Optometry not a good investment if you have more than $50,000 in federal loans

[AwesomeTeeth]

Personally I think Dental Hygiene is a better route, if you'd enjoy doing that. It's a 2 year program that might cost you around 20 to 30K and afterwards you can expect to make anywhere from $35 to $50 per hour. $35 per hour = $72,800 or $50 per hour = $104,000. Now that's what I call a good financial investment, 6 years of schooling and loans worth bout 50K to yield a 75K to 100K salary.

Those salary numbers for dental hygiene are way off. I promise you they do not make that much. Maybe you're thinking PA?

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[layogurt]

Those salary numbers for dental hygiene are way off. I promise you they do not make that much. Maybe you're thinking PA?

You don't have to promise me anything. Most private offices don't list their salaries online, you can tend to see public clinics. Five of my female friends are hygienists in NYC and each makes at or more than $50 per hour. The problem is that they have to buy their own medical insurance which can cost from 10 to 20K a year. Otherwise they're still making bank. "Official" NYC salaries from Indeed.com list hygienists at 69K annually which is around $33 to $34 an hour.

 

[layogurt]

I keep telling you I'm NOT taking the grad plus loan! They offered me up to $42k Stafford, but I'm taking 40k/year.

Tuition + Other Fees = 48K. So I don't know how to plan to get another 8K and that doesn't include housing? How do you plan to pay for that? If you plan to live at home then you shouldn't be criticizing Shnurek for doing the same.

 

[Optomchick]

Tuition + Other Fees = 48K. So I don't know how to plan to get another 8K and that doesn't include housing? How do you plan to pay for that? If you plan to live at home then you shouldn't be criticizing Shnurek for doing the same.

$33,000 tuition ($32,000 tuition year 2-4) + $6000 apartment with utilities leaves about $1-2k for fees, then my part-time job and savings will probably cover food and equiptment costs. I am not living at home so I guess im allowed to criticize him

 

[Optomchick]

Not much changed I did the math for you since you don't know or care how to count your money. A roommate will only allow you to split the rent in half. All other expenses remain neutral. I believe you can only take 30K from Stafford for Optometry school, someone correct me if i'm wrong.

Your Monthly Payment will be
Stafford: $1,657
Grad Plus: $1,710
Total Monthly Payment: $3,367
3,367 * 120 pmts = $404,040 for your OD education

As I said above you'll earn either 75K which is around $3,634 a month meaning you'll have $267 left over afterwards. You can't live off $267. However if you earn 90K which is around $4,361 you'll have about $1,000 left over per month. This will barely cover rent, food, going out, etc. You'll probably have to live at home or with someone and you'll probably need to extend your loans to 30 years just so you can pay them off.

Personally I think Dental Hygiene is a better route, if you'd enjoy doing that. It's a 2 year program that might cost you around 20 to 30K and afterwards you can expect to make anywhere from $35 to $50 per hour. $35 per hour = $72,800 or $50 per hour = $104,000. Now that's what I call a good financial investment, 6 years of schooling and loans worth bout 50K to yield a 75K to 100K salary.

Also can you please recalculate with 40K a year stafford do you think if I took 35k instead it would make a big difference?

 

[layogurt]

$33,000 tuition ($32,000 tuition year 2-4) + $6000 apartment with utilities leaves about $1-2k for fees, then my part-time job and savings will probably cover food and equiptment costs. I am not living at home so I guess im allowed to criticize him

Work part time while going to a full time professional school program??? You're gonna be in for a real treat if you think you can manage working while doing a professional program full time. It's not ugrad where you can cram the night before. It doesn't work like that. I will assume that you'll quit your job after you realize its impossible to handle both. Even with cheaper rent your total cost will be be 236K and you're monthly payment will be $2,302 and if you earn $3,635 (75k a year) expect to have $1,333 left over. This equals a really frugal lifestyle.

PS Start doing your own research regarding your finance since I am not being paid for my services But expect to have a check by check type of lifestyle for a while.

 

[Blondiechick919]

Also can you please recalculate with 40K a year stafford do you think if I took 35k instead it would make a big difference?

Ummmmm yeah right...again, I say...try to live on $2000 a year in southern california (with or without a part time job). Even $10,000 is way under budgeting. That leaves you about 830.00 a month for ALL YOUR BILLS. Rent, food, car, electric, phone, etc.

