I don't know what I'm doing anymore

[lostgirlthrowaway]

Throwaway because this is gonna be pretty identifying....

I'm graduating in a few days. I have no plans for the future.

..... Except for the fact I enrolled in a top 3 chemistry PhD program a few weeks ago.

I don't feel excited about going. I am dreading moving across the country. I don't even like chemistry that much or the careers it would offer me.

I was premed until last November when I decided last second to apply and see if I found a program I loved. I have a 3.9 GPA, 36 MCAT, clinical volunteering, etc... I have all the boxes checked pretty much.

And then I asked my professors for letters of recommendation for grad school. I was admitted to all these amazing programs. I visited. I enjoyed my visits.

April 15 (grad school version of April 30) came and I didn't know what to do, I felt I needed more time to decide and, honestly, I thought worst case scenario was I would leave with a masters and apply to med school.

But now, I don't want to go. And I don't know if that's because I'm just scared of moving far away (if this was something I was passionate about, I think I wouldn't be so worried about being homesick) or if I am actually at the point where I can't try to force my foot into a shoe that won't fit any longer.

The great thing about research, the reason why I applied, is because it's very satisfying when things work. I like answering the fundamental questions. But I don't think any research career would be fulfilling in the long term, not without something to keep me grounded to reality. I feel like researchers often forget that at the end of the day they're just running a goddamn gel, they can share their buffers, etc.

But I also don't know if medicine is for me. I think academically I am quite capable. All the shadowing I have done made me really excited and really enthused about that career path (should have shadowed over fall break to have prevented myself from applying to grad school). I don't feel that way about anything else.

But I wanted to try to do something else. All of my dad's family are doctors. Everyone. And I thought, if I can find something else that can make me happy, especially as I hear them complain about the changes in medicine why not do that? And research could be it... I suppose I won't know until I try... But... I don't want to go.


If I don't go, I'm not sure I could even apply this year. I would have to ask my letter writers if they could write for me for med school instead, and try to explain what happened. I don't know if I feel comfortable doing that.

Next year my state school won't accept my September 2014 MCAT... We only have one state school where I live.

And what would I do for the year? I prefer research but I already have such a strong research experience I feel I should get more clinical hours.

Part of me feels I have betrayed the typical premed path and have shown such a grievous lack of commitment I need to take a couple years to prove to myself and to others I am serious about this.... But in all honesty I would just prefer to move on with life and go back to school as soon as possible.

TLDR - Fell off the well-defined plan I had for myself. I could go to a top program for chemistry and try to become the worlds most half-hearted chemist, or I need to figure out a plan to get myself back on track for med school.

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[Lord Boko]

Please, for the love of god, don't go to grad school just to become "the world's most half-hearted chemist". That sounds so sad. If I were in your position I'd either ask the letter writers to rewrite the letters for medschool or take a year off and do something, anything else. You sound like you REALLY don't want to do this chemistry program.

 

[ryanr]

"I don't even like chemistry that much or the careers it would offer me."

^ This sums it up. If that's the case, then don't pursue a chemistry PhD and resign yourself to a career that you don't want.

If you think a career in medicine will be fulfilling and that's what you want, go for it.

 

[Pasmal]

Getting new LORs shouldn't be a worry, that shouldn't be too hard.

You still have time to apply, but start working NOW. Get working on your primary app, come up with a school list (SDN can help), tell your letter writers to change PhD to MD and get your transcripts together so you can send them in for verification as soon as possible.

Figure out if medicine is for you while applying. Even if you don't end up going, applying is a small price to pay given that it seems to be your top choice at the moment. The risk of having to wait 2 years and retake your mcat is too great IMO.

Edit: props on stats

 

[PantherPride]

Getting new LORs shouldn't be a worry, that shouldn't be too hard.

You still have time to apply, but start working NOW. Get working on your primary app, come up with a school list (SDN can help), tell your letter writers to change PhD to MD and get your transcripts together so you can send them in for verification as soon as possible.

