IRR recall specifically mentioned

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Monty Python

Monty Python

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IRR mentioned In Trump’s order on Friday 27 March.

www.militarytimes.com

After Trump’s order, DoD reviewing how many Guard, Reserve troops to bring back for COVID-19 fight

Details on who will be recalled and when were not immediately released by the White House.
www.militarytimes.com www.militarytimes.com

www.whitehouse.gov

EO to Order the Selected Reserve and Certain Members of the Individual Ready Reserve of the Armed Forces to Active Duty | The White House

By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, including the National Emergencies Act (50 U.S
www.whitehouse.gov www.whitehouse.gov
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Just saw this as well. Specifically says high demand medical capabilities. I hope you folks have your emergency fund loaded and ready to use.

(From the NY Times)
“Trump signed an executive order that allows Defense Secretary Mark T. Esper to order units and individual members “and certain Individual Ready Reserve” members, Chief Pentagon spokesman Jonathan Rath Hoffman said in a statement released just after midnight on Saturday morning. The Individual Ready Reserve comprises former active-duty and reserve service members, who are commonly considered out of the military and rarely recalled.


Hoffman, who could not be reached for comment early Saturday, said that decisions about which people may be activated are still being reviewed. The statement did not address whether anyone will be involuntarily recalled.


“Generally, these members will be persons in Headquarters units and persons with high demand medical capabilities whose call-up would not adversely affect their civilian communities,” Hoffman’s statement said.”
 
I especially liked the last part where it said that the loss of people with headquarters level leadership experience and high demand medical capabilities wouldn’t adversely affect their civilian communities. What a dunce. No need for on the ground leadership and “high demand medical capabilities” during a pandemic crisis!
A97433D9-B147-447A-AD51-E2860512531D.jpeg
 
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The sad thing is many people in the IRR would make a bigger impact staying in their civilian roles.

I knew this would happen. What a cluster****.
 
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This is exactly what my first thought was. I, of course, didn’t expect Trump to take five seconds and think about anything he decides to say. But I have to imagine that in his head there’s an Army of ex-military medical personnel living on 200 acres in Montana, raising their daughter and avoiding society. Like Commando. And we just need to tap in to that resource.
 
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Signing an order allowing the recall of IRR and retirees and actually calling them to AD are two entirely different things.


Now, back to your regularly scheduled panic.
 
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There is absolutely no evidence that the IRR won't get recalled. It probably won't happen tomorrow, but I would bet money it will eventually.

The US is a mess right now. We have more cases than any other country and zero sign of slowing down. A lot of what happens now will occur our of desperation and hotter heads will prevail, unfortunately.

Imagine all the **** we did after 3000 people died in 9/11. Two wars and thousands of soldiers and civilians dead...all to create the perception that the government was responding. Just imagine what they'll do when COVID19 claims tens of thousands.
 
Baron Samedi said:
There is absolutely no evidence that the IRR won't get recalled. It probably won't happen tomorrow, but I would bet money it will eventually.

The US is a mess right now. We have more cases than any other country and zero sign of slowing down. A lot of what happens now will occur our of desperation and hotter heads will prevail, unfortunately.

Imagine all the **** we did after 3000 people died in 9/11. Two wars and thousands of soldiers and civilians dead...all to create the perception that the government was responding. Just imagine what they'll do when COVID19 claims tens of thousands.
Click to expand...

I still think you're fine, I still wouldn't bet on the IRR being recalled (involuntarily). To do this, they would have to go through most of the AD and SELRES pool, and they'd have to go through all the volunteers (I bet there'd be quite a few: there certainly was after 9/11 and at the height of OIF/OEF).

If it makes you feel any better, there's a lot of AD folks sitting around right now not doing anything b/c we've canceled our clinics and dramatically reduced our inpatient census (was pretty low in volume/acuity to begin with). We'll go first well before you do.
 
Someone remind me how IRR works? I know I am long outside this window of obligation but, as I understand it, IRR would not apply to hardly any civilian physicians.