 

[layogurt]

Ummmmm yeah right...again, I say...try to live on $2000 a year in southern california (with or without a part time job). Even $10,000 is way under budgeting. That leaves you about 830.00 a month for ALL YOUR BILLS. Rent, food, car, electric, phone, etc.

Interesting outside opinion! This will definitely make the numbers even worse for optomochick.

 

[Optomchick]

Ummmmm yeah right...again, I say...try to live on $2000 a year in southern california (with or without a part time job). Even $10,000 is way under budgeting. That leaves you about 830.00 a month for ALL YOUR BILLS. Rent, food, car, electric, phone, etc.

My parents are covering those. Don't hate on CA

 

[layogurt]

My parents are covering those. Don't hate on CA

oh so its cool to take money from your parents but its not cool to live with them you're def one funny chick. Either way I doubt you can work part time as a I said before so expect a very frugal lifestyle after this interesting investment choice.

 

[Optomchick]

oh so its cool to take money from your parents but its not cool to live with them you're def one funny chick. Either way I doubt you can work part time as a I said before so expect a very frugal lifestyle after this interesting investment choice.

IDK if you read the other thread, but the job is VERY part time, only like 4-6 hours on weekends, maybe 4-6 months out of the year. OK fine it is kind of hypocritical, but at least I can always fall back on my parents if ends don't meet haha.

 

[Optomchick]

Ummmmm yeah right...again, I say...try to live on $2000 a year in southern california (with or without a part time job). Even $10,000 is way under budgeting. That leaves you about 830.00 a month for ALL YOUR BILLS. Rent, food, car, electric, phone, etc.

@Blondechick, I've lived in Norcal/Socal my entire life, there's no need to keep "reminding me" that it's expensive. If you want to know, Pomona is one of the cheapest cities in CA. Have you ever even been to CA?

 

[AwesomeTeeth]

You don't have to promise me anything. Most private offices don't list their salaries online, you can tend to see public clinics. Five of my female friends are hygienists in NYC and each makes at or more than $50 per hour. The problem is that they have to buy their own medical insurance which can cost from 10 to 20K a year. Otherwise they're still making bank. "Official" NYC salaries from Indeed.com list hygienists at 69K annually which is around $33 to $34 an hour.

NYC. That's the problem right there. Almost everyone's salary is inflated there due to cost of living. If those hygienists made anything less, they'd be living under the Brooklyn bridge in a box. Those hygienists friends of yours wouldn't be making that in most markets. That indeed.com salary is more accurate and 69K isn't that great in NYC.

 

[deleted103644]

NYC. That's the problem right there. Almost everyone's salary is inflated there due to cost of living. If those hygienists made anything less, they'd be living under the Brooklyn bridge in a box. Those hygienists friends of yours wouldn't be making that anywhere else in the country. That indeed.com salary is more accurate and 69K isn't that great in NYC.

Physician salaries are actually lower due to over-supply.

 

[layogurt]

NYC. That's the problem right there. Almost everyone's salary is inflated there due to cost of living. If those hygienists made anything less, they'd be living under the Brooklyn bridge in a box. Those hygienists friends of yours wouldn't be making that in most markets. That indeed.com salary is more accurate and 69K isn't that great in NYC.

Private offices do not report their earnings on sites like indeed.com because they dont have to. So as they say the truth is somewhere in the middle of 70K to 100K. From my experience its been at or near 100K for most hygienists in the NY metro region. And I agree with johnny, due to oversupply a lot of medical profession earn significantly less in NYC. Either way the rate is pretty darn close to what I said before which is from $35 to $50 per hour.

 

[layogurt]

IDK if you read the other thread, but the job is VERY part time, only like 4-6 hours on weekends, maybe 4-6 months out of the year. OK fine it is kind of hypocritical, but at least I can always fall back on my parents if ends don't meet haha.

The numbers speak for themselves, OD as a profession is a debt trap.

 

[Blondiechick919]

@Blondechick, I've lived in Norcal/Socal my entire life, there's no need to keep "reminding me" that it's expensive. If you want to know, Pomona is one of the cheapest cities in CA. Have you ever even been to CA?