Figure out if medicine is for you while applying. Even if you don't end up going, applying is a small price to pay given that it seems to be your top choice at the moment. The risk of having to wait 2 years and retake your mcat is too great IMO.

Edit: props on stats

Agreed, applying this cycle is very practical. Basically, you can submit an application and wait to get that verified/prepare secondaries while your LOR's get prepared. Considering its early May, you have more than a month to get your app prepared for it to be considered early.

And if you don't want to go for your PhD, don't do it. You will be miserable if you go to grad school if you are already feeling this negative about it.

 

[Pacna]

You will be miserable if you go to grad school if you are already feeling this negative about it.

x10000000

Not worth. Abort.

 

[sazerac]

Who cares what we think. I want to know what @QofQuimica thinks. She would be older and wiser than any of us on this topic.

 

[Mad Jack]

Don't do it!!!! See if you can delay matriculation and apply med in the mean time.

 

[Goro]

While all new endeavors are fraught with anxiety, you really, really have to have the fire in the belly to go for a PhD in something.

Therefore, listen to your gut, and either ask for a deferral from your program, or just drop out now.

Go be a barista or something while you figure out what you want to do.

And don't choose Medicine as a career because it's just another choice. Work with patients to see if that's really for you. Medicine is a calling, like being a priest or a fireman.

Teaching moment! Did any of you watch the recent documentary on PBS "Cancer: Emperor of All Maladies"? There's a clip in featuring Robert Weinberg, who discovered the first human oncogene, and the first tumor suppressor gene. he said that Science is a great field for manic-depressives, because most of the time, your experiments don't work. but they do, it's cause for great elation, and that keeps us going back to the bench as well!

And having run a gazillion gels myself, at the end of the day, when I generate some good data, I get to find out something that until that point, was known only to God.

Throwaway because this is gonna be pretty identifying....

I'm graduating in a few days. I have no plans for the future.

..... Except for the fact I enrolled in a top 3 chemistry PhD program a few weeks ago.

I don't feel excited about going. I am dreading moving across the country. I don't even like chemistry that much or the careers it would offer me.

I was premed until last November when I decided last second to apply and see if I found a program I loved. I have a 3.9 GPA, 36 MCAT, clinical volunteering, etc... I have all the boxes checked pretty much.

And then I asked my professors for letters of recommendation for grad school. I was admitted to all these amazing programs. I visited. I enjoyed my visits.

April 15 (grad school version of April 30) came and I didn't know what to do, I felt I needed more time to decide and, honestly, I thought worst case scenario was I would leave with a masters and apply to med school.

But now, I don't want to go. And I don't know if that's because I'm just scared of moving far away (if this was something I was passionate about, I think I wouldn't be so worried about being homesick) or if I am actually at the point where I can't try to force my foot into a shoe that won't fit any longer.

The great thing about research, the reason why I applied, is because it's very satisfying when things work. I like answering the fundamental questions. But I don't think any research career would be fulfilling in the long term, not without something to keep me grounded to reality. I feel like researchers often forget that at the end of the day they're just running a goddamn gel, they can share their buffers, etc.

But I also don't know if medicine is for me. I think academically I am quite capable. All the shadowing I have done made me really excited and really enthused about that career path (should have shadowed over fall break to have prevented myself from applying to grad school). I don't feel that way about anything else.

But I wanted to try to do something else. All of my dad's family are doctors. Everyone. And I thought, if I can find something else that can make me happy, especially as I hear them complain about the changes in medicine why not do that? And research could be it... I suppose I won't know until I try... But... I don't want to go.


If I don't go, I'm not sure I could even apply this year. I would have to ask my letter writers if they could write for me for med school instead, and try to explain what happened. I don't know if I feel comfortable doing that.

Next year my state school won't accept my September 2014 MCAT... We only have one state school where I live.

