Military enlisting CRIMINALS?

[USAFdoc]

FYI: interesting article.

Out of Jail, Into the Army
From Salon.com:

Facing an enlistment crisis, the Army is granting "waivers" to an increasingly high percentage of recruits with criminal records -- and trying to hide it...

Through the use of a little-known, but increasingly important, escape clause known as a waiver. Waivers, which are generally approved at the Pentagon, allow recruiters to sign up men and women who otherwise would be ineligible for service because of legal convictions, medical problems or other reasons preventing them from meeting minimum standards...

According to statistics provided to Salon by the office of the assistant secretary of defense for public affairs, the Army said that 17 percent (21,880 new soldiers) of its 2005 recruits were admitted under waivers. Put another way, more soldiers than are in an entire infantry division entered the Army in 2005 without meeting normal standards. This use of waivers represents a 42 percent increase since the pre-Iraq year of 2000...

[E]xamples from the Air Guard files suggest a wider problem:

After his parents filed a domestic-abuse complaint against him in 2000, a recruit in Rhode Island was sentenced to one year of probation, ordered to have "no contact" with his parents, and required to undergo counseling and to pay court costs. Air National Guard rules say domestic violence convictions make recruits ineligible -- no exceptions granted. But the records show that the recruiter in this case brought the issue to an Air Guard staff judge advocate, who reviewed the file and determined that the offense did not "meet the domestic violence crime criteria." As a result of this waiver, the recruit was admitted to his state's Air Guard on May 3, 2005.


A recruit with DWI violations in June 2001 and April 2002 received a waiver to enter the Iowa Air National Guard on July 15, 2005. The waiver request from the Iowa Guard to the Pentagon declares that the recruit "realizes that he made the wrong decision to drink and drive."


Another recruit for the Rhode Island Air National Guard finished five years of probation in 2002 for breaking and entering, apparently into his girlfriend's house. A waiver got him into the Guard in June 2005.


A recruit convicted in January 2004 for possession of marijuana, drug paraphernalia and stolen license-plate tags got into the Hawaii Air National Guard with a waiver little more than a year later, on March 3, 2005.

Taken together, the troubling statistics from the Army and anecdotal information derived from the files of the Air National Guard raise a warning flag about the extent to which the military is lowering its standards to fight the war in Iraq. The president may be correct in his recent press conference boast that "we're transforming the military." But the abuse of recruiting waivers prompts the question: In what direction is this military transformation headed?

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[alpha62]

POTUS and the VP have 3 DUI's between them I think. Who gave them a wavier ?

 

[runningmom]

According to statistics provided to Salon by the office of the assistant secretary of defense for public affairs, the Army said that 17 percent (21,880 new soldiers) of its 2005 recruits were admitted under waivers. Put another way, more soldiers than are in an entire infantry division entered the Army in 2005 without meeting normal standards. This use of waivers represents a 42 percent increase since the pre-Iraq year of 2000...

Yes, but in standard "hype-media" format, this stat, though probably accurate, includes EVERY reason for a waiver, including the huge number of childhood-asthma, hayfever, and the like waivers out there. Then the details go on to exploit the fear factor that all those waivers were for criminals. I'm sure it happens, I'm not sure it happens with an alarming frequency. Interesting that all the examples were Guard though.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Nice....I worked with a lot of dirtbags in the Air Force, and this helps to explain it.....

 

[island doc]

Nice....I worked with a lot of dirtbags in the Air Force, and this helps to explain it.....

You're not the only one. I can certainly name more than a few myself. The crafter(s) of the deeply flawed GMO policy for a start.

 

[orbitsurgMD]

Not surprising. The Navy enlisted applicants with mild mental ******ation during the 1970s. When they are desperate, they do desperate things.

 

[RichL025]

Orbitsurg,

During the Vietnam war, the military lowered its standards to accept people who were (in effect) high-functioning ******ed. They called it "McNamara's Ten Thousand" (after the infamous Sec'y of Defense).

