The Point is That Segregating Yourself Doesn't Help with Diversity

[aphistis]

It's a little stupid to say, "I want equal rights" and then say, "I deserve special treatment b/c I'm...".

Word.

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[AhhPuller]

Perhaps minorities who think their minority status should give them special privelages should be viewed as similar to Klan members.

How dare you??!! Nah, totally right on the money.

 

[OzDDS]

You could replace "poor white males" with just about any minority and your post would still be valid. If you want to be treated the same and as an equal stop artificially segregating yourself. It's a little stupid to say, "I want equal rights" and then say, "I deserve special treatment b/c I'm...".

There are plenty of white people who don't succeed in life. Being white doesn't guarantee you anything in this country. White people who think being white guarantees them something are in the Klan. Perhaps minorities who think their minority status should give them special privelages should be viewed as similar to Klan members.

Great post!

 

[NoBraces]

...Perhaps minorities who think their minority status should give them special privelages should be viewed as similar to Klan members.

Who in SDN believes that their minority status SHOULD give them special privileges?

I have a friend, a white male blonde, blue-eyed who is 1/10th Native American, and his 1/10th Native heritage allows him to mark himself as "Native American" in his application. However, he isn't Native American culturally or socially. He is only a Native American on those school applications.

Perhaps you should check your family tree and you might discover any ancestry that you can use to your advantage. Whoa! Hold it I forgot that you are against that. My bad!

 

[tx oms]

Who in SDN believes that their minority status SHOULD give them special privileges?

I have a friend, a white male blonde, blue-eyed who is 1/10th Native American, and his 1/10th Native heritage allows him to mark himself as "Native American" in his application. However, he isn't Native American culturally or socially. He is only a Native American on those school applications.

Perhaps you should check your family tree and you might discover any ancestry that you can use to your advantage. Whoa! Hold it I forgot that you are against that. My bad!

What is the point of this post? I don't understand your point nor the value of this blathering.

As for my heritage, I generally decline to answer questions about race. What race am I? I am human. Period.

 

[NoBraces]

What is the point of this post? I don't understand your point nor the value of this blathering.

As for my heritage, I generally decline to answer questions about race. What race am I? I am human. Period.

It's a response to your post on

...Perhaps minorities who think their minority status should give them special privelages should be viewed as similar to Klan members.

My point: It is not fair to say that only minorities think that their minority status should give them special treatment. Non-minorities can make affirmative action work for them because there are loop holes.

 

[AhhPuller]

It's a response to your post on



My point: It is not fair to say that only minorities think that their minority status should give them special treatment. Non-minorities can make affirmative action work for them because there are loop holes.

Umm.. I think you're missing the point. The issue is not suddenly going to be resolved if white people find ways to fool the system. The system is the failure; compounding the problem by finding ways to paticipate in its inequalities won't make it any better. Discrimination is discrimination is discrimination. It doesn't matter how you try to mask it with fancy names like affirmative action, tolerance, or cultural diversity.

Check out this link about how nearly half of children under 5 are minorities: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/09/AR2006050901841_pf.html
It makes you wonder if the US can really hold itself together when everyone seems to want to identify with their "culture" and not America.

 

[NYUCD2010]

I am an Asian-American, and it is natural for me to admit that:

1) Most of my closest buddies are Asian-American, if not Korean-American. I feel most comfortable with others who understand certain aspects of my background. I am also seriously dating another Korean-American girl.

2) But that does not mean that I am intentional in those efforts. In fact, most minorities do not segregate on purpose - it is natural. Yes, there are cultural and ethnic groups on college campuses nationwide, but there also are mostly-Caucasian groups - they are called frats and sororities.

Whether you are Caucasian or not, let me ask you - what % of your closest family members and/or friends belong to the same ethnicity or race as yourself? If you are white, can you honestly tell me that the majority (>50%) of your friends are non-white?

The point is that intentional segregation is unhealthy no matter who does it, but that it shouldn't be everyone's homework to achieve perfect diversity in their human interactions/relationships.

If you are Caucasian, please understand that there ARE unfair and/or difficult aspects of being a minority (even if you were born in the US), and that there are valid reasons for associating yourself with others mostly of similar backgrounds. And if you are a minority, please understand that Caucasians may be slightly suspicious of US-born minorities who still seemingly stay away from mainstream society.

It makes you wonder if the US can really hold itself together when everyone seems to want to identify with their "culture" and not America.

Lastly, I would like to ask you one thing related to your statement above. If I, as a US citizen of Korean background, eat kimchi, take up Tae Kwon Do, and celebrate Korean holidays here in the US... is that less "American" than someone of Irish-American background celebrating St. Patrick's day... or someone of Italian-American descent enjoying pasta? How can identifying with one's culture be mutually exclusive with anything "America," when the nation itself is an aggregate mixture of different cultures?

