Need advice---dating as a foreign guy

[ctcell]

I just moved to the U.S. from an Asian country (northeast Asia, if that is relavant) for my residency training.
I am trying to date local girls and actually approached quite a few, but was rejected every time. I guess they might be a little scared of the fact that I was raised in another country where the culture is quite different from America. And I do speak English with a little accent, and may not understand their jokes occasionally.
For girls, do you think being a foreigner is a major turn-off for you? Especially since I came here for residency, which may insinuate that the U.S. is better than my home country, and women tend to like "marry up".
And I was quite attractive to girls before I came here, so I guess there must be something wrong with my foreign identity

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[dragonfly99]

A lot of women don't like to date "strangers", so it may not be personal. There are some not so nice people out in the world, so a lot of women might not respond positively to someone randomly asking them out on a date. You didn't say how you met these women, or if they are residency colleagues, or what. If they are nurses or other hospital staff, maybe they just don't want to date someone they work with...some people feel that way, and that it could create and awkward situation if one person likes the date, the other one does not, etc. It could be a lot of reasons. You are right that it could be your "foreignness", or accent, or something else about you that you cannot control, as well. Do you have time to meet people outside of the hospital? If you like particular activities like sports, outdoor hiking, or music, etc., you could find a Meetup group online or other group that has people in it who enjoy the same activities. This way you can meet people in a more social setting without the immediate pressure to try to date someone.

 

[foodle]

Whoa, whoa, slow down there Romeo ...

How about you just try to meet some people and make friends first?

Unless you're doing your residency in the Styx, dating a "foreign" guy usually isn't an issue. I don't think it has to do with your foreign-ness or their impression of your home country, so much as people don't just agree to go out on dates with people who they don't know at least a little.

 

[RadOncDoc21]

Whoa, whoa, slow down there Romeo ...

How about you just try to meet some people and make friends first?

Unless you're doing your residency in the Styx, dating a "foreign" guy usually isn't an issue. I don't think it has to do with your foreign-ness or their impression of your home country, so much as people don't just agree to go out on dates with people who they don't know at least a little.

There are way too many factors here... I found out the easiest way to "date" is to either be rich, good-looking or funny. Just focus on one of those and somebody will like you.

 

[Smurfette]

moving to spouses and partners forum since this is not residency specific.

 

[studentp0x]

Try and date girls who are of the same or similar culture. That's your best shot.

What country are you from?

 

[ctcell]

Whoa, whoa, slow down there Romeo ...

How about you just try to meet some people and make friends first?

Unless you're doing your residency in the Styx, dating a "foreign" guy usually isn't an issue. I don't think it has to do with your foreign-ness or their impression of your home country, so much as people don't just agree to go out on dates with people who they don't know at least a little.

Try and date girls who are of the same or similar culture. That's your best shot.

What country are you from?

I met most of the people outside of the hospital (like meet-up group or through friends), but the reality is that if I don't ask a girl out after the first meet, most likely I will never see her again. And I don't feel that I can meet any girl of my age on a regular basis to allow me to take things slowly. This is very frustrating.
For the one who suggest me to date people of same culture. I always feel that a relationship will be better if both partner can learn something new from each other. I don't think the culture barrier is insurmountable as long as both persons are at similar educational level and both are reasonable.
But in real life, I do notice that people tend to stick to people of similar culture, and they always try to introduce girls from asia to me, which is not what I am looking for.

 

[manders31]

Agree with what someone said above, you have to slow down.

Unless you are at a speed dating event most people shy away from someone who asks them out the first time they meet.

Try not focusing on finding a girlfriend so much and just enjoying life and the people you spend time with. I bet before long you will have someone special in your life

 

[Freesia88]

First, dating is hard enough as it is. You have two separate individuals trying to understand and accept each other enough to want to stick together through thick and thin. Cross cultural/Interracial/whatever-it-is-called-these-days dating is even more complicated because aside from being two separate people, you are even further separated by the fact that you have completely different upbringings, cultures, and even if you share the same values,the expression of these values might be different.

From your posts OP it sounds like you're not much into dating girls from your part of the world which is ok You like what you like. You have to be patient. Make friends, get to know people and give them a chance to know you. Truth is, you are different and any girl who wants to be with you will have to be ready to accept that difference and be willing to work with it. You don't want to be the "Foreign Adventure" or the Asian guy she dated just so she can say she's dated an Asian guy. Don't also become that Asian guy who only dates "insert girl of other culture here" because that could backfire on you. It's fine to have a "type" just don't turn it into a fetish.


Good luck to you. Hope you find what you're looking for

 

[studentp0x]

I met most of the people outside of the hospital (like meet-up group or through friends), but the reality is that if I don't ask a girl out after the first meet, most likely I will never see her again. And I don't feel that I can meet any girl of my age on a regular basis to allow me to take things slowly. This is very frustrating.
For the one who suggest me to date people of same culture. I always feel that a relationship will be better if both partner can learn something new from each other. I don't think the culture barrier is insurmountable as long as both persons are at similar educational level and both are reasonable.
But in real life, I do notice that people tend to stick to people of similar culture, and they always try to introduce girls from asia to me, which is not what I am looking for.

It's best to be blunt to save you time and frustration (serious).

You won't have much (any) luck trying to date white girls (assuming you you're going after girls who are 7s and up).

It's quite uncommon to see asians/indians with white girls, and very rare for a foreign asian/indian.
Asian girls find asian guys attractive more than white girls do. So aim for that.

 

[Staryy]

It's best to be blunt to save you time and frustration (serious).

You won't have much (any) luck trying to date white girls (assuming you you're going after girls who are 7s and up).

It's quite uncommon to see asians/indians with white girls, and very rare for a foreign asian/indian.
Asian girls find asian guys attractive more than white girls do. So aim for that.

The above is not true!!!

Focus on making friends with some girls. By friends I mean being normal, offering to buy coffee or water if you are getting one, inviting girls to a non-threatening group event (ie going to movies or lunch with a bunch of friends). Over time you will get to know some girls and if they observe you being nice and normal when you do ask them out they will be more likely to say yes.

By the way being consistently pleasant to be around, and persistent (asking a few times) goes a long way.

 

[SunsFun]

I will try to give some advice as a foreigner who has moved to the U.S. in my late teenage years and still have an accent. This is my opinion based on personal experience. I agree with some stuff already mentioned here and disagree with some other stuff. If you don't like or disagree with what I write, please feel free to ignore my comment.

First of all, I do think that coming from a different country will mean that you must learn the culture and understand how things here work. What has been effective in your home country will not always work here. Try to keep an open mind and do not get discouraged. You will need to "calibrate your game" and this tweaking will inevitably take time. How much time? This will depend on you and your ultimate goals. When I came here, several girls that I wasn't that interested in expressed some desire to be with me. I could have settled but my goal was to be with women that I am interested in and have fun just like the other guys seemed to. It took a while for me to get there and even longer to have guys I looked up to in my rear-view mirror. A lot of it is nonverbal communication and just random crap you say that may appear fine to you but in reality is very off-putting, creepy, and even offensive to American women. Being able to analyze your own behavior and see what works and what doesn't can go a long way.

