Case vs. Pitt - Please get your procrastination on while helping me out

I know...we are all sick of these posts, but is this not that SDN is (partly) here for? 😉 I've given this much thought, but I wonder if I'm overlooking some factors.

I am torn between Case and Pitt. A bit about myself: I am interested in working with underserved communities of color, particularly Latinos and African-Americans. I'll probably end up doing a pediatric subspecialty (maybe heme/onc) after med school (although I'm pretty open). I learn best with a combination of lectures and small group discussion, but I learn best when doing things "hands-on." I really like true pass/fail (no honors). I am interested in doing some research (psychosocial or behavioral). I would like to have some international health experiences throughout medical school (summers and 4th year).

I went to both 2nd looks. Case truly impressed me duirng second look (the prospective students as well as the current students were wonderful, the administration seemed genuinely interested and invested in the students...I felt very comfortable). Although i had favored Pitt post-interview, I was disappointed by the 2nd look visit (keep in mind, I went to Case's 2nd look first, which probably biased me). I didn't connect with as many prospective students...the deans disappeared after quickly greeting us at the beginning of the weekend. On the other hand, the weather was gorgeous and the apartments the students lived in were amazing. I was impressed by Pitt's hospital in Palermo, Italy....how sweet would it be to spend a summer there?

So, which one do you think is a better fit and WHY? Thank you. =)

👍 UPitt by a landslide!

Not only is Pittsburgh a wonderful location, but it will be perfect for your desire to work with the underserved. I have *heard* that Case is all about turning out researchers, but I do not know this to be a fact. But just based on the ?rumors? I suggest Pitt!!! 👍

I don't know anything about Case, but I do know about Pitt and love it. Is Case P/F? If so, that might be something pointing you toward there. I think that because both schools are very similar in terms of quality, you have to simply go to the one that feels like a better fit for you! I don't think anyone here can tell you which is a better fit for YOU, since only you will know that, but I do think that Pitt has what you are looking for in spades, and so does Case. It's just a matter of personal preference. Good luck!!

iampurestyle said:

👍 UPitt by a landslide!

Not only is Pittsburgh a wonderful location, but it will be perfect for your desire to work with the underserved. I have *heard* that Case is all about turning out researchers, but I do not know this to be a fact. But just based on the ?rumors? I suggest Pitt!!! 👍

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Case is NOT about churning out researchers. Its about turning out life long learners. It is about encouraging students to actively pursue in depth an area of health and medicine that he or she is interested in. If its basic/clinical sciences, then so be it, but further pursuit of public health, alternative medicine, and international health (just to name a few) are just as welcome. For example this summer, 90 students (3/4 of the class) recieved $2,500 grants from the school to pursue summer projects varying from molecular biology labs here at case to international health internships in Uganda.

Not that its something to brag about, but Cleveland probably has a more needy indigent population than pittsburgh.

And as pminty already knows, case is true pass fail with no recorded grades for the preclinical years. 😀

exmike said:

Case is NOT about churning out researchers. Its about turning out life long learners. It is about encouraging students to actively pursue in depth an area of health and medicine that he or she is interested in. If its basic/clinical sciences, then so be it, but further pursuit of public health, alternative medicine, and international health (just to name a few) are just as welcome. For example this summer, 90 students (3/4 of the class) recieved $2,500 grants from the school to pursue summer projects varying from molecular biology labs here at case to international health internships in Uganda.

Not that its something to brag about, but Cleveland probably has a more needy indigent population than pittsburgh.

And as pminty already knows, case is true pass fail with no recorded grades for the preclinical years. 😀

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hahahhahahha.... i'm sorry. i just had to comment on ur signature. it's AWESOME.

"I'm not going to be a gunner, I'm going to be a sniper" - overheard in a medical school library

This must be a really tough decision, I feel like these two schools are pretty similar and I like them both a lot.

Personally I would go to Pitt in a second, but in your case, Case may be a better fit. As exmike said, there's probably a larger needy inner-city population in Cleveland than Pittsburgh, and I also feel that Case has a little more focus on that.