I'm not trying to "remind you that it's expensive", it's just that not all of us have the luxury of running to mommy and daddy for money. My parents have government jobs and make good money but are putting my brother and sister through college just like they put me through undergrad so the deal was that grad school is up to me.

For the record, I'm not hating on SoCal, I've wanted to visit there forever. My boyfriend grew up half a mile from Disneyland and went every week as a child. Even if I had an opt school in my state, I would most likely apply elsewhere for a change of scenery, but that's just me.

 

[layogurt]

I'm not trying to "remind you that it's expensive", it's just that not all of us have the luxury of running to mommy and daddy for money. My parents have government jobs and make good money but are putting my brother and sister through college just like they put me through undergrad so the deal was that grad school is up to me.

For the record, I'm not hating on SoCal, I've wanted to visit there forever. My boyfriend grew up half a mile from Disneyland and went every week as a child. Even if I had an opt school in my state, I would most likely apply elsewhere for a change of scenery, but that's just me.

BS statement lol you'd go where ever its cheaper. its quite foolish to pay significantly more money for a different set of trees, buildings and streets

 

[Blondiechick919]

If they are private schools that charge the same tuition regardless of in state status, you better believe it!!

 

[jblil]

Those hygienists friends of yours wouldn't be making that in most markets.

My niece is a dental hygienist in the Raleigh-Durham area (NC) and makes $27/hr.

 

[Cozell]

Yeah Hygienist in NC start around 20-30 and work up to about 25-35

And what is the average salary for optometrist I didnt bother reading this whole thing but I assume it is pretty low.

 

[layogurt]

If they are private schools that charge the same tuition regardless of in state status, you better believe it!!

private schools are more expensive than a state school, a smart person tries to get into their state school at all costs and then relies on privates. Private OD schools are debt traps.

 

[Blondiechick919]

private schools are more expensive than a state school, a smart person tries to get into their state school at all costs and then relies on privates. Private OD schools are debt traps.

Well this is a mute point since I have no OD school within 4 hours of my house and I'm going to South Florida anyway. Nova's tuition for out-of-state is less than PCO's for ALL students by several thousand, and then the cost of living is WAY less. And it's no contest to where I would rather live between semi-ghetto Pennsylvania, Columbus, Ohio, or have it be 75 degrees in November. I highly doubt I'll come back to DC after graduation.

 

[Optomchick]

I'm not trying to "remind you that it's expensive", it's just that not all of us have the luxury of running to mommy and daddy for money. My parents have government jobs and make good money but are putting my brother and sister through college just like they put me through undergrad so the deal was that grad school is up to me.

For the record, I'm not hating on SoCal, I've wanted to visit there forever. My boyfriend grew up half a mile from Disneyland and went every week as a child. Even if I had an opt school in my state, I would most likely apply elsewhere for a change of scenery, but that's just me.

Well let me tell you about CA...NorCal and Socal are VERY different. So I'm getting enough of a scenery change by going back so Socal after spending a year in Norcal. In my opinion Socal has better beaches and more laid back people.

As far as what the above posters said, no intelligent person would pick a more expensive school for the scenery change. It's like if Berkley were way cheaper (like back in the day) there's no way anyone would pick SCCO over Berk, even though they liked Socal better. (Kind of sad how expensive Berk has gotten).

Not to have to defend myself, but my parents didn't pay for my undergrad. I went to a UC and they gave me grants to cover my tuition and then I got a scholarship to cover my housing.

But I think you have a valid point in that A LOT of students don't have their parents to fall back on and are going to have to take A LOT more than 40K stafford. Maybe $10-15k grad plus that has 7.8% interest. I think those people might have to seriously consider if Optometry returns are going to make up that amount of money spent. This is where Jason K has a quite valid point that putting yourself into a hole of debt for Optometry isn't worth it. I'm an only child, so I might even get my parents to chip in for paying back my loan or paying for my apartment, but others that don't have this security should really consider a field with a higher return on their loan.

 

[Shnurek]

private schools are more expensive than a state school, a smart person tries to get into their state school at all costs and then relies on privates. Private OD schools are debt traps.