One of the biggest issue to deal with as a foreigner is your own perception of yourself as having less to offer than American guys and being less attractive to "their" women than native men. This attitude is often a reflection of how some people here, mostly male, perceive foreigners. I don't want to start a political debate here but I think this attitude partly reflects pervasive negative stereotypes and racial insecurities. A more important reason for our purposes, however, is competitiveness and individuality as main values of mainstream American culture. American men more often than not are very competitive over women since their sense of worth is highly correlated with their ability attract desired women. Two friends can often get abrasive and even dismissive with each other over a girl they are both interested in. Why is this relevant to you? A foreigner, especially of a different race/ethnicity, getting a white woman that other white men are interested in is a blow to already fragile self-esteem. Instead of being genuinely happy for you some of your so-called friends may secretly resent you and want you to fail. Misery likes company and a guy without a girl will feel much better about himself when his "buddy" didn't get one either.This is especially true when the buddy is a foreigner.

This is not true at all times but it takes only one guy with this kind of attitude to plant the seeds of inferiority so deep that you will always feel somewhere inside that this girl is not for you when in fact she is interested. This lowers your confidence and manifests in awkward behaviors that makes girl doubt her initial impression of you. Most of the time the people who do this to you are not even aware that they are c***blocking you. For example, I do not hang out with people who, when meeting new women, make it a point to bring up my origins in very introduction for no apparent reason: "This is SunsFun. Guess what?? He is from XXX." There are multiple other ways for them to prop themselves up in ways that are putting you down that may appear as jokes or simple conversation fillers such as imitating your accent. It even comes in a form of nonverbal communication. The sooner you are able to recognize this behavior and cut them off the better off you will be in the long run.

I personally and several of my current friends wasted time hanging out with people like that and learning to be in a "second class". I ended up befriending many foreigners like me and Americans who have similar values and will sincerely want to see their friends succeed. One experience in particular settled the issue of being different for me once and for all. I rarely if ever think of my accent or ethnicity when talking to people and feel like it plays no role at all. This experience was befriending one Pakistani guy. He was short, balding, had crooked teeth, could hardly speak (not even talking about reading and writing) proper English and was a high school drop out in Pakistan. I am not exaggerating here in the slightest bit. However, this guy was street smart, knew how to dress, how to work out, how to make friends, and how to talk to women. He is the biggest player I have ever met. He routinely left with the hottest women and I am not talking about girls some on this site would consider trashy. When I saw him in action I knew I could do it to. I don't do what he does. I have my own ways that I developed which work for me. I think it will do you a lot of good to make friends from your community or other culture who you feel will also struggle with attracting American women. Find men who are "good" (define your own success) with women and just "insert" yourself in that environment. Eventually all your current worries will go away.

Lastly, I urge you to continue approaching women. I don't know a single guy who I would call successful with women that doesn't put in work into meeting new women. You have to go out there and take the initiative every time. If you don't want to be at the mercy of your circumstances, you need to make moves. Just don't be stupid about it and try to figure out what works and what doesn't, refining your approach in the process.

 

[studentp0x]

The above is not true!!!

Focus on making friends with some girls. By friends I mean being normal, offering to buy coffee or water if you are getting one, inviting girls to a non-threatening group event (ie going to movies or lunch with a bunch of friends). Over time you will get to know some girls and if they observe you being nice and normal when you do ask them out they will be more likely to say yes.

By the way being consistently pleasant to be around, and persistent (asking a few times) goes a long way.

I agree that making friends is absolutely key and is the first step for sure.

Anyway, my assumption is that the OP is saying "how do I date a hot white girl as a foreign-born asian guy."

If that is incorrect, then yes what I said can be incorrect (to a degree) as well.
If that is correct, then no what I said is very much correct.
Trying to convince the OP otherwise would lead to unnecessary rejection and a waste of time. It's like those pick up artists who sell all their "expert advice." Then you get forums full of people complaining it never worked (ex. puahate).

Of course there are exceptions, but generally speaking you won't see foreign men dating hot white girls (if that specifically is what the OP implied).

 

[studentp0x]

I will try to give some advice as a foreigner who has moved to the U.S. in my late teenage years and still have an accent. This is my opinion based on personal experience. I agree with some stuff already mentioned here and disagree with some other stuff. If you don't like or disagree with what I write, please feel free to ignore my comment.

First of all, I do think that coming from a different country will mean that you must learn the culture and understand how things here work. What has been effective in your home country will not always work here. Try to keep an open mind and do not get discouraged. You will need to "calibrate your game" and this tweaking will inevitably take time. How much time? This will depend on you and your ultimate goals. When I came here, several girls that I wasn't that interested in expressed some desire to be with me. I could have settled but my goal was to be with women that I am interested in and have fun just like the other guys seemed to. It took a while for me to get there and even longer to have guys I looked up to in my rear-view mirror. A lot of it is nonverbal communication and just random crap you say that may appear fine to you but in reality is very off-putting, creepy, and even offensive to American women. Being able to analyze your own behavior and see what works and what doesn't can go a long way.

One of the biggest issue to deal with as a foreigner is your own perception of yourself as having less to offer than American guys and being less attractive to "their" women than native men. This attitude is often a reflection of how some people here, mostly male, perceive foreigners. I don't want to start a political debate here but I think this attitude partly reflects pervasive negative stereotypes and racial insecurities. A more important reason for our purposes, however, is competitiveness and individuality as main values of mainstream American culture. American men more often than not are very competitive over women since their sense of worth is highly correlated with their ability attract desired women. Two friends can often get abrasive and even dismissive with each other over a girl they are both interested in. Why is this relevant to you? A foreigner, especially of a different race/ethnicity, getting a white woman that other white men are interested in is a blow to already fragile self-esteem. Instead of being genuinely happy for you some of your so-called friends may secretly resent you and want you to fail. Misery likes company and a guy without a girl will feel much better about himself when his "buddy" didn't get one either.This is especially true when the buddy is a foreigner.

This is not true at all times but it takes only one guy with this kind of attitude to plant the seeds of inferiority so deep that you will always feel somewhere inside that this girl is not for you when in fact she is interested. This lowers your confidence and manifests in awkward behaviors that makes girl doubt her initial impression of you. Most of the time the people who do this to you are not even aware that they are c***blocking you. For example, I do not hang out with people who, when meeting new women, make it a point to bring up my origins in very introduction for no apparent reason: "This is SunsFun. Guess what?? He is from XXX." There are multiple other ways for them to prop themselves up in ways that are putting you down that may appear as jokes or simple conversation fillers such as imitating your accent. It even comes in a form of nonverbal communication. The sooner you are able to recognize this behavior and cut them off the better off you will be in the long run.