 

[Cold Front]

What race am I? I am human. Period.

It's beyond that my friend.

Minority status, in my opinion means a group whose members have significantly less control or power over their lives than members of a dominant or majority group.

This is America, you are obviously not living in an area where that definition applies to.

 

[AhhPuller]

Lastly, I would like to ask you one thing related to your statement above. If I, as a US citizen of Korean background, eat kimchi, take up Tae Kwon Do, and celebrate Korean holidays here in the US... is that less "American" than someone of Irish-American background celebrating St. Patrick's day... or someone of Italian-American descent enjoying pasta? How can identifying with one's culture be mutually exclusive with anything "America," when the nation itself is an aggregate mixture of different cultures?

Yea, it's less American; it may not be PC to say, but it is less American. I think the Irish have been around long enough that you may find that most white Americans have some Irish in their background so celebrating St. Patrick's Day has sort of become a norm of American culture. Perhaps the same thing will happen with Koreans, and, if so, I welcome it cuz my g/f is Korean too and the BBQ is spectacular.

As for the notion that this country is a "mixture of different cultures," you are way off. This country was founded by disenfranchised citizens of Western Europe and really remained that way until the middle of the 20th century. It certainly wasn't the utopian "melting pot" that we learn about in grade school. I'm not saying it's a bad thing that we're now so mixed, but a drastic sway in demographics in the United States with people of different values and distinct cultures that are unwilling to accept what most of us think of as "American" will greatly divide this country.

 

[AhhPuller]

2) But that does not mean that I am intentional in those efforts. In fact, most minorities do not segregate on purpose - it is natural. Yes, there are cultural and ethnic groups on college campuses nationwide, but there also are mostly-Caucasian groups - they are called frats and sororities.

I've found that these mostly-Caucausian frats are simply reflective of our mostly white society, but usually include members of other ethnic groups. On the other hand, the "ethnic" frats (asian, hispanic, black, etc) generally only include members of those ethnicities.

 

[fightingspirit]

What race am I? I am human. Period.

this is beautiful .......but are you sure that you are as color-blind as you think you are? i am not maligning you. i am just reminding you that we have subconcious thoughts that we act on in a subconcious way too.

 

[food4thots]

i don't see why people have to assimilate to the mainstream culture, if they choose not. isn't america about the freedom of choice? a person's ethnicity is an important part of their identity. people of similar background tend to gravitate to one another, for many reasons. it's neither right, nor wrong for them to do so.

 

[fightingspirit]

the "ethnic" frats (asian, hispanic, black, etc) generally only include members of those ethnicities.

i highly doubt that "ethnic frats" are rejecting white boys.....

 

[AhhPuller]

i don't see why people have to assimilate to the mainstream culture, if they choose not. isn't america about the freedom of choice? a person's ethnicity is an important part of their identity. people of similar background tend to gravitate to one another, for many reasons. it's neither right, nor wrong for them to do so.

Yes, you have the right to do as you please. You have the right to burn the flag, you have the right to hate the country, and you have the right to do almost anything you want. The right to do something doesn't make it the right thing to do. If you are a guest in a foreign land (I am a guest here too since I'm originally from Europe), it shouldn't be too much to ask for some assimilation. What is a country to become if it can't identify with its own foundation? It's a scary thought, at least in my mind.

 

[fightingspirit]

i don't see why people have to assimilate to the mainstream culture, if they choose not. isn't america about the freedom of choice? a person's ethnicity is an important part of their identity. people of similar background tend to gravitate to one another, for many reasons. it's neither right, nor wrong for them to do so.

sure, but there is anglo-conformity that the dutch, the italians, the germans and others had to adopt, giving up their original languages when they firsy immigrated here. so why should the asians, arabs and hispanics not go through the same?

i am all for assimilation. but i am also cautious when it comes to being optimistic and sanguine about race relations....

 

[food4thots]

so you don't think that asians, hispanics, blacks, etc.. aren't assimilating to the american culture at all? i would disagree with this.

 

[food4thots]

sure, but there is anglo-conformity that the dutch, the italians, the germans and others had to adopt, giving up their original languages when they firsy immigrated here. so why should the asians, arabs and hispanics not go through the same?

i am all for assimilation. but i am also cautious when it comes to being optimistic and sanguine about race relations....

sure, but this happens over generations. many asians recently immigrated, so you can not expect the same transition immediately. some asian-americans have parents that don't even speak english.

 

[OzDDS]

sure, but this happens over generations. many asians recently immigrated, so you can not expect the same transition immediately. some asian-americans have parents that don't even speak english.

