That isn't true. Derm doesn't have the best salary, but it is one of the most competitive fields out there. General surg and IM used to also be quite competitive, despite lower salaries than the specialties.
Then why not Neurology? or Neuroradiology?
Dude. Work on getting into med school first. Hell, work on getting into a good college first, then getting good grades, then doing well on the MCAT. Neurosurg is a straight up 10 on the competitiveness scale and your life will be hell in ways you can't even imagine because you don't even know what life is yet. If you are sane, you'll change your mind and do neurology.I'm genuinely curious, friends: on a scale of 1 to 10, how competitive is neurosurgery? 1 being completely uncompetitive and 10 being you have to up the ladder and lick some boots for even a SLIVER of a chance to get matched. I'm in High School and it's my eventual goal and ambition to enter Neuro, so I'd really like someone educated on the subject to answer, not someone talking out of their anus on the matter. I've heard one of two things whilst talking to doctors about it:
1. neurosurgery is EXTREMELY competitive and it's in the same league as Derm and Plastics
2. neurosurgery is above average in competitiveness, but not as some other specialties because of the lifestyle and because they torture you in residency
I don't know what to believe and I need some good, honest feedback on this. Thanks in advance!!!
It's not in the same league as derm or plastics. Probably slightly less competitive than urology and ENT, about the same as ortho. It is a very self-selecting field and a large majority of US MD applicants that really go for it get a spot.I'm genuinely curious, friends: on a scale of 1 to 10, how competitive is neurosurgery? 1 being completely uncompetitive and 10 being you have to up the ladder and lick some boots for even a SLIVER of a chance to get matched. I'm in High School and it's my eventual goal and ambition to enter Neuro, so I'd really like someone educated on the subject to answer, not someone talking out of their anus on the matter. I've heard one of two things whilst talking to doctors about it:
1. neurosurgery is EXTREMELY competitive and it's in the same league as Derm and Plastics
2. neurosurgery is above average in competitiveness, but not as some other specialties because of the lifestyle and because they torture you in residency
I don't know what to believe and I need some good, honest feedback on this. Thanks in advance!!!
Well the thing is, I've shadowed a few neurosurgeons and they seem to have a pretty good life! Decent hours, good relationship with their kids, well respected, etc. And they get to do AWESOME surgeries on the most delicate organ in the body! I very much appreciate you guys' feedback and I'm curious to know why you think it's insane to go into Neurosurgery.
Because I would enjoy surgery more; not just diagnosis or staring at a computer screen.
There are very few things in life that compare to an 80 hr a week, 7 year commitment. It's almost impossible to comprehend how much of yourself you truly have to give during residency.
It's not that big of a sacrifice if a person has nothing to give in the first place.
Like a high school student.
Well it's process of elimination for me, really:
I truly and completely believe you, man; I really do! But I want this more than anything else!!! If I became a neurosurgeon, I would NEVER wake up in the morning and drag myself out of boredom and the monotony of the day; if I made it, I know I'd wake up, sit up, and say," God damn, I have a good life! Let's go to work!". And THAT is why I lose all terror of the opposition and sacrifice.
Thanks for your meaningful advice, really appreciate it!
Then don't let anyone here stop you. Bottom line, it's doable and not a complete crapshoot like integrated plastics.
And it's WHEN I get into med school, not "if" sir.
Thanks, man. I really appreciate your support! It really means a lot to me!!!
19 out of 20 don't make it that far. Waaay less than 1 in 100 that do make it become neurosurgeons. So you're looking at fractions of a percent that you end up in this field. That's why we're giving you a hard time. It's just silly and arrogant at this point to be speculating about neurosurgery of all things.And it's WHEN I get into med school, not "if" sir.
Well I don't expect you to understand my passion for it, and yes, I don't understand the stress of it; not even a little. But it's what I want to do with my life because I'm EAGER to learn all the stuff you mentioned, not because I know all about the specialty. It's just what I think will make me happy, man.
"And that's when he said, 'I want to help people!'"
2- you don't even know what stress is yet. Go maybe get a girl pregnant or something and get back to us. Then imagine that level of stress for 80 hours a week every week for 7 years.
3- you don't know anything about the CNS, really, nor do you have any idea what operating is like. That you imply the only thing you could possibly do with your life is procedures you can't comprehend on a system you don't understand is laughable.
