What do you wish you'd known preparing to apply for residency?

[TragicalDrFaust]

Would love some insight on how the process works, especially the unwritten rules if there are any.

For some background on me: Current OMS-2 interested in psych, IM or FM. My GPA will probably be low-average, I was a bottom quartile student last year but this year am top half and maybe top quartile. Boards will be P/F for us. I'm the president of a club and have research from a program this summer that may or may not lead to publication. One of our psych professors offered to look over my PS before I send it in. He's helped applicants from my school match psych in the past. I imagine this all will make me a middle of the road applicant when the time comes.

I ask this because after a conversation with a classmate, I'm wondering if I'm not "playing the game" or making/using enough connections. For example my uncle is an attending at an IM program where I shadowed. I was strongly considering not applying there because I thought it was unethical. Classmate says it would be normal to apply there. Classmate also says they'll be leveraging every last one of their connections (they're in a multi-generation family of physicians) to secure the best residency possible.

Apologies if this has already been asked but I wasn't able to find a recent similar thread.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[calivianya]

As a DO partway through the cycle with fewer interviews than I thought I was going to get based on my stats, I've got a couple. Not all of these are going to apply to you in particular.

1. Absolutely leverage every possible connection that you have. You really, really, really only want to have to go through the Match once.
2. Related - don't double dip unless you have a really solid reason for doing so, and by double dipping, I mean applying for more than one specialty at the same institution. Low odds of someone finding out, but this could be fatal for your chances of matching to either program if they do, so it's just not worth it IMO.
3. Applying broadly is great and all, but be aware that if interviews stay virtual, odds are that 95%+ of your interviews are going to come from your region. I have only gotten two interviews outside of the region of my med school despite top 1/4 of my class, 245-250 step 1, 255-260 step 2, 730+ level 1/level 2, and some (crappy) research. I've also been told in the interviews that I have had so far that they loved my PS/story and my letters said wonderful things, so I'm literally saying this as someone with *zero* red flags. Apply to *every single program* in your region if you apply to a competitive specialty. Set your expectations super low. That program you thought you're too good for? LOL, there's no such thing, go eat some humble pie and apply/interview there.
4. Related, but send LOIs *early,* especially if you really want to go to an out of region program. I unfortunately waited until the end of October to send LOIs and a lot of programs, at least in rads, seem to have sent out most of their interviews already. I base that on a lot of places that only sent out one wave of interview invites in 2020 per the spreadsheets having already sent out their potentially only wave of interviews by mid-October. If they've already invited everyone they're going to invite, it isn't going to mean a whole lot for you to send a LOI.

And for rads applicants specifically who may read this in the future, if you're applying IR as a DO - just don't. Apply to DR residencies that have ESIR spots, bc apparently applying IR and DR at the same facility is going to hurt you for the DR program (from the lips of a DR PD during a Q&A session on reddit this year). You don't want your chances for DR to be hurt as a DO... because the odds are really against you for matching IR in the first place. Don't screw up the specialty you have a chance to match in favor of "chasing your dream" or whatever BS, because if you go unmatched or have to SOAP into a backup specialty, there's no rads for you at all. You've at least got a shot at IR if you match DR.

 

[deleted1100659]

Would love some insight on how the process works, especially the unwritten rules if there are any.

For some background on me: Current OMS-2 interested in psych, IM or FM. My GPA will probably be low-average, I was a bottom quartile student last year but this year am top half and maybe top quartile. Boards will be P/F for us. I'm the president of a club and have research from a program this summer that may or may not lead to publication. One of our psych professors offered to look over my PS before I send it in. He's helped applicants from my school match psych in the past. I imagine this all will make me a middle of the road applicant when the time comes.

I ask this because after a conversation with a classmate, I'm wondering if I'm not "playing the game" or making/using enough connections. For example my uncle is an attending at an IM program where I shadowed. I was strongly considering not applying there because I thought it was unethical. Classmate says it would be normal to apply there. Classmate also says they'll be leveraging every last one of their connections (they're in a multi-generation family of physicians) to secure the best residency possible.