I agree with runningmom's assesment about the media-hype.

Plus, in all honesty, the military has been demanding choir-boys for years - for example, a DUI conviction prevents you from joining the military, what's up with that? I know several people who made one major lapse in judgement as young adults like that, who later turned out to be fine upstanding citizens. I also know many soldiers who made a stupid decision which cost them dearly (in money, rank, and increased insurance premiums) who then went on to be outstanding soldiers.

As for the example given in the article of the "domestic abuse complaint"... without knowing the details that's a very slanted description that makes it sound like they're recruiting wife-beaters. Yet because of historic laxity and an understandable desire to err on the side of protecting citizens, courts toss around those protective orders at the drop of a hat.

A former teammate of mine was required to surrender all of his private weapons and move into on-base housing in order to avoid _all_ contact with his wife because of a single, unsubstantiated allegation she made against him. He missed his son's birthday & other events because of this. After her second (possibly her third, I didn't press him for the details) arrest for crack possesion he managed to convince a judge that he was more believeable than his wife. The story ended well (he got custody) - but for a little less than a year his life was hell, couldn't see his kids and he was under a cloud of suspicion. Not to mention how much $$$ he had to spend on lawyers just to prove all this.

The court had no way of knowing who was telling the truth up front, so it erred on the side of the protective order. And if my teammate had not had extremely supportive friends, chain of command, and the financial ability to hire a lawyer to fight the case, he might have pled guilty and taken a year of probation just to get on with his life (like I said, the legal process took almost that long to resolve). Oh, and for that year, he was technically not allowed to touch ANY weapons. Even military weapons while he was on-duty!

The whole purpose of a waiver is to have a human being look at all the facts and make an informed decision, as opposed to a blanket rule that doesn't allow for the messiness and complexity of real life.

 

[MossPoh]

I was applying for ROTC scholarships (airforce and army) at several places. I went and got the physical done and passed everything just fine. Me being the honest person I was raised to be I mentioned that for a short period of time I was on anti-depressants. I could practically hear the offices setting alarms off. I got mailed back a bunch of paper work that I had to take to a psyciatrists office and get them to fill it out and send it in...without having any idea what was being said. I got a letter about 2 weeks later stating that I was "automatically disqualified for a mental condition" or something along those lines.....Evidently they didn't relay that information to the different schools and I pretty much had the scholarship at two different ones....the guys said I'd just need to get that stuff checked out. THey call back and I tell them eventually. The guy at one of the schools just said "Oh...you should've just lied..that is what they all do". I was very put down by this attitude..especially when I saw some of the people they recruited. I was a 4.0 student in all honors classes, while being president at multiple functions, and varsity sports and what not...aka no slouch. They allowed the guy I KNOW did Meth, along with failing nearly all his classes into the military. The guy at one Uni said I could wait another year off the drugs and try again..but by that point I was just too furious with the whole situation. The fact that an officer even suggessted I "should've just lied" really did it in for me. My dad, uncle, cousin, granfather(POW as well) were all officers in the airforce as high up as Col....it was just a bit disheartening for me. I have respect for the guys but damn..some of the stuff is ridiculous.

 

[USAFdoc]

I was applying for ROTC scholarships (airforce and army) at several places. I went and got the physical done and passed everything just fine. Me being the honest person I was raised to be I mentioned that for a short period of time I was on anti-depressants. I could practically hear the offices setting alarms off. I got mailed back a bunch of paper work that I had to take to a psyciatrists office and get them to fill it out and send it in...without having any idea what was being said. I got a letter about 2 weeks later stating that I was "automatically disqualified for a mental condition" or something along those lines.....Evidently they didn't relay that information to the different schools and I pretty much had the scholarship at two different ones....the guys said I'd just need to get that stuff checked out. THey call back and I tell them eventually. The guy at one of the schools just said "Oh...you should've just lied..that is what they all do". I was very put down by this attitude..especially when I saw some of the people they recruited. I was a 4.0 student in all honors classes, while being president at multiple functions, and varsity sports and what not...aka no slouch. They allowed the guy I KNOW did Meth, along with failing nearly all his classes into the military. The guy at one Uni said I could wait another year off the drugs and try again..but by that point I was just too furious with the whole situation. The fact that an officer even suggessted I "should've just lied" really did it in for me. My dad, uncle, cousin, granfather(POW as well) were all officers in the airforce as high up as Col....it was just a bit disheartening for me. I have respect for the guys but damn..some of the stuff is ridiculous.