True.. and there is nothing wrong with that. But when they seclude themselves in certain areas indefinitly and refuse to put effort into learning english and assimilating.. that is the problem.

How is America any different from any other country in the world concerning this issue?

If I as an American moved to France. I had better damn well learn to speak french. If I moved to China, I would be expected to put effort into learning chinese fairly quickly and to assimilate. If I didn't.. I would be considered a rude American and I would be treated like an outcast.

People seem to think that its ok if the French expect you to learn their language when you move to their country. But God forbid that an American expect any one else to learn english and to assimlate when they move to the US.

 

[NoBraces]

Umm.. I think you're missing the point. The issue is not suddenly going to be resolved if white people find ways to fool the system. The system is the failure; compounding the problem by finding ways to paticipate in its inequalities won't make it any better. Discrimination is discrimination is discrimination. It doesn't matter how you try to mask it with fancy names like affirmative action, tolerance, or cultural diversity.

I think you are missing the point. If people can take advantage of the system then everyone will try to do it not just minorities. People are basically the same inside regardless of how you "dress" them.

Discrimination is an integral part of people's learning mechanism. It is the same mechanism that aids you in distinguishing a sphere from a cube. It is not going to go away. The problem arises when people's discrimination turns into prejudice.

Check out this link about how nearly half of children under 5 are minorities: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/09/AR2006050901841_pf.html
It makes you wonder if the US can really hold itself together when everyone seems to want to identify with their "culture" and not America.

What's wrong with this? America prides itself as being a nation of diversity and tolerance. What's American culture anyway? Can you define it? There is even cultural variation among Caucasians. For instance, religious Jewish Americans still practice customs that are purely Jewish (i.e. Kosher).

 

[NoBraces]

Yes, you have the right to do as you please. You have the right to burn the flag, you have the right to hate the country, and you have the right to do almost anything you want. The right to do something doesn't make it the right thing to do. If you are a guest in a foreign land (I am a guest here too since I'm originally from Europe), it shouldn't be too much to ask for some assimilation. What is a country to become if it can't identify with its own foundation? It's a scary thought, at least in my mind.

Isn't the choice up to the person what degree of assimilation he/she wants to take up once he/she is living in the US? I work with many foreigners in my lab and good chunk of them from Europe and most of them hate the US and GWB so much that all they can tell me is how awful this country is and how stupid Americans are for re-electing BWG. When they get together with people from their own country they speak their own language even when Americans, who only speak English, are around. I get the feeling they won't be fully assimilating soon though most of them will be here for 5 years maybe more.

Yes, it is up to people to do what they want. You and other people posting on this site won't be able to control that. You can't force people to assimilate in the way you (or anyone else) want/would like them to. If people to choose friends who are like them (a.k.a. bird of a feather flock together) or vice versa then that's their prerogative.

 

[Dutchboy]

i highly doubt that "ethnic frats" are rejecting white boys.....

? It's an Ethnic frat. Let me put it into words you can understand. "No white boys aloud".

 

[AhhPuller]

I think you are missing the point. If people can take advantage of the system then everyone will try to do it not just minorities. People are basically the same inside regardless of how you "dress" them.

Discrimination is an integral part of people's learning mechanism. It is the same mechanism that aids you in distinguishing a sphere from a cube. It is not going to go away. The problem arises when people's discrimination turns into prejudice.

OK, so? The only way to get rid of that broken system is with the aid of those the system intends to uplift.

Isn't the choice up to the person what degree of assimilation he/she wants to take up once he/she is living in the US? I work with many foreigners in my lab and good chunk of them from Europe and most of them hate the US and GWB so much that all they can tell me is how awful this country is and how stupid Americans are for re-electing BWG. When they get together with people from their own country they speak their own language even when Americans, who only speak English, are around. I get the feeling they won't be fully assimilating soon though most of them will be here for 5 years maybe more.

Of course it's up to the individual, and that person can certainly do as he/she pleases. I understand your point about recent immigrants from Europe since many of my friends are from Eastern Europe. I agree that a lot of them hate GWB, but I disagree that it extends to the US. The ones that I know seem to assimilate fairly quickly and have no problem accepting me into their groups. But if it's much less likely to see a Russian waving their flag out there in a parade because it's less tolerated I think. Tolerance is only for other groups.

 

[AhhPuller]

What's wrong with this? America prides itself as being a nation of diversity and tolerance. What's American culture anyway? Can you define it? There is even cultural variation among Caucasians. For instance, religious Jewish Americans still practice customs that are purely Jewish (i.e. Kosher).