Apologies if this has already been asked but I wasn't able to find a recent similar thread.

First step is finding out the path you want to take. Psych and IM will lead to fairly different career paths, and you need to be true to yourself deep down, pick one and go after it. I think youll know more by the end of year 3, but start getting an idea while on rotations.

Work hard on rotations, be the person everyone likes to see, get great letters, make connections and do auditions at places you really want to match.

Apply to where you want to apply to, the fact that your uncle works there shouldnt exclude you from attending if you want to attend. The residency match is the non lethal form of the hunger games, work hard and do your best to match at the place you feel is best for you, because residency is where you really learn to be a doctor.

 

[FutureDoctor5000]

As a DO partway through the cycle with fewer interviews than I thought I was going to get based on my stats, I've got a couple. Not all of these are going to apply to you in particular.

1. Absolutely leverage every possible connection that you have. You really, really, really only want to have to go through the Match once.
2. Related - don't double dip unless you have a really solid reason for doing so, and by double dipping, I mean applying for more than one specialty at the same institution. Low odds of someone finding out, but this could be fatal for your chances of matching to either program if they do, so it's just not worth it IMO.
3. Applying broadly is great and all, but be aware that if interviews stay virtual, odds are that 95%+ of your interviews are going to come from your region. I have only gotten two interviews outside of the region of my med school despite top 1/4 of my class, 245-250 step 1, 255-260 step 2, 730+ level 1/level 2, and some (crappy) research. I've also been told in the interviews that I have had so far that they loved my PS/story and my letters said wonderful things, so I'm literally saying this as someone with *zero* red flags. Apply to *every single program* in your region if you apply to a competitive specialty. Set your expectations super low. That program you thought you're too good for? LOL, there's no such thing, go eat some humble pie and apply/interview there.
4. Related, but send LOIs *early,* especially if you really want to go to an out of region program. I unfortunately waited until the end of October to send LOIs and a lot of programs, at least in rads, seem to have sent out most of their interviews already. I base that on a lot of places that only sent out one wave of interview invites in 2020 per the spreadsheets having already sent out their potentially only wave of interviews by mid-October. If they've already invited everyone they're going to invite, it isn't going to mean a whole lot for you to send a LOI.

And for rads applicants specifically who may read this in the future, if you're applying IR as a DO - just don't. Apply to DR residencies that have ESIR spots, bc apparently applying IR and DR at the same facility is going to hurt you for the DR program (from the lips of a DR PD during a Q&A session on reddit this year). You don't want your chances for DR to be hurt as a DO... because the odds are really against you for matching IR in the first place. Don't screw up the specialty you have a chance to match in favor of "chasing your dream" or whatever BS, because if you go unmatched or have to SOAP into a backup specialty, there's no rads for you at all. You've at least got a shot at IR if you match DR.

The last part is soo odd, like most IR applicants(DO or MD) apply DR as a back up since it's soo competitive. Match rate was like in the 60's for IR for DO's, I can't imagine how applying DR back up at the same institution could hurt you or why it should since IR is a sub specialty of DR. It's not like someone applying IM back up to surgery or something. It's no different than most I6 CT or I5 vasc surgery people applying Gen surgery as a back up...

 

[calivianya]

The last part is soo odd, like most IR applicants(DO or MD) apply DR as a back up since it's soo competitive. Match rate was like in the 60's for IR for DO's, I can't imagine how applying DR back up at the same institution could hurt you or why it should since IR is a sub specialty of DR. It's not like someone applying IM back up to surgery or something. It's no different than most I6 CT or I5 vasc surgery people applying Gen surgery as a back up...

I applied IR at 80 something places and applied DR everywhere I applied IR (plus lots of other places). The only places that have an IR program that are interviewing me for DR are doing dual interview days for IR and DR, so they are looking at me for IR first. I've also gotten three IR interviews that are explicitly just IR, and not DR, despite applying for both at those three facilities. Literally not a single place I have applied for both has looked at me for just DR, so the PD comment tracks for me personally.

I feel like with my stats I could have nabbed some DR interviews at the places I applied to both if I hadn't applied IR. It's bizarre, honestly.