And what would I do for the year? I prefer research but I already have such a strong research experience I feel I should get more clinical hours.

Part of me feels I have betrayed the typical premed path and have shown such a grievous lack of commitment I need to take a couple years to prove to myself and to others I am serious about this.... But in all honesty I would just prefer to move on with life and go back to school as soon as possible.

TLDR - Fell off the well-defined plan I had for myself. I could go to a top program for chemistry and try to become the worlds most half-hearted chemist, or I need to figure out a plan to get myself back on track for med school.

 

[lostgirlthrowaway]

Thank you everyone for your replies! You've given me a lot to think about.

I got an email today from my program asking for a description of my research interests to help start matching me with an advisor. I looked at the form and just felt so dead inside - I have NO specific research interests - I feel like I could lend my brain and my hands to just about any project and eventually enjoy the problem solving involved.

And so I will be taking a year off to regain the sense of purpose that I have lost over the course of the past 6 months.

 

[deleted577188]

While all new endeavors are fraught with anxiety, you really, really have to have the fire in the belly to go for a PhD in something.

Therefore, listen to your gut, and either ask for a deferral from your program, or just drop out now.

Go be a barista or something while you figure out what you want to do.

And don't choose Medicine as a career because it's just another choice. Work with patients to see if that's really for you. Medicine is a calling, like being a priest or a fireman.

Teaching moment! Did any of you watch the recent documentary on PBS "Cancer: Emperor of All Maladies"? There's a clip in featuring Robert Weinberg, who discovered the first human oncogene, and the first tumor suppressor gene. he said that Science is a great field for manic-depressives, because most of the time, your experiments don't work. but they do, it's cause for great elation, and that keeps us going back to the bench as well!

And having run a gazillion gels myself, at the end of the day, when I generate some good data, I get to find out something that until that point, was known only to God.

What is your PhD in? Or is that TMI?

 

[Goro]

I could tell you, but then I'd have to reject you!

What is your PhD in? Or is that TMI?

 

[lostgirlthrowaway]

While all new endeavors are fraught with anxiety, you really, really have to have the fire in the belly to go for a PhD in something.

Therefore, listen to your gut, and either ask for a deferral from your program, or just drop out now.

Go be a barista or something while you figure out what you want to do.

And don't choose Medicine as a career because it's just another choice. Work with patients to see if that's really for you. Medicine is a calling, like being a priest or a fireman.

Teaching moment! Did any of you watch the recent documentary on PBS "Cancer: Emperor of All Maladies"? There's a clip in featuring Robert Weinberg, who discovered the first human oncogene, and the first tumor suppressor gene. he said that Science is a great field for manic-depressives, because most of the time, your experiments don't work. but they do, it's cause for great elation, and that keeps us going back to the bench as well!

And having run a gazillion gels myself, at the end of the day, when I generate some good data, I get to find out something that until that point, was known only to God.

One line in your response, Goro, really stuck with me and is the reason I logged into my throwaway account and came back to this thread... Warning - this is literally just me thinking out loud.

"Don't choose medicine as a career just because it's another choice."

I agree with this 100%, which is why I'm gonna sacrifice the ability to go to my state school in 2016 and think things through. Medicine was something I always was interested in, always thought I wanted to do... Until I got to college and really started to research the downsides of the career (and really started to consider the complaints of my family).. In addition how competitive the admissions process is really scares me, I guess. Having to prove that I am worth the investment and that I am capable, when I know I could be successful doing something else that's easier to get into, but with it's own challenges (like science, business).

Obviously, I have really tried to consider options outside of medicine. But every other career path, the negatives far out way the positives (to me). I love teaching, but I need more mental stimulation than planning new lessons. I love the problem solving aspect of research, but I see nothing for myself career-wise after grad school. Tenure track is too intense for someone like me who lacks vision. I'm not interested in going into industry, or dental school, or law school, or starting my own business. I want to do something meaningful, but also is intellectually stimulating (and these two criteria mean different things to different people.)