See preview post. Yes, American culture is something distinct and specifically definable. If a nation doesn't have an identity, but is instead just groups of people living together without commonalities, it will not thrive. Who will fight for a nation that has forgotten its roots? Who will fight for a country where citizens would rather fly their native flag vs. the American flag? I highly doubt I'd be welcome with open arms in Asia or Europe if I decided to form my own little ethnic group. I'd be an outcast; I would have a hard-time finding a decent paying job that's for sure. I'd better quickly learn the language and culture or have no choice but to leave.

 

[NYUCD2010]

Yea, it's less American; it may not be PC to say, but it is less American. I think the Irish have been around long enough that you may find that most white Americans have some Irish in their background so celebrating St. Patrick's Day has sort of become a norm of American culture. Perhaps the same thing will happen with Koreans, and, if so, I welcome it cuz my g/f is Korean too and the BBQ is spectacular.

Statistically speaking, I would venture to state that the % of US citizens with "some" Irish in their blood is smaller than the equivalent population with "some" blood in African-American or Hispanic ethnicities. And surely, these people groups (and even Asian-Americans, since the Chinese immigrated in mass amounts before the Irish) and their characteristics should be considered more "mainstream American" than St. Patrick's Day, based on numbers and/or history alone, no?

In your opinion, then, shouldn't certain behavioral traits and/or cultural aspects associated with non-Caucasian ethnicities be considered more of a 'norm' within American culture? I fully agree that celebrating St. Patrick's Day has become such a norm, and I'm happy with that. But the point is that the rationale for defining something as part of 'mainstream American culture' is often illogical and, at times, even unfair. Non-Caucasian cultural groups and their behavior (i.e. Kwaanza, Chinese holidays, latin music, etc.) will be classified as non-mainstream and even foreign, EVEN though its history and numerical representation far outweighs that of other Caucasian characteristics (i.e. St. Patrick's Day).

The point is that THERE IS A GOOD and VALID reason for certain minority groups to associate with each other. Intentional segregation, again, is unhealthy (ironically, for the ones who minorities, mostly) for America, but fostering a network with other people of similar backgrounds/behaviors is standard, normal, and to a degree, empowering.

And yes, Korean BBQ (galbi) rocks.

As for the notion that this country is a "mixture of different cultures," you are way off. This country was founded by disenfranchised citizens of Western Europe and really remained that way until the middle of the 20th century. It certainly wasn't the utopian "melting pot" that we learn about in grade school. I'm not saying it's a bad thing that we're now so mixed, but a drastic sway in demographics in the United States with people of different values and distinct cultures that are unwilling to accept what most of us think of as "American" will greatly divide this country.

Yes, the nation wasn't (and still isn't) the utopian "melting pot" or even the "salad bowl" that certain schools of thought in secondary education seem to perpetuate. Having said that, what's defined as "mainstream American culture" needs to expand beyond the behaviors and characteristics associated with Caucasians and/or economically advantaged/white-collar professionals. What you fear will 'divide this country,' is unfortunately, inevitable, and open-mindedness about different cultures beats traditionalism any day.

Good dialogie. Thanks for your points.

 

[klfb80]

Okay, relax. Not all countries are like this. From direct knowledge, I can tell you tons of U.S. expats live in the middle east and are not getting killed. TONS more live in Europe.

If a country claims to be a democracy then you better be ready to accept other cultures. Otherwise, we're no different from some other rulers.... (won't say any names...)

America, as a country, is unique because it accepts other nationalities into its melting pot. I'm not saying America is not culturally distinct. Its true America is a culturally distinct entity.. BUT, as a country it was founded on the principle of welcoming other nationalities. Sure, some people go overboard in showing their cultural pride, I completely agree with that. But having a cultural student group on campus is NOT going overboard. I don't think you should generalize anyone who is proud of their cultural descent as all the same. I am a proud American and yet I am proud of my cultural descent at the same time. And I do recognize that some people go overboard in expressing their cultural descent. Lastly, I do recognize the privelage I have of being an American citizen. But rights are rights, and they should not be denied.

I missed the part of the definition of democracy where it says anything about other cultures.

 

[klfb80]

so you consider the vietnamese thread "an elite group." somebody's getting a little carried away now. i think you're spending too much time staring at those threads.

So I’m a minority, born and raised in this country. I personally would see the aforementioned threads and would ignore them. I could care less about the presence of a particular ethnicity/race/culture/religion going to a particular school. Several points.

-I’ve read on a few other threads that racism in this country doesn’t exist (or barely exists – can’t remember the exact wording). The person who wrote that must be pretending to be ignorant, or is very naïve. Aside from a little tan, and a different name, I blend right in. I’m very well endowed as well – ok that’s another story. Despite that I could tell you guys a ton of stories of how I’ve personally experienced extremely dehumanizing hate and racism.

