Infamous "pre med major"

[Chemistry>Physics]

Of course, at least one time in our lives we've heard someone reference to the notorious "pre med major". Every time I hear those words a part of me cringes, and another part of me has an intense SDN urge to correct them. But the only thing stopping me is the possibility that maybe there is a pre med major at some fluke school in flukeville.

So my question is, has anyone ever seen a major (I.e. Not "Chemistry B.S. With pre medical focus") that is maybe like "pre medical studies"? I couldn't imagine such a thing happening, but with the amount of for-profit colleges now a days I'm not so sure.

Documented evidence of a pre med major listed in a course book or university website would be a real solid.

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[Kelevra]

Apparently the Princeton Review does: http://www.princetonreview.com/majors.aspx?cip=511102. Obviously, they're not a university.

And from their context, they mean "pre-med" to be any major that is generally considered to be filled with the pre-reqs. But the wording of the page is confusing for students that don't know that.

But I suppose it does demonstrate the looseness of the term, and that some institutions may actually have a program called "pre-med" that just has classes that they consider reqs and useful.

 

[Mad Jack]

They exist: http://bulletin.hofstra.edu/preview_program.php?catoid=53&poid=5437&returnto=3019

 

[RedPhys]

I think anyone who studies "Health Sciences", or something similar-sounding, is a very confused pre-med who thinks that is a legitimate major.

 

[Mad Jack]

I think anyone who studies "Health Sciences", or something similar-sounding, is a very confused pre-med who thinks that is a legitimate major.

Some schools legit have a B.S. in Premedical Studies though, with Hofstra being one.

I've already expressed my loathing for the term premed multiple times on this forum- it's just a dumb term most students use to give themselves a status designation they have in no way earned. You want to be a doctor and you are talking the courses, fine, but that really doesn't mean anything. If I want to go into politics someday so I'm pursuing a law degree, I don't call myself a pre-Congressman. If I want to be in management so I'm talking business courses I don't call myself pre-management. It's just a silly term IMO, moreso in the way people attempt to gain credibility through its use than as a term itself.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Regarding a pre-med major:
On a scale from 1 to a bad idea that seems like invading Russia in the winter
-@claduva94

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Some schools legit have a B.S. in Premedical Studies though, with Hofstra being one.

I've already expressed my loathing for the term premed multiple times on this forum- it's just a dumb term most students use to give themselves a status designation they have in no way earned. You want to be a doctor and you are talking the courses, fine, but that really doesn't mean anything. If I want to go into politics someday so I'm pursuing a law degree, I don't call myself a pre-Congressman. If I want to be in management so I'm talking business courses I don't call myself pre-management. It's just a silly term IMO, moreso in the way people attempt to gain credibility through its use than as a term itself.

And at the other extreme, there are med students who classify themselves as "non-students"

 

[~Soñadora~]

There is literally a premed major in my university. Although why would you major in premed instead of in bio or chemistry or something else is beyond me. But at least in my university, premed is a major and you can get a bachelor's degree in Premed.

 

[baxt1412]

Yes many schools have actual "pre-med" majors.


but, it doesn't matter what you major in as long as you meet the pre-reqs and smash your MCAT and GPA.
degrees aren't even required at many schools (not sure if applicable to all schools, so I won't make that blanket statement)

u could major in art, get a 4.0 sGPA, and a 35 on your MCAT and be golden. sometimes "unconventional" degrees can actually help people.

 

[Lucca]

I think on one of the AAMC charts it shows that people with those kinds of majors or related majors like "Health Sciences" or whatever do the worst in the application process. They also have the lowest GPA and MCAT.

 

[Mad Jack]

Yeah, I have a feeling adcoms would look suspiciously at a legit premed major as being one-dimensional and lacking interests outside of medicine. It wouldn't help, but could certainly hurt.

 

[baxt1412]

what about a pre-med major at a liberal arts school? I'm sure this situation exists somewhere.

