, soon as I came on as a Firefighter as well, their attitudes changed (except my nickname "doc" stuck). One thing I will agree with you on is most FF (especially the older ones) have an "interesting" sense of humor that is not for the easily offended.

 

[easyrock]

MedicFL brings up a good point. EMS structure typically varies by state. In some states, the scope of practice for the different providers is different in every county.

After starting out in Los Angeles, CA and moving to Durham, NC, EMS is unique to each state in so many respects.