- some white guys are saying ‘I worked damn hard for everything I got” comments , “nothing was handed to me.” ya in your eyes I guess you feel you are on equal ground with everyone else. Truth of the matter is you don’t even understand the obstacles minorities in this country have to face. And this whole reverse racism thing is very funny to me. playing the victim however is a pretty effective debating tool I will admit. To the guy who got yelled cracker while jogging ok that’s messed up – really. That is racism – and I can relate to you with that experience. However what’s much worse is racism that specifically deters your opportunities in life. i WISH that was the extent of racism i've had to deal with. And that’s despite the fact that I got a big Johnson.

- I first thought the white alliance thing was a funny joke – then while reading some of the follow-up posts – some of you seem very insecure. I’m running out of names for my little friend.

- for the most part, the ethnic threads and clubs are a waste of time – however I could see someone new to this country starting a thread like that - in order to find someone who could relate to them and guide them through getting acclimated here.
– when it comes to clubs at school, only purpose of that I could imagine is if it’s a major religious / cultural event that out-of-staters want to celebrate together and stuff, that’s cool. Imagine yourself celebrating Christmas in the reverse situation. But one the whole, yes some people get carried away with the clubs. I saw ron burgundy anchorman this morning – not very funny movie - adversely effecting my sense of humor.

- “go back to another country” – how childlike of a comment is that – are you planning on being a professional? Again – naïve, defensive, ignorant comment.

Bottom line is yes racism exists. Sooner people acknowledge it and try to do something about it, then it’ll get better. Also, minorities get carried away with the threads.

Now that I think about it, I’m actually much more appreciative of my friends and dent school classmates. was very diverse, not segregated at all. that didn't help me get my passport stamped though if u know what i'm saying.

Sob little story my friend. Boo Hoo nobody knows whats racism feels like except you. You sound like an idiot. Sure you can sit here and speak for everyone in this country and say that theres no such thing as reverse discrimination and that minorities are the only one who suffer from racism. What a stupid generalization, you must have a least (at a minimum) lived in dozens of different cities in this country because the whole statement you wrote sounds like you know every single city in this country is the same. If not, you are an jack@ss for this sob little post.

 

[NoBraces]

I missed the part of the definition of democracy where it says anything about other cultures.

Our nation is a republic not a democracy.

"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

http://www.serendipity.li/jsmill/baska01.htm
http://www.chrononhotonthologos.com/lawnotes/repvsdem.htm

 

[klfb80]

Who in SDN believes that their minority status SHOULD give them special privileges?

I have a friend, a white male blonde, blue-eyed who is 1/10th Native American, and his 1/10th Native heritage allows him to mark himself as "Native American" in his application. However, he isn't Native American culturally or socially. He is only a Native American on those school applications.

Perhaps you should check your family tree and you might discover any ancestry that you can use to your advantage. Whoa! Hold it I forgot that you are against that. My bad!

Check those stats. They are incorrect. You should be a much higher percent in order to claim it (not sure what percent, I've heard 1/3). In my opinion if you are less than that and have no tribal affiliation your using it as a crutch. I guess he could say i'm 1/10 native american. But if your friend is going around putting that on applications then he is straight up dishonest or atlest not telling the whole truth. People like that never win in the end.

 

[klfb80]

Our nation is a republic not a democracy.

"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

http://www.serendipity.li/jsmill/baska01.htm
http://www.chrononhotonthologos.com/lawnotes/repvsdem.htm

just quoting someone else pal. not an original if you'll notice the post I made.

 

[klfb80]

i highly doubt that "ethnic frats" are rejecting white boys.....

Isn't the first requirement of an ethnic frat to be of that certain ethnicity you are applying for.

 

[fightingspirit]

Our nation is a republic not a democracy.

"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

not very accurate but close. our nation is a democracy first and a republic second. republic is a subclassification of democracy, kinda of an indirect democracy....

 

[fightingspirit]

Isn't the first requirement of an ethnic frat to be of that certain ethnicity you are applying for.

...true...

 

[S Files]

Sob little story my friend. Boo Hoo nobody knows whats racism feels like except you. You sound like an idiot. Sure you can sit here and speak for everyone in this country and say that theres know such thing as reverse discrimination and that minorities are the only one who suffer from racism. What a stupid generalization, you must have a least (at a minimum) lived in dozens of different cities in this country because the whole statement you wrote sounds like you know every single city in this country is the same. If not, you are an jack@ss for this sob little post.

you're funny. you sound extremely intelligent. take your repressed anger and direct it elsewhere. ya every city in the country is the same. sure yup i said that. matter of fact ghettos are the same as suburbs too right?
and ok new rule: everyone has to live in dozens of different cities in this country in order to post on SDN. hey not too much road rage on the drive home ok?