I went to a liberal arts school and hated it mostly just because the philosophy and theology departments acted extraordinarily elitist and did not even offer relatively easy courses even though, for example, our science departments offer classes like "chemistry of cooking", etc. I realize that this stuff seems easy to me because I was a science major, but trust me it was a common complaint at my school from all majors that phil/theo were extraordinarily difficult even in the 101 classes. but I can see how it definitely made my knowledge more well-rounded.


I can't imagine a major being a deciding factor in an admissions decision if all other things were considered equal (GPA, MCAT). I feel like ECs and interview would take precedence over actual major and even then, it would be next to impossible to split that many hairs of identical applicants.

 

[Womb Raider]

Better question: who cares?

Pre-med does not confer any sort of advantage or entitlements, so not sure what the problem is there. It's simply a way of explicitly showing what you want to do after you graduate, the same as saying "I'm a business major" (when most aren't majoring in 'business') pre-law, pre-dent, etc.... In other words, it's an extremely easy and convenient way to bypass the following conversation:

What's your major?
Chemistry
Oh, wow that's impressive! My [insert random relative here] studied Chemistry! He does this and this now, lives here, and makes this much money. It's such a fascinating field. Do you know what area you want to specialize in? I suggest you pursue this and this......etc...
15 minutes later: I just want to go to medical school

The other conversation that is bypassed is explaining what your major actually entails to the typical ignorant super-talkative acquaintance.

Give me a break guys, your "analness" is showing. 99% of pre-meds don't think they're entitled to anything for saying they're pre-med. The 1% that do, well they'll probably feel just as entitled if they call themselves something else - it's their fault not yours. Why let it bother you?

 

[LizzyM]

I think on one of the AAMC charts it shows that people with those kinds of majors or related majors like "Health Sciences" or whatever do the worst in the application process. They also have the lowest GPA and MCAT.

I've long suspected that many of the applicants in that "Health Sciences" category are non-trads who are trying to transition from another health care profession. They weren't pre-med in college and didn't go all out for a perfect GPA and they hope to get some traction with their clinical experience to make up for a lower than average MCAT. It doesn't always work out that way.

 

[TxC]

My school has a premed major (http://science.psu.edu/premed/majorinfo).

A lot of people who begin college as premed majors aren't even premeds anymore. I think a lot of them didn't even make it to ochem.

 

[altblue]

Okay, now I feel a bit strange for saying I'm pre-med. Is it bad if I do so just so people don't think I'm going into education or research?

 

[Womb Raider]

Okay, now I feel a bit strange for saying I'm pre-med. Is it bad if I do so just so people don't think I'm going into education or research?

If I were you... I wouldn't answer "premed" to the question "What is your major?" If it really isn't your major... If you want to circumvent the boring dialogue that ensues just follow up with something like: "...and hoping to go to medical school after college."

But to answer other questions like: "What are your plans for college?" I think "pre-med" is perfectly fine.

 

[DokterMom]

what about a pre-med major at a liberal arts school? I'm sure this situation exists somewhere.

I went to a liberal arts school and hated it mostly just because the philosophy and theology departments acted extraordinarily elitist and did not even offer relatively easy courses even though, for example, our science departments offer classes like "chemistry of cooking", etc. I realize that this stuff seems easy to me because I was a science major, but trust me it was a common complaint at my school from all majors that phil/theo were extraordinarily difficult even in the 101 classes. but I can see how it definitely made my knowledge more well-rounded.

Hey! Don't knock Chemistry of Cooking -- Most useful course I ever took.

But not loving a "Premed Major" What exactly could you do with that employment-wise if you do not get into medical school? It's like your own resume proclaims you a failure for the rest of your life...

 

[Koikoi]

I am one of those people with that useless degree. I was a naive international undergrad student at a liberal arts college getting a useless degree. If knew back then what I know now I would have gone for a different major, I worked as a phlebotomist at a plasma center for a long time because that's all I could swing with my "degree". I did do a post bacc in Medical lab sciences so now I can at least get a better job.

 

[mmmcdowe]

I would strongly discourage being a "pre-med" major if your school has one (mine did). It in no way prepares you better for medical school and has utterly no job market potential and provides no expertise for the application towards research. No matter how much you are sure you will be a doctor, do yourself a favor and get some other major. There is nothing more uninteresting.

