Under-represented groups

In medicine there are several races that are greatly under-represented for any number of reasons, not the least of which is that medicine has traditionally always been a white, male, profession. The races are listed below. Hope it helps!

American Indian or Alaska Native
Black or African American
Hispanic
-Cuban
-Puerto Rican
-Mexican or Mexican American

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American Indian or Alaska Native
Black or African American
Hispanic
-Cuban
-Puerto Rican
-Mexican or Mexican American
- Pacific Islander

that's dumb. let the better ppl get it, even if they are wasps.

how does one define better??

I am part Cherokee Indian and am wondering what puts you in the "minority" category. Is there a certain percentage? I have not been able to find this info. Thanks.

amnesia said:

that's dumb. let the better ppl get it, even if they are wasps.

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let me guess, you're a white male?

run_4ever said:

I am part Cherokee Indian and am wondering what puts you in the "minority" category. Is there a certain percentage? I have not been able to find this info. Thanks.

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i think you qualify you as a minority. I've never heard of having to be a certain percentage (i.e. having to be at least 50% or something).

my friends is arab (from palestine). are they considered under-represented minorities? i think he told me that he had to put white on his AMCAS, which is absolutely ridiculous considering how much prejudice arabs take now a days. i was just wondering whether med schools would bypass this and consider him a minoritiy anyways.

tinkerbelle said:

i think you qualify you as a minority. I've never heard of having to be a certain percentage (i.e. having to be at least 50% or something).

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I have, I have! I think my friend said that you at least have to be 1/16th. Or 1/8th. I can't remember. What generation are you? 2nd, 3rd?

Thanks for your response. It's 1/32. That actually seems like a small amount, but I still want to know if it puts me in the category of minority.

sigh, I wish Asians would be counted as under-represented minority.

VeggieGal said:

my friends is arab (from palestine). are they considered under-represented minorities? i think he told me that he had to put white on his AMCAS, which is absolutely ridiculous considering how much prejudice arabs take now a days. i was just wondering whether med schools would bypass this and consider him a minoritiy anyways.

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Nope. Arabs aren't considered minorites, which is total crap. They really should have a different category for Arabs... writing white totally does not describe me. I always check the "other" box.

run_4ever said:

I am part Cherokee Indian and am wondering what puts you in the "minority" category. Is there a certain percentage? I have not been able to find this info. Thanks.

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This may have already been answered but I know that to actually be apart of certain Native American TRIBES nowadays you have to have like 1/8'th ancestry AND some official documents proving your blood (Like marraige reciepts or something).

I'm not sure how med schools do it. I'm guessing that if you are blonde haired with blue eyes and have no real Native American culture then they might not take your "Indian" claims seriously.

Nunca said:

This may have already been answered but I know that to actually be apart of certain Native American TRIBES nowadays you have to have like 1/8'th ancestry AND some official documents proving your blood (Like marraige reciepts or something).

I'm not sure how med schools do it. I'm guessing that if you are blonde haired with blue eyes and have no real Native American culture then they might not take your "Indian" claims seriously.

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Yes, I know what you are saying. I have black hair, brown eyes, and the cheekbones that validate my ancestry.

There is a delimma for me in that only recently have I learned of my ancestry thru a family member doing geneological research. It's something my family has avoided talking about over the years. That's unfortunate on many levels. My exposure culturally has been limited for that reason. At any rate, with 1/32 ancestry - I expect it is a non-issue anyway.

Yes, I am 1/16 Cherokee and to qualify for URM status you have to be a member of the tribe, I think, which at least for Cherokee means you have to be 1/8 and documented, like somebody above said. And you have to identify as Cherokee, which I certainly don't considering I'm an Orthodox Jew (I guess the two aren't exactly mutually exclusive but pretty darn close)

GuyLaroche said:

American Indian or Alaska Native
Black or African American
Hispanic
-Cuban
-Puerto Rican
-Mexican or Mexican American
- Pacific Islander

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what makes up pacific islander? which nations?

Damn, AA makes me want to go and actually see if someone in my family is a URM. It would be great walking into an interview being black on the paperwork because of my great-great-great-great-(well, you get the point) grand father happens to be black. The look on their faces would be priceless. "But we can't let you in now, you aren't black enough for our racist enrollment plans!"

BTW, anyone else find it funny that "Mexican-American" was the only hyphonated name? Whats up with that? Just call them Mexican just like everyone else... (i.e. no hyphon)

think about this historically and it will make sense.

think about all the groups of human beings that have been brutalized by anglo saxon european americans.. IT Is not underepresenation, it is an indirect way of saying, forgive us for raping your women, killing your kids, incarcerating all of you in jail, using you to build north america, for discriminating and keeping you out of institutions by adminstering mcat's gre's, sat's, lsats based on anglo saxon european logic...and on an on and on.....

now if you know the history of north america, then those groups will be depicted very vividly in your head, think about it...

don't be fooled.