Exactly I feel so lucky almost everytime I think about it that I have the privilege to go to a state school and at the same time live with my ageing parents to take care of them. If I didn't get into this school I honestly don't know if I could have afforded optometry. I'm from a type of family that hates debt no matter what kind and we do not spend money we do not have.

In college its cool to live away from the parents and explore new things but people grow up and realize that you save tens of thousands of dollars just by dealing with a few annoying things your parents might do.

Also layogurt you are comparing hygienists to optometrists which are two completely different professions. One is a mid-level with a ~65k salary and the other is a doctoral level autonomous practitioner with ~100k mean salary and potential ~175k when you own your own practice.

 

[Optomchick]

Exactly I feel so lucky almost everytime I think about it that I have the privilege to go to a state school and at the same time live with my ageing parents to take care of them. If I didn't get into this school I honestly don't know if I could have afforded optometry. I'm from a type of family that hates debt no matter what kind and we do not spend money we do not have.

In college its cool to live away from the parents and explore new things but people grow up and realize that you save tens of thousands of dollars just by dealing with a few annoying things your parents might do.

Also layogurt you are comparing hygienists to optometrists which are two completely different professions. One is a mid-level with a ~65k salary and the other is a doctoral level autonomous practitioner with ~100k mean salary and potential ~175k when you own your own practice.

I am very jealous of your tuition price lol. Kind of sucks you can't have your gf sleep over at "your place" though

 

[layogurt]

Exactly I feel so lucky almost everytime I think about it that I have the privilege to go to a state school and at the same time live with my ageing parents to take care of them. If I didn't get into this school I honestly don't know if I could have afforded optometry. I'm from a type of family that hates debt no matter what kind and we do not spend money we do not have.

In college its cool to live away from the parents and explore new things but people grow up and realize that you save tens of thousands of dollars just by dealing with a few annoying things your parents might do.

Also layogurt you are comparing hygienists to optometrists which are two completely different professions. One is a mid-level with a ~65k salary and the other is a doctoral level autonomous practitioner with ~100k mean salary and potential ~175k when you own your own practice.

175K? no way dude. I'll give you your 100 to 120K in NYC and no where else. Then you'll take the hygienists NYC salary of 80 to 100K.

Lets run some basic stats:
- Hygiene is a 2 yr program at a CC and OD is a 4 yr prof program.
- Hygiene will probably cost 20K for the whole ride and OD will cost 80K for you since you're living at home.
- Your 80K will turn into 108K after yearly tuition increases and loan capitalization. Then adding on interest after 10 years that will turn into $150K. So you'll spend $150K cash for your education and you give up working for 4 years.
- Hygienist works for 4 years that you're in school and saves the $150K that you'll spend on your education. Hygienist that earns $80K will earn around $53 post tax x 4 years = $214K + the $150K that they save by skipping OD school = $364K
- If you as an OD earn 100K (60K post tax) then you'd need to work another 6 years just to catch up to the hygienist. But wait she'll probably get a salary increase in the 4 years she has ahead of you therefore she will probaly earn 53K + 53K + 60K (which is 90K pretax) + 60K = $226K + $150K = $376K MORE THAN YOU. So then take 376/60 = 6.27 YEARS. Also remember I was very generous and gave you a starting salary of 100K, this probably won't happen right away so I anticipate: A hygienist will OUTEARN YOU BY $500K or HALF A MILLION DOLLARS. You'll catch up after 8 or more years. Good luck!

 

[Blondiechick919]

Well let me tell you about CA...NorCal and Socal are VERY different. So I'm getting enough of a scenery change by going back so Socal after spending a year in Norcal. In my opinion Socal has better beaches and more laid back people.

As far as what the above posters said, no intelligent person would pick a more expensive school for the scenery change. It's like if Berkley were way cheaper (like back in the day) there's no way anyone would pick SCCO over Berk, even though they liked Socal better. (Kind of sad how expensive Berk has gotten).

Not to have to defend myself, but my parents didn't pay for my undergrad. I went to a UC and they gave me grants to cover my tuition and then I got a scholarship to cover my housing.