 

[ProudMD]

Yes many schools have actual "pre-med" majors.


but, it doesn't matter what you major in as long as you meet the pre-reqs and smash your MCAT and GPA.
degrees aren't even required at many schools (not sure if applicable to all schools, so I won't make that blanket statement)

u could major in art, get a 4.0 sGPA, and a 35 on your MCAT and be golden. sometimes "unconventional" degrees can actually help people.

Great points.

Based on my experiences, "unconventional" degrees can help even without smashing the GPA and MCAT.

 

[Sana504]

Some schools legit have a B.S. in Premedical Studies though, with Hofstra being one.

I've already expressed my loathing for the term premed multiple times on this forum- it's just a dumb term most students use to give themselves a status designation they have in no way earned. You want to be a doctor and you are talking the courses, fine, but that really doesn't mean anything. If I want to go into politics someday so I'm pursuing a law degree, I don't call myself a pre-Congressman. If I want to be in management so I'm talking business courses I don't call myself pre-management. It's just a silly term IMO, moreso in the way people attempt to gain credibility through its use than as a term itself.

Wow, this is really anal. All calling youreself a "pre-med" means that you have aspirations to attend medical school, nothing more. It's just a shortened answer to the question "Oh, what are you intend to do with your major?" I've never heard it used any other way. I can't believe that someone would get uppity about this, yes someone wouldn't call themselves a "pre-congressman" because it's generally a term used for professional graduate schools, but it's valid to say "I hope to go into politics someday".

 

[Fedekz]

I hope more universities adopt official pre-med majors. Will make me feel better about my psych major, and MAYBE give it more weight

 

[swolebrah]

My school has these bull **** degrees that are called "healthcare studies". All the premed's in my classes take it for easier classes since the school is located under interdisciplinary studies school. I guess its smart since the idea is to work smarter not harder, however it just blows my mind how the school came up with a name for that degree. If you weren't going into medical school, exactly what could a degree in healthcare studies in this economy do for you lol.

 

[miszfifi820]

I think anyone who studies "Health Sciences", or something similar-sounding, is a very confused pre-med who thinks that is a legitimate major.

im confused on whats wrong with having a Health Sciences major. If you go straight into med school, you wont even be using your equally useless 'real' degree anyway.

oh wait, some of you might be those who majored in physiology and neurobiology with a minor in aerospace engineering, and feel uberly accomplished about that even though you didnt use the degree, just like the person sitting right next to you on accepted students day that majored in psych

i majored in health sciences and it allowed me freedom. I took my pre-med courses and took public health course, in addition to advanced physics courses and it all counted towards my degree, studied abroad, and I picked up 2 minors.

I would strongly discourage being a "pre-med" major if your school has one (mine did). It in no way prepares you better for medical school and has utterly no job market potential and provides no expertise for the application towards research. No matter how much you are sure you will be a doctor, do yourself a favor and get some other major. There is nothing more uninteresting.

job prospects, i agree, but like was said earlier and has been beaten to death .. you can major in anything and go to med school and most likely succeed (as long as youre good enough to be accepted)

 

[miszfifi820]

My school has these bull **** degrees that are called "healthcare studies". All the premed's in my classes take it for easier classes since the school is located under interdisciplinary studies school. I guess its smart since the idea is to work smarter not harder, however it just blows my mind how the school came up with a name for that degree. If you weren't going into medical school, exactly what could a degree in healthcare studies in this economy do for you lol.

umm.. what exactly can just a bachelors in biology do for you? get you a research assistant job? in this day and age, what can a bachelors in almost anything do for you?

 

[RedPhys]

im confused on whats wrong with having a Health Sciences major. If you go straight into med school, you wont even be using your equally useless 'real' degree anyway.

i majored in health sciences and it allowed me freedom. I took my pre-med courses and took public health course, in addition to advanced physics courses and it all counted towards my degree, studied abroad, and I picked up 2 minors.