I personally and several of my current friends wasted time hanging out with people like that and learning to be in a "second class". I ended up befriending many foreigners like me and Americans who have similar values and will sincerely want to see their friends succeed. One experience in particular settled the issue of being different for me once and for all. I rarely if ever think of my accent or ethnicity when talking to people and feel like it plays no role at all. This experience was befriending one Pakistani guy. He was short, balding, had crooked teeth, could hardly speak (not even talking about reading and writing) proper English and was a high school drop out in Pakistan. I am not exaggerating here in the slightest bit. However, this guy was street smart, knew how to dress, how to work out, how to make friends, and how to talk to women. He is the biggest player I have ever met. He routinely left with the hottest women and I am not talking about girls some on this site would consider trashy. When I saw him in action I knew I could do it to. I don't do what he does. I have my own ways that I developed which work for me. I think it will do you a lot of good to make friends from your community or other culture who you feel will also struggle with attracting American women. Find men who are "good" (define your own success) with women and just "insert" yourself in that environment. Eventually all your current worries will go away.

Lastly, I urge you to continue approaching women. I don't know a single guy who I would call successful with women that doesn't put in work into meeting new women. You have to go out there and take the initiative every time. If you don't want to be at the mercy of your circumstances, you need to make moves. Just don't be stupid about it and try to figure out what works and what doesn't, refining your approach in the process.

Everything you said is legit but the second last paragraph sounds like some of that PUA nonsense (pick up artist). Basically the old "guy with a 3/10 face gets 10/10 supermodels every other day" type of ad that's made those guys a fortune. They endlessly preach "looks don't matter" but then you get all these people complaining online that their advice never did a thing for them.

I've been in a relationship for over a year now, but I believe in every aspect of life it's good to have realistic expectations. I know an average looking guy who's pulled quite a few hotties too. On the surface he looks like a player, but in his personal life he's been cheated on several times, hasn't had a girlfriend for more than a couple months (always gets dumped), etc.

 

[SunsFun]

Everything you said is legit but the second last paragraph sounds like some of that PUA nonsense (pick up artist). Basically the old "guy with a 3/10 face gets 10/10 supermodels every other day" type of ad that's made those guys a fortune. They endlessly preach "looks don't matter" but then you get all these people complaining online that their advice never did a thing for them.

I've been in a relationship for over a year now, but I believe in every aspect of life it's good to have realistic expectations. I know an average looking guy who's pulled quite a few hotties too. On the surface he looks like a player, but in his personal life he's been cheated on several times, hasn't had a girlfriend for more than a couple months (always gets dumped), etc.

There are no stats on any of this and our experiences might have been quite different. I don't think the guy is 3/10 when he goes out. He is at least 7. He works our religiously, gets a cut twice a week, and only wears brand name clothes. But I do think it is his "handling" of people that makes hum a 10 in many girls eyes. I never saw him sweat a girl. He never let me pay for anything at all when we go out even though he is not that rich. He knows almost everybody in the hospitality industry on the first name basis and get hooked up. He pretty much created an image for himself that makes him appealing to people.

Regardless I don't think it even make sense to single him out and try to assign some scores. My point was that surrounding yourself with successful people is a good first step in the right direction. I specifically brought him up because people believe that if you are East/South Asian (especially foreigner) you will almost always have harder time with white girls. In OP's case, I think it will be extremely beneficial to be around those type of people so that this mental roadblock (American girls don't like my accent/ethnicity/culture) will go away.

 

[studentp0x]

There are no stats on any of this and our experiences might have been quite different. I don't think the guy is 3/10 when he goes out. He is at least 7. He works our religiously, gets a cut twice a week, and only wears brand name clothes. But I do think it is his "handling" of people that makes hum a 10 in many girls eyes. I never saw him sweat a girl. He never let me pay for anything at all when we go out even though he is not that rich. He knows almost everybody in the hospitality industry on the first name basis and get hooked up. He pretty much created an image for himself that makes him appealing to people.

A guy who's a 7 can definitely pull off 8s and 9s, no doubt about it. Attractiveness is only a general requirement for men, and the 7/10 zone is definitely enough.
Of course looking like you lift and standing out is a huge add-on. I woudn't have had any success with girls ever (given my face is average ish, above average to some) if I wasn't into serious weight lifting (powerlifting).

Regardless I don't think it even make sense to single him out and try to assign some scores. My point was that surrounding yourself with successful people is a good first step in the right direction. I specifically brought him up because people believe that if you are East/South Asian (especially foreigner) you will almost always have harder time with white girls. In OP's case, I think it will be extremely beneficial to be around those type of people so that this mental roadblock (American girls don't like my accent/ethnicity/culture) will go away.

But it is true that asian men have a tough time with hot white chicks. Otherwise given the asian population, we'd see asian male-caucasian female couples everywhere all day. The foreign born aspect makes it significantly more challenging, but if one doesn't want to give up, then yes your advice does work. Though it's necessary to meet new people and make friends regardless of your ethnicity or where you're born.

 

[Stroganoff]

Nah, I don't think SunsFun's 2nd to last paragraph describing his Pakistani friend reeks too much of PUA crap. I've said it before and I'll say it again: after making sure I had all my other ducks in a row such as personality, intelligence, humor, confidence, faith, the ONE thing that gave me the highest yield, the highest Return-On-Investment, and the most dramatic results was: bulking up by doing weight training. Major body transformations in a few months of consistently lifting Monday-Wednesday-Friday AND eating enough healthy food AND sleeping enough.

The aspect of bulking the heck up is just... one more "checkbox" to check off in one's self-improvement bucket list. It eliminated a lot of the "superficial" obstacles when meeting women and then allowed other aspects like personality, humor, and kindness to advertise themselves to women.

Just do enough self-reflection to find out what's missing in your life, and fill that void.

 

[Stroganoff]

Attractiveness is only a general requirement for men, and the 7/10 zone is definitely enough.

Disagree with the bolded part. It's really a universally human trait. Yes, when considering the whole package, women generally place less emphasis on looks, but they damn sure do consider/require it, even if subconsciously.

All I'm saying is if you self-improve everything in your power and ability in the physical looks and appearance and health department, it eliminates a lot of obstacles that then allow more important traits like intelligence, personality, humor, and kindness to manifest.

 

[studentp0x]

Nah, I don't think SunsFun's 2nd to last paragraph describing his Pakistani friend reeks too much of PUA crap. I've said it before and I'll say it again: after making sure I had all my other ducks in a row such as personality, intelligence, humor, confidence, faith, the ONE thing that gave me the highest yield, the highest Return-On-Investment, and the most dramatic results was: bulking up by doing weight training. Major body transformations in a few months of consistently lifting Monday-Wednesday-Friday AND eating enough healthy food AND sleeping enough.

The aspect of bulking the heck up is just... one more "checkbox" to check off in one's self-improvement bucket list. It eliminated a lot of the "superficial" obstacles when meeting women and then allowed other aspects like personality, humor, and kindness to advertise themselves to women.

Just do enough self-reflection to find out what's missing in your life, and fill that void.

Yea I changed my view right when he said he'd "consider him a 7/10 at least." If someone's pretty attractive, then what's the surprise? PUA crap is basically telling unattractive men they can bang supermodels with some "tricks."

Anyway, yea lifting and standing out among other guys is extremely key, even for guys with attractive faces. Pretty much every girl loves a big jacked guy (even ones who deny it, still largely do). This was the only reason I was able to have any success with women.