But I think you have a valid point in that A LOT of students don't have their parents to fall back on and are going to have to take A LOT more than 40K stafford. Maybe $10-15k grad plus that has 7.8% interest. I think those people might have to seriously consider if Optometry returns are going to make up that amount of money spent. This is where Jason K has a quite valid point that putting yourself into a hole of debt for Optometry isn't worth it. [B]I'm an only child[/B], so I might even get my parents to chip in for paying back my loan or paying for my apartment, but others that don't have this security should really consider a field with a higher return on their loan.

see now this makes sense. If I was an only child I guarantee my parents would have no problem putting me through grad school as well as undergrad. Unfortunately I have 2 younger siblings and in 2013-2014 we will all be in school at the same time. I'd like to also not have to get married at city hall as well, so we'll see how that works out

 

[layogurt]

500K is a lot of cheddar

 

[Shnurek]

[/B]

175K? no way dude. I'll give you your 100 to 120K in NYC and no where else. Then you'll take the hygienists NYC salary of 80 to 100K.

Lets run some basic stats:
- Hygiene is a 2 yr program at a CC and OD is a 4 yr prof program.
- Hygiene will probably cost 20K for the whole ride and OD will cost 80K for you since you're living at home.
- Your 80K will turn into 108K after yearly tuition increases and loan capitalization. Then adding on interest after 10 years that will turn into $150K. So you'll spend $150K cash for your education and you give up working for 4 years.
- Hygienist works for 4 years that you're in school and saves the $150K that you'll spend on your education. Hygienist that earns $80K will earn around $53 post tax x 4 years = $214K + the $150K that they save by skipping OD school = $364K
- If you as an OD earn 100K (60K post tax) then you'd need to work another 6 years just to catch up to the hygienist. But wait she'll probably get a salary increase in the 4 years she has ahead of you therefore she will probaly earn 53K + 53K + 60K (which is 90K pretax) + 60K = $226K + $150K = $376K MORE THAN YOU. So then take 376/60 = 6.27 YEARS. Also remember I was very generous and gave you a starting salary of 100K, this probably won't happen right away so I anticipate: A hygienist will OUTEARN YOU BY $500K or HALF A MILLION DOLLARS. You'll catch up after 8 or more years. Good luck!

1) You forgot the 20k hygienist tuition cost so it would be more like 60k over for an OD assuming no accrued interest. (I'm using my life savings at this point so 0 debt thus far.)
2) I don't want to be someone's b*tch for the rest of my life.
3) You overestimate hygienist salary and underestimate optometrist salary. Go to bls.gov for the most objective rankings.

 

[KHE]

[/B]

175K? no way dude. I'll give you your 100 to 120K in NYC and no where else. Then you'll take the hygienists NYC salary of 80 to 100K.

!

As a practice owner, I can assure you that I make a hell of a lot more than that and I'm not in NYC.

 

[Tippytoe]

As a practice owner, I can assure you that I make a hell of a lot more than that and I'm not in NYC.

Ditto. However, we are likely that last generation that will able to say this.

 

[layogurt]

.

 

[AwesomeTeeth]

My niece is a dental hygienist in the Raleigh-Durham area (NC) and makes $27/hr.

Which is alot less then the 50/hour that layogurt is quoting.....

But whatever, I don't even know why I'm here. Goodbye future optometrists, I wish you all the best of luck.

 

[layogurt]

wrong ms

 

[layogurt]

Which is alot less then the 50/hour that layogurt is quoting.....

But whatever, I don't even know why I'm here. Goodbye future optometrists, I wish you all the best of luck.

Yup in NC NOT NYC! Regional averages VARY according to region

 

[layogurt]

1) You forgot the 20k hygienist tuition cost so it would be more like 60k over for an OD assuming no accrued interest. (I'm using my life savings at this point so 0 debt thus far.)
2) I don't want to be someone's b*tch for the rest of my life.
3) You overestimate hygienist salary and underestimate optometrist salary. Go to bls.gov for the most objective rankings.

1. 20K isnt more than 145K so no point to nickpick and most people dont have 80K and will thus have similar loans
2. You will be someones b*tch haha your PATIENTS haha they'll own you, nag, hassle and annoy you.
3. http://www.bls.gov/ooh/Healthcare/Optometrists.htm

BLS reports 100K as the median. So I think you just got owned by a gov't website Plus a DH job is growing much faster than an OD so they'll have more opportunities and thus will be able to increase their salaries at a faster rate.