The issue I have with those 'Health Sciences' type of majors is that there is usually no depth to anything being studied. If you study Philosophy, you end up learning a lot about thinking, moral, ethics, etc. If you study Physics, you go very deep into how everything works and how to model it. Traditional majors have depth, which end up requiring building up concepts as the courses become more advanced.

Good for you in having taken the freedom to take advanced physics, and get two minors. I think such a 'free' option ends up luring a lot of people (like my cousin, who is now in nursing school) into a false sense of security and deprives them of some critical thinking that you have to face in completing a more traditional major.

 

[miszfifi820]

The issue I have with those 'Health Sciences' type of majors is that there is usually no depth to anything being studied. If you study Philosophy, you end up learning a lot about thinking, moral, ethics, etc. If you study Physics, you go very deep into how everything works and how to model it. Traditional majors have depth, which end up requiring building up concepts as the courses become more advanced.

Good for you in having taken the freedom to take advanced physics, and get two minors. I think such a 'free' option ends up luring a lot of people (like my cousin, who is now in nursing school) into a false sense of security and deprives them of some critical thinking that you have to face in completing a more traditional major.

I understand your point of view, however like everything else in college, it depends how much you put into.
because the same can be said about general 'biology'. biology is such a broad major - there's marine biology, neurobiology, genetics etc. and unless the student decides to go above and beyond to attain depth, such as working in a lab, doing a research thesis, tutoring a course (all which I did with my health science degree) they wont attain that security.. the only thing they have mastered is rote memorization. but thats just my opinion

 

[mmmcdowe]

im confused on whats wrong with having a Health Sciences major. If you go straight into med school, you wont even be using your equally useless 'real' degree anyway.

oh wait, some of you might be those who majored in physiology and neurobiology with a minor in aerospace engineering, and feel uberly accomplished about that even though you didnt use the degree, just like the person sitting right next to you on accepted students day that majored in psych

i majored in health sciences and it allowed me freedom. I took my pre-med courses and took public health course, in addition to advanced physics courses and it all counted towards my degree, studied abroad, and I picked up 2 minors.



job prospects, i agree, but like was said earlier and has been beaten to death .. you can major in anything and go to med school and most likely succeed (as long as youre good enough to be accepted)

A large portion of people are not "good enough" (last time I checked 50+% of health science majors didn't get accepted) or, more commonly, change their minds. Even the smartest and hardest working person should have the humility to accept that there's always a chance of going into something other than medicine. I had no trouble picking up a second major unrelated to science. You don't have to do pre-med major to have freedom. Just don't do engineering if you want freedom .

 

[miszfifi820]

A large portion of people are not "good enough" (last time I checked 50+% of health science majors didn't get accepted) or, more commonly, change their minds. Even the smartest and hardest working person should have the humility to accept that there's always a chance of going into something other than medicine.

last time i check 56% of ALL applicants dont get accepted ... maybe its the health sciences students skewing the stats...

health sciences isnt just for medicine, so i dont think students who major in that are not being humble. some students in that major, literally have no idea what they want to do, but the major allows them the freedom to complete the requirements for various pre-health professions. As a reminder, im sspeaking for health sciences major, not 'pre-med' major

 

[mmmcdowe]

last time i check 56% of ALL applicants dont get accepted ... maybe its the health sciences students skewing the stats...

The rate of acceptance for health science majors is 34%, the lowest of any group by 6% from the next lowest, so yes you are correct they are skewing things though probably not by a statistically significant margin when you factor in the relative small size of that group.

https://www.aamc.org/download/321496/data/factstable18.pdf

 

[DokterMom]

If you go to medical school and become a physician, the name of your major probably won't matter in the slightest. It's not the kind of thing anyone mentions --

But if you don't - your choice or theirs - then your degree and (generally also) major will often appear on your resume for the rest of your life -- or at least be asked in job interviews. I personally would find it embarrassing to be asked in every job interview what my major was and having to answer 'Pre-Medicall Studies' when there was no medical school that followed.

Not that a BS in Biology is eminently more useful -- Just a face-saving alternative.