I also believe how you dress is key. You need to show what you have (like most girls do).

Disagree with the bolded part. It's really a universally human trait. Yes, when considering the whole package, women generally place less emphasis on looks, but they damn sure do consider/require it, even if subconsciously.

All I'm saying is if you self-improve everything in your power and ability in the physical looks and appearance and health department, it eliminates a lot of obstacles that then allow more important traits like intelligence, personality, humor, and kindness to manifest.

I generally meant that attractiveness is more of something that's a check box type of thing in men. In women, the hotter you get the more "value" you have if you know what I mean. This somewhat holds true for men as well, but not as much as in women.

 

[SunsFun]

Yea I changed my view right when he said he'd "consider him a 7/10 at least." If someone's pretty attractive, then what's the surprise? PUA crap is basically telling unattractive men they can bang supermodels with some "tricks."

Anyway, yea lifting and standing out among other guys is extremely key, even for guys with attractive faces. Pretty much every girl loves a big jacked guy (even ones who deny it, still largely do). This was the only reason I was able to have any success with women.

I also believe how you dress is key. You need to show what you have (like most girls do).

The point I was trying to make is that genetically and culturally he initially had "less" to work with than most of us yet was able to maximize it.

 

[SunsFun]

But it is true that asian men have a tough time with hot white chicks. Otherwise given the asian population, we'd see asian male-caucasian female couples everywhere all day. The foreign born aspect makes it significantly more challenging, but if one doesn't want to give up, then yes your advice does work. Though it's necessary to meet new people and make friends regardless of your ethnicity or where you're born.

I honestly don't have that many close East Asian friends but earlier you have mentioned Indian guys as having hard time with attractive white women which, based on my personal experience, is not the case.

I have tons of Indian friends and have went out with their group many times. There are almost always guys in the group. both foreign-born and American, able to attract cute white girls and frequently take them home. They actually had easier time than white guys I went out with who normally just end up hammered and alone. It may be different for other areas of the U.S. I am talking about West Coast and surrounding areas.

Now, there are several reasons you may have a different impression of how successful those guys are. First of all, some foreign guys that I've met try to hard to "Americanize" in the hopes of getting white girls. They only hang out with whites. bleach their hair, dress preppy, etc. There is absolutely nothing wrong with them except that denying their own cultural heritage makes them appear insecure since they are still what they are and everyone knows. The white guys they are with sometimes treat them as token foreigner/minority which really hurts their chances.

Secondly, many (all the Indians I've ever met) foreign guys do not seriously date or marry white women. For variety of reasons (family, friends, religion, views) they only fool around with them and end up dating/marrying their own kind. I feel sorry for the girls used in this situation because some of these guys fail to set honest expectations about the relationship.

Also, I have noticed many more American guys tend to be friendzoned. Most of my foreign friends will not waste time with a girl who initially didn't send the right vibes.

 

[ctcell]

The above is not true!!!

Focus on making friends with some girls. By friends I mean being normal, offering to buy coffee or water if you are getting one, inviting girls to a non-threatening group event (ie going to movies or lunch with a bunch of friends). Over time you will get to know some girls and if they observe you being nice and normal when you do ask them out they will be more likely to say yes.

By the way being consistently pleasant to be around, and persistent (asking a few times) goes a long way.

Thanks for the suggestions! There is one thing that's still puzzling me. Dating is just a way to know each other for me, and I usually need only one minute to know if I want to go on a one-on-one meeting with a girl. So why is it so different for girls that they don't want to date "strangers"?
And you mentioned "non-threatening", then what is "threatening" here? I don't think that I look like a criminal that will kill the girl on the first date.

 

[ctcell]

It's best to be blunt to save you time and frustration (serious).

You won't have much (any) luck trying to date white girls (assuming you you're going after girls who are 7s and up).

It's quite uncommon to see asians/indians with white girls, and very rare for a foreign asian/indian.
Asian girls find asian guys attractive more than white girls do. So aim for that.

Thank you for the advice. You must be quite serious when you wrote this.
It might be true for teenagers, but not so much for adults (20 and above). Here are the reasons:
Asians tend to be late boomer, so Asian guys are perceived as childish in middle/high schools, which is not an attractive trait to girls. And it is difficult for teen girls to figure out the social economical value of a guy at her age, so it is more of a "meat game". However, even teen girls are attracted to smart guys.
But for adults, it is more of a social economical game. Women are consciously/subconsciously looking for "father material", which means normal fertility and great productivity. As long as one is not too ugly, tall, short, obese, skinny, then he is considered to have normal fertility and carry healthy genes. And being M.D. itself sends the message of great productivity. Being funny also insinuates creativity and wisdom, which is associated with productivity. And better educated women are less likely to believe in racial stereotype, who is also my target population.
In addition, 40% of American medical students are Asian, and 50% of American residents are Asian. I will be shocked that all of them are having difficulty with dating 70% of the population.
Finally, here is the data from Pew Research Center:
In the year of 2008 (sample size>1000), 41.7% of American-born Asian men were married to non-Asian races, while 11.7% of foreign-born Asian men were married to non-Asian races. http://pewsocialtrends.org/files/2010/10/755-marrying-out.pdf, page 35. There are also data in this report which prove that better educated people are more receptive to interracial marriage.
As you can see, race does not matter much. It is the foreign background that hurts (unfamiliarity leads to apprehension. People are more likely to stick to familiar brands even when they buy laundry detergent, not to say getting a boyfriend).
However, you can also say it is because foreign born Asians are less interested in girls of other races. And I don't have evidence to support either claim.
What is interesting is that only 27% of Americans are fine with family member marrying to people who don't believe in god, way lower acceptance rate than interracial marriage! Sounds like I should start to believe in god

 

[ctcell]

I will try to give some advice as a foreigner who has moved to the U.S. in my late teenage years and still have an accent. This is my opinion based on personal experience. I agree with some stuff already mentioned here and disagree with some other stuff. If you don't like or disagree with what I write, please feel free to ignore my comment.

First of all, I do think that coming from a different country will mean that you must learn the culture and understand how things here work. What has been effective in your home country will not always work here. Try to keep an open mind and do not get discouraged. You will need to "calibrate your game" and this tweaking will inevitably take time. How much time? This will depend on you and your ultimate goals. When I came here, several girls that I wasn't that interested in expressed some desire to be with me. I could have settled but my goal was to be with women that I am interested in and have fun just like the other guys seemed to. It took a while for me to get there and even longer to have guys I looked up to in my rear-view mirror. A lot of it is nonverbal communication and just random crap you say that may appear fine to you but in reality is very off-putting, creepy, and even offensive to American women. Being able to analyze your own behavior and see what works and what doesn't can go a long way.