Also, Pittsburgh has virtually no latino population.

I have never visited Cleveland, (though heard of Shaker Heights)
just wanted to let you know that weather in Pittsburgh gets pretty miserable.

Without Wax said:

I have never visited Cleveland, (though heard of Shaker Heights)
just wanted to let you know that weather in Pittsburgh gets pretty miserable.

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I think that the weather in Cleveland is probably worse, at least in the winter.

YzIa said:

I think that the weather in Cleveland is probably worse, at least in the winter.

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comparing cleveland and pittsburgh weather is like comparing a ford pinto and a Yugo. They both suck, so whats the point? 😀

exmike said:

comparing cleveland and pittsburgh weather is like comparing a ford pinto and a Yugo. They both suck, so whats the point? 😀

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Right on exmike, right on. I'd only add the comment about the Latino population here is pretty much true, but there is a health advocacy initiative currently being instated to address the health needs of those who are here - so the population is not completely absent and is in need. In addition, in terms of need, Pittsburgh has many underserved populations, and Pitt does a great job of connecting you so that you can become a part of helping these communities (in fact, there is one service opportunity every Saturday morning specifically for Latino populations). It was one of the primary reasons that brought me here.

With regard to the weather, I went to school in Michigan, and the weather is like this all over the mid-west - gray and depressing. Cleveland just has the benefit of being by the lake, so they get 8 inches of snow in mid-April, whereas Pittsburgh might get 1 or 2 (this has been a light winter in terms of snow). But weather is certainly not a factor that should send you to one place or the other.

Based on the other things that you mentioned about the second visit - the people that you met (at least most of them) will be your colleagues for the next four years. I believe in the feeling of belonging, and if you didn't quite get that, then go where your heart tells you to go. On the other hand, one thing about medical school is that, especially since you're all feeling each other out in the beginning and making a major change in your life in attending medical school, you can't always rely on first impressions.

From a student in the the other city that sucks. 😀
H&T

exmike said:

comparing cleveland and pittsburgh weather is like comparing a ford pinto and a Yugo. They both suck, so whats the point? 😀

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Yeah, weather is not even a factor. I am from Boston, I went to school in Providence and have lived there for the past 2 years after graduation. I'm destined to have to endure sucky weather.

exmike said:

For example this summer, 90 students (3/4 of the class) recieved $2,500 grants from the school to pursue summer projects varying from molecular biology labs here at case to international health internships in Uganda.

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Thanks, exmike...I wasn't sure of the opportunities to do funded international internships...this makes me very happy!

....could you please address the stregnths and weaknesses of the clinical years at Case and Pitt (exposure to variety of conditions, patient diversity [not just racial or ethnic, but also socioeconomic], hands-on experience, etc)? I feel I (as many) have focused a lot on the first 2 years whe, in reality, the clinical years are probably more important.

Thanks for all that you have contributed. I know everyone is very busy. 🙂

I love both Pitt and Case. I picked Pitt for myself. You mentioned you might be interested in a pediatric subspecialty...I was VERY impressed with Rainbow Babies & Children's in Cleveland and they have an excellent reputation so you might be able to get some valuable experiences there while at Case. Children's Hospital of Pittsburgh is also very good, and they're building a new one that is just a short bus ride away from the med school (http://www.chp.edu/about/abt2newchp.php). Don't know a date of completion on that though.

This may or may not be helpful...

PMinty44 said:

....could you please address the stregnths and weaknesses of the clinical years at Case and Pitt (exposure to variety of conditions, patient diversity [not just racial or ethnic, but also socioeconomic], hands-on experience, etc)? I feel I (as many) have focused a lot on the first 2 years whe, in reality, the clinical years are probably more important.