Turkeyman said:

Yeah I was mainly wondering if there was a spot for arab-americans or south-asian american on the AMCAS application(and if they're under represented groups). Also....even though I'm pakistani, for some reason my friends and I would always put pacific islander on our standardized tests, because I think pacific islander actually represents more of the south asian community rather(indonesia, phillipines, sri lanka, etc) than just plain old "Asian" does. Plus, Asians in general forget that us brown people ARE asian, so I'd rather not put myself in the same group as them when applying

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Heyyyy.. you're in silver spring. maryland turkeyman? Me too. Did you go to high school here too?

Anyways. The AMCAS application is a lot better than most application forms. I'm pretty sure I was able to click on a box for both Indian and Middle Eastern (i'm a mix). And if the exact name isn't there, I think you can write something under "other". So you shouldn't have any problem.

Mr PluM said:

think about this historically and it will make sense.

think about all the groups of human beings that have been brutalized by anglo saxon european americans.. IT Is not underepresenation, it is an indirect way of saying, forgive us for raping your women, killing your kids, incarcerating all of you in jail, using you to build north america, for discriminating and keeping you out of institutions by adminstering mcat's gre's, sat's, lsats based on anglo saxon european logic...and on an on and on.....

now if you know the history of north america, then those groups will be depicted very vividly in your head, think about it...

don't be fooled.

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1. I would honestly like to know what is so racist about standardized tests? Everyone takes the same test and everyone knows whats on the test? Is it because grade school math is taught with pizzas (advantage: Italians) instead of tortilla (advantage: Mexicans)?

2. Strange, I never did any of those, but then again, liberals (who are generally the most ardent political side that supports judgeing people by the color of their skin and not by the content of their mind) are always into self flagellation over the crimes of others.

3. Strange, the tribes in Africa seem to be pretty good at killing each other too, so about half of your "crimes that we must atone for" are also commited by Africans, against Africans to this very day.

4. What is so bad about judgeing someone by the content of their mind rather then the color of their skin?

5. Would you rather be treated by the doctor that almost failed out of med school, or the doctor (med school grades unknown) who was only admitted to med school because they were the right color (i.e. an AA case, because blacks with a 3.5 and 30 aren't AA cases, they get in on their own merit)?

tinkerbelle said:

Heyyyy.. you're in silver spring. maryland turkeyman? Me too. Did you go to high school here too?

Anyways. The AMCAS application is a lot better than most application forms. I'm pretty sure I was able to click on a box for both Indian and Middle Eastern (i'm a mix). And if the exact name isn't there, I think you can write something under "other". So you shouldn't have any problem.

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Is there a "decline to state" box on the AMCAS?

Siggy said:

1. I would honestly like to know what is so racist about standardized tests? Everyone takes the same test and everyone knows whats on the test? Is it because grade school math is taught with pizzas (advantage: Italians) instead of tortilla (advantage: Mexicans)?

2. Strange, I never did any of those, but then again, liberals (who are generally the most ardent political side that supports judgeing people by the color of their skin and not by the content of their mind) are always into self flagellation over the crimes of others.

3. Strange, the tribes in Africa seem to be pretty good at killing each other too, so about half of your "crimes that we must atone for" are also commited by Africans, against Africans to this very day.

4. What is so bad about judgeing someone by the content of their mind rather then the color of their skin?

5. Would you rather be treated by the doctor that almost failed out of med school, or the doctor (med school grades unknown) who was only admitted to med school because they were the right color (i.e. an AA case, because blacks with a 3.5 and 30 aren't AA cases, they get in on their own merit)?

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dunce, if your have some kind of mind, european american "whites" have had affirmative action for 500 years or so..

i am awed by your level of ignorance, i am kind to say level, because you are drowning.. i imagine that is why medicine is also failing and healthcare is out of control, so much for any kind of consciuosnous......let it all be merit based on anglo saxon europeand logic and go drown the drain.....

so much...

Mr PluM said:

dunce, if your have some kind of mind, european american "whites" have had affirmative action for 500 years or so..

i am awed by your level of ignorance, i am kind to say level, because you are drowning.. i imagine that is why medicine is also failing and healthcare is out of control, so much for any kind of consciuosnous......let it all be merit based on anglo saxon europeand logic and go drown the drain.....

so much...

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Yes our health care system sucks because med school admissions should be based on lottery! Or even better yet, a couple sets of genetic code that determins the pigment of our skin!.