 

[klfb80]

you're funny. you sound extremely intelligent. take your repressed anger and direct it elsewhere. ya every city in the country is the same. sure yup i said that. matter of fact ghettos are the same as suburbs too right?
and ok new rule: everyone has to live in dozens of different cities in this country in order to post on SDN. hey not too much road rage on the drive home ok?

Hey I just replyed to your little pitty party post that said noone except for you has felt the effects of racism.
wasn't it you that said:

"so you consider the vietnamese thread "an elite group." somebody's getting a little carried away now. i think you're spending too much time staring at those threads."

Here you go,please do tell us all of the dehumanizing hate and racism you've encountered.

"-I’ve read on a few other threads that racism in this country doesn’t exist (or barely exists – can’t remember the exact wording). The person who wrote that must be pretending to be ignorant, or is very naïve. Aside from a little tan, and a different name, I blend right in. I’m very well endowed as well – ok that’s another story. Despite that I could tell you guys a ton of stories of how I’ve personally experienced extremely dehumanizing hate and racism."

Here it is below in black and white. Your pitty party. All minorities have it hard, right. Us white people don't know what it's like to have obstacles and we don't even understand what it like. Oh yeah and reverse racism thats funny to you. Calling someon a cracker isn't racist at all right. Also no of us white guys ever worked for anything, it just fell out the sky and hit smacked us right in the silver spoon that was hanging out of our mouth according to you.

"- some white guys are saying ‘I worked damn hard for everything I got” comments , “nothing was handed to me.” ya in your eyes I guess you feel you are on equal ground with everyone else. Truth of the matter is you don’t even understand the obstacles minorities in this country have to face. And this whole reverse racism thing is very funny to me. playing the victim however is a pretty effective debating tool I will admit. To the guy who got yelled cracker while jogging ok that’s messed up – really. That is racism – and I can relate to you with that experience. However what’s much worse is racism that specifically deters your opportunities in life. i WISH that was the extent of racism i've had to deal with. And that’s despite the fact that I got a big Johnson."

From the above comments you sound insecure

"- I first thought the white alliance thing was a funny joke – then while reading some of the follow-up posts – some of you seem very insecure. I’m running out of names for my little friend."

And finally Mr. intelligent can you please tell us all about your weiner again. Face it you have a small one. Most nerdy intelligent guys like yourself do

Ahole you made the comments not me. Maybe you care to reread your comments

 

[martinelli]

I've noticed most of the people who post on this thread are males or sound like they are men. And angry men at that! Strange.

 

[tx oms]

I've noticed most of the people who post on this thread are males or sound like they are men. And angry men at that! Strange.

I've noticed most convertibles are sporty cars. So what?

 

[tx oms]

If you are Caucasian, please understand that there ARE unfair and/or difficult aspects of being a minority (even if you were born in the US), and that there are valid reasons for associating yourself with others mostly of similar backgrounds. And if you are a minority, please understand that Caucasians may be slightly suspicious of US-born minorities who still seemingly stay away from mainstream society.

I follow what you're saying but it doesn't fit with the mantra of a "color-blind" society. If you stay within your own group no one's horizons will be broadened. Much of the unfairness and difficulty is due to minorities making no attempt to fit into mainstream society. This goes back to my OP. The CHOICE to not assimilate makes things difficult for oneself.

 

[tx oms]

this is beautiful .......but are you sure that you are as color-blind as you think you are? i am not maligning you. i am just reminding you that we have subconcious thoughts that we act on in a subconcious way too.

I am color-blind. I am not class blind. If you're a low class person I'm not going to like you. I socialize with and like all the minorities around me. I don't like trashy people.

Now, it is true that I make generalizations. We all do, like you said. I look at people and make snap judgements which they have to overcome if I am wrong.

 

[S Files]

Oh! I've been called an AHole. And a nerd. I feel so violated. And my weiner. Oh no you went there. by the way, that was an inside joke b/w other SDNers.

So there’s no need to get into specifics regarding racism I've had to deal with b/c yes then it would take away from the original point of the post, and would then in fact turn into a sob story. Even if I stated my and my family's experiences clearly, I’m sure you’d have a great response to it anyhoo. let's face it, some people just can't, scratch that, don't want to relate.

this klf guy, grow up and don't resort to simple-minded posts. To the others, including tx omfs and nyucd2010, even if we don’t agree, your views were constructive and did enlighten me. brought up some good points. Like someone else said, good dialogue.