Thanks for all that you have contributed. I know everyone is very busy. 🙂

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I'll be graduating from Case this weekend, and I'm going into peds. Looking at the peds programs where my classmates and other grads have gone, if you're a strong candidate, you have a good shot at them all. In terms of clinical experience, I think mine was great. You have the opportunity to rotate through:
-- University Hospitals, which includes Rainbow -- your typical mix of patients from all socioeconomic backgrounds for an urban tertiary care center, mostly Caucasian and African-American, but also quite a few Amish (at Rainbow) and referrals from a large radius. They have an excellent Cancer Center, and I absolutely love Rainbow -- the teaching is great, the attendings are great, and I would have stayed here if my husband and I didn't want to move to another city.
--MetroHealth -- the county hospital on the west side. I did most of my third year clerkships here, and I loved it. Most people who rotated through here did as well. Since it's the county hospital, they take everyone, regardless of insurance. Patient population is mixed, including lots of Latinos (I wish my Spanish were better!), plus quite a few Asian and Middle Eastern immigrants. You tend to see more pathology, with patients presenting later, not getting regular health care, etc. The teaching is great here, and the attendings there are there bc they want to teach (definitely not for the pay). I think students tend to get to do more here, since it's a county hospital. It can get quite interesting there in the ED and L&D, among other places.
--The infamous Cleveland Clinic -- I only did psych there, but most people seemed to like it there. Good for people who like big names. Not sure how much hands on experience you get, given all the private patients. For psych, I was treated like a resident, though, so that made things more interesting.
--The VA -- I didn't rotate through here, but by far offers students the most hands on experience. I know many people who enjoyed their time there. Based on the lectures we had from attendings there, they do some fantastic teaching.
-- There is also the Free Clinic (probably a similar one in Pitt) down the street from Case where students are welcomed and do a LOT, first through fourth years.

I think Case served me well, especially since I'll be going to my first choice program. I enjoyed the opportunity to rotate through the different hospitals, esp when it came time for me to look at residency programs -- I had a better sense of what sort of program and hospital I wanted. It definitely does NOT try to churn out researchers, although there is more of a focus on that with the new dean. Keep in mind, "research" can mean bench research, clinical research, public health/health policy research, etc. There is a lot of emphasis on early clinical exposure, which was one of my favorite things first and second years. Also, keep in mind that the administration is changing around the clinical curriculum a lot, but I don't know if all the changes would be in place for your class. You should ask about that if they haven't told you about that. And pass/fail the first two years is WONDERFUL! (and I did just fine on Step 1).

As for Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh... unless you have ties to one, is there really any difference?

Hope this helps. Good luck.

Thanks, Jamie, for your input!

Bump!

I think the new Children's Pittsburgh will be done in 2007! (In time for our clinical rotations!) You can't go wrong either way, just go with what feels better for you, Minty 🙂

criminallyinane said:

I think the new Children's Pittsburgh will be done in 2007! (In time for our clinical rotations!) You can't go wrong either way, just go with what feels better for you, Minty 🙂

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thanks, criminallyinane! 🙂

PMinty44 said:

thanks, criminallyinane! 🙂

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Thanks, everyone, for your input! I have decided to go with my gut: Case. 🙂

I feel great about having made a decision!

Again, thank you!

Hey,

So I just read that you decided, but if anyone else has the same dillemma:

I'm not attending either school in the fall, but I just finished up at Case for my undergrad and I've lived in Pittsburgh all of my life.

As far as cities go, they are mostly the same, but you can't beat Pittsburgh for scenic beauty (I love the hills). Cleveland is flat except for a rather large hill that you'll probably walk up and down every day to get to the School of Medicine. And that get's really old, really quickly in the winter. Pittsburgh probably has better night life with the South Side and the other things to do. If you like orchestra music, The Cleveland Orchestra is world-renowned (and right on campus!), and the Pittsburgh Symphony is quite good as well. Both have thriving art and music communities as well.

As far as education I was more impressed with Pitt, both with facilities and cirriculum. I did some research there this summer and it's really convenient to have everything right there on the hill and a shuttle to Shady Side. Also, Pitt has that facility with 21 or some crazy number of SIMman robots which is pretty cool. Oakland is a cool place, and definitely beats Case as far as restaraunts and things to do near the school. Hands down.