Please tell me the difference between European logic and African logic? Does the African logic tell us that a tribal ritual cures (I could honestly put in any religious rite here, but since Christanity is part of the evil European empire, it is bad too) a man better then medicine?

BTW, it is not becoming of your charactor to just attack a person with out substance. Attack my argument, not me, unless you have nothing to attack it with, which in that case you can DIAF.

I hope it is some consolation that no ethic/racial group is underrepresented on SDN.
However I do believe the native Indians are UR.

DieselPetrolGrl said:

I hope it is some consolation that no ethic/racial group is underrepresented on SDN.
However I do believe the native Indians are UR.

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i love you diesel petrol grl
you the only sane one on SDN
i love how you answered the OP without reading the garbel the other members are arguing about!
will you be my dance-flo'-luva!??

Mr PluM said:

think about this historically and it will make sense.

think about all the groups of human beings that have been brutalized by anglo saxon european americans.. IT Is not underepresenation, it is an indirect way of saying, forgive us for raping your women, killing your kids, incarcerating all of you in jail, using you to build north america, for discriminating and keeping you out of institutions by adminstering mcat's gre's, sat's, lsats based on anglo saxon european logic...and on an on and on.....

now if you know the history of north america, then those groups will be depicted very vividly in your head, think about it...

don't be fooled.

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i'm tired of this URM crap. btw, a URM means that they have to elevate the level of a minority with that of a wasp...


anyway, we should rank by merit and not by race. it's better.

goheel said:

sigh, I wish Asians would be counted as under-represented minority.

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We make up only 5% of American population, but we are not under-represented minority in academic settings because we study too hard. But seriously though, I have no problem with not being considered as a minority. I just think that everyone should be given an equal opportunity whether you are minority or not since no one chose to be the minority at the first place.

This is a no-win thread. Nothing new can be learned from it. These arguments are so old they will not benefit from Bush's social security privatization plan (it's anyone's guess if anyone would). The harsh truth of the matter is that no one on SDN makes admission policy. Wishes and opinions are fine, but they are pointless when they cannot shape the policy the decry.

Just my humble, very humble opinion...

tinkerbelle said:

Nope. Arabs aren't considered minorites, which is total crap. They really should have a different category for Arabs... writing white totally does not describe me. I always check the "other" box.

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I think this will happen during the next census. Afterwards, I wouldn't be surprised if other paperwork is revised to reflect this change.

MadameLULU said:

I think this will happen during the next census. Afterwards, I wouldn't be surprised if most non-governmental paperwork is revised to reflect this change.

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yeah, especially now that we're supposed to be scared of Arabs, right? geez this country is weird

Wow, if anything, it is biased against lowerclass, and thus (since the poor is comprised of people of many races) not an arguement for racial AA, but socieo-economic AA (aka need-based financial aid). BTW, who goes to school everyday (if you live on campus, then you don't count)?

For the second one, you don't have to eat breakfest or dinner every day to know what it is and in what order you do it in. Besides, I honestly do not see either:

A, how this corresponds to the MCAT since people who take the MCAT are college students and is not nearly as subjected (ignoreing the essay portion that, apparently everyone else for the most part ignore).

B: How grade school standardized tests affects kids (I'll admit that I'm a little ignorant on this one. I remember getting the results back, but do not remember if it directly affected me in anyway).

tigress said:

yeah, especially now that we're supposed to be scared of Arabs, right? geez this country is weird

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I can't wait till they divide up Europe. Is Eastern Europeans under represented in med school? Afterall, we are stereotypically the stupid Europeans (I'm Polish and have heard my fair share of Polish jokes), so it makes sense that we are not in college that much!

Perhaps I am opening a can of worms, but what do you think of gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgendered medical school applicants being considered underrepresented minorties? It appears as though in parts of North America it is still acceptable to discriminate based on sexual orientation...

Just a thought...

Siggy said:

Wow, if anything, it is biased against lowerclass, and thus (since the poor is comprised of people of many races) not an arguement for racial AA, but socieo-economic AA (aka need-based financial aid). BTW, who goes to school everyday (if you live on campus, then you don't count)?

For the second one, you don't have to eat breakfest or dinner every day to know what it is and in what order you do it in. Besides, I honestly do not see either:

A, how this corresponds to the MCAT since people who take the MCAT are college students and is not nearly as subjected (ignoreing the essay portion that, apparently everyone else for the most part ignore).

B: How grade school standardized tests affects kids (I'll admit that I'm a little ignorant on this one. I remember getting the results back, but do not remember if it directly affected me in anyway).