One of the biggest issue to deal with as a foreigner is your own perception of yourself as having less to offer than American guys and being less attractive to "their" women than native men. This attitude is often a reflection of how some people here, mostly male, perceive foreigners. I don't want to start a political debate here but I think this attitude partly reflects pervasive negative stereotypes and racial insecurities. A more important reason for our purposes, however, is competitiveness and individuality as main values of mainstream American culture. American men more often than not are very competitive over women since their sense of worth is highly correlated with their ability attract desired women. Two friends can often get abrasive and even dismissive with each other over a girl they are both interested in. Why is this relevant to you? A foreigner, especially of a different race/ethnicity, getting a white woman that other white men are interested in is a blow to already fragile self-esteem. Instead of being genuinely happy for you some of your so-called friends may secretly resent you and want you to fail. Misery likes company and a guy without a girl will feel much better about himself when his "buddy" didn't get one either.This is especially true when the buddy is a foreigner.

This is not true at all times but it takes only one guy with this kind of attitude to plant the seeds of inferiority so deep that you will always feel somewhere inside that this girl is not for you when in fact she is interested. This lowers your confidence and manifests in awkward behaviors that makes girl doubt her initial impression of you. Most of the time the people who do this to you are not even aware that they are c***blocking you. For example, I do not hang out with people who, when meeting new women, make it a point to bring up my origins in very introduction for no apparent reason: "This is SunsFun. Guess what?? He is from XXX." There are multiple other ways for them to prop themselves up in ways that are putting you down that may appear as jokes or simple conversation fillers such as imitating your accent. It even comes in a form of nonverbal communication. The sooner you are able to recognize this behavior and cut them off the better off you will be in the long run.

I personally and several of my current friends wasted time hanging out with people like that and learning to be in a "second class". I ended up befriending many foreigners like me and Americans who have similar values and will sincerely want to see their friends succeed. One experience in particular settled the issue of being different for me once and for all. I rarely if ever think of my accent or ethnicity when talking to people and feel like it plays no role at all. This experience was befriending one Pakistani guy. He was short, balding, had crooked teeth, could hardly speak (not even talking about reading and writing) proper English and was a high school drop out in Pakistan. I am not exaggerating here in the slightest bit. However, this guy was street smart, knew how to dress, how to work out, how to make friends, and how to talk to women. He is the biggest player I have ever met. He routinely left with the hottest women and I am not talking about girls some on this site would consider trashy. When I saw him in action I knew I could do it to. I don't do what he does. I have my own ways that I developed which work for me. I think it will do you a lot of good to make friends from your community or other culture who you feel will also struggle with attracting American women. Find men who are "good" (define your own success) with women and just "insert" yourself in that environment. Eventually all your current worries will go away.

Lastly, I urge you to continue approaching women. I don't know a single guy who I would call successful with women that doesn't put in work into meeting new women. You have to go out there and take the initiative every time. If you don't want to be at the mercy of your circumstances, you need to make moves. Just don't be stupid about it and try to figure out what works and what doesn't, refining your approach in the process.

How can I ignore this? Your article deserves publication! Let's set up a journal for you in SDN

 

[ctcell]

The above is not true!!!

Focus on making friends with some girls. By friends I mean being normal, offering to buy coffee or water if you are getting one, inviting girls to a non-threatening group event (ie going to movies or lunch with a bunch of friends). Over time you will get to know some girls and if they observe you being nice and normal when you do ask them out they will be more likely to say yes.

By the way being consistently pleasant to be around, and persistent (asking a few times) goes a long way.

You mentioned persistence. But what I am thinking is that if I took the initiative to ask her out, and if she is interested in knowing more about me, she should always come up with an alternative plan that she is comfortable with, logically.
If I ask her out again before she comes up with an alternative plan, is that too annoying/desperating?

 

[studentp0x]

I honestly don't have that many close East Asian friends but earlier you have mentioned Indian guys as having hard time with attractive white women which, based on my personal experience, is not the case.

I have tons of Indian friends and have went out with their group many times. There are almost always guys in the group. both foreign-born and American, able to attract cute white girls and frequently take them home. They actually had easier time than white guys I went out with who normally just end up hammered and alone. It may be different for other areas of the U.S. I am talking about West Coast and surrounding areas.

Now, there are several reasons you may have a different impression of how successful those guys are. First of all, some foreign guys that I've met try to hard to "Americanize" in the hopes of getting white girls. They only hang out with whites. bleach their hair, dress preppy, etc. There is absolutely nothing wrong with them except that denying their own cultural heritage makes them appear insecure since they are still what they are and everyone knows. The white guys they are with sometimes treat them as token foreigner/minority which really hurts their chances.

Secondly, many (all the Indians I've ever met) foreign guys do not seriously date or marry white women. For variety of reasons (family, friends, religion, views) they only fool around with them and end up dating/marrying their own kind. I feel sorry for the girls used in this situation because some of these guys fail to set honest expectations about the relationship.

Also, I have noticed many more American guys tend to be friendzoned. Most of my foreign friends will not waste time with a girl who initially didn't send the right vibes.

Idk man.. I rarely ever saw indians land any pretty white girls and every club I've been to they don't even make a move let alone go home with anybody.

Thing is, my observations seem to be agreed upon with whoever I talk to.

Thank you for the advice. You must be quite serious when you wrote this.
It might be true for teenagers, but not so much for adults (20 and above). Here are the reasons:
Asians tend to be late boomer, so Asian guys are perceived as childish in middle/high schools, which is not an attractive trait to girls. And it is difficult for teen girls to figure out the social economical value of a guy at her age, so it is more of a "meat game". However, even teen girls are attracted to smart guys.
But for adults, it is more of a social economical game. Women are consciously/subconsciously looking for "father material", which means normal fertility and great productivity. As long as one is not too ugly, tall, short, obese, skinny, then he is considered to have normal fertility and carry healthy genes. And being M.D. itself sends the message of great productivity. Being funny also insinuates creativity and wisdom, which is associated with productivity. And better educated women are less likely to believe in racial stereotype, who is also my target population.
In addition, 40% of American medical students are Asian, and 50% of American residents are Asian. I will be shocked that all of them are having difficulty with dating 70% of the population.
Finally, here is the data from Pew Research Center:
In the year of 2008 (sample size>1000), 41.7% of American-born Asian men were married to non-Asian races, while 11.7% of foreign-born Asian men were married to non-Asian races. http://pewsocialtrends.org/files/2010/10/755-marrying-out.pdf, page 35. There are also data in this report which prove that better educated people are more receptive to interracial marriage.
As you can see, race does not matter much. It is the foreign background that hurts (unfamiliarity leads to apprehension. People are more likely to stick to familiar brands even when they buy laundry detergent, not to say getting a boyfriend).
However, you can also say it is because foreign born Asians are less interested in girls of other races. And I don't have evidence to support either claim.
What is interesting is that only 27% of Americans are fine with family member marrying to people who don't believe in god, way lower acceptance rate than interracial marriage! Sounds like I should start to believe in god

Yes you're right, women over 25 (after they're done their partying and are carrying some sort of baggage) look for a provider. This certainly doesn't mean she genuinely loves you and will be faithful though.

 

[Staryy]

You mentioned persistence. But what I am thinking is that if I took the initiative to ask her out, and if she is interested in knowing more about me, she should always come up with an alternative plan that she is comfortable with, logically.
If I ask her out again before she comes up with an alternative plan, is that too annoying/desperating?