I don't think match rates are in the 60s range for DOs anymore since the 2021 report came out. 3 IR categorical matches out of 26 apps and 12 advanced IR matches out of 31 apps drives that number closer to the 30% range. It looks like the IR landscape changed a whole lot from the 2020 charting outcomes, and I will definitely be interested to see what it looks like when the new charting outcomes comes out regardless of how I end up doing in the match.

 

[FutureDoctor5000]

I applied IR at 80 something places and applied DR everywhere I applied IR (plus lots of other places). The only places that have an IR program that are interviewing me for DR are doing dual interview days for IR and DR, so they are looking at me for IR first. I've also gotten three IR interviews that are explicitly just IR, and not DR, despite applying for both at those three facilities. Literally not a single place I have applied for both has looked at me for just DR, so the PD comment tracks for me personally.

I feel like with my stats I could have nabbed some DR interviews at the places I applied to both if I hadn't applied IR. It's bizarre, honestly.

I don't think match rates are in the 60s range for DOs anymore since the 2021 report came out. 3 IR categorical matches out of 26 apps and 12 advanced IR matches out of 31 apps drives that number closer to the 30% range. It looks like the IR landscape changed a whole lot from the 2020 charting outcomes, and I will definitely be interested to see what it looks like when the new charting outcomes comes out regardless of how I end up doing in the match.

Yea with the virtual match the match % for many specialties went down. It would be 15/31 for IR I think since those 26 categorical apps also applied to advance spots.

 

[Cranjis McBasketball]

Absolutely leverage every possible connection that you have. You really, really, really only want to have to go through the Match once.

This is huge. A handful of my interviews have been with programs where I either know someone there or I met with their residents at the residency fair for medical students for our specialty. Connections are huge

 

[KirksvilleKrunk]

This is huge. A handful of my interviews have been with programs where I either know someone there or I met with their residents at the residency fair for medical students for our specialty. Connections are huge

Do you mean conferences for the specialty's organization like the American Board of (insert) or local residency fairs for programs in your area? Trying to get ahold of people in the specialty I'm interested in, because my school doesn't have a home program or any faculty from it.

 

[Cranjis McBasketball]

Do you mean conferences for the specialty's organization like the American Board of (insert) or local residency fairs for programs in your area? Trying to get ahold of people in the specialty I'm interested in, because my school doesn't have a home program or any faculty from it.

Yeah for the organization. Helped me a ton.

 

[Ho0v-man]

1) Exploit any and all connections you have. Too much on the line and everyone else is doing it. There’s nothing noble about not doing so and soaping. Despite all the crap you do to get X board scores and Y amount of pubs or whatever else, it still seemed like getting interviews is borderline freaking random.

2) Go to school in the region of the country you want to match. Most of my invites were regional to my school, despite me listing a different region as my hometown on ERAS.

3) To the above comments regarding applying to IR: I’m pretty sure it’s common practice for everyone to apply IR/DR at the same institution. While I certainly don’t doubt the above posters experience (and don’t want to challenge them during such an anxious period of med school), I’m not sure that advice is universally applicable.

 

[getfat]

Categorical IM intern here. My experiences may vary but this is what i've noticed during my first year on the other side.

1) Other than home students and referrals from residents. Who they decide to interview is random. Everyone's application is very similar.
2) Rankings will be based on 3 tiers 1) We need them and they know it 2) they are w/e, 3) DNR. Most of us are in the 2nd tier.
3) Some Programs will love you and some will hate you for who you are.
4) Most programs will like a lot of their applicants.
5) Honesty is by far the best policy.

Being yourself is the best advice I can anybody going through this process. If you're not someone that particularly outgoing or social, don't try to act like one suddenly. It won't work out for you.

 

[deleted966837]

Categorical IM intern here. My experiences may vary but this is what i've noticed during my first year on the other side.

1) Other than home students and referrals from residents. Who they decide to interview is random. Everyone's application is very similar.
2) Rankings will be based on 3 tiers 1) We need them and they know it 2) they are w/e, 3) DNR. Most of us are in the 2nd tier.
3) Some Programs will love you and some will hate you for who you are.
4) Most programs will like a lot of their applicants.
5) Honesty is by far the best policy.