In closing, my point was to state ya the white alliance thing was tongue in cheek and I agree with the main point. Like I said in my first post "the ethnic posts are a waste of time." But hey I gotta call you out on some of the follow-up statements that were made. Went too far and sdners start getting melodramatic about hey everyone else gets ‘special treatment,’ oh poor us, we get blamed for everything. And again open your eyes racism does exist. In closing I’ll tell you one thing, my girlfriend (heyklfb80 are you gonna come back with a great zinger about my girlfriend too…something like, “she’s stupider than you”), anyways my gf is 3rd generation greek immigrant. Her grandfather moved to the US and lived in a greek community/enclave in the city. Her father moved out, assimilated more and now she’s more or less fully assimilated – still does the cultural stuff here and there. Point is it takes time, most will fully assimilate and even marry some of you white guys. Your great-grandparents started out this way. mind you in this open society, the transition should not take nearly as long. Yay Korean bbq everywhere. not gonna waste any more time on this thread - will keep ignoring the ethnic posts and hope they go away.

 

[klfb80]

Oh! I've been called an AHole. And a nerd. I feel so violated. And my weiner. Oh no you went there. by the way, that was an inside joke b/w other SDNers.

So there’s no need to get into specifics regarding racism I've had to deal with b/c yes then it would take away from the original point of the post, and would then in fact turn into a sob story. Even if I stated my and my family's experiences clearly, I’m sure you’d have a great response to it anyhoo. let's face it, some people just can't, scratch that, don't want to relate.

this klf guy, grow up and don't resort to simple-minded posts. To the others, including tx omfs and nyucd2010, even if we don’t agree, your views were constructive and did enlighten me. brought up some good points. Like someone else said, good dialogue.

In closing, my point was to state ya the white alliance thing was tongue in cheek and I agree with the main point. Like I said in my first post "the ethnic posts are a waste of time." But hey I gotta call you out on some of the follow-up statements that were made. Went too far and sdners start getting melodramatic about hey everyone else gets ‘special treatment,’ oh poor us, we get blamed for everything. And again open your eyes racism does exist. In closing I’ll tell you one thing, my girlfriend (heyklfb80 are you gonna come back with a great zinger about my girlfriend too…something like, “she’s stupider than you”), anyways my gf is 3rd generation greek immigrant. Her grandfather moved to the US and lived in a greek community/enclave in the city. Her father moved out, assimilated more and now she’s more or less fully assimilated – still does the cultural stuff here and there. Point is it takes time, most will fully assimilate and even marry some of you white guys. Your great-grandparents started out this way. mind you in this open society, the transition should not take nearly as long. Yay Korean bbq everywhere. not gonna waste any more time on this thread - will keep ignoring the ethnic posts and hope they go away.

S files don't take it heart. Sorry for all the mud slinging and name calling. I was truly responding to comments that I was well, for lack of a better word offended by. Pretty much what you said word for word in your post is that white people think that we are all on a level playing field and that when we think we have earned something it was more or less given to us because we are white, or even rephrased we don't have to work as hard for what we have as minorities. This is certainly not the true. Each person on SDN has there own case regardless of there race or ethnicity. Under a general blanket I believe we are all sarting from the same point. This is the "land of opportunity". Here, you have to put up or shut up. I have my circumstances as do you. And yes, everything I have (white male or not) I earned through hard work, nothing was given to me. So all the "minorities have to work harder to acheive there goals" and the "theres no such thing as reverse discrimination", lets humor ourselves for a second and put that up on a shelf. Like I stated noone here knows what the other has been through to get here. We are all just slinging mud because everyone is making generalizations. I'm sure that most of us know some privlegeded people from several different races or ethnicities.

Oh yeah, Sfiles there will be no attack on your girlfriend. There is no need to go after ones loved ones here. This discussion is between you, me and the others from SDN. In fact this white guy is married to a mexican woman.

Again sorry for the name calling.

There now we can be friends again.

 

[Yellow Snow]

I have traveled to other countries for business, and for a white guy to try and move to most of these countries would result in death, whether he changed his name or not, what countries are more welcoming than the US, China? Iran? before complaining about US look where you come from and how open your doors are. and if it s*cks so bad here why are you here

Similar experiences here. I had a blast in Asia but I was still denied housing, entrance into stores and publicly harrassed because I am white. They are very upfront about it over there.

 

[martinelli]

I've noticed most convertibles are sporty cars. So what?

Man, you are not only angry; you're an a$$hole too!

 

[tx oms]

Man, you are not only angry; you're an a$$hole too!

Well, what's your point? Were you trying to say that if my genitals were on the inside I would feel differently? The whole "angry white males" thing is getting cliche.

 

[martinelli]

Well, what's your point? Were you trying to say that if my genitals were on the inside I would feel differently? The whole "angry white males" thing is getting cliche.