Oh and your logic about losing 80K w/o interest vs. 150K doesn't add much weight. A DH will still out earn you by around 400K or so. And even with a 100K salary aka 63K post tax you'll still need 7 years just to catch up to her level of income. You'll outpace her in like 10 or 15 years. So good luck!

 

[Optomchick]

1. 20K isnt more than 145K so no point to nickpick and most people dont have 80K and will thus have similar loans
2. You will be someones b*tch haha your PATIENTS haha they'll own you, nag, hassle and annoy you.
3. http://www.bls.gov/ooh/Healthcare/Optometrists.htm

BLS reports 100K as the median. So I think you just got owned by a gov't website Plus a DH job is growing much faster than an OD so they'll have more opportunities and thus will be able to increase their salaries at a faster rate.

Oh and your logic about losing 80K w/o interest vs. 150K doesn't add much weight. A DH will still out earn you by around 400K or so. And even with a 100K salary aka 63K post tax you'll still need 7 years just to catch up to her level of income. You'll outpace her in like 10 or 15 years. So good luck!

So why don't you go become a Dental Hygenist?? Oh right, cause it's a hard job that makes ****. If you were to say that Dental Hygenists make A LOT of money around here in CA, people would LAUGH their ass off at you. Not to mention the fact that DeVry and Community colleges churn out about 10 hygenists a day... See we all know that Optometry is declining, but don't throw some **** on here that Dental Hygenists make more than ODs because it's hilarious and we all just saw right through you.

 

[Jason K]

Not to mention the fact that DeVry and Community colleges churn out about 10 hygenists a day...

For what it's worth, dental hygiene and dental assisting are two very different things. You're thinking of dental assisting.

 

[layogurt]

So why don't you go become a Dental Hygenist?? Oh right, cause it's a hard job that makes ****. If you were to say that Dental Hygenists make A LOT of money around here in CA, people would LAUGH their ass off at you. Not to mention the fact that DeVry and Community colleges churn out about 10 hygenists a day... See we all know that Optometry is declining, but don't throw some **** on here that Dental Hygenists make more than ODs because it's hilarious and we all just saw right through you.

First of all I'm actually in dental school (3rd year) hahaha to be a dentist. I worked hard to get there. I didnt score a 320 like you on the OAT which is the 60th percentile. I scored in the 90th percentile and got into a super competitive program that only interviews 10% of 2,500 applicants. I ran the numbers for you ONCE AGAIN and yet once again you want to live in LA-LA land. Everything sucks out in Cali.. from Optometry to Dentistry to Pharma; the only good thing is the weather. But by opening your eyes (get it and looking at the debt you'll owe you'll realize you'll be behind a hygienist for a long period of time. You'll spend 282K for your education after the loan matures and the hygienist will work for those 4 years when you're in school. So googling Ponoma salaries for a DH, I got 54K which is about 36K post tax. 36 x 4 = 144K + the 282K you'll spend = $426,000 then you'll come out making 75k which is 47K post tax. $426,000/47,000 = 9 YEARS! That means after you graduate you'll be 10 YEARS BEHIND A DH IN TERMS OF INCOME! The "dumb" DeVry DH will out earn you for 10 years of your life

And to chime in Jason K was probably right, you have no clue as to what a DH does. You should probably google it, its nothing like assisting and the programs are actually competitive, they don't take students with average scores.

 

[Shnurek]

BLS reports 100K as the median. So I think you just got owned by a gov't website Plus a DH job is growing much faster than an OD so they'll have more opportunities and thus will be able to increase their salaries at a faster rate.

Oh and your logic about losing 80K w/o interest vs. 150K doesn't add much weight. A DH will still out earn you by around 400K or so. And even with a 100K salary aka 63K post tax you'll still need 7 years just to catch up to her level of income. You'll outpace her in like 10 or 15 years. So good luck!

um ya I said its ~100k so how exactly was I owned?
This is salary but average practice owner net is almost double as the overhead isn't as expensive as say dentistry but dents make more in the end, harder work.

First you say 8 years to catch up...now 10-15 make up your mind.

That's great that you are doing dentistry. I hope you love it at least a little bit its a great field if you can get over the average debt load for it. Its higher than any other professional schools out there I think around 250k. I've also seen 420k.