 

[Clubmeh]

According to UNC's admissions data, there are individuals who came in with a 'Pre-Medical' major.

http://www.med.unc.edu/admit/about-unc/our-students/demographics/demographics

 

[Willy38]

I've long suspected that many of the applicants in that "Health Sciences" category are non-trads who are trying to transition from another health care profession. They weren't pre-med in college and didn't go all out for a perfect GPA and they hope to get some traction with their clinical experience to make up for a lower than average MCAT. It doesn't always work out that way.

I always thought that a college major was irrelevant in the admissions process. My brother is currently a Health Sciences major thinking he wants to do med/dental school. Can you comment on whether or not this is a factor ? I'd like to be able to give him the best advice possible.

 

[Gibbward]

I graduated with a BS in Health Science from a liberal arts college and I agree with @miszfifi820 on everything! I understand why there's a stigma with this major, because there really isn't a set job market for this kind of major, and one wouldn't necessarily get an "in depth" education of a specific field.

1. Nonetheless, at least in my college, there isn't much of a difference between a bio and health science major really. I still took the same pre-reqs as everyone, and took the same biochem, genetics, and mol bio classes. The only difference was that I took Human Development, Public Health, and Clinical Psych instead of evolutionary bio, organismal bio and another random upper div bio class. I even had the time to squeek in a Chemistry minor (not that it really makes a difference but whatever haha). The point is, I would rather take courses that are interesting to me rather than getting a "nicer" sounding degree.

2. When it comes to the job market, like most other majors, it's all about getting internships, part-time jobs and research opportunities while in college. If you apply for a job with just a bachelors degree to show in your resume, you'll have a difficult time getting employed. With a health science degree, you can dabble into health education, environmental health and other public health endeavors, do research in a variety of fields, work in a health related non-profit, etc.

3. I also disagree with the idea that one cannot develop critical thinking unless one has a traditional major. It's really all about how much you immerse yourself in the material you are given. You can still learn how to piece together information between a public health class, a clinical psych class and a biochem class in order to defend or refute a hypothesis.

 

[WedgeDawg]

I understand your point of view, however like everything else in college, it depends how much you put into.
because the same can be said about general 'biology'. biology is such a broad major - there's marine biology, neurobiology, genetics etc. and unless the student decides to go above and beyond to attain depth, such as working in a lab, doing a research thesis, tutoring a course (all which I did with my health science degree) they wont attain that security.. the only thing they have mastered is rote memorization. but thats just my opinion

Don't know where you've taken biology classes, but at my school biology is almost entirely problem based and has one of the 3 lowest average GPAs of any major/department. The people who only memorize and daily to develop their capacity for critical thinking are the ones who do poorly. It bugs me when people say biology is all rote memorization because if it is, you're studying biology wrong. Heck, some of our tests are even open note and open book and people still get destroyed by them.

 

[Chemistry>Physics]

The rate of acceptance for health science majors is 34%, the lowest of any group by 6% from the next lowest, so yes you are correct they are skewing things though probably not by a statistically significant margin when you factor in the relative small size of that group.

https://www.aamc.org/download/321496/data/factstable18.pdf

thank you for the stats

 

[LizzyM]

I always thought that a college major was irrelevant in the admissions process. My brother is currently a Health Sciences major thinking he wants to do med/dental school. Can you comment on whether or not this is a factor ? I'd like to be able to give him the best advice possible.

The most important things are GPA and MCAT. Major is not as important. There are data from AAMC that show the number of applicants in each subject area (broadly defined), the average GPA and MCAT scores and proportion admitted. It may be less about the major and more about the majority of people who choose a specific major. There is always great amazement that music and philosophy majors have the best odds of admission. What is it about people who choose those majors that make them so successful at the admissions process? What it is about the pool of "health science" majors that make them least likely to be admitted? Keep in mind that this is both new college grads as well as non-trads and career changers.

 

[deleted577188]

I think at my school the closest major which might as well call itself "pre-med" is Biomedical Sience. It's geared strictly towards getting students into professional school, nothing more. It gives them significant research experience and helps with some of the other "check boxes" on the app. Very dry. Also, these are usually the most neurotic pre-meds at my school.

