Help ranking - Baystate, SUNY Up, SUNY Down, Buffalo

[TeslaCoil]

All of these programs seemed pretty good to me... having trouble deciding how to rank these 4. Location is not a big concern for me... just looking for some more outside opinions. Thanks!

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[244913]

t

All of these programs seemed pretty good to me... having trouble deciding how to rank these 4. Location is not a big concern for me... just looking for some more outside opinions. Thanks!

These are all terrible programs. Downstate places multiple people on probation every year. Upstate is in disarray. Buffalo works their residents 80 hrs per week btwn 4 different sites and has a horrendous board passing rate. Baystate is a malignant FMG mill according to an attending I know who recently graduated.

Ask around a bit more.

- ex 61N

 

[Psai]

All terrible

 

[Vergie]

t


Downstate places multiple people on probation every year.
- ex 61N

This is incorrect. Downstate recruited a new program director a few years ago and the culture has changed quite a bit.

 

[Gaseous1]

Baystate is not malignant at all. Great attendings and residents who get along.

 

[TeslaCoil]

I thought downstate was pretty solid... baystate seemed awesome too... Both of them had really solid fellowship and job placement lists... could they really be that bad?

 

[cowbydoc]

I currently work at Baystate. I'm biased but it does not seem "terrible" to me, I trained elsewhere at a large program in the Midwest and the training seems easily comparable if not a little better here. PM me if you would like more info.

 

[Ronin786]

Never interviewed at Downstate but I've heard nothing but bad things about them unfortunately.

I interviewed at Baystate and they seemed pretty good to me. Michael Bailin, their chair, is a fairly well-known name and a good educator. I didn't really see many FMGs in their residents when I interviewed, but if you look at their website that is definitely the case. I think they were hurt a bit back by some issues with research fabrication and the fact that they're located out in the middle of nowhere. You'd probably have the inside leg at some Boston fellowships if you wanted FWIW.

 

[criticalelement]

I work with a guy from baystate. All he does is talk sh i t about where he trained. And he is not that good.

 

[Gaseous1]

I work with a guy from baystate. All he does is talk sh i t about where he trained. And he is not that good.

n=1

 

[jthedestroyr]

This is incorrect. Downstate recruited a new program director a few years ago and the culture has changed quite a bit.

Yes they have a new PD, but the person that caused a lot of the issues people were complaining about either took a lateral position or moved up. It was discussed during our tour and at the dinner. FWIW I was told it was more this person was old school mentality that seems to hurt a lot of delicate helicopter parented types we have now. It wasn't a deal breaker for me. Whether this is true, I can only go by what was explained to me by multiple residents while interviewing last year.

Nothing discussed would have caused concern for me. At the end of the day I didn't feel the program was a good fit for me, the culture didn't fit my personality and I absolutely didn't want to live in NYC, therefore they were very low on my list. For me it was a good safety at the bottom of my list i.e. Match versus not match. Now that's not to say it's not a good fit for someone else.

My best advice is to rank how you feel you fit in. I always tell applicants you really need to rank based on where you fit in best. Not everyone can go to the stanfords ucsf etc.

 

[BrooklynGasMD]

FWIW I was told it was more this person was old school mentality that seems to hurt a lot of delicate helicopter parented types we have now. It wasn't a deal breaker for me. Whether this is true, I can only go by what was explained to me by multiple residents while interviewing last year.

This makes me so angry I had to log in just to reply.

Recent grads did not grow up with helicopter parents and social media that nowadays disparages the millennial generation and whatever came after that. We didn't get internet until high school or later. To use that catchphrase, overly emotional sensitivity, and participation trophies as an excuse to not expect respect and professionalism from your superiors while in residency training is insulting to those of us who went through that horrid place!

I wasn't around after the new PD was promoted, but before that he was well liked by everyone.

The Downstate name has nothing going for it. If one wants to judge the program, then one should find out some objective measures such as written board pass rate, first time oral board pass rate, repeat oral board pass rate, and overall board certification rate for each class during the past 5 years and overall for the past 5 years. I know those numbers, but let's see if a former or current chief resident and always predictable heroic defender of the program can respond or reply to the OP.

BTW, the program has zero board examiners on faculty to practice with or get advice from. There are almost zero mock oral exams during the entire time, which makes sense as the younger faculty haven't yet taken or haven't yet passed the oral board, and the older faculty passed so long ago that they can't help.

 

[criticalelement]

This makes me so angry I had to log in just to reply.

Recent grads did not grow up with helicopter parents and social media that nowadays disparages the millennial generation and whatever came after that. We didn't get internet until high school or later. To use that catchphrase, overly emotional sensitivity, and participation trophies as an excuse to not expect respect and professionalism from your superiors while in residency training is insulting to those of us who went through that horrid place!

I wasn't around after the new PD was promoted, but before that he was well liked by everyone.

The Downstate name has nothing going for it. If one wants to judge the program, then one should find out some objective measures such as written board pass rate, first time oral board pass rate, repeat oral board pass rate, and overall board certification rate for each class during the past 5 years and overall for the past 5 years. I know those numbers, but let's see if a former or current chief resident and always predictable heroic defender of the program can respond or reply to the OP.

BTW, the program has zero board examiners on faculty to practice with or get advice from. There are almost zero mock oral exams during the entire time, which makes sense as the younger faculty haven't yet taken or haven't yet passed the oral board, and the older faculty passed so long ago that they can't help.

I must chime in. I don't want to discount what you are saying but the fact that the program has zero board examiners, and no mock orals should not be part of the decision. The sheer volume of cases performed should be the number one thing applicants consider. Experience matters in the real world and you can't get experience if you dont do any cases. You can't get experience doing pet projects in the library to try to impress a chief. Case numbers matters. Getting out at 3 everyday will not help you gain experience.. Everything else you said i agree with and I appreciate you coming to slam Downstate because more programs in the country need to be outed....

 

[Vergie]

I absolutely didn't want to live in NYC, therefore they were very low on my list.
My best advice is to rank how you feel you fit in. I always tell applicants you really need to rank based on where you fit in best. Not everyone can go to the stanfords ucsf etc.

Can't argue with you there. NYC is not an easy place to live. I feel like it slowly sucks the life out of you with each passing day. The experience is good though and I am happy with the choice, overall.

 

[jthedestroyr]

I ended up in the south; no snow, cheap COL, life is good! Not as flashy as NYC, but I'm fine with that. My brother ended up in NYC, although another speciality and he's scrapping by.

I stand by original statement for OP, you should rank those places based on your gut feeling and not random internet comments. You also should prepare yourself based on any negatives discussed and whether or not you're willing to put up with those.