NO you will NOT look desperate if you ask her out again before she approaches you.

Just give the girls some time to get to know you. Women need time to get to know you and determine if you are a nice, normal guy before they go out with you. Even if you look like a nice guy as mentioned above lots of terrible things happen to women so women tend to be more cautious about dating than men. Besides that in general women look for more than appearance and status to determine if they are attracted to someone. Women often watch a man's BEHAVIOR, how he talks to and treats important and "less" important people for clues about the guy's values and ethics and if this matches up with her values and ethics. To make a long story short women analyze and process things differently from men. Get advice about how women think from a female sister, cousin, or friend.

The next time you ask be SPECIFIC with your plans about when and where you want to meet.
If a guy says "do you want to hang out sometime" and does not take the initiative to PLAN the date or let me know what he has in mind I assume that he is not serious (ie "he is just not that into you").
If a guy says " let me know when you are free" rather than asking "which day(s) and time is good for you to meet" I assume he is not serious.

 

[skab]

Idk man.. I rarely ever saw indians land any pretty white girls and every club I've been to they don't even make a move let alone go home with anybody.

Thing is, my observations seem to be agreed upon with whoever I talk to.



Yes you're right, women over 25 (after they're done their partying and are carrying some sort of baggage) look for a provider. This certainly doesn't mean she genuinely loves you and will be faithful though.

I don't know where you are from but interracial relationships are pretty common, especially between Asians and non-Asians on the West Coast or in the Northeast. I also don't know why you seem so jaded about longterm relationships. Many women are seeking partners, whom they can depend on for both companionship and support, and are not inherently adulterers, gold-diggers, or emotionally damaged.

To the OP, sounds like you have a lot to offer and know what you are looking for in a relationship. However, most are not so quick to decide. It can be helpful to let things evolve organically, without forcing a potential interest into making a split-second decision about whether or not they would like to pursue a romantic connection. If you're meeting someone through friends or in a group, perhaps arranging an additional group activity could give you another opportunity to get to know each other better in a low-pressure environment before setting up something one-on-one.

 

[studentp0x]

I don't know where you are from but interracial relationships are pretty common, especially between Asians and non-Asians on the West Coast or in the Northeast. I also don't know why you seem so jaded about longterm relationships. Many women are seeking partners, whom they can depend on for both companionship and support, and are not inherently adulterers, gold-diggers, or emotionally damaged.

To the OP, sounds like you have a lot to offer and know what you are looking for in a relationship. However, most are not so quick to decide. It can be helpful to let things evolve organically, without forcing a potential interest into making a split-second decision about whether or not they would like to pursue a romantic connection. If you're meeting someone through friends or in a group, perhaps arranging an additional group activity could give you another opportunity to get to know each other better in a low-pressure environment before setting up something one-on-one.

You rarely see a foreign born asian with an accent dating an attractive white girl. That is all.

also, what a woman is looking for now, doesnt reflect (necessarily) what she will want 10-15 years from now.

 

[ctcell]

NO you will NOT look desperate if you ask her out again before she approaches you.

Just give the girls some time to get to know you. Women need time to get to know you and determine if you are a nice, normal guy before they go out with you. Even if you look like a nice guy as mentioned above lots of terrible things happen to women so women tend to be more cautious about dating than men. Besides that in general women look for more than appearance and status to determine if they are attracted to someone. Women often watch a man's BEHAVIOR, how he talks to and treats important and "less" important people for clues about the guy's values and ethics and if this matches up with her values and ethics. To make a long story short women analyze and process things differently from men. Get advice about how women think from a female sister, cousin, or friend.

The next time you ask be SPECIFIC with your plans about when and where you want to meet.
If a guy says "do you want to hang out sometime" and does not take the initiative to PLAN the date or let me know what he has in mind I assume that he is not serious (ie "he is just not that into you").
If a guy says " let me know when you are free" rather than asking "which day(s) and time is good for you to meet" I assume he is not serious.

I don't know where you are from but interracial relationships are pretty common, especially between Asians and non-Asians on the West Coast or in the Northeast. I also don't know why you seem so jaded about longterm relationships. Many women are seeking partners, whom they can depend on for both companionship and support, and are not inherently adulterers, gold-diggers, or emotionally damaged.

To the OP, sounds like you have a lot to offer and know what you are looking for in a relationship. However, most are not so quick to decide. It can be helpful to let things evolve organically, without forcing a potential interest into making a split-second decision about whether or not they would like to pursue a romantic connection. If you're meeting someone through friends or in a group, perhaps arranging an additional group activity could give you another opportunity to get to know each other better in a low-pressure environment before setting up something one-on-one.

Great suggestions! Did not realize that before.
When I organize a group activity, should I text/email/call the girl individually when I invite her (but also tell her that other people are coming as well)? Is that too much pressure for her? Or actually girls like this way as that means I am interested in her? Or should I just post it, for example, on the website of meetup groups or my facebook, so she will feel that she is just one of my guests and does not feel too much pressure?

 

[rain4venus]

(woman here)
One reason women don't like to meet one-on-one with strangers is that something like 1 out of every 5 women is raped at some point in her life.

I don't think the problem is that you are foreign, but as someone said above, because you aren't acting in a culturally acceptable way for your new home. I would be extremely creeped out by almost any man who asked me on a date 5 minutes after meeting me. The women don't know anything about you yet, so they have NO reason to want to go out with you except your looks. If you want the girl to judge you on other things, like your intellect, personality, sense of humor, career, then you need to let her experience some of these things before you ever ask her out. For me at least, your approach would set you back weeks in the process, so just don't do it.

Get to know the girl first. Arranging more group activities, as suggested above, is a great idea. If you're at a group function, and you've been talking with a girl for most of the night (hours), and it seems like you're both really hitting it off, and it seems like she's interested in getting to know you more (this part is just as important as you being interested in getting to know her more, but many guys - even American born guys - forget this part), THEN ask her for a casual date to a public place. Phrase it something like "We should go to Starbucks sometime so we can talk more about [that thing you were talking about that you have in common - if you haven't found this, then why do you want to date her?]. How's Wednesday at 5?" OR "Hey can I get your number so we can go get coffee sometime and talk more about [that thing]?"

Note this does depend on the type of girl you're looking to meet. I, personally, prefer a man who is strong and direct, but ONLY if I already feel like it's a safe space. This is because I am very shy and don't like confrontation, making it extremely uncomfortable for me to feel like I need to fight off a guy I'm not interested in. Only once I have gotten to know a man a little bit, and feel like I want to get to know him better, I do want him to be aggressive. Unfortunately, this requires a lot of reading unspoken signals on his part to make sure I want him to make the next move, which does cut down my options. But I only needed the one
This is why people are always saying "be yourself." In theory, being yourself will attract people that are attracted to people like you, which may be a very limited number. If you want to attract a different kind of woman - or a certain type of woman you are not currently attracting, you most likely need to re-evaluate how you present yourself to women. You will never be attractive to everyone, so don't worry too much if you get turned down sometimes, even following the advice in this thread.