 

[deleted577188]

The most important things are GPA and MCAT. Major is not as important. There are data from AAMC that show the number of applicants in each subject area (broadly defined), the average GPA and MCAT scores and proportion admitted. It may be less about the major and more about the majority of people who choose a specific major. There is always great amazement that music and philosophy majors have the best odds of admission. What is it about people who choose those majors that make them so successful at the admissions process? What it is about the pool of "health science" majors that make them least likely to be admitted? Keep in mind that this is both new college grads as well as non-trads and career changers.

Where is this data? I would love to take a look at it!

 

[Stagg737]

My diploma says that I have a B.A. in pre-medical studies and biology (double major). The biggest thing you get out of an actual pre-med major is the convenience of knowing you'll fulfill all the major pre-reqs med schools require. At our school it was highly encouraged that pre-med majors double up with either bio or chem. The only difference between bio and pre-med for me was that pre-med required me to take calc 1 and genetics while bio required botany. Not that a bachelor's in biology is worth much anymore, but it gives you more to fall back on than just a pre-med degree if things don't work out.

 

[LizzyM]

Where is this data? I would love to take a look at it!

https://www.aamc.org/download/321496/data/factstable18.pdf

 

[Mad Jack]

My school has these bull **** degrees that are called "healthcare studies". All the premed's in my classes take it for easier classes since the school is located under interdisciplinary studies school. I guess its smart since the idea is to work smarter not harder, however it just blows my mind how the school came up with a name for that degree. If you weren't going into medical school, exactly what could a degree in healthcare studies in this economy do for you lol.

About as well as a bio, psych, English, sociology, art, history... Actually, I could go on for days, I'm just gonna stop now.

 

[Mad Jack]

im confused on whats wrong with having a Health Sciences major. If you go straight into med school, you wont even be using your equally useless 'real' degree anyway.

oh wait, some of you might be those who majored in physiology and neurobiology with a minor in aerospace engineering, and feel uberly accomplished about that even though you didnt use the degree, just like the person sitting right next to you on accepted students day that majored in psych

i majored in health sciences and it allowed me freedom. I took my pre-med courses and took public health course, in addition to advanced physics courses and it all counted towards my degree, studied abroad, and I picked up 2 minors.



job prospects, i agree, but like was said earlier and has been beaten to death .. you can major in anything and go to med school and most likely succeed (as long as youre good enough to be accepted)

With less than half of applicants getting into medical school, a degree in Premedical or Health Science Studies may as well be a degree in Career Suicide for the >50% that don't get in. Just as with the Caribbean, I can't recommend a path with a high failure rate that adversely affects the rest of your adult life should you fail.

 

[razzmatazz87]

I am biased because I was also a Health Science major. Not really sure that it is "pointless" I think studying plant biology and invertebrates would be pointless to my future goals, so I did not want to be a dime a dozen Biology major. I took all the pre-reqs, took upper level science classes like Microbio, Biochem, Genetics, Virology, etc. I minored in something I was passionate about

Also, I know a lot more about insurance companies, epidemiology, hospital administration, and prevalent health issues than a run of the mill Biology major.

But thanks for trying to downplay my degree, that's cool.

 

[miszfifi820]

With less than half of applicants getting into medical school, a degree in Premedical or Health Science Studies may as well be a degree in Career Suicide for the >50% that don't get in. Just as with the Caribbean, I can't recommend a path with a high failure rate that adversely affects the rest of your adult life should you fail.

1. @mmmcdowe & @Mad Jack now we all know better.. correlation does not imply causation. even though, they have the lowest acceptance rates, like @LizzyM said, one should not focus on the major, but rather the individuals who enter that major.
In my undergrad, most, not all, Health Sciences majors were individuals who began undergrad as hard science majors, performed poorly, and then switched health science as a way to redeem themselves or as a shortcut, but most of the time, the redemption is not good enough, cum. gpa gets better but science gpa is still in the tank, and if you pair that with a mcat thats reflective of their performance in their hard science courses...rejection.