 

[layogurt]

um ya I said its ~100k so how exactly was I owned?
This is salary but average practice owner net is almost double as the overhead isn't as expensive as say dentistry but dents make more in the end, harder work.

First you say 8 years to catch up...now 10-15 make up your mind.

That's great that you are doing dentistry. I hope you love it at least a little bit its a great field if you can get over the average debt load for it. Its higher than any other professional schools out there I think around 250k. I've also seen 420k.

$100K is the average salary but it doesn't mention tenure in the profession. You can earn 100K after 10 years in the field. Here's some real data: http://www.opted.org/files/public/Optometry_Career_Guide_April2008.pdf

Page 7 shows that it will STILL take you from 6 to 10 years to earn your coveted 100K.
Regarding the income difference, it will take both you and optochick around 10 years to catch up. It doesnt matter whether its 8 or 10 or 15. You'll owe more and have a lot less than any DH anywhere. That's a fact. Slice it however you like. And you're last statement doesn't make any sense. Your awesome OD programs like Western cost more than 250K. Oh and don't worry about me I'll have a very small debt and my starting salary will be much higher than yours I'd never go to a school where i'd have to take out 420K. I'll owe a lot less than most OD students and out earn them. I love dentistry its awesome, its a real hands on type of profession. It's not a wishy washy hands off profession like pharma or OD, it includes real surgery and procedures, not eyedrops

 

[OpticalBlackOut]

You'll spend 282K for your education after the loan matures and the hygienist will work for those 4 years when you're in school. So googling Ponoma salaries for a DH, I got 54K which is about 36K post tax. 36 x 4 = 144K + the 282K you'll spend = $426,000 then you'll come out making 75k which is 47K post tax. $426,000/47,000 = 9 YEARS! That means after you graduate you'll be 10 YEARS BEHIND A DH IN TERMS OF INCOME! The "dumb" DeVry DH will out earn you for 10 years of your life

Your credibility just went out the window with some very poor math calculations.
54Kx.67= 36K
75Kx.67= 50K
Ok, fine. Higher tax bracket...even though this wasn't mentioned.

Somehow that optometry student is paying for rent, food (and maybe a freaking boat?) with the max. amount of loans while that working dental hygienist is saving every single penny while living in a box by the highway. Right.
And it's Pomona

 

[Shnurek]

layogurt like I said dentistry is a great profession (as of now b/c their reimbursement rates are really good...for now) and you seem to like it and that's awesome but don't come here to insult people that like what they do as well even though they might make less over their lifetimes. I for one rather make 100k doing something I love than 160k or w/e the dental average is doing something I care less about. If you love dentistry then more power to you.

I am not and never was a Type A materialist so type A fields like dent and med are not for me. But hey everyone is different, so just do you man.

 

[layogurt]

Your credibility just went out the window with some very poor math calculations.
54Kx.67= 36K
75Kx.67= 50K
Ok, fine. Higher tax bracket...even though this wasn't mentioned.

Somehow that optometry student is paying for rent, food (and maybe a freaking boat?) with the max. amount of loans while that working dental hygienist is saving every single penny while living in a box by the highway. Right.
And it's Pomona

I went through the details before, its not worth to recalculate every penny. The point is the same: a DH will out earn an OD profession in the first 10 or so years. A DH is 4 years ahead financially while you're in OD school and he/she won't spend the additional 200K or more for an OD education. You don't need a fancy calculation to get that. If you don't get it, I can't help you.

 

[layogurt]

layogurt like I said dentistry is a great profession (as of now b/c their reimbursement rates are really good...for now) and you seem to like it and that's awesome but don't come here to insult people that like what they do as well even though they might make less over their lifetimes. I for one rather make 100k doing something I love than 160k or w/e the dental average is doing something I care less about. If you love dentistry then more power to you.

I don't think you should pick a profession based on the salary, however you should pick it based on your debt to income ratio. If OD schools cost as much as some ugrad schools then I wouldn't say a peep, but when you're spending north of 200K to earn 75 to 90K that's just as scary as Law school grads that earn 50K after they spend 150K on school loans.

And again stop being delusional, it'll be a long time before you make your 100K+. People lie but the numbers dont.