As I remember, you have a minimum 8-year military obligation no matter what type of contract you sign. So if you completed a 3-year residency with 4-year payback, you would only owe 1 year of IRR payback. All physicians with residencies with 4 years or longer (i.e. many high-need specialties such as critical care, ID, etc) would owe nothing.

Is this correct? If so, not many IRR physicians out there.
 
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Fortunately, ENTs are about as helpful with COVID as your typical podiatrist. Although we’re better at spreading it.
 
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Baron Samedi said:
There is absolutely no evidence that the IRR won't get recalled. It probably won't happen tomorrow, but I would bet money it will eventually.

The US is a mess right now. We have more cases than any other country and zero sign of slowing down. A lot of what happens now will occur our of desperation and hotter heads will prevail, unfortunately.

Imagine all the **** we did after 3000 people died in 9/11. Two wars and thousands of soldiers and civilians dead...all to create the perception that the government was responding. Just imagine what they'll do when COVID19 claims tens of thousands.
Click to expand...

With lower mortality rates, couldn’t this just suggest better detection? I honestly think that mobilizing medical units isn’t a horrible idea. For a few reasons...1) people like me who are doing PM&R are contributing very little to this fight, I’d be much more useful in a GMO rule, 2) the entire country may be in big trouble in the future but as it stands, not every place in the country is really struggling regarding medical resources right now. It makes sense to mobilize medical resources to NY and NO. I’m off of IRR but I signed up for the military to help in times of need. If I somehow get the call I’ll be ready.
 
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Anyone have info regarding status of M3 and M4 HPSP and USU medical students?
 
What, if anything, does this signal by way of possible stoploss for needed specialties? I imagine there are a number of individuals that are slotted to separate in the next couple months. Anyone have any insight/experience with the topic?
 
Most of the physicians in IRR status are residents in training, HPSP accessions who finished active duty obligations and are finishing out their 8-year commissioning obligation but are not yet in practice. They aren't retirees, they are not USUHS grads and they aren't former military who trained in the service but left before retiring. If you pull them to active duty, you cripple the house officer workforce in civilian hospitals at a time when they are most needed.
 
IRR callups won't produce many doctors. Maybe some junior nurses will be available, but again, they are already needed where they are. If they really need manpower, they will have to activate the selective service for medical personnel, which is a whole different process.
 
j4pac said:
With lower mortality rates, couldn’t this just suggest better detection? I honestly think that mobilizing medical units isn’t a horrible idea. For a few reasons...1) people like me who are doing PM&R are contributing very little to this fight, I’d be much more useful in a GMO rule, 2) the entire country may be in big trouble in the future but as it stands, not every place in the country is really struggling regarding medical resources right now. It makes sense to mobilize medical resources to NY and NO. I’m off of IRR but I signed up for the military to help in times of need. If I somehow get the call I’ll be ready.
Click to expand...

Time for the Army to open up Charity Hospital again?
 
orbitsurgMD said:
Time for the Army to open up Charity Hospital again?
Click to expand...

Oh man, flashbacks of working there pre-Katrina with stormin’ Norman McSwain.

I could write a dissertation on the entire peri-Katrina (mis)management of Charity Hospital. The Army/National Guard did a great job of getting the place ready for reopening, until state and LSU politics brought that to a screeching halt. I seriously doubt it could be put to any use for Covid; instead there are plans to use the riverfront Morial convention center as a field hospital.

RIP Norm.
In Memoriam: Norman E. McSwain, Jr., MD, FACS
 
I'm trying to focus on the things I can control. Wartime equivalent federal policy decisions is not one of them.

Protecting my family, self and people under me by learning from those overwhelmed with patients right now is one of them. Stay safe everybody.
 
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I’m worried for the hospital ships. COVID-19 testing is only 60-70% sensitive and a shipboard environment is as high risk as it gets. Really wish they had taken the bodies and supplies, moved into some empty hotels and set up a field hospital. I get that the big white ship looks pretty for the cameras but the y already have had to shut down carrier operations for COVID-19 and that’s without bringing a bunch of patients on board.
 