Being yourself is the best advice I can anybody going through this process. If you're not someone that particularly outgoing or social, don't try to act like one suddenly. It won't work out for you.

If you don't mind saying, what are some reasons people get DNR'd?

 

[ontiquicuo]

If you don't mind saying, what are some reasons people get DNR'd?

To be DNR , you have to first be good enough on paper to get an interview. Something has to happen at the interview to change their mind. Most likely it's unprofessionalism or personality disorders.

 

[fldoctorgirl]

2) Go to school in the region of the country you want to match. Most of my invites were regional to my school, despite me listing a different region as my hometown on ERAS.

I just want to comment on this as someone who's having the opposite experience. I went to med school in the midwest and I'm from FL, goal was always to match back in FL. Almost all of my interview invites have been from FL, with a handful in the region I went to med school and then almost none from any other part of the country. I made it especially clear in my PS that I wanted to be in FL, and all of the programs I signaled were in FL. I think the fact that I am a competitive applicant helped too. 75% of my interview invites were in FL. And I chose an OOS med school over an IS one, so this was something that really worried me. Just in case anyone is in a region they don't want to end up in permanently for med school and is freaking out reading these comments.....programs want applicants that want to be there. At my interviews, a lot of the other applicants are also from FL and mention that, even if they are in med school elsewhere. I think you just have to make sure you actively communicate that desire.

 

[Cranjis McBasketball]

I just want to comment on this as someone who's having the opposite experience. I went to med school in the midwest and I'm from FL, goal was always to match back in FL. Almost all of my interview invites have been from FL, with a handful in the region I went to med school and then almost none from any other part of the country. I made it especially clear in my PS that I wanted to be in FL, and all of the programs I signaled were in FL. I think the fact that I am a competitive applicant helped too. 75% of my interview invites were in FL. And I chose an OOS med school over an IS one, so this was something that really worried me. Just in case anyone is in a region they don't want to end up in permanently for med school and is freaking out reading these comments.....programs want applicants that want to be there. At my interviews, a lot of the other applicants are also from FL and mention that, even if they are in med school elsewhere. I think you just have to make sure you actively communicate that desire.

This is my experience for family medicine too. Every program I applied to in my home state granted me an interview, even competitive ones. One of the reasons could have been I made a separate personal statement for my home state. And the areas around my medical school I haven't gotten as much.

 

[Ho0v-man]

I just want to comment on this as someone who's having the opposite experience. I went to med school in the midwest and I'm from FL, goal was always to match back in FL. Almost all of my interview invites have been from FL, with a handful in the region I went to med school and then almost none from any other part of the country. I made it especially clear in my PS that I wanted to be in FL, and all of the programs I signaled were in FL. I think the fact that I am a competitive applicant helped too. 75% of my interview invites were in FL. And I chose an OOS med school over an IS one, so this was something that really worried me. Just in case anyone is in a region they don't want to end up in permanently for med school and is freaking out reading these comments.....programs want applicants that want to be there. At my interviews, a lot of the other applicants are also from FL and mention that, even if they are in med school elsewhere. I think you just have to make sure you actively communicate that desire.

This is my experience for family medicine too. Every program I applied to in my home state granted me an interview, even competitive ones. One of the reasons could have been I made a separate personal statement for my home state. And the areas around my medical school I haven't gotten as much.

Weird. My experience is similar to the other poster who applied rads. I’ve heard this from other rads applicants as well. I guess it’s just a rads thing, but that seems bizarre. I was a competitive applicant for my field as well.

Sorry to other posters who got anxious reading this bit. I guess I just assumed this advice would be more applicable in a broad sense. It really doesn’t make sense that only those doomed to the dark room would experience this, but here we are.

 

[getfat]

If you don't mind saying, what are some reasons people get DNR'd?

I've only heard of < 5 getting DNRed for my program. We are pretty small. Mostly it was just cocky attitude or being a know it all. Can't teach somebody if they already know everything.