Crap, I wasn't trying to get in the middle of this. Too late, I guess. No, tx oms, all I am saying is that from my observation, I have never heard a female (white or minority) scream discrimination or reverse discrimination. My hypothesis on this is that as females, we are pretty introspective; that is, we usually attribute our failures to our own doing, instead of blaming others. But I guess you're right, I probably don't really have a point to make. Maybe I was trying to instigate the white females out there to join in the mudslinging in order to see what their persectives are on this issue.

But I do have one question to ask all of you. Why do you think at adcoms (who are mostly Caucasian men and women) decide that having a diverse (both economically and ethically) student body is the best course of action for the FUTURE of this profession? Have you ever ponder about this? Have you ever asked an adcom person why this is the case? Is it a conscious decision or is it made subconciously? If it is a conscious decision, what are the reasonings behind it? Could it be that it is the BEST interest of our nation that there should be a good representation of all groups in all fields so that everyone could have their needs met? I think we all should give this question some thought instead of sitting around and seething the fact that someone else got into dental school instead of you.

 

[tx oms]

My hypothesis on this is that as females, we are pretty introspective; that is, we usually attribute our failures to our own doing, instead of blaming others.

Actually, I agree whole-heartedly

Could it be that it is the BEST interest of our nation that there should be a good representation of all groups in all fields so that everyone could have their needs met? I think we all should give this question some thought instead of sitting around and seething the fact that someone else got into dental school instead of you.

First, I have already finished dental school, though I think you meant "you" in general and not me specifically. Secondly, the best interest of our nation is to let the most qualified people into dental school. If that's 100% minority or 100% white, so be it. Having varying standards for different minorities is racists. It directly implies that minorities aren't smart enough/capable enough to earn something on their own merrit.

 

[klfb80]

Actually, I agree whole-heartedly



First, I have already finished dental school, though I think you meant "you" in general and not me specifically. Secondly, the best interest of our nation is to let the most qualified people into dental school. If that's 100% minority or 100% white, so be it. Having varying standards for different minorities is racists. It directly implies that minorities aren't smart enough/capable enough to earn something on their own merrit.

I agree with your statements. Also, since "everyone" wants a diverse population in our dental schools and not necissarily the best man for the job, doesn't this affirmitive action behavior lead to an over representation of minority populations.

 

[food4thots]

Crap, I wasn't trying to get in the middle of this. Too late, I guess. No, tx oms, all I am saying is that from my observation, I have never heard a female (white or minority) scream discrimination or reverse discrimination. My hypothesis on this is that as females, we are pretty introspective; that is, we usually attribute our failures to our own doing, instead of blaming others. But I guess you're right, I probably don't really have a point to make. Maybe I was trying to instigate the white females out there to join in the mudslinging in order to see what their persectives are on this issue.

But I do have one question to ask all of you. Why do you think at adcoms (who are mostly Caucasian men and women) decide that having a diverse (both economically and ethically) student body is the best course of action for the FUTURE of this profession? Have you ever ponder about this? Have you ever asked an adcom person why this is the case? Is it a conscious decision or is it made subconciously? If it is a conscious decision, what are the reasonings behind it? Could it be that it is the BEST interest of our nation that there should be a good representation of all groups in all fields so that everyone could have their needs met? I think we all should give this question some thought instead of sitting around and seething the fact that someone else got into dental school instead of you.

i agree with her..

although it varies w/ schools. i know some schools give minorities preferences based on the fact that these students will be providing services to their respective community, which in many cases, are underserved.

 

[AhhPuller]

i agree with her..

although it varies w/ schools. i know some schools give minorities preferences based on the fact that these students will be providing services to their respective community, which in many cases, are underserved.

OR just drive a big shiny brand spankin' new SUV. 1.

 

[fightingspirit]

I am color-blind. I am not class blind. If you're a low class person I'm not going to like you. I socialize with and like all the minorities around me. I don't like trashy people.

Now, it is true that I make generalizations. We all do, like you said. I look at people and make snap judgements which they have to overcome if I am wrong.

sounds like a winner......

if you know that you are subconsciously color-blind, then i salut you for the very high level of humanity you possess because it is extremely difficult to be color-blind (assuming you implied race-blind).

both sides of this debate make great points, which means that full-fledged integration and pluralism in america is about give and take. the host's predominant race and mainstream society should be truly welcoming, not pretendably, and truly accepting, and the immigrant's community has to be truly interested in assimilating and being equal.

segregation is such an interesting term. it is being properly used in the title of this thread, and ironically, only the day before yesterday, it was whites demanding racial segregation (no offense intended, just a paradoxical observation)....

finally, is that you in the avatar? just curious....nothing more