Does this mean, by process of elimination that I want to be a doctor? I don't know. I'm not sure how I can tell. I suppose I should add I'm not the kind of person that gets excited easily. It's one of the reasons I think research long-term is not for me. My lab mates are more enthused by my results than I ever am (and it's my project!). I absolutely loved the shadowing I did. That's what really had me sold - every time I shadowed I was always so certain that medicine was absolutely for me. The relationships these doctors had with their patients, the knowledge they had... These were people I felt I wanted to be. I wanted to do the things they did and know the things they knew. Back in the lab day in and day out, I guess things got.... Occluded.

I suppose my question to you is, how do I know for sure, that medicine is for me? Beyond shadowing, beyond volunteering? I suppose my main reservations are I'm just worried adcoms will sense somehow on some subconscious level that I'm not as gung-ho as other people are, and that I will not get in. I see my friends who just never even considered anything else, but I'm too cynical for that... Or maybe it's just not for me.

 

[Goro]

Medicine is a calling, like being a priest or a policeman.

What does your heart tell you????

I suppose my question to you is, how do I know for sure, that medicine is for me? Beyond shadowing, beyond volunteering? I suppose my main reservations are I'm just worried adcoms will sense somehow on some subconscious level that I'm not as gung-ho as other people are, and that I will not get in. I see my friends who just never even considered anything else, but I'm too cynical for that... Or maybe it's just not for me.[/QUOTE]

 

[deleted577188]

I could tell you, but then I'd have to reject you!

Aw lol

 

[StudyLater]

You get to share buffers without getting yelled at? Lucky.

In all seriousness. You sound set to go to apply this cycle, and you've got, what, a whole month (or so) before amcas opens? Get on the letter writers for a rewrite - which will probably entail simply replacing such sentences as "I think he would be great for grad school because..." with "I think he would be great for med school because..." You said yourself you've got all the boxes checked (although hours for shadowing/volunteering would be helpful to know); if that's really true, why would you punish yourself with an additional year off?

Sorry, I'm just not getting this. No one (in the med school arena) even has to know you applied to a grad school at all.

Oh, and for the record: your GPA/MCAT are excellent. Coupled with nice ECs (which it sounds like you have), you're leading the applicant pack and definitely have a shot at top 20s. Not only can you get into med school, you'd probably get into a great one.

 

[MPHOrtho13]

And so I will be taking a year off to regain the sense of purpose that I have lost over the course of the past 6 months.

So sorry to hear about that--you sound a lot like my best friend in grad school. He was also a brilliant problem-solver who was also in the exact same situation as you... not an easy place to be! Unlike your situation; however, his 'med school crisis' began in his second year of his Ivy League PhD program. He was working on his advisor's obscure research seven days a week, and it was soul-crushing. When he first told me about his secret med school plans (I was in another grad program, with the intention of going to med school after), I secretly believed his doubts were more about having gone directly into a PhD program from undergrad, then it was about being about the MD being his true calling. Nevertheless, I owed it to him to support his journey and to introduce him to as many docs as possible.

By the end of 1st semester, 2nd year, he decided to take the spring MCAT, leave his program with a masters that spring, and apply to med school that summer during a gap year. He got so far as to tell his PhD advisor that he was leaving (to which his advisor replied, 'like heck you're not'... only he didn't use the word heck). After some intense soul-searching and additional physician shadowing; however, he realized that he was much better suited for the PhD. So he cancelled his MCAT registration and has never looked back. Today, four years later, he's now loves his research (which is definitely not something he felt in his first 2 years), is about to graduate, and is by far the happiest I've ever seen him. Even though medicine wasn't right for him, I'm so glad he took his time to consider it because it reaffirmed his interest in his current career path. Main point: don't count chem out just yet.

