For the DO's- Internship Related

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SomeDoc

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Newbie here interested in practicing in FL down the road, with a few questions- will allopathic residencies accept the AOA internship as PGY-1? Also, will the ability to start as a PGY-2 (osteopathic or allopathic) after doing your AOA internship be dependent on available PGY-2 spots?
 
The only way your AOA internship will count as your pgy-1 year is if you match into a pgy 2-4 allopathic program or if you do a osteopathic EM residency (also in the pgy 2-4- format). If you want to do a pgy 1-3 allopathic residency then you will just have to repeat your intern year.
 
If I may spin off the OP's question...

Have any DO's had any success getting their PGY1 (EM1) approved as an AOA intern year via resolution 42?
 
Any idea if allopathic EM residencies grant PGY-1 residency credit using the AOA internship? I've read about this occurring, although not in EM.
 
Any idea if allopathic EM residencies are generally open towards granting PGY-1 residency credit using the AOA internship? I've read about this occurring, although not in EM.

Why don't you just call the programs with open PGY-2 spots (from the SAEM list) and find out. However, most of the adds say they want someone who completed an EM-1 year at an ACGME program.
 
Still got a while (few years) to go before internship/residency app time. Thanks for the info BadVb, much appreciated!
 
Any idea if allopathic EM residencies are generally open towards granting PGY-1 residency credit using the AOA internship? I've read about this occurring, although not in EM.

I sincerely doubt this is possible. The RRC currently only grants 6 months worth of credit to people who have completed a Family Medicine residency (3 years) and decide to do EM. Thus, I'm almost certain they wouldn't allow a transitional year to count towards a PGY-1 EM year. The rotations are different, so unfortunately there's probably no way to cheat the system.

You might have luck with the 2-4 programs - often those have some attrition before the actual start date of the program.
 
Gracias for both the links.
 
Opps, actually I had already seen both of those. Which brings me to my next question...if any EM people have succesfully had their intern year approved, what did it involve? It is my understanding that many people who initially apply for approval essentially give up as a result of the mountain of red tape.

Any comments from those who have been there, done that would be greatly appreciated.
 
I sincerely doubt this is possible. The RRC currently only grants 6 months worth of credit to people who have completed a Family Medicine residency (3 years) and decide to do EM. Thus, I'm almost certain they wouldn't allow a transitional year to count towards a PGY-1 EM year. The rotations are different, so unfortunately there's probably no way to cheat the system.

You might have luck with the 2-4 programs - often those have some attrition before the actual start date of the program.

I'm not a DO and don't really know what I'm talking about, but I HEAR that Geisinger in PA has some kind of something. They get many DOs but are an allopathic residency and I believe they get credit. Contact the program or a resident for info.
That probably wasn't helpful, but something to look into if you're really interested.
streetdoc
 
All the above info is good stuff. Let me tie it together a bit for you Street. From a fellow DO, I am fully expecting to have my DO internship in allopathic EM residency approved as my AOA intern year. A couple of my rotations in 2nd year actually count as part of the requirements. I had to have a 2nd medicine month, but it was met with a subspecialty medicine (cards in my case). I had to sell my soul and do an FM elective but my PD helped me do this with completely painless ease. So I will actually have met the requirements for the internship by the middle of the 2nd year, which I am now in. I wanted to keep this option open since my wife is from Pa.

Now as for Geisinger specifically, and perhaps other Pa allopathic EM programs. Geisinger is special because it is seriously a bi-training site (meaning it has as many DO interns and residents almost as it has MD residents). It actually has a rotating internship for DO's. Because of this, the in house allopathic program can generally meet the same requirements, but because the order of the the rotations is different, the intern year requirement is not met until 3rd year (and after you sell your soul for the family medicine elective there too!!).

It can be done. The hardest requirement to get past is the hardship requirement, meaning that you need to come up with a juicy reason why you are training where you are. Family is a good reason, as is other health issues requiring your presence or a spouses presence in a particular area.

Just be smarter than the suits, and play their game. Play by their rules and have some decent evidence if you get called on the carpet. The bottom line is that the AOA does not have the interest to be turning down every resolution 42 waiver request as it is bad business.
 
I'm not a DO and don't really know what I'm talking about, but I HEAR that Geisinger in PA has some kind of something. They get many DOs but are an allopathic residency and I believe they get credit. Contact the program or a resident for info.
That probably wasn't helpful, but something to look into if you're really interested.
streetdoc

Right, but the OP was discussing jumping into an EM PGY-2 spot (in a 1-3 program) after an osteopathic rotating internship. Based on what I've learned on SDN and elsewhere, that's definitely not possible - especially if the RRC is only giving 6 months credit to people who have already completed an entire residency.

I openly admit that I know nothing about the osteopathic internship thing, as I'm an allopathic student.
 
Right, but the OP was discussing jumping into an EM PGY-2 spot (in a 1-3 program) after an osteopathic rotating internship. Based on what I've learned on SDN and elsewhere, that's definitely not possible - especially if the RRC is only giving 6 months credit to people who have already completed an entire residency.

I openly admit that I know nothing about the osteopathic internship thing, as I'm an allopathic student.

Again, as Corpman pointed out, Geisinger and other PA programs are VERY familiar with DOs. I'd suggest that the OP contact these programs specifically and DIRECTLY about his/her situation. (As we are not DOs and are clueless)
I was hoping to get the OP in the right direction by bringing up Geisinger-which deals extensively with DOs and their questions. I would rather point you towards someone who can ANSWER the question rather than extinguishing any hope he/she may have based only on speculation.
Best of luck,
streetdoc
 
Thanks for the very informative responses. I'm about to start as an MS1 in a few days, and have been learning much about the intricacies/requirements of the match process/the 5-state internship requirement for DO's. These posts are very helpful.
 
Ok...got some more info: looks like a dually accredited program will grant residency credit using the AOA internship.
The thread:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=409355

The post of interest:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=5428828&postcount=6

Edit:
Found more information regarding osteopathic residencies:
For EM osteopathic residencies, beginning in 2008:

https://www.do-online.org/pdf/sir_postdocinternrestructure0708.pdf

OPTION 1 (OGME OGME-1 Resident), programs will grant residency credit for the 1st
postdoctoral year of training. Students will
apply and "Match" directly into the residency
and the 1st postdoctoral year will be
considered the first year of residency
training.
 
Thanks for the very informative responses. I'm about to start as an MS1 in a few days, and have been learning much about the intricacies/requirements of the match process/the 5-state internship requirement for DO's. These posts are very helpful.

Well, by the time you are in a position to be concerned this might have changed. Now that the AOA programs are getting away from the internship and shadowing allopathic programs, the internship might be a thing of the past. It will all depend on those 5 states, since they have separate medical boards they can do what they want. However, since DO's in AOA programs aren't doing the traditional internship, how can they expect us doing an ACGME residency to do one.
 
If you are looking to stay in FL you should also check out the AOA program at Mount Sinai in Miami Beach. It's a very strong program that includes rotations at Jackson Memorial Hospital, trauma and trauma critical care at the world famous Ryder Trauma Center. Pediatric Emergency Medicine and pediatric anesthesia are based at the internationally renowned Miami Children's Hospital, which also serves as a state recognized pediatric trauma receiving facility.

http://www.msmc.com/body.cfm?oTopId=0&id=222
 
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