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I don’t think there’s anything wrong with reaching out to every doctor the .mil knows. If anyone is sitting at home recently retired etc, they should endeavor to find them.
 
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Monty Python said:
Oh man, flashbacks of working there pre-Katrina with stormin’ Norman McSwain.

I could write a dissertation on the entire peri-Katrina (mis)management of Charity Hospital. The Army/National Guard did a great job of getting the place ready for reopening, until state and LSU politics brought that to a screeching halt. I seriously doubt it could be put to any use for Covid; instead there are plans to use the riverfront Morial convention center as a field hospital.

RIP Norm.
In Memoriam: Norman E. McSwain, Jr., MD, FACS
Click to expand...

I’m waiting to see where these Navy EMFs that just got warning orders are going. New Orleans could use one at the Convention Center if they don’t already have a staffing plan for the surge beds they’re putting there.
 
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Gastrapathy said:
I’m worried for the hospital ships. COVID-19 testing is only 60-70% sensitive and a shipboard environment is as high risk as it gets. Really wish they had taken the bodies and supplies, moved into some empty hotels and set up a field hospital. I get that the big white ship looks pretty for the cameras but the y already have had to shut down carrier operations for COVID-19 and that’s without bringing a bunch of patients on board.
Click to expand...

BINGO. This for sure. Had many conversations on this topic (ID control) with the SMOs when I was ship’s company with both the Comfort and the George Washington. The Teddy Roosevelt currently on Pacific patrol has to dock in Guam due to Covid. Worst case scenario this could have strategic implications. Heaven help us if one of our few operational boomer subs gets sidelined by this.
 
Gastrapathy said:
I don’t think there’s anything wrong with reaching out to every doctor the .mil knows. If anyone is sitting at home recently retired etc, they should endeavor to find them.
Click to expand...

I contacted both BUMED and Millington HR to volunteer. “Thanks we have your contact info.”

Unfortunately as a retiree in Cat III (age >60) I would be in the very last group recalled. And bringing a retiree back on duty is exponentially more work vice mobilizing a reservist. I lack a CAC, BUMED credentials, a physical, a security clearance etc, although the magic waiver wand can always be utilized.
 
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Gastrapathy said:
I’m worried for the hospital ships. COVID-19 testing is only 60-70% sensitive and a shipboard environment is as high risk as it gets. Really wish they had taken the bodies and supplies, moved into some empty hotels and set up a field hospital. I get that the big white ship looks pretty for the cameras but the y already have had to shut down carrier operations for COVID-19 and that’s without bringing a bunch of patients on board.
Click to expand...


Further details re hospital ships per Navy Times. Unable to run Covid-19 tests on board.

www.navytimes.com

COVID-19 screening uncertainty looms over USNS Comfort as Trump bids sailors ‘bon voyage’

"We also know how dangerous of a breeding ground a ship can be for a highly contagious pathogen."
www.navytimes.com www.navytimes.com
 
Chonal Atresia said:
Someone remind me how IRR works? I know I am long outside this window of obligation but, as I understand it, IRR would not apply to hardly any civilian physicians.

As I remember, you have a minimum 8-year military obligation no matter what type of contract you sign. So if you completed a 3-year residency with 4-year payback, you would only owe 1 year of IRR payback. All physicians with residencies with 4 years or longer (i.e. many high-need specialties such as critical care, ID, etc) would owe nothing.

Is this correct? If so, not many IRR physicians out there.
Click to expand...

Not correct.

BLUF:
ETS with less than 8 years service, you're in the IRR.
ETS with more than 8 years service and ETS <2 years ago, never formally resigned your commission, you're in the IRR.
ETS with more than 8 years service and ETS >2 years ago, you're not in the IRR




Unless you resign your commission, you are still in the IRR, even with your DD214 in hand, Honorable Discharge certificate (suitable for framing)in a drawer somewhere, and having completed your 8 year obligation as an officer.