 

[Shnurek]

Not being delusional b/c I never said I'd make 100k starting. You are weird and annoying and make me glad I made the right choice even more so. Wouldn't want to be surrounded by ppl like you for 4 years or longer.

 

[layogurt]

Not being delusional b/c I never said I'd make 100k starting. You are weird and annoying and make me glad I made the right choice even more so. Wouldn't want to be surrounded by ppl like you for 4 years or longer.

hahah me too. I couldnt be around delusional OD students who ignore all the facts. Watch what happens when you ignore facts about your patients

 

[Optomchick]

First of all I'm actually in dental school (3rd year) hahaha to be a dentist. I worked hard to get there. I didnt score a 320 like you on the OAT which is the 60th percentile. I scored in the 90th percentile and got into a super competitive program that only interviews 10% of 2,500 applicants. I ran the numbers for you ONCE AGAIN and yet once again you want to live in LA-LA land. Everything sucks out in Cali.. from Optometry to Dentistry to Pharma; the only good thing is the weather. But by opening your eyes (get it and looking at the debt you'll owe you'll realize you'll be behind a hygienist for a long period of time. You'll spend 282K for your education after the loan matures and the hygienist will work for those 4 years when you're in school. So googling Ponoma salaries for a DH, I got 54K which is about 36K post tax. 36 x 4 = 144K + the 282K you'll spend = $426,000 then you'll come out making 75k which is 47K post tax. $426,000/47,000 = 9 YEARS! That means after you graduate you'll be 10 YEARS BEHIND A DH IN TERMS OF INCOME! The "dumb" DeVry DH will out earn you for 10 years of your life

And to chime in Jason K was probably right, you have no clue as to what a DH does. You should probably google it, its nothing like assisting and the programs are actually competitive, they don't take students with average scores.

You're right, I have no idea what a DH does because cleaning people's dirty mouths does not appeal to me lol. And who says I'm going to practice in Pomona? I'm thinking of practicing in a high-income area of San Francisco. You know what people stop doing when the economy tanks? getting their teeth cleaned. But people NEED optometrists to WRITE prescriptions for their contacts lens that they NEED for every day, and its MANDATORY that they get a new prescription EVERY year. So while your patients will be putting off getting a dental exam for "next year when they have more money"...mine will still have to come in.

Also, I don't really appreciate some dental student coming on here and telling everyone to go be a DH, like get a life, man lol. Go post **** on your dental forums. Why is it that your brain keeps thinking back to Optometry? Maybe a bit regretful? I'm not sure what your issue is but you should accept that you're going to be some lame dentist and move-on.

P.S. Jason K--I found a community college where anyone can become a DH:
http://www.foothill.edu/bio/programs/dentalh/programs.php?title_id=Dental Hygiene

 

[layogurt]

You're right, I have no idea what a DH does because cleaning people's dirty mouths does not appeal to me lol. And who says I'm going to practice in Pomona? I'm thinking of practicing in a high-income area of San Francisco. You know what people stop doing when the economy tanks? getting their teeth cleaned. But people NEED optometrists to WRITE prescriptions for their contacts lens that they NEED for every day, and its MANDATORY that they get a new prescription EVERY year. So while your patients will be putting off getting a dental exam for "next year when they have more money"...mine will still have to come in.

Also, I don't really appreciate some dental student coming on here and telling everyone to go be a DH, like get a life, man lol. Go post **** on your dental forums. Why is it that your brain keeps thinking back to Optometry? Maybe a bit regretful? I'm not sure what your issue is but you should accept that you're going to be some lame dentist and move-on.

P.S. Jason K--I found a community college where anyone can become a DH:
http://www.foothill.edu/bio/programs/dentalh/programs.php?title_id=Dental Hygiene

Not true at all, if your vision doesn't get worse you use the same prescription that your OD gave you last year and buy contacts online instead of getting ripped off at their store But I'm not here to argue the details of what job is more fun or interesting. The thread is about finances and being a financially concerned citizen, the point is: OD isn't a good financial choice for students that have no parental help and that have to take out 200 to 300K on an OD education. The salaries are way too low to justify going to OD school unless you're living at home with mommy or having your parents pay your tuition costs... cough cough you both know who you are ... cough