I am now a civilian FP doc, and recently I met/heard of a couple of guys who were joining the military. One had BIPOLAR disorder, but was on no meds and was IMMEDIATELY accepted. His friend, had questionable reactive airway/RSV as a small boy, one episode of wheezing his whole life, and was disqualified.

 

[MossPoh]

Yea. Granted it is off the topic of criminal stuff but I just thought it was ridiculous how the process worked. Oh well..what can ya do. I am somewhat glad I didn't do it now so maybe it was fate.

 

[Croooz]

MossPoh,
CORE Values are at the "needs of the military". It's basically a lie, cheat, "borrow" but don't get caught. The unfortunate thing is if you do things the "right" way many times they won't get done. Some of the red tape is necessary but some is just some gaggle, some administrator heard about at some conference and decided it would be a good idea to implement in the military.

Regarding criminals in the military. It's always been there. Not at an alarming rate though. If the person works out then what's the problem? I've served with some x-criminals and just like everyone else...some were good, some were ok, and some were still criminals in uniform.

 

[rob14599]

I'm willing to bet that a lot of those waivers were for people who don't necessarily meet the height/weight restrictions (i.e. fat people). I've also heard about waivers being approved for enlisting soldiers who have too many tattoos on their body.

But what I would be most concerned about is the fact that there are a couple of hundred ACTIVE gang members in the military. I remember reading about how American gang graffiti is showing up on the sides of buildings in Iraq. The speculation is that some of nation's most vicious black and Hispanic gangs are sending members to join the military, either to learn combat and weapons skills that they can bring back to the streets or to put them in a position to steal military equipment and funnel it back to the gangs.

http://www.nbc17.com/news/4228063/detail.html


http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst-nws-gangs01.html

 

[Echinoidea]

I'm willing to bet that a lot of those waivers were for people who don't necessarily meet the height/weight restrictions (i.e. fat people). I've also heard about waivers being approved for enlisting soldiers who have too many tattoos on their body.

But what I would be most concerned about is the fact that there are a couple of hundred ACTIVE gang members in the military. I remember reading about how American gang graffiti is showing up on the sides of buildings in Iraq. The speculation is that some of nation's most vicious black and Hispanic gangs are sending members to join the military, either to learn combat and weapons skills that they can bring back to the streets or to put them in a position to steal military equipment and funnel it back to the gangs.

http://www.nbc17.com/news/4228063/detail.html


http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst-nws-gangs01.html

We had a gang member in my company when I was in Korea a few years ago. Our First Sergeant almost ripped his head off (this was an infantry company, so it was a little rough and tough) when he started flashing gang signs and giving people crap for wearing red jackets. Later on I talked to the 1SG and he told me about how horrible the gang problems were back in the early 80's, when they would have gang wars going on all over the post. That kid got court-martialed and sent to the slammer real quick for generally being an idiot.

 

[RichL025]

We had a gang member in my company when I was in Korea a few years ago. Our First Sergeant almost ripped his head off (this was an infantry company, so it was a little rough and tough) when he started flashing gang signs and giving people crap for wearing red jackets. Later on I talked to the 1SG and he told me about how horrible the gang problems were back in the early 80's, when they would have gang wars going on all over the post. That kid got court-martialed and sent to the slammer real quick for generally being an idiot.

I joined the army in 1987. We've had gang members of varying degrees since at least that time.