The army has you for 2 years in the IRR after separation. Title 10.
Unless you resign your commission.

I had 10 years AD and ETS. Started the process to resign my commission about 8 months later. Came back in the reserves 10+ years later. Looking at my retirement points total, I was earning 15 points per year (participation points) doing nothing for about 1.5 years until my resignation was complete.

AF website explains it somewhat
 
sb247 said:
In terms of calling up? You aren’t licensed for anything and are largely useless.
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'largely'?
You are too kind to our medical students.
Rule #11
  1. Show me a BMS (Best Medical Student, a student at The Best Medical School) who only triples my work and I will kiss his feet.
:hardy:
 
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armytrainingsir said:
Not correct.

BLUF:
ETS with less than 8 years service, you're in the IRR.
ETS with more than 8 years service and ETS <2 years ago, never formally resigned your commission, you're in the IRR.
ETS with more than 8 years service and ETS >2 years ago, you're not in the IRR




Unless you resign your commission, you are still in the IRR, even with your DD214 in hand, Honorable Discharge certificate (suitable for framing)in a drawer somewhere, and having completed your 8 year obligation as an officer.

The army has you for 2 years in the IRR after separation. Title 10.
Unless you resign your commission.

I had 10 years AD and ETS. Started the process to resign my commission about 8 months later. Came back in the reserves 10+ years later. Looking at my retirement points total, I was earning 15 points per year (participation points) doing nothing for about 1.5 years until my resignation was complete.

AF website explains it somewhat
Click to expand...

Why would any physician not resign his/her commission when leaving active duty?

I know, I know, it allows you to change your mind and return to active duty without recommissioning but does anybody actually stay in IRR for this reason?

I would find that hard to believe. The more likely scenario is that he/she didn’t know enough to resign his/her commission. Shame on them if that is the case.
 
armytrainingsir said:
.... ETS with more than 8 years service and ETS <2 years ago, never formally resigned your commission, you're in the IRR.

Unless you resign your commission, you are still in the IRR, even with your DD214 in hand
Click to expand...

That’s an interesting IRR ying/yang as I read about it as a retiree. When I dropped my retirement packet, I was informed of my choices:

* take the pension and lifetime benefits, get a retiree ID card, retain commission, and be liable for involuntary recall in worst-case scenario assuming I had a pulse. But no DD214 forthcoming.

or

* resign commission, receive DD214 and nothing else (no pension nor benefits), no liability for involuntary recall (except a truly worst case end of the world draft).
 
Monty Python said:
That’s an interesting IRR ying/yang as I read about it as a retiree. When I dropped my retirement packet, I was informed of my choices:

* take the pension and lifetime benefits, get a retiree ID card, retain commission, and be liable for involuntary recall in worst-case scenario assuming I had a pulse. But no DD214 forthcoming.

or

* resign commission, receive DD214 and nothing else (no pension nor benefits), no liability for involuntary recall (except a truly worst case end of the world draft).
Click to expand...


Don't you need the DD214 for VA benefits?
 
Chonal Atresia said:
Why would any physician not resign his/her commission when leaving active duty?
Click to expand...

Years ago, no one ever mentioned to a doc that was ETSing anything about resigning your commission or involuntary IRR assignment. It was pure happenstance that I found out about it and resigned my commission. Most thought, erroneously, that ETS meant you were completely done with the army.
 
armytrainingsir said:
Years ago, no one ever mentioned to a doc that was ETSing anything about resigning your commission or involuntary IRR assignment. It was pure happenstance that I found out about it and resigned my commission. Most thought, erroneously, that ETS meant you were completely done with the army.
Click to expand...

Interesting. To get out now (not retire) you have to start by resigning your commission. Or at least I had to.
 
Any idea where these IRR people are going? Replace the AD at some of these field hospital setups?
 
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