P.S. No, it does not ever hurt to improve your physical appearance. Not all girls are into bulk, but almost everyone is into fitness, so get yourself to a gym during your many non-work hours. And find someone to go clothes shopping with who seems to have good taste, or at least who girls seem to find attractive.

 

[skab]

Great suggestions! Did not realize that before.
When I organize a group activity, should I text/email/call the girl individually when I invite her (but also tell her that other people are coming as well)? Is that too much pressure for her? Or actually girls like this way as that means I am interested in her? Or should I just post it, for example, on the website of meetup groups or my facebook, so she will feel that she is just one of my guests and does not feel too much pressure?

A friendly text inviting her along or seeing if she's attending another group event wouldn't be unwelcome. IMHO, email seems a little too impersonal and calling should probably be reserved until you know each other a little better.

 

[ruralsurg4now]

1 out of every 5 women is raped at some point in her life

Where'd you get that from, the National Organization for Women? I LOLED.

 

[SunsFun]

Where'd you get that from, the National Organization for Women? I LOLED.

Well this number may be true for certain Central African countries.

 

[SunsFun]

(woman here)
One reason women don't like to meet one-on-one with strangers is that something like 1 out of every 5 women is raped at some point in her life.

I don't think the problem is that you are foreign, but as someone said above, because you aren't acting in a culturally acceptable way for your new home. I would be extremely creeped out by almost any man who asked me on a date 5 minutes after meeting me. The women don't know anything about you yet, so they have NO reason to want to go out with you except your looks. If you want the girl to judge you on other things, like your intellect, personality, sense of humor, career, then you need to let her experience some of these things before you ever ask her out. For me at least, your approach would set you back weeks in the process, so just don't do it.

Get to know the girl first. Arranging more group activities, as suggested above, is a great idea. If you're at a group function, and you've been talking with a girl for most of the night (hours), and it seems like you're both really hitting it off, and it seems like she's interested in getting to know you more (this part is just as important as you being interested in getting to know her more, but many guys - even American born guys - forget this part), THEN ask her for a casual date to a public place. Phrase it something like "We should go to Starbucks sometime so we can talk more about [that thing you were talking about that you have in common - if you haven't found this, then why do you want to date her?]. How's Wednesday at 5?" OR "Hey can I get your number so we can go get coffee sometime and talk more about [that thing]?"

Note this does depend on the type of girl you're looking to meet. I, personally, prefer a man who is strong and direct, but ONLY if I already feel like it's a safe space. This is because I am very shy and don't like confrontation, making it extremely uncomfortable for me to feel like I need to fight off a guy I'm not interested in. Only once I have gotten to know a man a little bit, and feel like I want to get to know him better, I do want him to be aggressive. Unfortunately, this requires a lot of reading unspoken signals on his part to make sure I want him to make the next move, which does cut down my options. But I only needed the one
This is why people are always saying "be yourself." In theory, being yourself will attract people that are attracted to people like you, which may be a very limited number. If you want to attract a different kind of woman - or a certain type of woman you are not currently attracting, you most likely need to re-evaluate how you present yourself to women. You will never be attractive to everyone, so don't worry too much if you get turned down sometimes, even following the advice in this thread.

P.S. No, it does not ever hurt to improve your physical appearance. Not all girls are into bulk, but almost everyone is into fitness, so get yourself to a gym during your many non-work hours. And find someone to go clothes shopping with who seems to have good taste, or at least who girls seem to find attractive.

I disagree with this. You don't need to be talking to someone for hours to get her number. As a matter of fact you will come across even more creepy and desperate if you keep talking to the same girl the whole night and abandon your friends in the process. Unless you're talking her home short conversation is usually enough to get her number if she is digging you. The more you talk to her the higher the chance of you coming off weird/foreign. Besides you can't put all your eggs in one basket so spending less time with one girl allows you to move on to the next one and get several numbers in one night.

Also, first impressions are everything. In the first minute a girl will make up her mind if she likes you enough physically and once that happens all you can do is mess it up. Most normal grown women will have no problem going out to the restaurant with you if they find you attractive.Some college girls may not like these types of dates so with them you just meet out in the bars or clubs.

Lastly, try to get physical with her sooner rather than later otherwise you will end up friendzoned. Any girl if she likes you will be cool with it. If she is conservative she will push you back a little bit. If she is not cool with you showing her that you want her then you just need to move on to the next one.

 

[rain4venus]

Where'd you get that from, the National Organization for Women? I LOLED.

more like the CDC, but yeah I know, rape is hilarious....

 

[rain4venus]

I disagree with this. You don't need to be talking to someone for hours to get her number. As a matter of fact you will come across even more creepy and desperate if you keep talking to the same girl the whole night and abandon your friends in the process. Unless you're talking her home short conversation is usually enough to get her number if she is digging you. The more you talk to her the higher the chance of you coming off weird/foreign. Besides you can't put all your eggs in one basket so spending less time with one girl allows you to move on to the next one and get several numbers in one night.

Also, first impressions are everything. In the first minute a girl will make up her mind if she likes you enough physically and once that happens all you can do is mess it up. Most normal grown women will have no problem going out to the restaurant with you if they find you attractive.Some college girls may not like these types of dates so with them you just meet out in the bars or clubs.

Lastly, try to get physical with her sooner rather than later otherwise you will end up friendzoned. Any girl if she likes you will be cool with it. If she is conservative she will push you back a little bit. If she is not cool with you showing her that you want her then you just need to move on to the next one.

The problem is that clearly these women are NOT interested in him at the point he's asking them out. It sounds to me like he's being too forward too fast. I agree that boxing a girl in all night isn't going to work, but I consider dates to be an opportunity to get to know someone *better.* The idea of a blind date except for the fact that I already know what you look like isn't appealing to me. But like I said in my post, that's me. I pretty much only date guys I'm already friends with. *shrug*
It also completely depends on what he's looking for - getting more dates, getting more hookups, or getting married.

 

[ruralsurg4now]

more like the CDC, but yeah I know, rape is hilarious....

That's great, but if half the population (roughly) is women and 20% of them have been raped, that's approximately 31 million women who have been raped in America, which I don't buy. Do you?

 

[rain4venus]

Sadly, yes, that is buyable.
But about half were by "intimate partners" and another eighth were before the age of 10, so if it makes you feel better, it's less than 11 million who have been victims of "legitimate rape."

 

[ruralsurg4now]

OK, well it's not buyable to me.

 

[studentp0x]

ruralsurg, I think you're confusing "rape" with being raped by some violent criminal in a back dark alley. It's often not like that at all. Consider 2 things:

1) A LOT of girls go partying/drinking regularly. Just statistically, they will end up "too drunk" a certain number of times and either not be very coherent or just completely pass out. At this point, chances of being raped are quite high. Even if full out rape doesn't occur (penetrative intercourse), some form of sexual assault (being touched for example) is quite likely... And this is why I wouldn't ever let my daughter(s) go partying (if i ever have a daughter ). These scenarios are very common, and virtually every party girl I know has been a victim (most on multiple occasions, keeping in mind even if they have some small recollection, they weren't in the state of mind to consent properly). Also, don't forget many times a girl won't ever even know or ever remember.
That 'guy friend" who you've known for a while, can quickly turn into a rapist after a long session of drinking/partying.