For me, medicine was a calling since I was a child, but I've had many doubts along the way. Taking time off was the best thing I could have ever done-- I got an intense clinical research job that allowed me to experience both sides. It also led me to go to grad school before med school. Who knows, maybe at this time next year you will realize that a PhD in Chem is right for you. Or maybe it'll be a MD/PhD. Or something else entirely. Either way, I'm thrilled that you're taking the time off. It's a brave decision, and I can assure you that it will be challenging, but 110% worth it.

If I were you, I'd shadow/work with additional physicians ASAP (especially dual degree docs like MDs or DOs with PhDs, MPHs, MBAs, or JDs, etc. to experience other sides of medicine), submit your primaries this June, and explore job opportunities you would have never previously considered (I worked in ACA reform and it was actually really eye-opening). Another group of people I'd consider speaking to are PharmD/MBAs... People I've met with that degree combination do some insanely cool stuff. Anyway, by the end of the summer, with some more shadowing under your belt, some long discussions with your loved ones/mentors, and the misery of primary applications behind you, you should have a lot more clarity.

I'd also consider telling your mentors that you're thinking of med school, but you may also end up applying to other programs later in the fall as a back-up (not necessarily chem if you truly hate it that much). I applied to both grad and med while working and it's not as bad as you'd think because med school secondaries should be done months before most other grad cycle deadlines. In your situation, most advisors will be surprisingly understanding of applying to both (pre-med committees... not so much) and will gladly change the words on their recs from PhD to MD or whatever it is that you want to pursue).

You owe it yourself to explore. Don't worry, it will all work out. Enjoy this year-- I'm sure you will do great things.

 

[MDDoubleD]

I'm assuming you're smart enough to get a decent job with that chem BS, work things out for a few years.

You should never go to ANY grad school (but especially med school) on a half-hearted whim.

Medicine breaks people who WANT to do it, I can't imagine you'll have a nice life as an MD.

 

[NeuResurgens]

Do not do what you don't want to do. It sounds like you might shy away from medicine simply because of your family's history.. Don't let that sway you if you loved your experience while shadowing! If medicine feels right, then you can overcome any challenges that changes in the profession might present.

Do you enjoy research at all, or just not chemistry? Because you might be a good candidate for MD/PhD if you decide you like medicine AND research.

 

[MDDoubleD]

Do not do what you don't want to do. It sounds like you might shy away from medicine simply because of your family's history.. Don't let that sway you if you loved your experience while shadowing! If medicine feels right, then you can overcome any challenges that changes in the profession might present.

Do you enjoy research at all, or just not chemistry? Because you might be a good candidate for MD/PhD if you decide you like medicine AND research.

I don't mean to be an Internet ahole but I'm afraid that's bull. The "challenges" of medicine break great men, they break smart men, they break the weak and the disinterested, at the end of the day very few people are actually actually cut out for it. Wanting to be a doctor/it "feeling right" will not save you, that counts for nought in the long run and thinking that way will just make you a crap doctor.

 

[NeuResurgens]

I don't mean to be an Internet ahole but I'm afraid that's bull. The "challenges" of medicine break great men, they break smart men, they break the weak and the disinterested, at the end of the day very few people are actually actually cut out for it. Wanting to be a doctor/it "feeling right" will not save you, that counts for nought in the long run and thinking that way will just make you a crap doctor.

What do you then suggest as prerequisites for being a doctor, outside of having a passion for what it is doctors do (as well as a commitment to learn the necessary skills, obviously)? I may be misinterpreting, but you make it sound like the problems can't be overcome, period, no matter how you feel about the profession.

I've found my love for the field has overcome multiple dissuading factors, some of them close family members trying to discourage me from it. I love what doctors do and the problems faced by them is just more motivation for me to get in to try and help. Yes, there are issues and I am aware of them. But the opportunity to use science, reasoning and compassion to assist people who are struggling with illness cannot be beat for me.