Once again, this is just a trend I noticed in my undergrad. When I switched to Health Sciences, first thing my advisor said was 'why are you switching, youre doing amazing as a bio major. most people switch because they are performing poorly or cant handle it'
If you put those students in the bio or hard science category, im pretty sure they would still receive a rejection, regardless of the major.

@Mad Jack thats ridiculous to compare health sciences to the Caribbean. you can go to the Caribbean and receive the same step scores/'gpa' as an individual in a US MD school, but that individual in the US will still have an astronomically better chance of landing a residency. If an individual majors in health sciences and receives a competitive gpa and mcat score, they are on the same playing field as any other major with similar stats.

 

[Mad Jack]

1. @mmmcdowe & @Mad Jack now we all know better.. correlation does not imply causation. even though, they have the lowest acceptance rates, like @LizzyM said, one should not focus on the major, but rather the individuals who enter that major.
In my undergrad, most, not all, Health Sciences majors were individuals who began undergrad as hard science majors, performed poorly, and then switched health science as a way to redeem themselves or as a shortcut, but most of the time, the redemption is not good enough, cum. gpa gets better but science gpa is still in the tank, and if you pair that with a mcat thats reflective of their performance in their hard science courses...rejection.

Once again, this is just a trend I noticed in my undergrad. When I switched to Health Sciences, first thing my advisor said was 'why are you switching, youre doing amazing as a bio major. most people switch because they are performing poorly or cant handle it'
If you put those students in the bio or hard science category, im pretty sure they would still receive a rejection, regardless of the major.

@Mad Jack thats ridiculous to compare health sciences to the Caribbean. you can go to the Caribbean and receive the same step scores/'gpa' as an individual in a US MD school, but that individual in the US will still have an astronomically better chance of landing a residency. If an individual majors in health sciences and receives a competitive gpa and mcat score, they are on the same playing field as any other major with similar stats.

It's still a fair comparison in my opinion, because the consequences of failure are similar. And >50% of students don't get into school regardless of major- my point was that Health Sciences dooms those >50% to damn near unemployment, while a bio/chem/physics/math degree can at least open up some doors (teaching K-12, tutoring college students, graduate degree paths, lab and research work, etc). A bio degree is "I hope I get in, because if I don't I'm going to be doing a job that isn't ideal," while a health sciences degree is straight up do or die, and the majority are on the die side of that equation.

 

[Lucca]

Edit: nvm

 

[miszfifi820]

It's still a fair comparison in my opinion, because the consequences of failure are similar. And >50% of students don't get into school regardless of major- my point was that Health Sciences dooms those >50% to damn near unemployment, while a bio/chem/physics/math degree can at least open up some doors (teaching K-12, tutoring college students, graduate degree paths, lab and research work, etc). A bio degree is "I hope I get in, because if I don't I'm going to be doing a job that isn't ideal," while a health sciences degree is straight up do or die, and the majority are on the die side of that equation.

Every single one of those 'alternate' degree paths you mentioned, I have actually completed with my health science degree besides the teaching K-12, but I doubt having a bio degree would really give me a upper hand if i wanted to teach 1st grade.

and graduate degree paths? which grad degree path nowadays has a 'required' undergrad major, rather than required course requirements? Very few. I can go to law school tomorrow if I wanted to.

 

[Mad Jack]

Every single one of those 'alternate' degree paths you mentioned, I have actually completed with my health science degree besides the teaching K-12, but I doubt having a bio degree would really give me a upper hand if i wanted to teach 1st grade.

and graduate degree paths? which grad degree path nowadays has a 'required' undergrad major, rather than required course requirements? Very few. I can go to law school tomorrow if I wanted to.

It's fairly difficult to get a Master's in chem, bio, or physics from a reputable school without having an undergraduate degree in the subject. If you want to actually do something with a Master's or PhD, the name on your diploma matters. As to professional degrees, you are correct- but most of us don't want to be lawyers. I was referring more to traditional MS and PhD degrees.