2) Child molestation, no explanation needed for this. It happens, happens a lot.

 

[ctcell]

ruralsurg, I think you're confusing "rape" with being raped by some violent criminal in a back dark alley. It's often not like that at all. Consider 2 things:

1) A LOT of girls go partying/drinking regularly. Just statistically, they will end up "too drunk" a certain number of times and either not be very coherent or just completely pass out. At this point, chances of being raped are quite high. Even if full out rape doesn't occur (penetrative intercourse), some form of sexual assault (being touched for example) is quite likely... And this is why I wouldn't ever let my daughter(s) go partying (if i ever have a daughter ). These scenarios are very common, and virtually every party girl I know has been a victim (most on multiple occasions, keeping in mind even if they have some small recollection, they weren't in the state of mind to consent properly). Also, don't forget many times a girl won't ever even know or ever remember.
That 'guy friend" who you've known for a while, can quickly turn into a rapist after a long session of drinking/partying.

2) Child molestation, no explanation needed for this. It happens, happens a lot.

This is interesting and something that I would like to understand, as I grew up in a country that young people do not party or go to bars. If party is so dangerous for girls, why there are so many of them go to parties and get drunk? I think they can either just not going or refuse to drink if they do go there.

 

[studentp0x]

This is interesting and something that I would like to understand, as I grew up in a country that young people do not party or go to bars. If party is so dangerous for girls, why there are so many of them go to parties and get drunk? I think they can either just not going or refuse to drink if they do go there.

There's usually a variety of reasons. Not all parties are the same, and your level of intoxication isn't the same at every party. Some parties, no one gets laid at all. Some parties are half orgies. Certainly being really drunk in the second environment is almost a guaranteed ticket to sexual assault.
Girls go to parties for social reasons and due to being a part of a social group.. or due to being friends with such people. However, that's one reason I've talked about the need of parental supervision over teenagers (something that likely won't exist in families where both people work 40+ hours a week). Age is one factor, but the level of peer pressure is too strong during the teenage years to allow teens to make well informed decisions.

I personally (if i have a daughter) will raise my daughter to not want to go to parties from the beginning, nor would I give her permission to. Anyone who cares about their daughter should be doing the same thing.

 

[ruralsurg4now]

If 20% of women are getting so drunk they're getting raped at parties and they presumably don't like bing raped, I would assume they would just not get drunk at parties. Still not buying it.

 

[that redhead]

If you had no problems back home but are now experiencing problems, it's likely that you're still unfamiliar with cultural norms/customs. Heck, I'm in school in Canada from the US and there are still cultural things I had to pick up. It takes time to get into the groove of a new, unfamiliar social scene and it's possible that you're diving in headfirst without doing any groundwork. It would be good to go out with a group of friends (no expectations) and just absorb what's going on - what are people wearing? How do they approach strangers? What do they talk about? It may be that you just need a little time to get your footing before approaching women to date.

I think it's fine to invite her out the first time you meet her - she knows you're interested. But many women (myself included) would be more amenable to a low-key first date like coffee - quick (in case she doesn't like where it's going), in a busy/"safe" place, etc. If things go well with coffee, progress to something another step up, etc. And if you want to go out, get her number and follow up the next day or so with a date/time/place in mind. Take the initiative - if she rejects that particular time, ask when she's free. If she continues to dodge, let it go and move on. Good luck

 

[that redhead]

Christ on a cracker, let's all blame the drunk women for rape? Where's that head explosion smiley when you need it...

 

[ctcell]

Now it seems most people suggest me to take it slowly. But if I suggest something (a place/activity/time) that she does not feel comfortable with, she should always come up with an alternative plan if she still want to know more about me, right? So can I safely assume that if she does not suggest anything else, she does not even want to know more about me?
And I also tried to organize group activities and invited 10 to 20 girls and about the same number of guys each time. For the majority of the events no girls responded. So can I safely assume that none of the girls are interested in knowing more about me (although most of them have only met me one time)?
Then what else can I do to meet more girls? My colleague residents are on average 5 years older than me and are mostly married, and they do not go to any social activity or they only invite people from their own culture/country.

 

[ctcell]

And I also make efforts to go to events hosted by other people of my age. But I noticed most of those events are centered around alcohol (e.g. parties, bars, dancing club, pub crawls, wine tasting.... and it's quite common to see a guy buy a drink for a girl to start a conversation), I don't drink alcohol at all and feel ashamed to buy other people a drink. Although I still go to those events, but always wondering that if they are the right person that I should hang out with (alcohol is a proven health hazard and frequent alcohol consumption is a sign to me that this person is not taking responsibility of his/her health, let alone being responsible for others).
And in a broader aspect, I feel that I don't fit in any social circle here (I have been in the U.S. for 1.5 years). Resident colleagues don't accept me because of the age gap (and most of them are married and have no time for social activity), medical students don't accept me because they think I am a senior resident (and they are also busy and have their own circle), people outside the hospital don't accept me because they have already established their social circle through classmates from kindergarden to college, and I have very little in common with those people (for example some songs and movies are well-known to most of them and I have never heard of). Everyone is "friendly" and polite to me, but keep a distance from me. Meanwhile, I intentionally avoid people from my home country as I feel that I will never be accepted by local society if I spend significant amount of time with people from homeland, while at the same time I have no idea how long is the road ahead of me to be assimilated into local society and how painful the process will be especially given the fact that I came here at a relatively older age (unlike SunsFun who came here in high school when kids are still very honest and tell you what they really think of you).
Sorry if it sounds like complaints. But before I came to the U.S., I have never made any effort to meet girls (or meet people in general) as they always take initiative. So unfortunately I barely have any experience with this.

 

[studentp0x]

Christ on a cracker, let's all blame the drunk women for rape? Where's that head explosion smiley when you need it...

When did this become about blame? This is about preventing rape.

In every case of rape such as this where there's concrete evidence, I support extreme measures (that are used on the other side of the world - death penalty).

But, does that not mean you should actively prevent such people from getting to you? Teenagers do not have the mental capacity to make accurate decisions in regards to preventing such things. Now if you're a parent of a teenage female, it is your job to not allow her in such settings where such things can occur. Similarly, you need to teach your 5 year old not to get into a stranger's car and you yourself need to not walk through a dark alley at night.

I knew a couple smart teenage girls who avoided drinking anything more than a couple beers with guys for fear that they'd be taken advantage of... but most teenage women don't think like that. It's sad that some guys are like that, but it is what is it.

 

[that redhead]

Being aware of one's surroundings and taking measures to avoid being the victim of a crime are important - I don't argue that. But the whole idea that it is the purely the woman's responsibility to prevent her own rape is just...ugh. I think equally important to educating my daughter about the potential risks of heavy drinking (even aside from the possibility of rape) is educating my son to be a respectful human being who would not take advantage of a woman in that situation. The responsibility of preventing rape, sexual assault and crimes in general does not lie with one gender, but with society as a whole.