One thing I don't (and didn't) like about Case is the atmosphere of the university and how it "deals with" students of all kinds. Case has this obsession with becoming (and I'm quoting President Hundert) "The Most Powerful Learning Environment in the World", which is completely laughable. This may be a little less apparent in the School of Medicine but probably not. I worked there and took undergrad classes taught by medical school faculty and they are wonderful. There's A LOT of research going on and sometimes, too often, that overshadows the act of teaching, undergrad, grad, and med students alike. The students there are all really cool, at least the ones I know.

As far as weather goes, it is similar in the winter, meaning that it sucks for about 5 months. Cleveland gets blasted with the lake-effect snow and doesn't know how to clear it's roads. Pittsburgh gets slightly less, but not by much. I would venture to say that Cleveland has worse weather than Pittsburgh but only slightly. The wind gets pretty wicked in both places.

Both cities would be a great opportunity to work with underpriveleged and under-represented. There is a free clinic very close to Case's campus where med students do some volunteer work that really helps the community.
You may also want to weigh the fact that with Case the Cleveland Clinic Foundation is literally right down the street. You may not want to pass up the chance to do your 3rd and 4th years there. Pittsburgh also treats a lot of underpriveleged, but mostly not at UPMC, and usually across the river at Allegheny General (which is affiliated with Drexel University College of Medicine).

Ultimately the decision lies with you. Congrats on acceptances to two great schools. I wish I was in your position, deciding between two of my favorite places. Good luck with everything.

Peace out!

power10n2 said:

Hey,

So I just read that you decided, but if anyone else has the same dillemma:

I'm not attending either school in the fall, but I just finished up at Case for my undergrad and I've lived in Pittsburgh all of my life.

As far as cities go, they are mostly the same, but you can't beat Pittsburgh for scenic beauty (I love the hills). Cleveland is flat except for a rather large hill that you'll probably walk up and down every day to get to the School of Medicine. And that get's really old, really quickly in the winter. Pittsburgh probably has better night life with the South Side and the other things to do. If you like orchestra music, The Cleveland Orchestra is world-renowned (and right on campus!), and the Pittsburgh Symphony is quite good as well. Both have thriving art and music communities as well.

As far as education I was more impressed with Pitt, both with facilities and cirriculum. I did some research there this summer and it's really convenient to have everything right there on the hill and a shuttle to Shady Side. Also, Pitt has that facility with 21 or some crazy number of SIMman robots which is pretty cool. Oakland is a cool place, and definitely beats Case as far as restaraunts and things to do near the school. Hands down.

One thing I don't (and didn't) like about Case is the atmosphere of the university and how it "deals with" students of all kinds. Case has this obsession with becoming (and I'm quoting President Hundert) "The Most Powerful Learning Environment in the World", which is completely laughable. This may be a little less apparent in the School of Medicine but probably not. I worked there and took undergrad classes taught by medical school faculty and they are wonderful. There's A LOT of research going on and sometimes, too often, that overshadows the act of teaching, undergrad, grad, and med students alike. The students there are all really cool, at least the ones I know.

As far as weather goes, it is similar in the winter, meaning that it sucks for about 5 months. Cleveland gets blasted with the lake-effect snow and doesn't know how to clear it's roads. Pittsburgh gets slightly less, but not by much. I would venture to say that Cleveland has worse weather than Pittsburgh but only slightly. The wind gets pretty wicked in both places.

Both cities would be a great opportunity to work with underpriveleged and under-represented. There is a free clinic very close to Case's campus where med students do some volunteer work that really helps the community.
You may also want to weigh the fact that with Case the Cleveland Clinic Foundation is literally right down the street. You may not want to pass up the chance to do your 3rd and 4th years there. Pittsburgh also treats a lot of underpriveleged, but mostly not at UPMC, and usually across the river at Allegheny General (which is affiliated with Drexel University College of Medicine).

Ultimately the decision lies with you. Congrats on acceptances to two great schools. I wish I was in your position, deciding between two of my favorite places. Good luck with everything.

Peace out!

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Thanks for your input! 🙂