And then there's the whole "it is more competitive than you could possibly imagine" factor. But I'm not even bothering going there, because it's just overkill.
I'm just curious about the occupation I've chosen for myself, sir! I understand it's a very long ways away, and I'm focused on making it in the top %10 of my high school class right now, so don't worry! I'm just trying to see the size of the mountains I'll have to climb along this long road, if you catch my drift
The mountains are enormous like you wouldn't believe, but best climbed one at a time. Focus on getting into a good college and doing well there. That is the mountain for now.
Thank you, sir! And yes, I certainly will need it.
Reality is going to hit you like a sack of metal bricks dropped from orbit, but I'll leave it to you to learn your lessons. Life ain't peaches and cream and you aren't a special snowflake, but good luck. Lord knows you'll need it.
Yeah, I understand; and maybe I am a bit naïve and gung-ho about something I know little more than trivial knowledge about. Thanks for your POSITIVE and CONSTRUCTIVE feedback, sir!!! This forum seems to be a little bit lacking on that bit, so I really appreciate it!
Yeah, that's my focus right now, I think; just a bit excited and curious for what's in the future. Thanks for your feedback, sir!
Yes sir, I understand. Just excited for what the future holds is all. Thanks for your feedback, I appreciate it!!
I'll remember that. Really I will. Voice of wisdom, true enough. I suppose I'll be less gung-ho about it publicly in the future, to be sure! And just curious, why is it laughable that I want to be a surgeon because I want to help people in an impactful way? Not mad, just curious.
You'll understand someday, young padawan. It's just one of the many things you've said that are so both cliché and vague that they are eye roll inducing. We all said things like you once, before reality happened.
I feel like the little kid with the lollipop talking to the scarred PTSD Vietnam vet on how much I can't wait to go to war..
You said "Do I really still want to be a doctor?" in PREMED?! I mean, I've heard 2nd year of med school is pretty much your darkest hour but is premed really that bad???
That's because I've actually seen more people die in my life than likely attend your high school lol. Medicine isn't glorious. No one thanks you at the end of the day nine times out of ten. It's a messy business where a lot of people don't make it and they're often the ones you liked the most. A place where you'll second guess if you made mistakes late into the night. Where you might have the misfortune of watching good people die in front of their spouses and family in the ICU for no good reason.
Yo, mad respect for this dude right here. He's telling the truth. Residency is tougher than med school, which is tougher than undergrad premed, which is tougher than high school. Like, I've shadowed cardiology and orthopedics and I think I'd love doing those specialties 10+ years later right now. However, I also understand that they are also highly competitive specialties (at least I know ortho is) and require considerable research during med school in that specialty to become a competitive applicant for residency programs. I have no undergrad research experience, so I'd have to break out of my shell and dive right into research early on in med school to make up for it, when I truly love volunteering and doing community service much more. My point is, I'm still willing to change my mind later. I'm an ER scribe now, and I think EM would be good for me too; working random shifts doesn't bother me too much. OP, when everyone's telling you to "wait until you get to med school and then talk," they mean it. Hell, wait until undergrad premed starts. Then you'll see part of what I mean. And everyone else, please feel free to correct me if anything I said is false or naive. I don't back down from criticism.
No, actually it doesn't. Mainly bc you have no idea what 1, 2, and 3 really entails. Right now you're just giving it lip service.
That's bc WUSTL is a known premed hell.
It sure is/was. I just hope that most med schools know this fact and take it into account when evaluating a WUSTL student/alum's application.
They scramble. How you play the scramble really depends on your overall app strength, but you can try scrambling prelim or categorical. If even that ends up falling, you can either take a research year, get a one year MPH, MHA or the like, or call whatever FM residency in NoDak didn't have any takers.
So are you suggesting I shouldn't gun for neurosurgery? From my youthful and uneducated observations, it seems like a good field if you know where to head after residency. Like the neurosurgeon in my town, Dr. Dorman, is only on-call one week out of the month, he works from 5 AM to 5 PM almost every day, and he actually sees his kids and has a good family life!!! He told me that it's only the ones in the huge regional centers that work like hell everyday. (I live in a town of 150,000, by the way) Your thoughts, mate? Is this an irregularity? Is it worth the sacrifice?
Lol, we've gone over this, broseph. Read ALL of the conversation first before making your mundane observations.