Some of them were kids who used the army to escape the rough streets of chicago, and tried their best to make something of themselves in the army. Some of them were little punks who thought they were still 'back on the block', and I remember a few incidents like your 1SG handled. Some of _those_ managed to straighten up and fly right (at least until ETS), some wound up incarcerated.

Then again, we had enough billybob rednecks that could be described in much the same category, only without specific "colors". Matter of fact, when it came to drug usage, the billy bobs were _worse_ than the inner-city kids. Go figure.

As for "gang colors" spray-painted in Baghdad, well, there were some places on _Ft Bragg_ caucasian soldiers (or non-caucasians who didn't have the proper credentials, whatever) didn't go after dark. That always frosted me...

 

[DropkickMurphy]

the military lowered its standards to accept people who were (in effect) high-functioning ******ed.

Good....then my brother will be able to enlist after all.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

some were good, some were ok, and some were still criminals in uniform.

To be more correct: "Maybe one was good (on a good day), a few were mediocre and most of them were still criminals while in uniform." Actually I know a lot more people who BECAME criminals because of the military, than turned law-abiding citizen.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Matter of fact, when it came to drug usage, the billy bobs were _worse_ than the inner-city kids.

Speaking of troublemaker Billy Bobs, you want to see a bunch of screw ups....I recommend checking out the 152nd Infantry of the Indiana Army National Guard, in particular the company out of Washington. Granted, the town has more to do with the piss poor quality of the troops than anything else. "Warshington" (to use the local enunciation) is not the deepest gene pool around....actually I've seen mud puddles with cleaner water and more depth.

 

[RichL025]

To be more correct: "Maybe one was good (on a good day), a few were mediocre and most of them were still criminals while in uniform."

Our experiences appear to have been different. I know of several people, personally, who were saved by a military career from a trajectory that would have landed them in the pen.

 

[RichL025]

To be more correct: "Maybe one was good (on a good day), a few were mediocre and most of them were still criminals while in uniform."

Our experiences appear to have been different. I know of several people, personally, who were saved by a military career from a trajectory that would have landed them in the pen. And they were, by and large, damn good soldiers.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Ah, the critical difference: soldiers vs. airmen.

 

[pgg]

I am now a civilian FP doc, and recently I met/heard of a couple of guys who were joining the military. One had BIPOLAR disorder, but was on no meds and was IMMEDIATELY accepted. His friend, had questionable reactive airway/RSV as a small boy, one episode of wheezing his whole life, and was disqualified.

I had a handful of Marines who got in on waivers for physical ailments that shouldn't have, but I had bigger problems with psychiatrists giving the stamp of approval for obviously disqualifying mental health issues. The biggest psych problem I had (and one I "almost" had) were with a pair of active duty psychiatrists who cleared guys to deploy when they shouldn't have.

Case A was a Marine who got picked up by the cops out in town for stalking drug dealers with a knife. He was admitted, diagnosed as bipolar, and started on meds. He did very well over the next couple weeks, and the psychiatrist said he'd be OK to deploy with us approx 2 months later. I said No Way Dude and we left him behind. It still just blows my ****ing mind that they actually thought a newly diagnosed bipolar kid (who had paranoid delusions and intended to kill suspicious-lookin' people on the streets of Jacksonville) should deploy to Iraq. Can you imagine this guy losing his meds and/or manning a 240G while scanning crowds of Iraqi civilians looking for suspicious people?

Case B was a Marine who had a complete meltdown temper tantrum on a range at CAX after someone was critical of his shooting. He was carted out of the field in an ambulance in a "catatonic state" but was "fine" by the time he got to the ER. The shrink there said he had "anger issues" and recommended anger management classes. The shrink back home concurred and said he was deployable. His company CO and I agreed that "No Way Dude" was the correct answer here too, and we left him home. Several months later he was sent to us as a combat replacement, and he promptly got in a knife fight with another Marine and popped off a few rounds at one of our own convoys as it left a compound.

I'd rather have a dozen motivated Marines with asthma over one with a mental health problem or personality disorder.