 

[MDDoubleD]

What do you then suggest as prerequisites for being a doctor, outside of having a passion for what it is doctors do (as well as a commitment to learn the necessary skills, obviously)? I may be misinterpreting, but you make it sound like the problems can't be overcome, period, no matter how you feel about the profession.

I've found my love for the field has overcome multiple dissuading factors, some of them close family members trying to discourage me from it. I love what doctors do and the problems faced by them is just more motivation for me to get in to try and help. Yes, there are issues and I am aware of them. But the opportunity to use science, reasoning and compassion to assist people who are struggling with illness cannot be beat for me.

Actually wanting to do what doctors really do. In essence, we take bodies that don't work and make them work. The lifestyle sucks and doing it for the money is a bad idea, we aren't huggers or hand holders, we make bodies work. That's our thing and you better be dedicated to doing that. It also helps to start off fairly intelligent.

 

[NeuResurgens]

Actually wanting to do what doctors really do. In essence, we take bodies that don't work and make them work. The lifestyle sucks and doing it for the money is a bad idea, we aren't huggers or hand holders, we make bodies work. That's our thing and you better be dedicated to doing that. It also helps to start off fairly intelligent.

I thought that's what I meant by being passionate about medicine, I might not have been clear enough. I'm not just referring to passion for the science of medicine, but about most of the aspects of being a doctor. I think many of the negative aspects become less daunting when you find you truly enjoy the work.

This is difficult to quantify, since what counts as a "deal breaker" drawback might vary from person to person. Perhaps I'm just speaking from my own personal reasons for pursuing medicine, but I find that the problems faced are worth tackling if it means I get to help "make bodies work!"

 

[MDDoubleD]

I thought that's what I meant by being passionate about medicine, I might not have been clear enough. I'm not just referring to passion for the science of medicine, but about most of the aspects of being a doctor. I think many of the negative aspects become less daunting when you find you truly enjoy the work.

This is difficult to quantify, since what counts as a "deal breaker" drawback might vary from person to person. Perhaps I'm just speaking from my own personal reasons for pursuing medicine, but I find that the problems faced are worth tackling if it means I get to help "make bodies work!"

This isn't really directed at you personally, but I think a lot of pre-meds wind up in medical school out of a vague desire to "help people" or an interest in science or both. Don't get me wrong, that's entirely admirable but it ignores the mechanics of how you'll really spend your days (and nights and anytime else) and quite a few of these people burn out because they were never really fit for it.

 

[rkearl27]

It looks like you've made you're decision but i wanted to through in my perspective as well. I decided to shoot for med school late in the game and I knew I'd be taking a gap year so I went to grad school. I had it all planned out to master out of the chem phd program in one year and so it worked out very smoothly for me. Doing something like this takes planning and I'm sure depends on the program.

 

[NeuResurgens]

This isn't really directed at you personally, but I think a lot of pre-meds wind up in medical school out of a vague desire to "help people" or an interest in science or both. Don't get me wrong, that's entirely admirable but it ignores the mechanics of how you'll really spend your days (and nights and anytime else) and quite a few of these people burn out because they were never really fit for it.

Oh, yeah I completely see what you're saying here. I'll definitely be more clear in the future giving advice in this regard - vaguely wanting to help people or liking science isn't a substitute for truly understanding (and enjoying) how it is doctors actually go about their jobs!

 

[moisne]

Go be a barista or something while you figure out what you want to do.

ROFL - that was great. <3 made my day - while I procrastinate studying...

 

[Edv14]

You might think about scribing for awhile as one option. You should have a pretty good chance at a minimum to get an interview with a scribe company with your GPA and experiences, and you'll really be able to see what being a doctor is like on a daily basis as you'll spend your entire day with them... also, it will give you the opportunity to earn at least one new LOR or more.

 

[UTUT]

apply to texas schools, mcat accepted from last 5 years. Cheap tuition even for OOS