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Okay... firstly, I agree with you entirely about the bias being socioeconomic, not racial. When people speak of "racial bias" on these tests I do think "socioeconomic bias" is more appropriate. In terms of affirmative action for that... that's a whole other can of worms. In response to your point:

A) As stated, I just gave an example of how a test could be biased. I do think the MCAT could be biased against people who didn't have tons of privileges, however. For example, in one review book I had, there was a sample passage reviewing an opera. Now, although I and many other students are familiar with operas, there could definitely be people who have never heard, seen, or read reviews of an opera. A highly intelligent person could likely deduce stuff about operas and thus answer questions correctly. Unfortunately, a student from a foster home in West Philly who is intelligent but not terrific at verbal passages might be at a disadvantage when reading this passage compared to a person with the same intelligence from a different background.

B) Oh, man... my mom's kids who did poorly on these tests are setting themselves up for a lifetime of "lower-level" classes, not being able to get the help they need in public school (which happens, unfortunately), and being labeled "learning-disabled", among other things.

As for knowing about eating breakfast and stuff, you'd be surprised. You're very lucky.

Prag said:

Perhaps I am opening a can of worms, but what do you think of gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgendered medical school applicants being considered underrepresented minorties? It appears as though in parts of North America it is still acceptable to discriminate based on sexual orientation...

Just a thought...

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wouldn't a lot of ppl then claim they were lgbt?

Quynh2007 said:

wouldn't a lot of ppl then claim they were lgbt?

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Yes, that is a definite possibility, though the 't' part may be hard to convince the adcom should you be lying...

Prag said:

Perhaps I am opening a can of worms, but what do you think of gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgendered medical school applicants being considered underrepresented minorties? It appears as though in parts of North America it is still acceptable to discriminate based on sexual orientation...

Just a thought...

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or disabled applicants? i have a disability and it's very clear to me that my difference has disadvantaged me educationally and in terms of my career even though i've been educated at fine schools and had some wonderful opportunities... it also seems fairly apparent to me that disabled people are underrepresented in med school admissions, even if you account for those who couldn't meet technical standards.

leaving aside issues of merit and quotas and aa for the moment, i'd like to say simply that as a patient, i would LOVE to have had a disabled doctor, even just once.

funny. asia is racist against whites. japan doesnt even let you emigrate there. i think we shold do the same instead.

we should long for the days of imperialism. it will become true in the successor states of the US and EU. Oceania 1984 style... NZ + AU

Turkeyman said:

Heyy, why yes I am. What university/med school do you go to right now? I went to springbrook high school...right now at the university of maryland college park.

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Hi Turkeyman I went to Paint Branch, but my brother went to Springbrook. I graduated from Hopkins (yuck -Baltimore ).

visualwealth said:

how does one define better??

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You know MCAT, GPA, medical oppurtunities, volunteering. Only the things we've been killing ourselves over for the past few years.

Prag said:

Yes, that is a definite possibility, though the 't' part may be hard to convince the adcom should you be lying...

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Hell, I would be willing to wear a dress to an interview if it helped my chances...

If harvard, yale and hopkins wanted to fill their schools with 4.0's and 38+'s on the MCAT they would be able to do it easily....If it was based on stats alone I bet the cut off would be like 3.8 and 34 for all top 50 shools.... From observing MD applicants and other sources I have realized that top schools tend to love things like diversity, interesting applicants( inventors lol), leaders, research kings/queens etc... if your stats suck but you have done something spectacular you probably have a better chance than someone with 4.0 and 40 (that is, if you pass the screen)

TheProwler said:

It would be incredibly easy to claim you were bisexual, so no, I doubt that this will become a criterion ever.

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I agree that logistically it would very difficult to verify an applicant's claimed sexual orientation, but the purpose of my post was merely to demonstrate that LGBT individual's minority status goes largely unrecognized in this process...

beep said:

or disabled applicants? i have a disability and it's very clear to me that my difference has disadvantaged me educationally and in terms of my career even though i've been educated at fine schools and had some wonderful opportunities... it also seems fairly apparent to me that disabled people are underrepresented in med school admissions, even if you account for those who couldn't meet technical standards.

leaving aside issues of merit and quotas and aa for the moment, i'd like to say simply that as a patient, i would LOVE to have had a disabled doctor, even just once.

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In my experience a lot of med school applicants (and I guess people in med school and doctors but I know more applicants ) in fact have had significant contact with the medical community in the form of being a patient themselves. A lot of people with chronic illnesses or people who have had experiences that left them in the hospital for a length of time, for example, choose to go into medicine to help people like themselves. I agree I haven't met many doctors with physical disabilities (though as was mentioned on the forum recently, there are deaf doctors, and I met one once), you might be surprised by the number of doctors who have chronic conditions or other experiences being a patient.